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So with my small-but-growing Word Bearers force and pile of mothballed Daemons so old many of them could vote, I'm looking at how the two lists work together.

Deployed Beasts of Nurgle seem like a great asset for gunlines. More so for Guard than CSM. A Nurgle Soulgrinder or two will really sort out an Aegis line.

The Portaglyph of spewing out little scoring units has potential for Abaddon lists and other lists where Troops slots are filled out with powerful shock units. Flying DP drops it on home objective on T1, then goes off and does his thing. Or maybe even just a cheap Herald?

Cannons of Khorne and Fiends of Slaanesh could make fast-moving assault units very scary.

I can see Kairos being a deal-breaker for deciding to take CD with allies or CSM/other with CD allies. Low risk Warp Storm is pretty handy.

Instruments of Chaos could be handy to make damned (ahah) sure that Oblits and Helldrakes arrive on T2.

Edit: Epidemius and Blood Thrones don't work with CSM Daemon units.

 lindsay40k wrote:

It seems to me that Obliterators with MoN could rack up kills for Epidemius (as could other CSM Daemon units), but I wouldn't like to bet on it surviving the first FAQ. To a lesser extent, I'm seeing Blood Thrones having similar potential for synergy - that may be shot down by the FAQ - with Khornate CSM Daemon units.

Uh.... Daemons of Nurgle =/= units with the Daemon special rule and the Mark of Nurgle. You need the specific special rule to be "Daemon of X".


Personally, I can only see some unit synergies. Like Fiends and/or Seekers supporting Spawn/Biker assaults or a Tzeentch Psyker Blob providing tons of shooting.

I also just checked something... Characters with Instability can only join units with instability.

So half of the stuff players are trying (FNP, Shrouded Obliterators) can't be done.

Puscifer wrote:
I also just checked something... Characters with Instability can only join units with instability.

So half of the stuff players are trying (FNP, Shrouded Obliterators) can't be done.

And yet one can still spam the stronger things like the heldrake because for some reason the ground forces don't want to work together.

Puscifer wrote:
I also just checked something... Characters with Instability can only join units with instability..

What page are you reading that?

 labmouse42 wrote:

Puscifer wrote:
I also just checked something... Characters with Instability can only join units with instability..

What page are you reading that?

Daemonic Instability, first sentence: "A unit with this special rule cannot be joined by a model without this special rule."

That's only the one way round, though. So a unit of Daemons can't be joined by an outside IC, but a Daemon IC can absolutely join a non-Daemon unit.

 Super Ready wrote:
That's only the one way round, though. So a unit of Daemons can't be joined by an outside IC, but a Daemon IC can absolutely join a non-Daemon unit.

Daemonic Alignment: Daemons can only join units that are composed entirely of Daemons of the same alignment as themselves. - note that normally, units with the Daemons special rule don't have an alignment (even with Marks, as marks don't turn them into Daemons of X).

Good point... if I've read that correctly, it stops them joining *any* unit not from Codex Chaos Daemons at all, which I missed. Thanks.

Lawyers will argue 'alignment' is not strictly defined to exclude 'CSM Daemon unit with Mark' until it gets FAQ'd.

 lindsay40k wrote:
Lawyers will argue 'alignment' is not strictly defined to exclude 'CSM Daemon unit with Mark' until it gets FAQ'd.

It is. There is a big "Daemonic Alignment" special rule in the DE codex .

Daemonic Alignment and Marking are different mechanics. They've got different names and convey totally different benefits.

I wish they were the same, because it'd allow my Daemons and CSM to cooperate better and do more funky tricks, but alas, that is not the case.

 Mannahnin wrote:
Daemonic Alignment and Marking are different mechanics. They've got different names and convey totally different benefits.

I wish they were the same, because it'd allow my Daemons and CSM to cooperate better and do more funky tricks, but alas, that is not the case.

Even if for some reason they could've made specific units Daemons OF rather then marked.

Kinda like Warriors of chaos, where spawn/forsaken (possessed) gain Daemons of X rather then the marks..

 AtoMaki wrote:

 labmouse42 wrote:

Puscifer wrote:
I also just checked something... Characters with Instability can only join units with instability..

What page are you reading that?

Daemonic Instability, first sentence: "A unit with this special rule cannot be joined by a model without this special rule."

Doesn't that say CSM ICs cant join heralds? CSM ICs, lacking the special rule clearly cannot join daemons.

A unit of Mutulators do not have that special rule, therefor the quoted text does not apply to the herald. The herald has other criteria that must be met.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Mannahnin wrote:
Daemonic Alignment and Marking are different mechanics. They've got different names and convey totally different benefits.

I wish they were the same, because it'd allow my Daemons and CSM to cooperate better and do more funky tricks, but alas, that is not the case.

Yet GW has already crossed that line with the Axe of Blind Fury being available to daemon princes lacking a mark. Does that barrier only apply when GW decides it does on a whim? There should be consistency

I expect and hope GW corrects this in a FAQ. They have been good about rapid release of FAQs.

Even if they are just Daemons and not Daemons of ______ units of mutilators, Obliterators, and Warp Tallons can still get the reduced scatter from deepstriking off icons.

Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the entry for instruments say it can only pull "another unit in deepstrike reserve"? So, this couldn't be used to guide in a helldrake.

 labmouse42 wrote:

A unit of Mutulators do not have that special rule, therefor the quoted text does not apply to the herald. The herald has other criteria that must be met.

For Mutilators, Possessed, Warp Talons and Obliterators, we have the Daemonic Alignment. It says that a CD IC can only join a unit with the Daemon special rule and the same alignment. Following this, it lists the four alignments (the Daemon of Khorne, Tzeentch, Nurgle and Slaanesh special rules). So a Herald can join only a unit with these alignments, and the only unit in the CSM codex with these alignments is the Daemon Prince... The description of Marks says nothing about alignment, you can't use them to prove any unit's alignment.

 labmouse42 wrote:

 Mannahnin wrote:
Daemonic Alignment and Marking are different mechanics. They've got different names and convey totally different benefits.

I wish they were the same, because it'd allow my Daemons and CSM to cooperate better and do more funky tricks, but alas, that is not the case.

Yet GW has already crossed that line with the Axe of Blind Fury being available to daemon princes lacking a mark.

Quite the opposite, to my read. Instead of FAQing it to equate the terms by saying something like “Although the Axe says Mark of Khorne, that also includes “Daemon of Khorne”, they errata’d the eligibility requirement of the axe to Mark of Khorne OR Daemon of Khorne. Thus reinforcing that they’re two distinct and separate concepts.