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I fully expect the Marauders I receive to be ones shown on Saturday no changes.

I've dipped in and out of the comments but I find myself reading them less and less recently and then to just pick out Mantic's own posts to see what's going on that said this is no Rivet Wars comment section that was truly terrible.

Got my Dreadball wave 2 stuff today very nice it is to some of the official paint jobs don't do the miniatures justice that said what they said about sorting the issues with the first wave miniatures castings from what I've seen they are pretty much the same as before mostly OK some bad flash here and there though and I've had to hot water treat all of my Void Sirens to make them stand correctly.

edlowe wrote:
Hi first post long time lurker, ive been on the dz comments from day one and it seems recently to have become very negative towards any criticism or alternative suggestion. In particular there seems to be an instance that bringing up any issues you have are damaging to the ks and should not be voiced.

Is this usual for ks, ive never experienced this before?

Hi Ed, glad to see one of the voices of reason here.

It can happen with kickstarter, most often in the middle of a campaign when things are naturally slower and people who are heavily invested in wanting it to succeed are keen to stamp out anything "negative" as they feel it will put people off of pledging.

IMO, the arguing is often a bigger problem than the criticism itself, so I'm going to leave the comments section alone for any suggestion and just message Mantic if I feel the need to mention something. Otherwise you get the situation you can currently see over there with 10x more complaints about people complaining about complaints (and variations on that kind of noise) than the (often polite and succinct) criticism that started it all.

There's quite a lot of people in this thread (judgedoug etc.) who already had this figured out.

Ill wait the mantic pics, I doubt they will be good since the problems are not related to bad photography and then push.

I fought in the first war about them, I will not waste my time in skirmishes with overprotective supporters, I will go in for the second battle.

Thanks scarletsquig!
The stupid thing is there are a lot of things mantic have got spot on. I love the plague figures and the helfather merc, not so keen on the giant jellyfish but heh I dont have to buy it.

The problem is I have to have the orx since im taking a strike pledge. I would much rather swap them out for more plague or astarians.

 Eilif wrote:
New stretch goal.
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1744629938/deadzone-the-sci-fi-miniatures-board-game/posts/479404
10 dollar jellyfish alien.

Spoiler:

Hello Enslaver...

^ I seem to remember those got some White Dwarf rules that would be usable for the current edition, too.

One of the cooler bits of 40k lore to dip into anyway, I quite like it when Mantic draws more inspiration from Rogue Trader and 80's Warhammer.

That comment wasn't about "not voicing your opinion" it was about not getting into heated debates.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Eilif wrote:
New stretch goal.
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1744629938/deadzone-the-sci-fi-miniatures-board-game/posts/479404
10 dollar jellyfish alien.

Spoiler:

Hello Enslaver...

I was thinking more of the dudes that float around in Mass Effect, with the echoey voices!

Although, 'alien jellyfish thing' has been a sci-fi trope for some time, I wouldn't be surprised to see some floating around in some cheesy 60's B-movie!

Interesting to see what the 'improved tactics' element might be, regarding the use of the model in the game..

So... possibly $500,000 for the new faction?

the hanar from masseffect, and i love mantics twist, hanar meets enslaver. hanar are mostly peaceful, enslavers are power hungry, so mantics beast must be completely indifferent. lol

Pacific - So... possibly $500,000 for the new faction?

Judging by the obnoxiousness that has come from 10k to pay for this guy, I'm assuming Mantic will dig up a freebie.

30k of stretches to diversify and encourage a few add-ons just doesn't seem as aweful as some have made it out to be.

That's not to say that can't come between the new faction goal OR the new faction won't provide some freebies.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
The funniest part is we about be through that goal is all the people who dropped out hadn't dropped out.

Less then 20 new backers on the kicktraq day, but that's the difference. I'm sure many who dropped will rejoin down the road.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
EB 2 open

Yes... to those who asked, KS'er comments are often that bad... generally when the hardest core of the fanboys claim the space as their own personal blog.

Luckily, here we're kept to a higher standard of civility where we can disagree... but have a real conversation about why.

