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2013/04/21 04:28:33
Subject: 1750 - 50 Shades of Pink Daemons vs Farsight-bomb Tau w/Riptides (Completed)
I need help guys. I can't decide what to name my Tzeentch-Slaanesh daemons. Please vote on which name or names you like or post a name that you like in this thread. Thanks!
This battle is actually a rematch. I've already played 1 game against Adam's Farsight-bomb Tau and lost. That was with my more competitive FMC-spam daemons with 4 flying monstrous creatures. This time, I used my more balanced Tzeentch-Slaanesh daemon army mainly because he hasn't played against it. It's not quite as scary but I think the extra firepower will help. Now if only I can get Perfect Timing (ignore cover) for my Tzeentch Heralds....
Lord of Change - Lvl 3, 2x Greater Gifts (Re-roll Invuln's, 4+ FNP) - Prescience, Foreboding, Flickering Fire
Warlord Trait: Re-roll Daemonic Instability
Herald - Tzeentch, Lvl 3, Loci of Conjuration, Exalted Gift (Grimoire of True Names) - Prescience, Forewarning, Flickering Fire Herald - Tzeentch, Lvl 3, Loci of Conjuration, Exalted Gift (Portaglyph) - Prescience, Forewarning, Flickering Fire
16x Pink Horrors
16x Pink Horrors
15x Seekers of Slaanesh
Daemon Prince - Tzeentch, 3+, Wings, Lvl 3, 2x Greater Gifts (+1W, It Will Not Die!, Re-roll Invuln's) - Warp Speed, Life Leech, Flickering Fire Soulgrinder - Slaanesh, Baleful Torrent
Soulgrinder - Tzeentch, Phlegm
Daemons: This is going to be another interesting battle. Tau is one of those armies who can and will give most armies problems. However, daemons may just be one of the tougher armies for Tau to play against. Daemons have the speed and the resiliency that will give Tau problems. He's going to have to deal 2 flying monstrous creatures, 2 soulgrinders advancing towards him and a unit of seekers with 2++ Invuln's potentially and 3 out of those 5 units will hit his lines by Turn 2. Does he have the firepower to deal with all my units, especially considering his deathstar will be in reserves? I'm not so sure. The 2 riptides and 3 units of fire warriors may not be enough in my opinion. If it was me, I'd feel more comfortable with either 1 more unit of fire warriors or 1 large unit of kroots acting as a screen.
Then again, my opponent has already beaten my daemons once (though with a slightly different Tau build) so it isn't beyond the realm of possibility that he can do it again. In any case, I think this is going to be a good fight. I am looking for some payback and either I'm going to get it or I'm going to get tabled trying.
1 riptide over-charges. The other takes 1W due to a failed over-charge.
He then lights up my Tzeentch soulgrinder with 5 markerlights and my seekers with 7.
Fortunately, he couldn't see my FMC's due to the central impassable terrain.
Riptide only takes off 1 HP from my grinder. However, the rest of his army kills all but 1 seeker. Doh!
Well, so much for my triple-threat daemons. At least he didn't get First Blood.
Daemons 1
Spoiler:
I cast Forewarning and then use the Grimoire on my Warlord. I also cast Prescience on my DP and one of my horror units. Lastly, I cast Forewarning on one of the horror units.
Horrors (with the Grimoire Herald) advance. Seeker hides behind the LOS-blocking terrain to try to deny First Blood to my opponent.
The rest of my army advances. Right horror unit drops off the Portaglyph.
Both FMC's swoop to try to get shots off over the Aegis line.
Portaglyph spawns 3 horrors (using daemonettes as proxies). Shooting by the right horror unit, the 3-horror unit and a scatter by the soulgrinder phelgm manages only to kill 5 fire warriors. I believe either my Herald failed his psychic test or his shooting was denied.
FMC shooting causes much more damage, killing 6 and 5 fire warriors respectively. I gave the closer unit (the front 3 models only) Aegis cover from my Warlord's shooting. My opponent then goes-to-ground with them for 2+ cover but I still manage to kill 6. However, he would pass his Warpflame test to give that unit FNP 6+.
Finally, my Slaanesh grinder runs 8-9".
