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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/24 03:46:31
Subject: Re:Paper Titans
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Fresh-Faced New User
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Not sure if this makes a difference, but that scratch-built titan is almost certainly from the "JSV templates" that were created in 2008 and based off of a 2003 non-GW design, not a GW White Dwarf print. A quick Google search can turn up these blueprints. While that one looks pretty rough (and if made out of printer paper instead of cardboard is gonna be pretty crappy), when done properly, the JSV Template can produce some amazing results upon completion.
-James
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/24 22:13:49
Subject: Paper Titans
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Innocent SDF-1 Bridge Bunny
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We used to have a guy like BB at our FLGS. This guy used to bring a gi joe toy as his super heavy. Even when we blew it up with our GW models he still cried about how unfair the rules are. Eventually even the store owner couldn't take this obnoxious person and barred him from coming back. And this was before the apocalypse book came out. We were just playing for fun but this guy had some major personality quarks.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/25 08:32:11
Subject: Re:Paper Titans
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Douglas Bader
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AegisGrimm wrote:They all end up being about how Forgeworld models are the most legitimate, because they are expensive and take tons of time to build and paint, and how scratchbuilders and papercrafters are trying to horn in on the game with something inexpensive and cheaply thrown together.
That's because many scratchbuilders are bringing something cheaply thrown together with minimal effort. Yes, there are talented scratchbuilders who produce awesome models (after spending way more effort on them than it would take to build the "real" model), but let's be honest here: most people scratchbuilding Apocalypse stuff just found the rules for overpowered D-weapon spam and want to win games without having to invest a lot of effort into it. Their cardboard "titans" are just a bunch of boxes glued into the general shape of a titan with no detail/painting/etc, just to get their powerful unit on the table asap and start "building" the next one. And even the "good" papercraft models are still seriously lacking.
So yes, there's some justifiable annoyance when you spend a huge amount of effort building and painting an awesome centerpiece model and then someone else brings one they spent 15 minutes building the night before the game because it has awesome rules.
I think the paper titan is brilliant when I saw it, I think what some people have to understand is that some people really cannot afford an £800 Titan from FW, I mean I would love a Chaos Reaver Titan but if I tried to buy one it would take me at least 4+ years to get one, and even then no one plays Apoc events at my FLGS so it would be a waste of time unfortunately, but my main point is that for some people, if they want it but cant afford it the paper route is where they will go and I support this, for me it dosnt matter about skill as long as you tell me where the weapons are then im all for it.
Then if you can't afford one (and can't build one that is the same quality) don't play with a titan. There's no rule that Apocalypse games have to have titans, in fact they're probably better balanced if you don't.
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There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/25 10:07:43
Subject: Paper Titans
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Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain
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Paper model is a model. Resin model is a model. Model fights model. One model loses.
So one guy got pissy because his expensive model got killed by a cheaper model? Dry 'em, buddy. As long as it was a good build, respect the effort the guy put into his scratchbuild and don't have a cry because your tactics sucked.
Boys get very whiney about their war dollies, don't they?
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Stormonu wrote:For me, the joy is in putting some good-looking models on the board and playing out a fantasy battle - not arguing over the poorly-made rules of some 3rd party who neither has any power over my play nor will be visiting me (and my opponent) to ensure we are "playing by the rules" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/25 11:09:53
Subject: Paper Titans
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Douglas Bader
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JohnnyHell wrote:As long as it was a good build, respect the effort the guy put into his scratchbuild and don't have a cry because your tactics sucked.
It wasn't a good build. There's a picture of it posted on the first page, and it falls well short of anything I'd consider acceptable.
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There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/25 11:38:48
Subject: Paper Titans
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Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain
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Peregrine wrote: JohnnyHell wrote:As long as it was a good build, respect the effort the guy put into his scratchbuild and don't have a cry because your tactics sucked.
It wasn't a good build. There's a picture of it posted on the first page, and it falls well short of anything I'd consider acceptable.
OK, let me re-work my comment:
If you agreed to play against a model, don't get pissy if it kills your model. This includes the scratchbuild you agreed to play against, and the Grot that kills your Terminator. Please apply this to any scenario where you get upset after the fact.
