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Well my main army is complete. Time to get back into cars and buy a house. Have fun GeeDub!

 agustin wrote:


Yep, their livelihood is dependent on GW decisions out of their control and keeping their job is dependent on selling more product than the year before in spite of GW's behavior. What a crappy position to find oneself in.

-a

If it is any comfort - the vast majority of them have nothing to do with miniatures. Out of around 2000 employees, only 280 or so of them are involved with design and manufacture (with the majority being on the manufacture side of things...so they could go make spoons just as well as miniatures).

The rest are retail or management - so no losses there (or flooding of the miniature employment market).

Still haven't seen any discussion making this news or a rumor. either people didn't know there was a GW Facebook page or they didn't care.

Either way, the sky is not falling

 SoloFalcon1138 wrote:
Still haven't seen any discussion making this news or a rumor. either people didn't know there was a GW Facebook page or they didn't care.

Either way, the sky is not falling

The sky is simply filled with the regular slings and arrows that rain down on a daily basis. It's just one more arrow shot at BS 1 firing into cover with a 2++ save and FNP.

Just not going to happen to make any difference in the gaming world...

I agree with WarOne, the fb page in and of itself isn't going to make a real difference in the gaming world. I'm pretty sure I've only seen that page once myself.

However, gw does have a serious problem, which the previous CEO was probably quite aware of. The chapter house suit was not quite the cakewalk I'm sure they thought it would be. This take down notice backfired so badly that people are wondering whether it was illegally done. Both were started prior to mark wells leaving. Although, if I had to take a guess I'd say Tom Kirby was probably the main driver of the legal team.

The fb page isn't a harbinger of much except that Tom Kirby should be pushed out somehow and replaced with someone that has a long term vision for the company before it really is too late. By long term, I mean more than the next 3 years.

It's going to be rough for awhile before it even has a chance to get better.

 SoloFalcon1138 wrote:
Still haven't seen any discussion making this news or a rumor. either people didn't know there was a GW Facebook page or they didn't care.

No matter how many times you express your opinion in this thread that you personally feel is not newsworthy, clearly many other people disagree with you, and I suggest you simply find another thread to read, instead of repeatedly sipping the sour milk and informing everyone in earshot "this milk's gone bad" over and over again.

i have been known to drink bad milk from time to time.

 SoloFalcon1138 wrote:
Still haven't seen any discussion making this news or a rumor. either people didn't know there was a GW Facebook page or they didn't care.

Either way, the sky is not falling

It's amazing sometimes, truly amazing...

AesSedai - is there absolutely nothing else on the market at the moment that piques your interest?

 SoloFalcon1138 wrote:
Still haven't seen any discussion making this news or a rumor. either people didn't know there was a GW Facebook page or they didn't care.

Either way, the sky is not falling

it is, the first space rocks arrived in Russia this morning, and take a look at the sky tonight with DA-14

 timetowaste85 wrote:

 Kroothawk wrote:

violenceha over at Warseer wrote:Citadel sand, now available in head size tubs.

Do they sell FineOstrich masks too? They could make tons of money on those.

Yes, that was the joke, congratulations on spelling it out for everyone.

 Harriticus wrote:
This really boggles the mind. GW is so scared of the Internet it isn't funny. Even mom and pop restaurants around here have a FB page. What a bunch of children they are. I have no idea which genius in advertising thought it was. God idea to cut the. Off,from the Internet, which is the exact opposite of what every other business in the world is doing. No, GW doesn't know more then every other company in the world.

As for them taking it down over "hate", that's nonsense. Every other company in the world (including ones that generate far more heated debates like apple and Walmart) manages a FB page fine. He'll if the fething Israeli Army manages a FB despite online hate, so can GW.

TLDR: what the hell are they doing?

GW still has Facebook pages, just for the individual stores rather than one global "Games Workshop" page.

The thing is, a Facebook page that large does work as a form of advertising, and when there is so much vitriol on the page (from various sources) that it actually becomes a negative advertisement, then of course GW are going to get rid of the page. They're paying someone to look after it, it's costing them money, but the only impression it would give to anyone new isn't "we make really nice models" it's "everyone that comments on this page hates GW, therefore the company must suck", then they're paying money to lose interest in their product.

