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I notice that regular space marine librarians are restricted from generating divination powers, while DA, SW, BA, and GK can. Is there some sort of fluff for this, because i don't see why vanilla marines can't use divination but DA, SW and BA can. What about Varro Tigerius divining the movements of the Hive Mind or Blood Ravens Librarians using fore-sight to determine enemy battle plans, sounds like divination to me.

Really? I didnt realise that was the case. Where does it say what tables they can generate powers from?

In the FAQ's for space marine it tells you what powers you can generate from. I'd like to have divination as an option but in reality I would very rarely give up null zone because it is so powerful.

No, it makes no sense, yes it is annoying. Every time there's new SM FAQ I cross my fingers and hope they've changed it.

Well, CSM don't get divination either. Seems a little silly when that's one of the things Tzeentch does best.

 deathholydeath wrote:
Well, CSM don't get divination either. Seems a little silly when that's one of the things Tzeentch does best.

Yes. That is actually even worse that SM not having it.

Can't Arhiman get powers from Divination? I know the book lets you get Divination(if you roll it)


Anyway, GKs, Space Wolves, and Blood Angels have been shown in the fluff preforming divination powers and abilities so it makes complete sense they would have it. DAs are just randomly included for some reason.

Thing is you're supposed to use vanilla dex to represent about 95% of the Space Marine chapters. It should be flexible.

 Grey Templar wrote:
Can't Arhiman get powers from Divination? I know the book lets you get Divination(if you roll it)


Anyway, GKs, Space Wolves, and Blood Angels have been shown in the fluff preforming divination powers and abilities so it makes complete sense they would have it. DAs are just randomly included for some reason.

How do you think they hunt the fallen?
Dark angels dont get biomancy either, I for one would like to use this on ezekial, tigurius with
Biomancy can become very nasty indeed

Oh boo hoo. Eldar are master psychers but they only get two trees while many SM chapters get 4!

warpspider89 wrote:
Oh boo hoo. Eldar are master psychers but they only get two trees while many SM chapters get 4!

Well, Eldar should get them all, definitely. I'd also give them rule that would allow them to choose their powers rather than roll for them.

warpspider89 wrote:
Oh boo hoo. Eldar are master psychers but they only get two trees while many SM chapters get 4!

Doesn't change the fact that divination should be given to C:SM libbies since the other SM books get it. Eldar should also get all the trees, since they are as you said master psykers. Point being, we can't see to much rhyme or reason behind this and hope it changes.

(And I don't even play C:SM haha)

Of course they should have it. I didn't even realize C:SM didn't have divination until I saw this post, I just assumed they did. Silly me for assuming that logic would prevail with 40k rules. However, I was aware of Eldar only having access to two types of psychic powers, which is equally, if not more baffling.

 Grey Templar wrote:
Can't Arhiman get powers from Divination? I know the book lets you get Divination(if you roll it)


Anyway, GKs, Space Wolves, and Blood Angels have been shown in the fluff preforming divination powers and abilities so it makes complete sense they would have it. DAs are just randomly included for some reason.

arhiman cannot. He has to take half of his powers from the crap awful Tzeench list.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Crimson wrote:

 deathholydeath wrote:
Well, CSM don't get divination either. Seems a little silly when that's one of the things Tzeentch does best.

Yes. That is actually even worse that SM not having it.

Very annoying and makes no sense


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 ace101 wrote:
I notice that regular space marine librarians are restricted from generating divination powers, while DA, SW, BA, and GK can. Is there some sort of fluff for this, because i don't see why vanilla marines can't use divination but DA, SW and BA can.

CSM cant take it either, despite constantly praying to Tzeench to let them see the future.

particularly annoying when Divination is clearly the best tree

The only way CSM can get Divination is through the very expensive and very risky Scrolls of Magnus, or by picking Huron. In both cases you still have to roll on a table and the odds of getting Divination are not good.

Also, in both cases you are locked out of the Primaris, so no twin-linking your stuff.

Access to Divination has become a rather reliable indicator of what MeQ army is top-tier competitive and which one is not. Though pretty much all Imperial forces are just one Ally away from getting it.

Ahriman only has to take 1 power from Tzeentch - half is a maximum, not a minimum.

He can take Pyromancy, Biomancy and Telepathy for the others (I can't remember which of those regular Sorcerers don't get. Pyromancy I think).