Tau 2
Spoiler:
Farsight and company drops in for a visit. Otherwise, not much movement by my opponent.
I believe another riptide takes 1W again for a failed Over-charge.
He then hits my Tzeentch grinder and right horror unit (with 4+ Inv from Forewarning) with 5 markerlight hits each and my Slaanesh Grinder for 6.
Fusion blasters blow up my Tzeentch grinder. The explosion kills 3 drones as well. Then plasmas and missiles hitting at BS5(6?) to the rear of my Slaanesh grinder only manages to take off 2 HP and remove its baleful torrent.
My opponent gets First Blood for the Tzeentch grinder.
The rest of his shooting - Gun drones and both of his riptides - kill 10 horrors as well as my Herald.
He also takes out the unit of 3 horrors as well with fire warriors.
Last but not least, he takes out 4 horrors from my left troops.
Overall, a good turn of shooting for my opponent, taking out 1 grinder, the flamer on the other grinder, 1 herald and lots of pink horrors.
Daemons 2
Spoiler:
I cast my psychic powers, including Forewarning on the Slaanesh grinder and Prescience on my DP. I use the Grimoire on my LoC.
DP, grinder and seeker converge onto Farsight's unit. This is how you assault a shooty unit - by charging in with a sacrificial unit first (my seeker).
My Warlord (now with a re-rollable 3++ Invuln thanks to the Grimoire) swoops onto the ruins.
He then fires at the Ethereal's unit. They go-to-ground and I kill 3 warriors and put 1W on his Ethereal. They would pass their Warpflame test and receive 6+ FNP.
Shooting kills several shield drones.
I then charge Farsight's unit. My seeker bites it from Overwatch. My DP challenges Farsight. I smash but he passes his Invuln's. In return, he does 1W to my DP but I pass my Invuln as well. The grinder kills a couple of drones but Farsight would pass morale.
Tau 3
Spoiler:
Tau movement. Riptides jump around.
He fires his entire army at my Warlord. You know, the bird with the re-rollable 3++ and 4+ FNP? They fail to do anything to him, though they did manage to ground him.
In the Assault phase, riptides jump back in to protect his troops.
In combat, I insta-kill Farsight and a couple of suits, thus giving me Slay the Warlord. I then sweep the entire unit and consolidate forwards.
Daemons 3
Spoiler:
This turn I use the Grimoire on my DP but it reduces his Invuln to 6++ instead. DP swoops forwards. My Warlord prepares to assault his riptide.
Grinder and horrors advance. Portaglyph fails to generate troops once again.
Shooting by my DP wipes out his Ethereal and unpainted fire warriors.
Horrors fire at another unit of fire warriors and they break, falling back about 8".
My Warlord fails to hurt his riptide with shooting and so charges in. I think I take2W from Overwatch.
Doesn't matter. I still whip his TMC (Tau monstrous creature) in combat.
At this point, it is just cleanup.
Tau 4
Spoiler:
Tau movement.
Warriors regroup.
It isn't over until the fat lady sings. Despite having 5W, his riptide boosted by some markerlights is able to shoot down my DP! I believe he hit with 2 marker hits and then uses that to raise the BS of his riptide. Then he rolls phenomanally on his shooting, getting 4 rends and a few normal wounds. Because of my 6++ Invuln only, I fail all my saves and my DP croaks. However, I did forget that he was on area terrain and could have taken 5+ cover.
He fails to do anything to my Warlord, however.
Daemons 4
Spoiler:
This turn I will be assaulting with both my soulgrinder and Warlord.
I don't even need to assault his riptide as my horrors with Prescience shoots down his riptide (with 3W remaining).
Before I could charge his last 2 units of fire warriors with my grinder and Warlord, my opponent concedes. He will only have 3 units of pathfinders left after combat.
Aftermath of our battle:
Crushing Victory by 50 Shades of Pink Daemons!!!
This message was edited 20 times. Last update was at 2013/04/23 06:24:55
I dunno how people read those tau lists, but it got every tool to shoot every threat down in his list.
One grinder will die the turn farsight comes, then he will hunt whatever getst close, providing het is putting this markerlights clever, asaulting that unit could prove painfull..
I'll say a light advantage to the tau here.
