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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/20 23:48:22
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Terminator with Assault Cannon
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ironhand45 wrote:Back in the summer of 2010, my friend took me to his local comic store, getting some tips from a local gamer. This is where my love for 40k, and tabletop in general, originated.
This was back when I could buy a SMTS for around $20-25. Now, thats almost double to close to $40. This is the main reason I'm basically quitting my tabletop gaming until the prices lower even a little.
What does "SMTS" stand for? If it means "Space Marine Tactical Squad," they've been the same price since May 2010-- 37.25 USD. I believe prior to that they were 35.00 USD. It sounds like perhaps the store you went to was giving you an unusually good deal?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/21 10:30:51
Subject: Re:GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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It's total revenue from GW (incl. BL and FW), taken from business reports (financial years starting 1st June), adjusted for inflation.
The bubble marks the time when De Agostini made professional marketing and sold reasonably priced introductory products for LOTR. Since the cooperation ended, the revenue is basically flat and low, in a growing tabletop market.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/04/21 10:34:42
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/21 10:34:48
Subject: Re:GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Ian Pickstock
Nottingham
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Kroothawk wrote:GW raises prices 10-20%, in a few cases 100% per year, and still total revenue is flat.
The price of individual kits has gone up that much. At an army wide basis it varies widely, but it's anywhere from 2% to 15% after inflation, with the average being around 6% per year.
Sod's law I don't have the post that breaks this down. Does anyone have access to it?
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Naaa na na na-na-na-naaa.
Na-na-na-naaaaa.
Hey Jude. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/21 11:08:36
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Stalwart Strike Squad Grey Knight
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Prices are relative and peoples whinging on this has absolutely no bearing on reality.
A tactical squad is expensive.
I buy one tactical squad and I use it week upon week upon week and that doesn't include the time I spend modelling and painting it.
The same week after week we spend on average £10 each on beer and snacks, half a price of a tactical squad on a weekly basis that lasts no longer than a night and we never think of the beer and snacks being expensive.
Its a joke! It might only be small plastic models but they last for as long as you want them whereas beer lasts approximately 90 minutes before you flush it, the after effects in a mixture of pain and pleasure 24 hours.
Is beer so expensive that we're all quitting beer lol.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/21 12:15:15
Subject: Re:GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Its a joke! It might only be small plastic models but they last for as long as you want them whereas beer lasts approximately 90 minutes before you flush it, the after effects in a mixture of pain and pleasure 24 hours.
Now I dont know how much beer costs in the UK , but taking 10 pounds per week you would have two drink a 1 and half litter beer every day [ 5 bottles] and double that on weekend to spend that much on beer here.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/21 13:27:59
Subject: Re:GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Automated Rubric Marine of Tzeentch
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Makumba wrote:Its a joke! It might only be small plastic models but they last for as long as you want them whereas beer lasts approximately 90 minutes before you flush it, the after effects in a mixture of pain and pleasure 24 hours.
Now I dont know how much beer costs in the UK , but taking 10 pounds per week you would have two drink a 1 and half litter beer every day [ 5 bottles] and double that on weekend to spend that much on beer here.
here in aus for a semi decent beer its like $50 for a carton of 24x 330ml bottles..... go to the pub and its $10 a pint
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CSM 20,000 Pts
Daemons 4,000 (ish)
WoC over 10,000
6000+ Pts
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/21 13:40:31
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Esteemed Veteran Space Marine
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I have to question why this topic was even made, considering the OP's sig shows multiple armies, some of which are extremely expensive, and the obvious over-exaggeration of the price increase since 2010.
The OP has a 1000 points of Elysian Drop Troops and yet complains about SM tac squad prices? The OP also claims he can't field a legal SM army, but his sig shows he has 1750 points in SMs (but no tactical marines apparently).
As if we don't have enough posts about people "claiming" they are leaving the hobby because of price, army balance, codex isn't strong enough, a model offends them, GW looked at them wrong, whatever, only to see them continue to post battle reports, questions about the new codex, etc.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/21 14:20:58
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Well armies were cheaper . First o all you didnt have to buy bit kits or flyers or tanks to make them work . 30 marines to make 6 minimax weapons for them 2 units of tac terminators and either some dreads or some speeders and you had a ready army . Right now we not only play higher point games , but also have to buy stuff that costs more and vendettas maybe cheap in points , but not in cash.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/21 15:54:02
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Giggling Nurgling
Columbus, Ohio
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The way I look at it.. Miniature wargaming is a niche market.. All gaming has gotten more expensive over the decades. It seems GW has risen more than the others.. Why? Besides being one one of the more popular companies.. They have their own stores.. Having to pay a somewhat decent salary to their employees.. If they didn't have their own brick and motar stores and sold to local stores only.. I think the price would come down a bit. I do buy a lot of my stuff at my local GW store.. Why? The staff there is out standing and friendly. I will pay a little extra for good service.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/04/21 15:55:06
2000+ points
4000+ points
2000+ish)
1500+ish |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/21 16:02:20
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Ollanius Pius - Savior of the Emperor
Gathering the Informations.
