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Their models are AWESOME! And when I've used them in the past they have acted like super powerful glass cannons. They hit harder than almost anything else in the army but despite their high toughness and wounds they die easily and are tough to regenerate. Im conscious that VC already has enough glass cannons and so I'm wondering if there is a place for these flying beasts. I think they would work well in a magic heavy list as you could regen a wound every time a spell is cast but it's a bit gimmicky.

I guess you use them as they should be used and or build a list around them. That way they are in range of some type of IoN plus other spells to push them forward. That and putting something else out on the board to cause havoc. That way the enemy will focus on said unit instead of the varg...

They are a glass cannon that needs to be used carefully to flank. Like pretty much the entire VC army they are viable, but they are one of the harder ones to make work imo.

Tarval wrote:
I guess you use them as they should be used and or build a list around them. That way they are in range of some type of IoN plus other spells to push them forward. That and putting something else out on the board to cause havoc. That way the enemy will focus on said unit instead of the varg...

I'm going to park 4 behind my center in my next game. That will let my fly over my own units can charge units trying to sneak in on my flanks. It will also keep them very close to my casters for invoke.
In the past I haven't been a fan, but I'll be running them with crypt horrors and black knights, so they might be worth holding back and then supporting these anvils.

-Matt

HawaiiMatt wrote:

Tarval wrote:
I guess you use them as they should be used and or build a list around them. That way they are in range of some type of IoN plus other spells to push them forward. That and putting something else out on the board to cause havoc. That way the enemy will focus on said unit instead of the varg...

I'm going to park 4 behind my center in my next game. That will let my fly over my own units can charge units trying to sneak in on my flanks. It will also keep them very close to my casters for invoke.
In the past I haven't been a fan, but I'll be running them with crypt horrors and black knights, so they might be worth holding back and then supporting these anvils.

-Matt

Hmm that's actually a very good idea, might have to borrow that one.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

HawaiiMatt wrote:

Tarval wrote:
I guess you use them as they should be used and or build a list around them. That way they are in range of some type of IoN plus other spells to push them forward. That and putting something else out on the board to cause havoc. That way the enemy will focus on said unit instead of the varg...

I'm going to park 4 behind my center in my next game. That will let my fly over my own units can charge units trying to sneak in on my flanks. It will also keep them very close to my casters for invoke.
In the past I haven't been a fan, but I'll be running them with crypt horrors and black knights, so they might be worth holding back and then supporting these anvils.

-Matt

Automatically Appended Next Post:

BaconUprising wrote:

HawaiiMatt wrote:

Tarval wrote:
I guess you use them as they should be used and or build a list around them. That way they are in range of some type of IoN plus other spells to push them forward. That and putting something else out on the board to cause havoc. That way the enemy will focus on said unit instead of the varg...

I'm going to park 4 behind my center in my next game. That will let my fly over my own units can charge units trying to sneak in on my flanks. It will also keep them very close to my casters for invoke.
In the past I haven't been a fan, but I'll be running them with crypt horrors and black knights, so they might be worth holding back and then supporting these anvils.

-Matt

Hmm that's actually a very good idea, might have to borrow that one.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

BaconUprising wrote:

HawaiiMatt wrote:

Tarval wrote:
I guess you use them as they should be used and or build a list around them. That way they are in range of some type of IoN plus other spells to push them forward. That and putting something else out on the board to cause havoc. That way the enemy will focus on said unit instead of the varg...

I'm going to park 4 behind my center in my next game. That will let my fly over my own units can charge units trying to sneak in on my flanks. It will also keep them very close to my casters for invoke.
In the past I haven't been a fan, but I'll be running them with crypt horrors and black knights, so they might be worth holding back and then supporting these anvils.

-Matt

Hmm that's actually a very good idea, might have to borrow that one.





Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ok sorry about the above post my computers mucking up and no matter how much I edit it it just repeats the post.

HawaiiMatt wrote:
[
I'm going to park 4 behind my center in my next game. That will let my fly over my own units can charge units trying to sneak in on my flanks. It will also keep them very close to my casters for invoke.
In the past I haven't been a fan, but I'll be running them with crypt horrors and black knights, so they might be worth holding back and then supporting these anvils.

-Matt

Most disappointing unit. I not yet had them do anything of value. T4 naked is too much to overcome. S5 is good, but it isn't quite enough.
They don't hit hard enough to win by weight of attacks, and being T4 naked they give up enough combat res that they where they are crumbling.
If anyone has any idea on how to run them with any degree of reliable success I'd love to hear how. So far, the best use I've had for them is flying around and not going into combat. Make my opponent think that they are a threat, but never actually commit to combat, else you lose them, and lose the effect of your opponent trying to deal with them. Basically, they are tau stealth suits.

Even hitting a unit in a flank just results in a combat reform and then a bunch of dead Vargheists.
Vampires can warmachines hunt for a lot cheaper than ~150 to ~200 points.
IMO, vargheists need WS5 Init5, or some type of save.

-Matt

Ok as you have actually had a proper game to experience them I will go with you. I think I might just get crypt horrors as I know for a fact they are as hard as nails and a unit of 12 can deal SO MUCH pain!

I usually run a unit of 3 w/ a Vargoyle and move them up a flank to go warmachine or character hunting and then circle back for some flank/rear charges. They have done wonders for me and with their long charge range getting them into combat is not to hard. You do have to be careful with them, as you know T4 with no save is tough but they can be devastating.

Their pretty scary in units of 7+, less then that and your basicaly just giving easy VP's

Tiarna Fuilteach wrote:
Their pretty scary in units of 7+, less then that and your basicaly just giving easy VP's

When I tried running big units, I found that the lack of save and higher unit value made them worse. A 138 point unit might get ignored for a turn or two.
A 378 point unit doe not get ignored.
Anything Init 5 was putting too big of a dent into them.
Not having a standard, musician and unable to get ranks hurt them too, it's just another slap in the face.
Losing 378 points to dark elf spearmen makes me a sad panda.
God forbid you go up against chaos warriors.

Swap frenzy for hatred, and bump to Init 5, they are worth 46 points.
With the chance for forcing the charge, and init 5 being a pretty hard counter for them, they are too often not worth 46 points.

-Matt