You have ruled this galaxy for ten thousand years
Yet have little of account to show for your efforts
Order. Unity. Obedience.
We taught the galaxy these things
And we shall do so again.
4500 pts
2013/04/21 07:43:00
Subject: Re:1750 - Need a Name for my Daemons.....vs Farsight-bomb Tau w/Riptides
More possibilities:
Winged Horrors
Horrorseekers
Sexyfeathers
Run a whole lot of wfrp and other rpg's, play The Woods and Kill Team, gather and look mournfully at imperial guard knowing I'll never finish enough to use them on the tabletop
2013/04/21 14:43:18
Subject: 1750 - Need a Name for my Daemons.....vs Farsight-bomb Tau w/Riptides
Daemon list is very light on troops. So is the Tau army. The mission though counter balances this since HS score which I don't think will provide a good indication of either army actual effectiveness.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/04/21 14:45:46
No HitAndRun on the Farsight bomb? I see that posing a problem, as yeah they'll kill a Soul Grinder, then take an assault and die... Tau are light on units, but have enough Markerlights to threaten the FMCs... This'll be a good one. On the one hand the Tau have a lot of shooting, but every unit they lose will hurt a lot. I'm picking Daemons just based on jy2s skill, but this looks to be a real close one.
2013/04/21 15:02:12
Subject: 1750 - Need a Name for my Daemons.....vs Farsight-bomb Tau w/Riptides
problem with Tau list is that once the bomb/Riptides go down those markerlights will be slightly wasted. I think the list has too few units to really take advantage of Markers.
Bee beep boo baap
2013/04/21 15:15:10
Subject: 1750 - Need a Name for my Daemons.....vs Farsight-bomb Tau w/Riptides
Riddick40k wrote: I don't think this is going to go well for the Tau...
I think if he can ground my FMC's early, he'll have the advantage. If not, I think I will have the advantage.
LValx wrote: Tau list is too top heavy, i'd imagine you wipe the floor with him.
I agree about the top heavy part, though I wouldn't be as confident about the "wiping the floor" part.
I'm not too big on Farsight's deathstar unit, however, he did do very well with them in our 1st game. In our 1st game, he ran a slightly smaller unit with only 4 bodyguards and no shield drones. Farsight's unit killed a soulgrinder and 1 unit of horrors with Herald. However, what was most remarkable (or lucky, I should say) was that they killed my charging DP (with 3W still).....on Overwatch!!!
Still, if it was me, I'd prefer a normal Commander with Iridium suit and bodyguards instead.
Valek wrote: I dunno how people read those tau lists, but it got every tool to shoot every threat down in his list.
One grinder will die the turn farsight comes, then he will hunt whatever getst close, providing het is putting this markerlights clever, asaulting that unit could prove painfull..
I'll say a light advantage to the tau here.
His list does have the tools to deal with most opponents. However, I'd probably cut back on Farsight's unit (too many points) and some pathfinders to fit in another unit of fire warriors or kroots. I'd probably go with no more than 3x6 pathfinders.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Dozer Blades wrote: Daemon list is very light on troops. So is the Tau army. The mission though counter balances this since HS score which I don't think will provide a good indication of either army actual effectiveness.
Yeah, both lists have that weakness. The Portaglyph may help but it is not even guaranteed that I'd get even 1 unit of troops from it (that's happened before to me). Tau may be even worse because his troops aren't as resilient to psychic, flying daemons. If I get Perfect Timing, his troops are toast!
Big Guns here benefit me more. I've got 3 highly resilient heavies whereas my Tau opponent has no heavy supports at all.
jifel wrote: No HitAndRun on the Farsight bomb? I see that posing a problem, as yeah they'll kill a Soul Grinder, then take an assault and die... Tau are light on units, but have enough Markerlights to threaten the FMCs... This'll be a good one. On the one hand the Tau have a lot of shooting, but every unit they lose will hurt a lot. I'm picking Daemons just based on jy2s skill, but this looks to be a real close one.
That would be a good wargear for Farsight. But I suspect my opponent is still just experimenting with his Farsight bomb. I will give him the suggestion the next time we meet.