So the solution is to take down the FB page..... or to act to make everyone not hate you so much so the FB page becomes a place of joyous frolics?

hellpato wrote:
Lol. Some people acts like kids when they discovered the Tooth Fairy, Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny are not real.... The purpose of GW is to make money.... suck it up buttercup....

But back to the topic. If GW removed the FB page just because they are not able to take criticisms... That stupid or they really need a new guy at the head of the marketing department.

Generally speaking you make more money with happy customers than with angry ones.

Generally speaking you make more money if your customers and retailers know what's coming and can get excited.

Generally speaking you make more money if you keep popular products like Space Hulk in production.

Generally speaking you make more money if popular products like Horus Heresy figures are widely available rather than mail order exclusives from the UK.

Generally speaking you make more money if you keep fans engaged and interested, it stops them from drifting off to other compeditors.

Generally speaking you make more money if fans feel they're getting good value for their money and not being charged $75 for 4 figures.

Generally speaking you make more money if fans are confident the products they buy are free of production problems and are of acceptable quality.

BUt then again I'm not Tom Kirby so what do I know.

 Ouze wrote:
No matter how many times you express your opinion in this thread that you personally feel is not newsworthy, clearly many other people disagree with you, and I suggest you simply find another thread to read, instead of repeatedly sipping the sour milk and informing everyone in earshot "this milk's gone bad" over and over again.

But what would Solo do if he couldn't do that? He'd almost literally have nothing else to post! Don't take his bread and butter away from him.

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

hellpato wrote:
Lol. Some people acts like kids when they discovered the Tooth Fairy, Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny are not real.... The purpose of GW is to make money.... suck it up buttercup....

But back to the topic. If GW removed the FB page just because they are not able to take criticisms... That stupid or they really need a new guy at the head of the marketing department.

Generally speaking you make more money with happy customers than with angry ones.

Generally speaking you make more money if your customers and retailers know what's coming and can get excited.

Generally speaking you make more money if you keep popular products like Space Hulk in production.

Generally speaking you make more money if popular products like Horus Heresy figures are widely available rather than mail order exclusives from the UK.

Generally speaking you make more money if you keep fans engaged and interested, it stops them from drifting off to other compeditors.

Generally speaking you make more money if fans feel they're getting good value for their money and not being charged $75 for 4 figures.

Generally speaking you make more money if fans are confident the products they buy are free of production problems and are of acceptable quality.

BUt then again I'm not Tom Kirby so what do I know.

So much this, once upon a time GW could do what they wanted and managed to get away with it but they refuse to accept that times have changed and are paying for it.

 Baragash wrote:
So the solution is to take down the FB page..... or to act to make everyone not hate you so much so the FB page becomes a place of joyous frolics?

yes, but which is easier?

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

hellpato wrote:
Lol. Some people acts like kids when they discovered the Tooth Fairy, Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny are not real.... The purpose of GW is to make money.... suck it up buttercup....

But back to the topic. If GW removed the FB page just because they are not able to take criticisms... That stupid or they really need a new guy at the head of the marketing department.

Generally speaking you make more money with happy customers than with angry ones.

Generally speaking you make more money if your customers and retailers know what's coming and can get excited.

Generally speaking you make more money if you keep popular products like Space Hulk in production.

Generally speaking you make more money if popular products like Horus Heresy figures are widely available rather than mail order exclusives from the UK.

Generally speaking you make more money if you keep fans engaged and interested, it stops them from drifting off to other compeditors.

Generally speaking you make more money if fans feel they're getting good value for their money and not being charged $75 for 4 figures.

Generally speaking you make more money if fans are confident the products they buy are free of production problems and are of acceptable quality.

BUt then again I'm not Tom Kirby so what do I know.

Generally speaking you are very precise on what to do in order to keep customers happy. And I totally agree with you my friend.

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
It's not hate.

It's disdain.

Yes, hello.

Edit: WTH, quote system?