Deadzone's comments section is particularly bad because several folks have claimed the space, and those people happen to have formed a weird solidarity. The result is a brick-wall any counter opinion has to bump against.

I disagree that the comments are the wrong place to have the debates though. People act as if raising as much money as possible is our principle goal as backers. I see how it can be confusing as our winfall CAN align with Mantics... but make no mistake... we are potential investors. I WANT to see Mantic do well, hit stretch-goals, etc... as I happen to gain... but they still have to prove their product to me as an investor, and I in turn should be able to voice concerns... be they about ugly Orx, or whatever.

Problem is, the aforementioned will not let comments be, where they might potentially help shape/improve the product, but instead turn everything into a fight, which yes... just serves to scare off others.

Maybe it's worth everyone (Sorry Lego!), registering on the Mantic forums then?

I've been contemplating putting up a simple poll there about the orx.

I can't believe I'm one of the few who really likes the Orx. I want them to stay as they are. But, as always, differing opinions.

While I've only got extensive experience in a single Kickstarter, it seems to me that the individual update comments are less dominated by Kickstarter Paris Hiltons/Kardashians than the general ones. Is that true for Deadzone?

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
Yes... to those who asked, KS'er comments are often that bad... generally when the hardest core of the fanboys claim the space as their own personal blog.

Luckily, here we're kept to a higher standard of civility where we can disagree... but have a real conversation about why.

Deadzone's comments section is particularly bad because several folks have claimed the space, and those people happen to have formed a weird solidarity. The result is a brick-wall any counter opinion has to bump against.

I disagree that the comments are the wrong place to have the debates though. People act as if raising as much money as possible is our principle goal as backers. I see how it can be confusing as our winfall CAN align with Mantics... but make no mistake... we are potential investors. I WANT to see Mantic do well, hit stretch-goals, etc... as I happen to gain... but they still have to prove their product to me as an investor, and I in turn should be able to voice concerns... be they about ugly Orx, or whatever.

Problem is, the aforementioned will not let comments be, where they might potentially help shape/improve the product, but instead turn everything into a fight, which yes... just serves to scare off others.

The reason why that comments section is a bad place for lengthy debates is because of how awful the organization is for the comments. Squig's whole "someone ran me off when I tried to voice an opinion" was less actually running her off and more "Mantic just said that's not gonna happen". At that point, you're best served to e-mail Mantic directly and plead your case, otherwise Mantic's actual post gets more and more buried.

And I don't see why folks are so afraid to say "Hey guys. The hockey discussion is making it harder for me to find solid information from Mantic. Can we try to keep it to a minimum?" That's not out of line. Complaining about the comments section has, in essence, made this thread about as bad to find discussion about the ACTUAL game and KS difficult in and of itself. In order to prevent infringing on others freedom of speech, many here instead infring on their own. It really is a silly comcept

 warboss wrote:
While I've only got extensive experience in a single Kickstarter, it seems to me that the individual update comments are less dominated by Kickstarter Paris Hiltons/Kardashians than the general ones. Is that true for Deadzone?

You realize that in the Robotech one there's a guy with 10% of the total comments. He's also one of the most useless posters in there.

That's impressive considering there's almost 28000 comments.

In most KS comments section, there's always that one guy....

 timetowaste85 wrote:
I can't believe I'm one of the few who really likes the Orx. I want them to stay as they are. But, as always, differing opinions.

I'm waiting to see some better photos of the things, but 90 Degree Arm Bend Man is pretty awkward, and Dancing Monkey Sniper is hard to get out of my head.

 DaveC wrote:


Got my Dreadball wave 2 stuff today very nice it is to some of the official paint jobs don't do the miniatures justice that said what they said about sorting the issues with the first wave miniatures castings from what I've seen they are pretty much the same as before mostly OK some bad flash here and there though and I've had to hot water treat all of my Void Sirens to make them stand correctly.

Dear god, I hope this is not the case. I will be super disappointed if I have to re-sculpt detail because the flash is so thick that it damages the model and the mold lines are in bad locations.

Did they twist and yank the models off the sprue leaving plastic damage or snip them cleanly?