As 545 agreed to fight the PaperHound and as he seems to have unpainted, unfinished and/or unbased models on his side too, IMHO he doesn't have a $300 dollar resin leg to stand on, frankly...
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/02/25 11:41:02
Stormonu wrote:For me, the joy is in putting some good-looking models on the board and playing out a fantasy battle - not arguing over the poorly-made rules of some 3rd party who neither has any power over my play nor will be visiting me (and my opponent) to ensure we are "playing by the rules" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/25 11:47:16
Subject: Paper Titans
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Douglas Bader
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JohnnyHell wrote:If you agreed to play against a model, don't get pissy if it kills your model. This includes the scratchbuild you agreed to play against, and the Grot that kills your Terminator. Please apply this to any scenario where you get upset after the fact.
I'm not disputing this part, this specific person behaved extremely poorly and the OP is right to not want them back ever again. However, they did have a valid point about the paper titan and I can understand entirely why they'd be annoyed about the situation.
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There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/25 12:24:28
Subject: Paper Titans
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Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain
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Peregrine wrote: JohnnyHell wrote:If you agreed to play against a model, don't get pissy if it kills your model. This includes the scratchbuild you agreed to play against, and the Grot that kills your Terminator. Please apply this to any scenario where you get upset after the fact.
I'm not disputing this part, this specific person behaved extremely poorly and the OP is right to not want them back ever again. However, they did have a valid point about the paper titan and I can understand entirely why they'd be annoyed about the situation.
What was their valid point, exactly? A model they'd agreed to play beat them. Simple as that. They agreed to its presence on the table, and only changed that view when it started to be effective. This is pathetic behaviour, in my view. If you agree, you can't un-agree later because it doesn't suit you.
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Stormonu wrote:For me, the joy is in putting some good-looking models on the board and playing out a fantasy battle - not arguing over the poorly-made rules of some 3rd party who neither has any power over my play nor will be visiting me (and my opponent) to ensure we are "playing by the rules" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/25 23:07:19
Subject: Re:Paper Titans
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Fixture of Dakka
West Michigan, deep in Whitebread, USA
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However, they did have a valid point about the paper titan and I can understand entirely why they'd be annoyed about the situation.
 Like what? Someone else's model blew up their precious Forgeworld warhound? That's the point of the frigging game. A player being butthurt about the aggressor being a "cheap paper model" when theirs cost a ton of money is a direct result of lacking any other legitimate reason to complain. Especially when they agree to letting that exact model be in play.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Peregrine wrote: AegisGrimm wrote:They all end up being about how Forgeworld models are the most legitimate, because they are expensive and take tons of time to build and paint, and how scratchbuilders and papercrafters are trying to horn in on the game with something inexpensive and cheaply thrown together.
That's because many scratchbuilders are bringing something cheaply thrown together with minimal effort. Yes, there are talented scratchbuilders who produce awesome models (after spending way more effort on them than it would take to build the "real" model), but let's be honest here: most people scratchbuilding Apocalypse stuff just found the rules for overpowered D-weapon spam and want to win games without having to invest a lot of effort into it. Their cardboard "titans" are just a bunch of boxes glued into the general shape of a titan with no detail/painting/etc, just to get their powerful unit on the table asap and start "building" the next one. And even the "good" papercraft models are still seriously lacking.
So yes, there's some justifiable annoyance when you spend a huge amount of effort building and painting an awesome centerpiece model and then someone else brings one they spent 15 minutes building the night before the game because it has awesome rules.
I think the paper titan is brilliant when I saw it, I think what some people have to understand is that some people really cannot afford an £800 Titan from FW, I mean I would love a Chaos Reaver Titan but if I tried to buy one it would take me at least 4+ years to get one, and even then no one plays Apoc events at my FLGS so it would be a waste of time unfortunately, but my main point is that for some people, if they want it but cant afford it the paper route is where they will go and I support this, for me it dosnt matter about skill as long as you tell me where the weapons are then im all for it.
Then if you can't afford one (and can't build one that is the same quality) don't play with a titan. There's no rule that Apocalypse games have to have titans, in fact they're probably better balanced if you don't.