 Capamaru wrote:

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:

hellpato wrote:
Lol. Some people acts like kids when they discovered the Tooth Fairy, Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny are not real.... The purpose of GW is to make money.... suck it up buttercup....

But back to the topic. If GW removed the FB page just because they are not able to take criticisms... That stupid or they really need a new guy at the head of the marketing department.

Generally speaking you make more money with happy customers than with angry ones.

Generally speaking you make more money if your customers and retailers know what's coming and can get excited.

Generally speaking you make more money if you keep popular products like Space Hulk in production.

Generally speaking you make more money if popular products like Horus Heresy figures are widely available rather than mail order exclusives from the UK.

Generally speaking you make more money if you keep fans engaged and interested, it stops them from drifting off to other compeditors.

Generally speaking you make more money if fans feel they're getting good value for their money and not being charged $75 for 4 figures.

Generally speaking you make more money if fans are confident the products they buy are free of production problems and are of acceptable quality.

BUt then again I'm not Tom Kirby so what do I know.

Generally speaking you are very precise on what to do in order to keep customers happy. And I totally agree with you my friend.

The caricature of GW's bad decisions seems enough such that they should be begging another larger entity to swallow them up and save them from utter ruin and bankruptcy.

And yet here we are; they make money (if not large bushels of it) and are the evil empire of the miniatures world. Of the things KK listed above, GW has to do some of what was described or else they would literally be a footnote in history. We just don't get to see everything they do.

And don't mistake me; they make boatloads of mistakes. But they're not in the market to be a money losing enterprise. They have to do some things right to still be alive.

Well, how long can they continue to borrow money to pay dividends?

And with THQ gone to the winds, their royalty payments are going to dry up fast.

They are in trouble.

 WarOne wrote:

The caricature of GW's bad decisions seems enough such that they should be begging another larger entity to swallow them up and save them from utter ruin and bankruptcy.

And yet here we are; they make money (if not large bushels of it) and are the evil empire of the miniatures world. Of the things KK listed above, GW has to do some of what was described or else they would literally be a footnote in history. We just don't get to see everything they do.

And don't mistake me; they make boatloads of mistakes. But they're not in the market to be a money losing enterprise. They have to do some things right to still be alive.

Well there is that theory that Kirby is just running it into the ground so he can sell off all his shares right before the crash then buy them all back for a hundredth of the price and start the process over again. That or he is simply seeing the company going downhill and is killing any hope of long term viability to keep it afloat short term so he can retire in a couple of years.

He's already a multimillionaire after issue himself millions in bonus money during the LotR boom. Not to mention the stock options in 2007 and paying himself even more through borrowing to pay dividends.

GW's current path has made him rich. Why should be change direction now when he can just slash more staff costs, switch more stores to one person operations, offer less services and increase prices? As long as revenue stays flat, he'll just issue more dividends and that'll be that.

There's no reason for GW to actually communicate with their customers when it becomes clear that the goal of GW is to extract share holder equity into Kirby's personal account.

GW is Kirby's cash cow and he'll keep milking it like mad. If things go south before he's gone, maybe he can negotiate a buy out that pays him even more of a bonus than LOTR did.

 jonolikespie wrote:

Well there is that theory that Kirby is just running it into the ground so he can sell off all his shares right before the crash then buy them all back for a hundredth of the price and start the process over again. That or he is simply seeing the company going downhill and is killing any hope of long term viability to keep it afloat short term so he can retire in a couple of years.

Remember, Kirby has been running the company since the late 1991 when he bought it out from the previous owner and was working at GW long before that. The whole, run it into the ground to make a quick buck rings hollow in that sense. He could have cashed out a long time ago.

We'll see if the Facebook shutdown is permanent or simply, wait for the storm to pass and reopen.

 jonolikespie wrote:

 WarOne wrote:

The caricature of GW's bad decisions seems enough such that they should be begging another larger entity to swallow them up and save them from utter ruin and bankruptcy.

And yet here we are; they make money (if not large bushels of it) and are the evil empire of the miniatures world. Of the things KK listed above, GW has to do some of what was described or else they would literally be a footnote in history. We just don't get to see everything they do.

