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-What are the stats of abbadon and a swarmlord??? Also he is not that easy to kill because he has eternal warrior so he cant be insta killed. He can instant kill other toughness 4 hqs easily too. His shooting is good with rerolls to wound and against ghazgull thraka in a character bash on 24 x 24 board he pwns by 1-2 wounds

xdras wrote:
-What are the stats of abbadon and a swarmlord??? Also he is not that easy to kill because he has eternal warrior so he cant be insta killed. He can instant kill other toughness 4 hqs easily too. His shooting is good with rerolls to wound and against ghazgull thraka in a character bash on 24 x 24 board he pwns by 1-2 wounds

Apart from not being allowed to post specific things, I'll try to help here:

Abaddon has Marneus Calgar's stats with these modifiers:

WS +1
BS +0
Str +0
T +1
W+0
I +1
A +0 (And an extra one for having two special weapons, and gets +2 on the charge)
LD +0
[2+ armour save]
[4+ Inv save]

He has the choice between using the Talon of Horus, (which gives his attacks x2 strength, Ap3, Shred), and Drach'nyen (which gives his attacks +D6 attacks, +1 Str, Ap2).
He has Eternal Warrior, can get buffs from the Chaos Boon table, Hatred (against all Space Marines), Fearless, and all of his attacks are at I6.

And he only costs 15 points more.

EDIT: Oh, and he also has a twin-linked bolter for shooting, and has this Warlord Trait:

--Black Crusader: All friendly units within 12" have Preferred Enemy (Space Marines)

xdras wrote:
-What are the stats of abbadon and a swarmlord???

Swarmlord: http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1460211a

Abbadon: http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440207a&prodId=prod1160030a (EDIT: See above post)


Very little can actually stand up to the Swarmlord in close combat truth be told, especially if he gets certain psychic buffs.

 Strat_N8 wrote:

xdras wrote:
-What are the stats of abbadon and a swarmlord???

Swarmlord: http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1460211a

Abbadon: http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440207a&prodId=prod1160030a


Very little can actually stand up to the Swarmlord in close combat truth be told, especially if he gets certain psychic buffs.

That's Abaddon's old lineup. He no longer has a personal icon, and the Str 4(8) is only in effect with one of his weapons. And T4(5) is permanent.

 Selym wrote:

 Strat_N8 wrote:

xdras wrote:
-What are the stats of abbadon and a swarmlord???

Swarmlord: http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1460211a

Abbadon: http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440207a&prodId=prod1160030a


Very little can actually stand up to the Swarmlord in close combat truth be told, especially if he gets certain psychic buffs.

That's Abaddon's old lineup. He no longer has a personal icon, and the Str 4(8) is only in effect with one of his weapons. And T4(5) is permanent.

Ah, ok! I didn't know if he changed much with the new chaos book so I just assumed it would be close to accurate. The statline provided for the Swarmlord is still current though.

From a purely buff the rest of your army perspective epidemius is solid. Eldrad is the one I consistently hate playing against

I'd also say that with some luck for Psyker power rolls and Warlord Traits, the Swarmlord is actually the best HQ in the game. With Iron Arm, Endurance, and Warp speed to pick from the Swarmlord becomes disgusting while the TK shield lets him deflect those annoying krak missiles. Warlord traits can hand him some pretty neat buffs.

Given that a hulked out Swarmlord's victory is assured in challenges, legendary fighter can be a cheap way to get victory points, 4-6 on the strategic table can also be neat, and coordinated assault is always nice for having that much more cushion for charge ranges. His own special rules are also pretty nice, handing out buffs to units that could use them, providing a nice, wide synapse radius, and helping you get those Ymgarls into play sooner. Outflanking is garbage these days though, so I wouldn't worry about it.

And of course, the Swarmlord has an insanely high WS stat, easily one of the highest in the entire game. He's going to get to hit pretty much anything on a 3+ while the vast majority of enemies will only ever get a 5+ in assault, a 5+ that has to get through his high toughness (that can become so high that most models in the game can't even hurt him in assault), and decent saves as well as his superior initiative to the majority of beatstick units.

Forcing enemies to reroll their precious inv saves is invaluable, as is always causing instant death all the time which is excellent for gutting other people's MCs and pesky multiwound bricks like Paladins, Wraiths, and Nobs. Furthermore, the Swarmlord can be accompanied by the criminally underrated Tyrant guard who are themselves pretty hefty bricks and can have a Tyranid Prime tag along too. A full swarmlord brick can crumple just about any unit in the game like so much tissue paper while having a much smaller footprint than a Calgar+Honor guard/Assault termy brick.

Overall, the Swarmlord is a true gem in an otherwise lackluster codex. And hey, the Swarmlord took Calgar's lunch money in the fluff as easily as he'll take Calgar's lunch money on the tabletop.

Eldrad. Three spells/turn and two can be cast twice. Those spells almost always succeed. Resistant to perils (+3) when the happen. Causes all enemy spells to fail 50% of the time & perils 45% of the time. Sword ignores armor & always wounds on 2+. 3+ invulnerable save. Also allows you to repositions between 3-5 units after deployment.

I think i'll compare Marneus Calgar, to an Iphone.

Yeah, it's great and all, but I could probably go elsewhere and get something just as useful, for half the cost.

IMHO, the best characters to tear him a new one are:
Abbadon
Swarm lord
Skarbrand
Bloodthirster
Kharn?
Daemon Prince??

The best army buffers are:
Typhus, though he's sort of in the middle
Coteaz

However there is probably more for each list, but Calgar ïs actually pretty bad compared to other SM HQs. Take Vulkan with lots of melta and flamer weapons. Stick him in a TH/SS blob in a LR, at least until the new codex comes out...