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What store were you going to in NC that had Terminator Squads for $20-$25?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/21 16:04:32
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Waaagh! Warbiker
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ClassicCarraway wrote:I have to question why this topic was even made, considering the OP's sig shows multiple armies, some of which are extremely expensive, and the obvious over-exaggeration of the price increase since 2010.
The OP has a 1000 points of Elysian Drop Troops and yet complains about SM tac squad prices? The OP also claims he can't field a legal SM army, but his sig shows he has 1750 points in SMs (but no tactical marines apparently).
As if we don't have enough posts about people "claiming" they are leaving the hobby because of price, army balance, codex isn't strong enough, a model offends them, GW looked at them wrong, whatever, only to see them continue to post battle reports, questions about the new codex, etc.
I tried to point this out here earlier and got no response. With what he has in his sig he can have allies, an apoc game, and standard games with no problem. I do understand when someone is broke, I also understand when you really can't afford the fun things in life. But you make do. If he REALLY can't afford more troops, play with your current setup.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/21 22:36:36
Subject: Re:GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Decrepit Dakkanaut
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Jim30 over at Warseer wrote:Well I was at Salute today, the fifth time in as many years. Something which I and my friends noticed though was just how downsized the presence of any GW items for sale was compared to previous years. A few years ago GW had a stall on site (selling full price while others around it were doing 20% off, so hardly doing a roaring trade!). Most of the larger retailers present had a very substantial amount of GW stock on their stands, and it would usually seem to sell - the usual round of 10-20% off plus old blisters getting people scrabbling for a bargain.
this year there seemed to be hardly any traders carrying GW, and when it was seen it was in far smaller quantities than before. Wayland for instance had a small GW bit in the middle of its stand, but it was seemingly outnumbered by Warmahordes stock. Very few other retailers who come year after year seemed to have any, and the interest in buying second hand models just didnt seem to be there. I've been going to wargames shows for over 25 years and I have never seen such a low presence of GW stock at a show.
The one bright spot was Forge World who had a big queue at one point, but not much action by late in the day.
By contrast a vast range of new systems were being demoed and shown off with plenty of people like myself investing a lot of money in new toys and systems. This wasn't a convention of old grognards, this was thousands of people (I heard one organiser say that they had 2500 advance sales plus overall numbers were up on last year - at least 5 - possibly 10,000 people were there during the day). The majority of the audience were teens - thirty somethings, with money to spend. The fact is that this is a market which GW should have eating out of its hand, but instead they were playing all manner of systems and I didnt see a single GW demo game or participation game.
It is quite telling that GW not only seems uninterested in trying to sell regular products at these events, but that traders think that on a show where according to some they do 20% of their annual turnover in a day, they felt no need to bring a large amount of GW stuff with them, but still got good levels of sales.
My takeaway (shared by friends with similar views) was that GW is not only divorcing itself from wargaming into being a toy company, but that the interest in their product from a large wargames gathering seems vastly lower than only a couple of years ago. (...)
I didnt even spot the 40K demo games.
Worth looking at what other companies were doing - BF, Gripping Beast, Mantic, Great Escape to name but a few were all running tabletop demos of their kit, with freebies and great stuff to use. Lots of crowds, lots of interest and people spending money on new systems they may not have looked at before.
Thats the thing with a show like Salute - people come with money and a will to spend it if the offer is right. I spent about £250 today all told, and a lot of it was completely unplanned. Now if GW had put a small presence, maybe doing some demo games in the show, who knows who they may have won over and got a bit of extra revenue for very little effort, which could turn into a few new customers. As a company they just dont seem interested in generating new business anymore.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/04/21 22:38:52
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/22 00:26:27
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Thinking of Joining a Davinite Loge
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Kingsley wrote: ironhand45 wrote:Back in the summer of 2010, my friend took me to his local comic store, getting some tips from a local gamer. This is where my love for 40k, and tabletop in general, originated.
This was back when I could buy a SMTS for around $20-25. Now, thats almost double to close to $40. This is the main reason I'm basically quitting my tabletop gaming until the prices lower even a little.
What does "SMTS" stand for? If it means "Space Marine Tactical Squad," they've been the same price since May 2010-- 37.25 USD. I believe prior to that they were 35.00 USD. It sounds like perhaps the store you went to was giving you an unusually good deal?
Hey hey hey back in 1995 I could get a tactical squad from my FLGS for 29.99. I think in the last 15 + years the price for the core units haven't gone up too much. In 3rd edition, the new plastic tactical squad cost $30 and had all of the bits to make anything in the codex with the exception of the heavy weapon. The stuff you see going up constantly are the big ticket items that most people will only get one of ie land raiders, thunder fire cannons, etc. The reason you're seeing a huge price difference from a 2nd edition time frame to now is not the price per model but the fact that the points per model has decreased thus requiring more models to continue to play at the current points. GW went away from a skirmish game because we as customers wanted it. A 5000 point game in 2nd edition is about a 2000 point game in today's standard. Marines were baseline 30 points and characters and psychers were gods on the table top with their point costs to prove it.