And don't mistake me; they make boatloads of mistakes. But they're not in the market to be a money losing enterprise. They have to do some things right to still be alive.

Well there is that theory that Kirby is just running it into the ground so he can sell off all his shares right before the crash then buy them all back for a hundredth of the price and start the process over again. That or he is simply seeing the company going downhill and is killing any hope of long term viability to keep it afloat short term so he can retire in a couple of years.

The corporation is known for it's disinformation/misinformation tactics and over the years there have been people really looking at the suspect financials.
The only way this company is going to go anywhere is when Kirby retires. Otherwise you are going to get the same song and dance that people been hearing for years.

 jonolikespie wrote:

 WarOne wrote:

The caricature of GW's bad decisions seems enough such that they should be begging another larger entity to swallow them up and save them from utter ruin and bankruptcy.

And yet here we are; they make money (if not large bushels of it) and are the evil empire of the miniatures world. Of the things KK listed above, GW has to do some of what was described or else they would literally be a footnote in history. We just don't get to see everything they do.

And don't mistake me; they make boatloads of mistakes. But they're not in the market to be a money losing enterprise. They have to do some things right to still be alive.

Well there is that theory that Kirby is just running it into the ground so he can sell off all his shares right before the crash then buy them all back for a hundredth of the price and start the process over again. That or he is simply seeing the company going downhill and is killing any hope of long term viability to keep it afloat short term so he can retire in a couple of years.

I've heard rumblings. This isn't as far-fetched as it sounds.

silent25 wrote:

 jonolikespie wrote:

Well there is that theory that Kirby is just running it into the ground so he can sell off all his shares right before the crash then buy them all back for a hundredth of the price and start the process over again. That or he is simply seeing the company going downhill and is killing any hope of long term viability to keep it afloat short term so he can retire in a couple of years.

Remember, Kirby has been running the company since the late 1991 when he bought it out from the previous owner and was working at GW long before that. The whole, run it into the ground to make a quick buck rings hollow in that sense. He could have cashed out a long time ago.

We'll see if the Facebook shutdown is permanent or simply, wait for the storm to pass and reopen.

True, but it doesn't mean he hasn't grown apathetic to what GW used to mean and only sees it now as a device to bring in money.

 SoloFalcon1138 wrote:
Still haven't seen any discussion making this news or a rumor. either people didn't know there was a GW Facebook page or they didn't care.

Either way, the sky is not falling

Uh... it did in Russia this morning.

A twin-tailed comet blazed through the skies...

silent25 wrote:
Remember, Kirby has been running the company since the late 1991 when he bought it out from the previous owner and was working at GW long before that. The whole, run it into the ground to make a quick buck rings hollow in that sense. He could have cashed out a long time ago.
.

I don't go in for reading tea leaves about GW, a company with IP I adore and business practices I abhor. The recent legal fiascoes should but probably won't cause GW to have a moment of clarity and improve. Generally, I stick to rolling my eyes at the newesthottestarmyomgmustbuybuybuy that GW trends towards these days as well as the almost hilariously inept use of social media the company has had for the last 10-odd years.

I'm happy just accumulating my Guard and Orks second hand like I have been for 15-ish years now.

I don't go in for whiteknighting or blackknighting GW, I think that it generally adds heat but no light to 40k discussions and the Internet is already a nasty enough place.

That having been said, in 1991 Kirby was 22 years younger than he is today. A middle aged businessman has strikingly different incentives than a near-retirement one has.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Ouze wrote:
No matter how many times you express your opinion in this thread that you personally feel is not newsworthy, clearly many other people disagree with you, and I suggest you simply find another thread to read, instead of repeatedly sipping the sour milk and informing everyone in earshot "this milk's gone bad" over and over again.

But what would Solo do if he couldn't do that? He'd almost literally have nothing else to post! Don't take his bread and butter away from him.

Don't worry, he just copy-pastes the same comment in every thread of this nature - I'm sure its possible to set up something automatic from Outlook Express, will have to check out the help file

Gamesworkshop appears to have taken down all of the majour facebook pages; the main one and the country-specific ones as well.

soon they'll all be gone