I assume that SMs methods of using Divination are too lengthy and unwieldy to use in battle. More ritualistic than invoked.

As for Eldar, they get Ghosthelms and Wards of witnessing and [the other one], but not better powers. The new codex should sort that out, with new Eldar cards.

Fluffwise...

Space Wolf Rune Priests are shaman type characters, who were particularly known for 'casting the runes' in order to see the future. Or staring into the entrails of birds and the like.

Blood Angels: One of Sanguinius' most noted abilities was being able to see the future, an action that he passed onto his sons.

Dark Angels: To be honest, I can't massively justify this, most of the DA fluff I'm aware off would fall under the heading of 'telepathy' rather than 'divining the future.' I suppose there could be the argument of them 'scrying to find the fallen' - but that just seems to be well, telepathic... More typical Professor X abilities than prophecy.

Grey Knights: Much of the same arguments could be made with Dark Angels. However, I would err on the side of giving GK Divination as they probably do spend a lot of time hunting the future for demon incursions.

As for CSM, well... I could see the argument for not giving them Divination if the Tzeentch tree had powers that were divination-ish. Instead, half of them are just rubbish shooting attacks, so I've got nothing...

 Compel wrote:

.

As for CSM, well... I could see the argument for not giving them Divination if the Tzeentch tree had powers that were divination-ish. Instead, half of them are just rubbish shooting attacks, so I've got nothing...

In the fluff, divination is a huge deal for Chaos. Erebus, Lorgar, Ahriman, even non-corrupted rebels like Konrad Curze and Talos. I think game 'balance' *cough* was the defining factor here. After all, a book with something as uber as Mutilators doesn't really need access to Divination, right?

Well chaos can get every psychic power from the BRB.....technically (sigh). At least we can turn every one of our hq's into psykers. (tzeentch only )


Except primaris powers, which makes it worse.

Every power from the BRB? You're not referring to the Scrolls, are you?

 washout77 wrote:


Doesn't change the fact that divination should be given to C:SM libbies since the other SM books get it.

-because all SM chapters should be the same?

 Sephyr wrote:

 Compel wrote:

.

As for CSM, well... I could see the argument for not giving them Divination if the Tzeentch tree had powers that were divination-ish. Instead, half of them are just rubbish shooting attacks, so I've got nothing...

In the fluff, divination is a huge deal for Chaos. Erebus, Lorgar, Ahriman, even non-corrupted rebels like Konrad Curze and Talos. I think game 'balance' *cough* was the defining factor here. After all, a book with something as uber as Mutilators doesn't really need access to Divination, right?

Who cares if Tsons are 50 points a model! They have ap3 bolters, totally OP.

 Exergy wrote:

 Sephyr wrote:

 Compel wrote:

.

As for CSM, well... I could see the argument for not giving them Divination if the Tzeentch tree had powers that were divination-ish. Instead, half of them are just rubbish shooting attacks, so I've got nothing...

In the fluff, divination is a huge deal for Chaos. Erebus, Lorgar, Ahriman, even non-corrupted rebels like Konrad Curze and Talos. I think game 'balance' *cough* was the defining factor here. After all, a book with something as uber as Mutilators doesn't really need access to Divination, right?

Who cares if Tsons are 50 points a model! They have ap3 bolters, totally OP.

The faux Sorcerer is 58 points, for no real apparent reason.

*cough* They're only 23 points/model, with the Sorcerer at 58 because he's 23+25 (IE: the cost of a mastery level).

That said, when using a squad of Thousand Sons + Ahriman as allies for my Necrons, they did almost as much damage as the two Doom Scythes I was also running (and yes, Ahriman did completely dismantle a C'tan in close combat... somehow).

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Every power from the BRB? You're not referring to the Scrolls, are you?

That + huran blackheart. (I don't know if I spelled his name right but w.e.)

Huron, but nearly.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
*cough* They're only 23 points/model, with the Sorcerer at 58 because he's 23+25 (IE: the cost of a mastery level).

That said, when using a squad of Thousand Sons + Ahriman as allies for my Necrons, they did almost as much damage as the two Doom Scythes I was also running (and yes, Ahriman did completely dismantle a C'tan in close combat... somehow).

Isn't that illegal? You can't make any of the cult units (Plague Marines, Noise Marines, Thousand Sons, and Khorne Berzerkers) into troops if they are allies, primary detachment only.

I had cultists as well, I just didn't feel the need to list them.