 TalonZahn wrote:

 warboss wrote:
While I've only got extensive experience in a single Kickstarter, it seems to me that the individual update comments are less dominated by Kickstarter Paris Hiltons/Kardashians than the general ones. Is that true for Deadzone?

You realize that in the Robotech one there's a guy with 10% of the total comments. He's also one of the most useless posters in there.

That's impressive considering there's almost 28000 comments.

In most KS comments section, there's always that one guy....

Definitely. It's hard to not see his comments and he would be a prime example of the Kardashian type I was referring to (the other being Bad_Syntax aka Eric Smith who pulled his 2k pledge one night because people were mean to him and then came back after changing his username). It sounds like the actor cult of whatshisname (the "other" annoying gungan) fills that role in deadzone.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Eilif wrote:
New stretch goal.
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1744629938/deadzone-the-sci-fi-miniatures-board-game/posts/479404
10 dollar jellyfish alien.

Spoiler:

Hello Enslaver...

Dammit, I was going through the comments hoping someone else wouldn't realize first

 warboss wrote:

 TalonZahn wrote:

 warboss wrote:
While I've only got extensive experience in a single Kickstarter, it seems to me that the individual update comments are less dominated by Kickstarter Paris Hiltons/Kardashians than the general ones. Is that true for Deadzone?

You realize that in the Robotech one there's a guy with 10% of the total comments. He's also one of the most useless posters in there.

That's impressive considering there's almost 28000 comments.

In most KS comments section, there's always that one guy....

Definitely. It's hard to not see his comments and he would be a prime example of the Kardashian type I was referring to (the other being Bad_Syntax aka Eric Smith who pulled his 2k pledge one night because people were mean to him and then came back after changing his username). It sounds like the actor cult of whatshisname (the "other" annoying gungan) fills that role in deadzone.

I personally have NO idea how that KS is doing as well as it is, but that is a derailment.

WWX had a few guys who BS a bit too much, and just a few folks asking them to chill did the trick. It really doesnt hurt to ask

 TalonZahn wrote:

 warboss wrote:
While I've only got extensive experience in a single Kickstarter, it seems to me that the individual update comments are less dominated by Kickstarter Paris Hiltons/Kardashians than the general ones. Is that true for Deadzone?

You realize that in the Robotech one there's a guy with 10% of the total comments. He's also one of the most useless posters in there.

That's impressive considering there's almost 28000 comments.

In most KS comments section, there's always that one guy....

YUP. and that dude also disseminates a lot of wrong info.

 spaceelf wrote:
Canons are brutal weapons when in the right hands. Ask anyone who has had their knuckles smashed by a sister of battle.

or the catholic church...

I've kind of stopped looking at the general comments section since the Blesseds seem to think it's actually a chat room.

I was hoping we'd reach $460,000 today, but no dice. So close, too.

 RiTides wrote:
I've never wanted "some of every faction" which is part of the reason why I think Mantic's campaigns have never appealed to me. I want a lot of one faction, for almost any game I play as a general rule... not a little bit of each.

I think its a great idea, lets you sample models before buying. Then again you can please some of the people some of the time, but you can't please all the people all the time. This is perfectly apt with KS.

Hi all,

I've pledging on Deadzone and have been following the KS comments and Mantic forums. It seems people here are a bit more open, so I thought I'd give it a go.

First, hats off to Scarletsquig for making reasoned, informed suggestions on the KS thread.

If Mantic fail to crack 1 million - something that once seemed impossible - it will be because they didn't price their product attractively enough. In business, when your hot item isn't selling as hotly as you'd like, that usually means you priced it wrong. Current pledgers, content or not, are not the issue. It's the people sitting on the sidelines that have to be convinced, and evidently a fair number of them don't yet find the Deadzone pledge deals good enough to jump aboard. You can't sell the game to those people by arguing the point. All you can do is try to tempt them, and that means sweetening your current deals by lowering prices or adding more to them.

For current pledgers, on the other hand, there's no getting around the fact that the Marauders issue is a big one. I'm a first time Mantic customer. If they decide to keep the Marauders as is, I'll probably stay on anyway if the total deal is good enough, but they still won't be getting as much of my money.