All I gotta say to that is
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/02/25 23:10:17
"By this point I'm convinced 100% that every single race in the 40k universe have somehow tapped into the ork ability to just have their tech work because they think it should." |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/26 01:26:38
Subject: Re:Paper Titans
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Douglas Bader
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AegisGrimm wrote:  Like what? Someone else's model blew up their precious Forgeworld warhound? That's the point of the frigging game. A player being butthurt about the aggressor being a "cheap paper model" when theirs cost a ton of money is a direct result of lacking any other legitimate reason to complain. Especially when they agree to letting that exact model be in play.
Like the fact that someone threw together a minimal-effort proxy for a powerful unit and immediately used it to kill their real model. It's not about money, it's about effort. The player with the FW titan spent a lot of effort on making an awesome model, the player with the paper titan spent very little effort on building it and didn't even bother to paint it. So yes, it's legitimate to be annoyed that you spent a ton of effort on something while someone else gets the same benefits with a model I wouldn't even allow on the table if I was running the event.
JohnnyHell wrote:This is pathetic behaviour, in my view. If you agree, you can't un-agree later because it doesn't suit you.
Again, I'm not justifying their TFG behavior. The person in the OP has behavior problems that go way beyond the paper titan, and the OP is entirely justified in banning them from future games.
However, that does not change the fact that they had a legitimate point about the paper titan being inappropriate.
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There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/26 01:59:58
Subject: Paper Titans
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Hacking Shang Jí
Calgary, Great White North
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StormK wrote:White Dwarf #53 had templates and instructions for building a Warhound Titan.
WD #98 was the first issue with Warhammer 40k: Rogue Trader. Didn't think time travel had been invented back then. Who knew?
It's possible it was in a later WD, but I really get the feeling the " WD #53" comment was to legitimize the model as "sanctioned" by GW, not because GW actually created blueprints.
In any case, I hope he keeps working on it, it's definitely got potential.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/02/26 02:18:28
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/26 02:02:21
Subject: Paper Titans
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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I actually had a game like this recently. I brought a FW titan and someone had a warhound built out of plasticard parts.
I did not raise a fit (like BB), I told him it looked alright, et cetera, and I didn't mention a thing.
But I did feel bad, as if I had wasted money, that I had spent the money on an actual Forge World model, and I wanted to ask him "why? Why would you make a Warhound out of plasticard?"
Honestly it seems (to Peregrine and I) that this type of person simply wants a Warhound so that they can have a quad-turbolaser platform for apocalypse. Not so that they can have a centerpiece model (as they, in my experience, do not look remotely as awesome as the real thing).
That's just how it appears though, I'm sure I'm overgeneralizing or something.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/26 02:20:17
Subject: Paper Titans
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[DCM]
Dankhold Troggoth
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Unit1126PL... Some (many) people can't afford a titan. So, a great conversion out of card can be a good substitute for an Apocalypse game.
Dreamforge is changing all this, anyhow, with their cheap Crusader  (although not as large as a Warhound, it would do in a pinch, I think, or work with custom rules).
For myself, I don't have the skill to make an excellent card conversion, so I'd either buy the model if I wanted to use one, or more likely buy an alternate model and convert it (probably Dreamforge, or similar).
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/02/26 02:21:55
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/26 02:27:34
Subject: Paper Titans
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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RiTides wrote:Unit1126PL... Some (many) people can't afford a titan. So, a great conversion out of card can be a good substitute for an Apocalypse game.