LValx wrote: problem with Tau list is that once the bomb/Riptides go down those markerlights will be slightly wasted. I think the list has too few units to really take advantage of Markers.
Yeah, I think he's invested slightly too much into his markerlights. I'd probably cut back to 3x6 instead of 3x8 if I was him. I believe this is the first time he's spamming those pathfinders so it's a trial for him.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/04/21 16:18:27
I voted for Sexyfeathers...too funny! I think Tau is going down. He has no way to grab objectives. Farsight bomb is a trap.
I play:
40K: Daemons, Tau
AoS: Blades of Khorne, Disciples of Tzeentch
Warmachine: Convergence of Cyriss
Infinity: Haqqislam, Tohaa
Malifaux: Bayou
Star Wars Legion: Republic & Separatists
MESBG: Far Harad, Misty Mountains
2013/04/22 07:07:56
Subject: 1750 - Need a Name for my Daemons.....vs Farsight-bomb Tau w/Riptides
Yay! GO SEXYFEATHERS has quite a ring to it I think
Run a whole lot of wfrp and other rpg's, play The Woods and Kill Team, gather and look mournfully at imperial guard knowing I'll never finish enough to use them on the tabletop
2013/04/22 14:39:44
Subject: Re:1750 - Need a Name for my Daemons.....vs Farsight-bomb Tau w/Riptides
I saw you and the Tau guy playing at Gamekastle on Thursday I believe. You were palying eldar vs him though. ((i was the guy with the star wars card game))
cool to see you guys post reports here!
Tell your friend to try out the farsunstar!!!! its the best bang for the buck with the star but comes in 900ish points!
I saw you and the Tau guy playing at Gamekastle on Thursday I believe. You were palying eldar vs him though. ((i was the guy with the star wars card game))
cool to see you guys post reports here!
Tell your friend to try out the farsunstar!!!! its the best bang for the buck with the star but comes in 900ish points!
He can read my thread in the tactics forum on it.
The eldar player is actually Grant (aka SonsofGrant here on dakka).
I'll mention your Farsunstar to my Tau opponent. It's an interesting but really expensive unit!
From wrote: What a shame it seems as though I am too late to suggest my name for your army.
The Changer of Plays
More appropriate for bloodbowl I suppose.
Yeah, sorry but the name's already been decided. Though I suppose I can still add it to the poll just to see how many like it.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/04/23 00:23:21
bagtagger wrote: Do monsterous creatures get area terrain cover saves? I thought they could only get cover from los blocking terrain.
This is a change form 5th edition, they used to only benefit from being 50% obscured, but now benefit from area terrain, intervening models, et cetera.
I really do not like that farsight bomb. It has no target locks so you have to focus your whole unit at one target, It has no vector thrusts so it can't get out of combat, and the weapons seem a little off. If that unit had vector thrusts it could have hit and run and probably killed the other soul grinder. I also felt like it was placed in an odd area where three units could assault it. I feel if the far sight unit could have been properly utilized tau would have had more of a chance.
2013/04/23 02:47:50
Subject: Re:1750 - 50 Shades of Pink Daemons vs Farsight-bomb Tau w/Riptides (Completed)
This is a change form 5th edition, they used to only benefit from being 50% obscured, but now benefit from area terrain, intervening models, et cetera.
Thanks calypso2ts.
Yeah, this is one of the changes from 5th that many people are still not aware of. You need to be physically obscured (25%) by the ruin walls to get 4+ cover. However, MC's can now benefit from area terrain just like standard infantry.
Walkers and vehicles, on the other hand, still needs to be 25% obscured and get no benefits from area terrain that do not physically obscure them.
lambsandlions wrote: I really do not like that farsight bomb. It has no target locks so you have to focus your whole unit at one target, It has no vector thrusts so it can't get out of combat, and the weapons seem a little off. If that unit had vector thrusts it could have hit and run and probably killed the other soul grinder. I also felt like it was placed in an odd area where three units could assault it. I feel if the far sight unit could have been properly utilized tau would have had more of a chance.
I believe his unit does have target locks because he was firing at 3 different units (both grinders and 1 unit of horrors). Yeah, vector-thrusts would definitely be a good idea for the unit. Just give it to one of the body guards.