Why? Because of unsold miniature add-ons. If it becomes clear that Mantic find poor quality sculpts of high quality concept drawings acceptable, then people will conclude that putting down a lot of money for figures on the basis of concept sketches is a very, very bad idea. Low pricing could offset that gamble somewhat, but Mantic's current KS add-on prices are not low. With the commando situation unresolved, it doesn't matter how much I like Heath's drawing of a Kraaw or a Marauder Hulk. I'm not buying his drawings; why should I pledge money for sculpts that may look nothing like them?

I like Mantic's ambition, their market hutzpah, and their aesthetic. I'm probably going to end up quite happy with this kickstarter. But it would be a shame to see that 1 million + mark slip through their fingers, and if they play their cards right, I see no good reason for that to happen.

^ Welcome to the forums, Vermonter - great first post.

As for wondering if it'll be good value... it will be, eventually.

I'd put a safe bet on ~100+ minis for $150 by the time this ends, or 70% overall discount (we're already at 50%).. both KoW and Dreadball finished at this sum.

Mantic are pretty heavily committed to actually using KS money purely for tooling and manufacture, it is genuinely about creating as many new minis as possible.

It's possible that their pricing was too high off the bat, though, the starting offer of 6 minis for $40 required a lot of stretch goal freebies before it started looking like a good deal, and a lot of early birds that jumped in purely on the notion of "expected value" might be getting itchy fingers at this point since we've had 2 non-freebie goals in a row now, and Mantic have said that the next 1-2 stretch goals (new faction starters) will not be freebies either.

I'm quite surprised that Mantic doesn't have Warpath 2.0 lists for all the minis in all 4 factions already live + heavily pimping the "buy an extra couple of starters and then you'll have an elite shock trooper army for Warpath too!" angle... there's a lot of missed potential for cross-promotion here since WP 2.0 is a very good game, and they should be shouting from the rooftops about it and how you can use your deadzone minis in this awesome game of theirs instead of not really mentioning much about it at all.

Hell, have "Elite Warpath army bundles" and whatnot as add-ons, people would lap it up. Feels like there's an obvious upsell route that isn't being taken, it's hinted at with the 6x4 board options available, but has never been explicitly stated.

The biggest thing Mantic could improve upon is instead of one-by-one goals, maybe try freebie to freebie. Having the next free model visible on the horizon is attractive to all, even if you aren't 100% enthusiastic about that particular freebie.

That's the biggest thing that hurt their retention this past day: the fear that the freebies were over.(At least of the stuff that happened yesterday specifically)

Well said Vermonter.

I've been watching this project like a hawk since they introduced the terrain pledge levels knowing mantic have a habit of making the end value of a pledge more appealing than the starting value. The current value is not enough to make me go in for the project, but hopefully that will improve over the next two and a half weeks. I haven't read the comments so I'm unsure if there are any intentions to add more sprues or battleones but I imagine it is on their mind with earlybird deals still available almost a week after introduction.

Though I have no interest in the game or miniatures, I agree with your sentiments on the company's standards of sculpt quality as well. I remember being wowed by the kings of war ogre concept art and let down by the greens. They are very hit and miss on their ranges right now.

 scarletsquig wrote:

I'm quite surprised that Mantic doesn't have Warpath 2.0 lists for all the minis in all 4 factions already live + heavily pimping the "buy an extra couple of starters and then you'll have an elite shock trooper army for Warpath too!" angle... there's a lot of missed potential for cross-promotion here since WP 2.0 is a very good game, and they should be shouting from the rooftops about it and how you can use your deadzone minis in this awesome game of theirs instead of not really mentioning much about it at all.

Hell, have "Elite Warpath army bundles" and whatnot as add-ons, people would lap it up. Feels like there's an obvious upsell route that isn't being taken, it's hinted at with the 6x4 board options available, but has never been explicitly stated.

Seconding this. While I like Deadzone's Alpha rules (And so does my fiance, a minor miracle in and of itself!), I absolutely love Warpath and the ability to find models or such that interest me now for WP would encourage my purchasing of add-ons. Currently, only looking at adding the original Enforcer Captain and that'll be about it barring a really phenomenal sculpt that sways me...