Why though? Are Titans a prerequisite for apocalypse and I just missed the memo?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/26 02:31:19
Subject: Paper Titans
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[DCM]
Dankhold Troggoth
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Not a prerequisite, but I don't think I'd bother playing Apocalypse without a superheavy of some kind (meaning, over a normal game of 40k). They seem to be pretty darn scary... also, kind of the point of playing Apocalypse is to get to pull out the big guns
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/26 02:35:51
Subject: Paper Titans
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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RiTides wrote:Not a prerequisite, but I don't think I'd bother playing Apocalypse without a superheavy of some kind (meaning, over a normal game of 40k). They seem to be pretty darn scary... also, kind of the point of playing Apocalypse is to get to pull out the big guns 
Not all superheavies are titans. If you can hold off buying 2 Leman Russ tanks, or 1.33 Land Raiders, then buy yourself a Shadowsword and run it as the Iron Saint.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/26 03:33:50
Subject: Re:Paper Titans
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Fixture of Dakka
West Michigan, deep in Whitebread, USA
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Like the fact that someone threw together a minimal-effort proxy for a powerful unit and immediately used it to kill their real model. It's not about money, it's about effort. The player with the FW titan spent a lot of effort on making an awesome model, the player with the paper titan spent very little effort on building it and didn't even bother to paint it. So yes, it's legitimate to be annoyed that you spent a ton of effort on something while someone else gets the same benefits with a model I wouldn't even allow on the table if I was running the event.
What happens if I have an expensive Forgeworld resin tank that took several hours to paint on top of tons of conversion work to make unique, and some guy gets lucky and kills it with a stock plastic Space Marine Predator that he assembled and painted in 1/10th of the time, to a standard I would not deem acceptable if it were in my army? Nothing. 40k is a game and I still have a cool model i spent lots of effort on. I would just focus on what good things my cool conversion had "done" for me in other circumstances, not talk about how mine is so much better because of the effort and money I spent on it.
We obviously know you take the hard line when it comes to the hobby, but that's not all there is. I would happily put together a lower-cost titan (plasticard, not paper- for structural reasons) if all I was going to use it for is random giant fun games. I would rather spend my modelling effort on the forces that I will use regularly on the table, than some multi-hundred dollar figure that I use twice a year - if I was lucky.
Especially in this situation, where by looking at the pics, the unpainted paper Warhound shared a table with bunches of unpainted figures, and the actual Forgeworld Warhound looks like it has about 4 colors in it's paint-job. It's hardly the single eyesore.
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This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2013/02/26 03:41:58
"By this point I'm convinced 100% that every single race in the 40k universe have somehow tapped into the ork ability to just have their tech work because they think it should." |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/26 03:49:03
Subject: Paper Titans
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Abhorrent Grotesque Aberration
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As this is all a bunch of opinions, here's mine. First, I don't really care what the paper titan was made of or how it looked. If the TO thought it was OK then it was acceptable for play. At that point 545 had a choice: either play that game or not. Either way there was no room for 545 to complain about anything. If the other players thought the paper titan was crap and shouldn't be allowed, then it was up to all of them to talk to the TO about it and get a ruling. Next, I couldn't care less if my opponent has actual GW models or not. In today's pricing environment, coupled with the fact that GW has dropped all tournament support, I've actually encouraged people to go outside of GW to pick up models. The only real thing I'm a stickler about is that they have their codex and rule book. IMHO, if they are playing this game then they should have the appropriate rules on hand and those rules should not have been stolen. After all, GW claims that their models are about "collecting" and that gaming is a distant secondary after thought. (side note, I lost count of the number of times the words "collect", "collection" and "collecting" were used in the latest white dwarf. They were seriously pounding on that concept.) If GW's perspective is that their models are only really targeted at collectors then my opinion is that those models should be bought, assembled, painted and promptly placed in glass case never to come out again; in the meantime I intend to play a game. Third, although I prefer playing against painted armies, this doesn't prevent me from enjoying a game against an unpainted one. Heck, I've played against armies painted by people wanting to sell their painting services that I honestly wished they had simply left primed; they were that bad... (side note: if you are trying to sell your painting services at an event, showing up with a white army which looks very much like it was painted with dried toothpaste and certainly didn't even bother to trim the mold lines from is probably not a good idea). I have a few kids that play this game. My 9 year old started when he was 6 with Tyranids. I showed him the basics of building and painting and he went to town and they certainly look like a 6 year old did it and quite frankly that's ok. I've taken him to a couple tournaments and I am very happy to say that everyone was encouraging with him. Another side note: we have a few basic rules in our house with