As for putting it in a "odd" place, I don't think that could be avoided given that he was trying to kill both of my soulgrinders. He had a good plan. Fusions to 1 grinder. S7 to the rear of the other grinder, both of whom he put a lot of markerlights on. He was actually expecting to kill both and to have to deal with just my DP. He also didn't see my seeker coming to mess up his Overwatch plans as well.
I'm not sure how else he could have played his Farsight bomb. It was his best chance at taking out my soulgrinders, though personally, I wouldn't run such a large unit (actually, personally, I wouldn't even go with Farsight at all).
The problem with vector thrusters for Tau is their low initiative... Still it's better than nothing. I really think the Farsight bomb was poorly played.
Dozer Blades wrote: The problem with vector thrusters for Tau is their low initiative... Still it's better than nothing. I really think the Farsight bomb was poorly played.
50/50 to get out of combat for only 5-pts?!? Hell yeah! It's a no-brainer.
But you're also going to need the Puretide Engram Neurochip (PEN) to give them stubborn so that they don't get swept before they can get out of combat.
LValx wrote: Saw that coming from 2 miles away. Farsight bomb with no ATSKNF or HnR is a bad idea.
It's a suicide unit that's too expensive and valuable (Warlord) to suicide with. With the exception of our 1st game, every time I've played against Farsight, I've managed to kill him and his squad, both in 5th and in 6th. So yeah, I'm not really a big fan of him either.
Though he does open up a lot of tactical flexibility to an otherwise static army.....
Yeah, at too high a cost. The defensive abilities arent that great unless you add the shrouding IC and add a Libby with Gate. Then you can defend a little better by deep striking around, then your spending a ridiculous amount on it though!
Bee beep boo baap
2013/04/23 04:34:34
Subject: Re:1750 - 50 Shades of Pink Daemons vs Farsight-bomb Tau w/Riptides (Completed)
I honestly Liked the Tau's player's list just some major key rolls went totally out of his favor( Not dropping both those Soul Grinders hurt). I really didn't care for the Riptides in this opening game of my first time seeing them but it's early so ehhh.
Simply put though not to take away from Jy2 because he's obviously a great general and brings a hard list; the Cheese Bird of Change has to be one of the best characters in the game right now as when there are no psychic hindering units on the field he's down right OP when the dice are hot and the powers are good. He just goes straight up God mode and says "I see the future" hence I save everything and I kill everything. I think that he may have just beat out the top spot against the Flyrant for FMC with deathspitters given his resiliency and overall buffs he gives to other units.
@ Jy2
I gotta say that in the games you've posted so far and the daemon players I've played the polygryph has yet to really do anything xD should probably take the one that makes the daemon prince more beasty in combat. Another Thing; although not as fast 15 seekers of slaanesh have you tried running a large group of 20 bloodletters and giving them the 2++ and seeing how much carnage they can dish out? If not you should try it simply put if you want a gun magnet that is the biggest gun magnet you can probably get for 200 points and still be so resilient and then affective in crashing lines. Ideally you would deepstrike them next to a unit that has an icon so that they don't scatter so you can keep them unmolested but I'm sure running them down field would still draw a rediculous amount of fire, did I mention 200 points for 20 guys with ap3 weapons and a 2++ meaning you got roughly 400 points to throw out to something you wish you had but don't have like more scoring units <
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2013/04/23 04:42:50
2500pts 2000
2013/04/23 04:53:02
Subject: 1750 - 50 Shades of Pink Daemons vs Farsight-bomb Tau w/Riptides (Completed)
LValx wrote: Saw that coming from 2 miles away. Farsight bomb with no ATSKNF or HnR is a bad idea.
It's a suicide unit that's too expensive and valuable (Warlord) to suicide with. With the exception of our 1st game, every time I've played against Farsight, I've managed to kill him and his squad, both in 5th and in 6th. So yeah, I'm not really a big fan of him either.
Though he does open up a lot of tactical flexibility to an otherwise static army.....
That seems to be the general problem with deep strike units. By putting a unit (especially one that's so expensive) in reserve, you're forgoing a round or two of shooting and field presence. The surprise of showing up anywhere the board is usually not worth it for that trade.
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