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[/sarcasm] |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/22 02:17:07
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Member of the Ethereal Council
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insaniak wrote:You don't need to give up tabletop wargaming just because you're sick of GW's prices... We're living in a golden time, with more choice out there for gamers than we've ever had before when it comes to finding something to play.
And most companies out there aren't as determined to drive away their veteran players as GW seems to be.
That is Highly dependent on where you are. Here, Only Two games Thrive, Warmachine and Warhammer. Dust, Infinity and Malifaux have fallen by the wayside.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/22 04:33:14
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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[MOD]
Making Stuff
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hotsauceman1 wrote:That is Highly dependent on where you are. Here, Only Two games Thrive, Warmachine and Warhammer. Dust, Infinity and Malifaux have fallen by the wayside.
If you don't play a game just because someone else doesn't play it, then that's just one fewer person playing that game.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/22 04:37:19
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Member of the Ethereal Council
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If i wanted to pick up...say infinity. What will i do? there is no place for a game.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/22 05:08:51
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Waaagh! Warbiker
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hotsauceman1 wrote:If i wanted to pick up...say infinity. What will i do? there is no place for a game.
I've had this happen before, I picked up horrorclix only to find out not one person wanted to play in my area. and again with monsterpocaylpse. All I saw from it was lost cash, but cool minis(thankfully).
I won't get into a game unless I find three people playing it locally now.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/22 05:09:22
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Boosting Black Templar Biker
Cincinnati
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hotsauceman1 wrote:If i wanted to pick up...say infinity. What will i do? there is no place for a game.
Well, when I wanted to get into WarmaHordes and my friends were curious, I bought the 2-player starter and demoed it with them. I showed them all of the available factions, and pointed them towards available reading sources (battlecollege, etc.).
Shortly after, everyone bought a battlegroup and some other goodies and we all started playing.
I don't know much about infinity, but if you can do what I did, it might help you out.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/22 05:19:04
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Waaagh! Warbiker
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baritowned wrote: hotsauceman1 wrote:If i wanted to pick up...say infinity. What will i do? there is no place for a game.
Well, when I wanted to get into WarmaHordes and my friends were curious, I bought the 2-player starter and demoed it with them. I showed them all of the available factions, and pointed them towards available reading sources (battlecollege, etc.).
Shortly after, everyone bought a battlegroup and some other goodies and we all started playing.
I don't know much about infinity, but if you can do what I did, it might help you out.
There is another side to that. Like buying the starter and people don't like it.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/22 05:28:26
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Boosting Black Templar Biker
Cincinnati
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That's true, but if one were to go around and ask other people what they would be interested in it could prevent that from happening.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/22 10:20:49
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Major
London
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ironhand45 wrote:Or, like the guys on 40k radio said, they have no foresight and believe that no matter how much they raise prices, people will buy their products.
People will. People are morons.
"I've already bought 3 armies, I've invested too much to be able to give up now"
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/22 10:49:58
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Ian Pickstock
Nottingham
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Fenrir Kitsune wrote: ironhand45 wrote:Or, like the guys on 40k radio said, they have no foresight and believe that no matter how much they raise prices, people will buy their products.
People will. People are morons.
"I've already bought 3 armies, I've invested too much to be able to give up now"
Yeah! Or they like the models.
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Naaa na na na-na-na-naaa.
Na-na-na-naaaaa.
Hey Jude. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/22 11:58:28
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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What bothers me is its taken a great deal of time to get a local gaming group going but their only interest is 40k so if that goes under and they quit I'm stuck back were I was before. Buying models I like to paint and build but never getting to play them. I love the warmachine and hordes models and all the other games as well but non of my locals are interested. O well.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/22 13:12:32
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Major
London
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Nevermind. Ignore list is better than back and forth.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/04/22 13:13:23
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/22 14:18:57
Subject: Re:GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Jovial Plaguebearer of Nurgle
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Ironhand45...I'm not trying to call you out or anything. But, your profile has listed like some 8500+ pts spread across 6+ armies. Now I can understand that buying the new models may be harder with the higher cost of models but you seem to have quite a few already. Maybe you shouldn't quit 40k but instead just not support them when it comes to purchasing their new releases. Don't get me wrong, I'm not support GW by the increase in cost but if I simply could afford anymore model I would just play with what I have. Just my two sense
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/04/22 17:17:46
Subject: GW future (not positive if this will go here)
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Waaagh! Warbiker
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baritowned wrote:That's true, but if one were to go around and ask other people what they would be interested in it could prevent that from happening.
Could is the key word. I did ask around about horrorclix. People seemed interested. But outside of one person nobody bought into a starter. two people playing for a month and we were done. I still won't get into a game unless my FLGS Already has players.
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