regards to games. The first is No Crying, especially when that favored unit bites it. I can't stand crying/whining/pouting or anything of that nature and simply have a no tolerance policy. As a TO, I would have bounced the guy the moment he threw a fit; he wouldn't have had a choice but to leave. The next one is be gracious in winning and an outstanding loser. It's okay to mourn your loses but at the same time it's important to celebrate the winner as long as everything is respectful. I'd probably send 545 to bed for that display  and would have pulled 40k "privileges" until he could show a bit of maturity. Next, kudos to the kid that built that paper titan. I have respect for anyone that attempts to scratch build a model regardless of material used. It's hard; really hard. Even if he only spent "3 days" on it, I would still congratulate him on his progress. As you can tell I am by no means a snob. Yes, I can buy that FW titan. Yes, I can even afford to have a good painter make it look far better than I could. However, none of that precludes my ability to recognize that others aren't so well off and certainly it doesn't stop me from respecting those that try to get into this game by any *legal* means necessary. At the end of the day, I have a much higher regard for a partially completed scratch built army/unit than I do for a professionally painted FW army. Mainly because I know money can buy damn near everything, but putting time in to do things yourself has a tremendous amount of personal value. Which leads to the next thing: trying to compare "3 days" of time for one person to "weeks" of time to another is impossible. None of us know what 3 days of time meant to that kid. Maybe it was nothing, or maybe he put off other important things he could have been doing just to be able to join this experience. For all I know he has some serious ADD and focusing on anything for "3 days" is a herculean task. Ultimately, what matters to me is the player across the table. That is who I'm engaging with for the next 2+ hours, not the silly pieces of plastic/resin/whatever; those are the side show.
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This message was edited 6 times. Last update was at 2013/02/26 04:02:22
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"Why me?" Gideon begged, falling to his knees.
"Why not?" - Asdrubael Vect |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/26 03:52:36
Subject: Re:Paper Titans
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Fixture of Dakka
West Michigan, deep in Whitebread, USA
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Exactly- though you say it more eloquently than me.
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"By this point I'm convinced 100% that every single race in the 40k universe have somehow tapped into the ork ability to just have their tech work because they think it should." |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/02/26 12:33:26
Subject: Re:Paper Titans
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Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain
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Peregrine wrote:
JohnnyHell wrote:This is pathetic behaviour, in my view. If you agree, you can't un-agree later because it doesn't suit you.
Again, I'm not justifying their TFG behavior. The person in the OP has behavior problems that go way beyond the paper titan, and the OP is entirely justified in banning them from future games.
However, that does not change the fact that they had a legitimate point about the paper titan being inappropriate.
You're still missing my point.
Ignore the extra behavourial issues quoted.
Ignore the models in question.
If you set the expectation that ANY model is not agreeable and refuse upfront: no issue.
If you agree to play against ANY model and bitch when it beats you, well, you only have yourself to blame.
It's really that simple. You can get as angry as you like at others, you should only really be angry at yourself as you created that situation by agreeing to play that game. Just spending more money than your opponent does not entitle you to win. All it entitles you to is fewer opponents as no-one will want to play against you if your toys leave the pram regularly.
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Stormonu wrote:For me, the joy is in putting some good-looking models on the board and playing out a fantasy battle - not arguing over the poorly-made rules of some 3rd party who neither has any power over my play nor will be visiting me (and my opponent) to ensure we are "playing by the rules" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/03/31 00:57:02
Subject: Re:Paper Titans
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Regular Dakkanaut
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SabrX wrote:I wonder if anyone would argue against a Warhound titan built out of Games Workshop 40k paper box sets. Clearly it's 100% 40k product.
What an awesome idea! Roflmao.
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Laugh, and the worlds laugh with you. Cry, and someone cuts off your head for the glory of Khorne! |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/03/31 01:34:38
Subject: Re:Paper Titans
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Fixture of Dakka
West Michigan, deep in Whitebread, USA
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Short answer, he got beat by the rules, not the model. Players shouldn't whine if something they agree to play against gets used better then what they have.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/03/31 01:35:28
"By this point I'm convinced 100% that every single race in the 40k universe have somehow tapped into the ork ability to just have their tech work because they think it should." |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/03/31 02:54:51
Subject: Re:Paper Titans
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Regular Dakkanaut
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CLively:
Your post is the clearest expression of my opinion on the entire hobby. I got into this hobby because of the fun I was having. Back in the day all GW models looked like crap but we had so much fun.