Take a weird boy and you can turn him into a sqwig! Trust me it nearly happened to me, I only just passed my Insative roll.

Take a LoC and you can change him into a spawn. Take Ork allies and have a spawn squig.

 n0t_u wrote:
Take a LoC and you can change him into a spawn. Take Ork allies and have a spawn squig.

Lords of change can't do that fun anymore

Damn. -.-

I am thinking Ezekiel may be an interesting choice.

Mindworm gives him a big boost in the first round of CC.
He has access to Divination spells to boost units around him.
He can go for the Force weapon kill.
And most importantly he costs half of what the other beatstick characters cost.

Eldrad, is this a contest? For a little over a fully kitted out farseer you get everything he gets, a 3+ invul, ignores armour, Mastery level 3, casts 1 power twice, re-deploying, and to put the cherry on top T4.

The amount of force multiplication he gives out is amazing, and he is one of the few units keeping the entire elder codex viable. You can keep your power fists and daemon swords, all eldrad needs is his brain and some runes of rape...I mean warding.

 Evileyes wrote:

Lords of change can't do that fun anymore

Au contraire!

If you give them a Mutating Warpblade, characters be turnin' into spawnz!

Iranna.

Ghazghkull Mag Uruk Thraka will, with the proppa application of Waaaagh!, kill any other HQ in close combat.

This includes Swarmy Ab-baby, and that stupid GK Librarian with the re-rollable 2++ save.

Check and mate.

 ALEXisAWESOME wrote:
Eldrad, is this a contest? For a little over a fully kitted out farseer you get everything he gets, a 3+ invul, ignores armour, Mastery level 3, casts 1 power twice, re-deploying, and to put the cherry on top T4.

The amount of force multiplication he gives out is amazing, and he is one of the few units keeping the entire elder codex viable. You can keep your power fists and daemon swords, all eldrad needs is his brain and some runes of rape...I mean warding.

The space marine scum won't listen to us because they know it is true that Eldrad puts them all to shame. Lets not also forget that Eldrad has some what viable offensive spells that most people forget about. O' you have a warlord in that squad? Lets have a dance of the mind shall we? If only we could roll on biomancy then I would iron arm the Avatar all day.

Our phoenix lords are also something that can go into the running. Have ya seen Fuegan?

I have always hated and feared Mephiston. While one can argue back and forth forever about stats and what not, the reality is that in a game in which he uses his wings to engage, essentially, non 2+ armor targets, he bats the crap out of all of them. In fact he does it so FAST that he has time to kill 3 or four units a game and still survive. that return is hard to beat.

Abaddon is the one I probably think is ruthlessly good and a very close race there. when he rolls big on a Daemon weapon, it's not a good scene.

 Evileyes wrote:
I think i'll compare Marneus Calgar to an Iphone. Yeah, it's great and all, but I could probably go elsewhere and get something just as useful, for half the cost.

Or as I say - it's a great piece of equipment for surfing and using apps, but compared to a basic phone it sucks when you actually need to make a call or receive one. Bad reception, bad interaction with bluetooth handsfree.

Same for Calgar. He's a nice beatstick in certain scenarios but usually you'd get more out of cheaper generic HQs.

I've seen a few people say Eldrad cast 3 spells a turn. I thought it was 4. Isn't he used as an example in the BRB?

My bad, just read through the BRB and the FAQs. Says he has 4 spells in the FAQ.

Calgar is tough, but hes not the top dog.

As mentioned -- Swarmlord, Abbadon, and a few others can take his lunch money.

DAaddict wrote:
I am thinking Ezekiel may be an interesting choice.

Mindworm gives him a big boost in the first round of CC.
He has access to Divination spells to boost units around him.
He can go for the Force weapon kill.
And most importantly he costs half of what the other beatstick characters cost.

Ezekiels Mindworm debuff is permanent, not just one turn

Don't worry OP, new SM codex is possibly out in October and maybe we'll see 'Old 2 Gloves' ramped up in fight or (preferably) down in cost. He's a great all rounder, as a good Ultramarine should be, but as already mentioned too pricey in pts.

I still have fond memories of kitting him out with 'Combat Drugs' and rampaging through a Nid army or 2, good times....

If you've ever faced Yarrick you will know real pain

Calgar dies when he is killed.

Celestine does not.

Advantage: Celestine.

reaper with no name wrote:
Calgar dies when he is killed.

#

Thank you. I was hoping someone would swing the bat at that particular pitch.

GTKA666 wrote:

 ALEXisAWESOME wrote:
Eldrad, is this a contest? For a little over a fully kitted out farseer you get everything he gets, a 3+ invul, ignores armour, Mastery level 3, casts 1 power twice, re-deploying, and to put the cherry on top T4.

The amount of force multiplication he gives out is amazing, and he is one of the few units keeping the entire elder codex viable. You can keep your power fists and daemon swords, all eldrad needs is his brain and some runes of rape...I mean warding.

The space marine scum won't listen to us because they know it is true that Eldrad puts them all to shame. Lets not also forget that Eldrad has some what viable offensive spells that most people forget about. O' you have a warlord in that squad? Lets have a dance of the mind shall we? If only we could roll on biomancy then I would iron arm the Avatar all day.

Our phoenix lords are also something that can go into the running. Have ya seen Fuegan?

'cept that Mind War is now a focussed witchfire power, so in order to actually pick the target you have to roll under 5 on the leadership test.

Personally, I think Ahriman is better than Calgar. Sure, he doesn't have the massive cost advantage of all these others, and he's only AP4... but my Ahriman has killed C'tan in close combat.

Against Calgar? He wounds on 2s and has a 4++ save against those fists. He's not going down easy, especially if he gets Iron Arm for defence.