To update everyone this guy is notorious for his hissy fits and arguments over ridiculous things. As an organizer of the event I was upset that his behaviour was so bad after so many concessions had been made for his benefit. He is a notoriously bad loser and an even worse winner. He has a reputation at a number of game stores in the area and he is usually the source of conflict everywhere he goes. Everyone in our game group has agreed that they do not want him in any future club-sanctioned games.
With that in mind I realize the hobby has changed and is no longer what it used to be. I feel like I should find another game because GW games seem to attract people like 545 and so many have begun to take this "game" too seriously.
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Laugh, and the worlds laugh with you. Cry, and someone cuts off your head for the glory of Khorne! |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/03/31 04:42:01
Subject: Paper Titans
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Wraith
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I give him credit for the build. I don't play 40k, and it looks like similar enough to the forgeworld one that I'd accept it.
As to the argument that 'he only wanted it to get a D-weapons platform!', I feel as though you're assign prior wrongs done via powergaming to you to this individual.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/03/31 07:39:46
Subject: Paper Titans
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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It was a casual fun game? It was just a mock up with friends?
If it was not, you are playing this wrong, 40k is not designed for competitive play..
If it was just for fun, why care about it? The guy who paid more have a better model, the guy who made it from cardstock have "nice" model. The guy who feel "offended" by the cardstock titan is bitching...
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If my post show some BAD spelling issues, please forgive-me, english is not my natural language, and i never received formal education on it...
My take on Demiurgs (enjoy the reading):
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/537654.page
Please, if you think im wrong, correct me (i will try to take it constructively). |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/03/31 09:31:56
Subject: Paper Titans
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Nurgle Veteran Marine with the Flu
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If I had bought in a forgeworld titan for an apocalypse game and somebody else bought in a scratch build I usually wouldn't care and enjoy the game. Although if the scratch build was poor quality, sure I would be slightly annoyed because I like 40k for the cool miniatures and seeing decently painted armies on the table top but I would never get all butthurt about it like 545 did and the most important rule of any hobby is to have fun.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/03/31 09:34:34
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/03/31 13:56:18
Subject: Paper Titans
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Boom! Leman Russ Commander
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Kudos to Clively, you basically expressed my opinion better than I could have ever done !
I'd play people with scratchbuilt stuff all the time it's the fun that counts not how much you spent on your models and if they are the official ones or not.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/03/31 14:31:40
Subject: Paper Titans
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Shas'la with Pulse Carbine
New Bedford, MA
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My opinions exactly clively, it was allowed and widely excepted beforehand so no whining. Just have fun, that's what apocalypse games are about.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/03/31 15:10:36
Subject: Re:Paper Titans
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Kid_Kyoto
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I was up at my FLGS yesterday. Someone had a paper Caestus they had just assembled. It actually looked better quality than most of the FW ones I've seen. It was really quite striking.
I'd play against paper stuff any day.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/03/31 15:34:29
Subject: Paper Titans
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Been Around the Block
Manresa, Catalonia
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StormK wrote:White Dwarf #53 had templates and instructions for building a Warhound Titan.
A friend of mine spent three days building his Warhound using the GW guides and fielded it in our recent Apocalypse game.
Another player fielded a FW Warhound and was upset that the paper Titan was allowed.
This was not a GW tournament. It was not a store-run event. It was just a big game we all worked together to plan and play.
Who is right?
Is the paper Titan considered a GW model since they were the ones who released the instructions in the first place?
To this general question, answer: the paper titan, if made with GW released templates, is by definition a GW model. Nothing in this world should disallow it unless it is stated otherwise in a tournament or game participation requisites.
Well built or not. Even the best kit can be horribly built or paint so no coolness factor should rule it out. BTW, while today GW can release kits for each and every vehicle on their books, it was not always like this, or it may not be so even today. So scratch built models dating from a time like that should be allowed, as long as they are clearly recognisable as a given vehicle.
I'm sad nobody took a picture of such a whiner packing up and leaving the house for our enjoyment.
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'ere we go! |
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