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Made in za
Fixture of Dakka




Temple Prime

And yeah there are 40k comics, but because Boom! is such a tiny company they are nearly impossible to find.

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.



 
   
Made in hr
Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator




Croatia

 Kain wrote:
And yeah there are 40k comics, but because Boom! is such a tiny company they are nearly impossible to find.

I have all of them !!! Tankred endures and all that. ...But I think talking about ethnicity isn't really fair especially when there has been so many mutations over generations...O and don't forget landscape changes, warp storms etc....


ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."

Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan


 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran



South Portsmouth, KY USA

On Salamanders:

With all the volcanoes and fire lore, they really seem to have been modeled after the Polynesian peoples and should therefore be "brown"-skinned. Ash black, IMHO, is lazy and disingenuous and the red eyes are just dumb, period. Give them a real ethnic flavor not this "too lazy to paint tanned flesh, so we'll say they are black - really black; and give them red eyes so as to make them totally gonzo weird" feldercarb and give some diversity to things. Heck we already have space vikings, space germans, space romans, and space russians, lets try something else for inspiration, no one will be upset. But straight up black skin, you have got to be kidding me.

Armies: Space Marines, IG, Tyranids, Eldar, Necrons, Orks, Dark Eldar.
I am the best 40k player in my town, I always win! Of course, I am the only player of 40k in my town.

Check out my friends over at Sea Dog Game Studios, they always have something cooking: http://www.sailpowergame.com. Or if age of sail isn't your thing check out the rapid fire sci-fi action of Techcommander http://www.techcommandergame.com
 
   
Made in nz
Longtime Dakkanaut





The Roman god Vulcan was the god of fire, including exploding volcanoes. The polynesians don't come into it.
The salamanders are black and red because that is the colour of lava, cooler black of solidified rock on the top, red molten rock underneath.
I've no idea about the names of the Salamanders, they could be asian or african or completely made up. Not given it much thought.
   
Made in hr
Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator




Croatia

Again, I wonder how average Roman looks like :-)


Theme =/= Ethnicity

ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."

Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan


 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran



South Portsmouth, KY USA

So the fact that the Polynesian peoples live on islands in the Pacific ocean, in an area known for seismic activity and hence volcanoes, which formed a large number of those islands (therefore 'volcanic islands'), would mean nothing to you?

I'll grant you that there is a wide use of Greek mythology involved, but the flavor of the army was originally intended as being Polynesian. Its just like originally the Deathwing and in fact the Dark Angels themselves were intended to have a very strong Native American vibe, however many of their names did not reflect that. So names should be considered aside from flavor.

Armies: Space Marines, IG, Tyranids, Eldar, Necrons, Orks, Dark Eldar.
I am the best 40k player in my town, I always win! Of course, I am the only player of 40k in my town.

Check out my friends over at Sea Dog Game Studios, they always have something cooking: http://www.sailpowergame.com. Or if age of sail isn't your thing check out the rapid fire sci-fi action of Techcommander http://www.techcommandergame.com
 
   
Made in hr
Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator




Croatia

xraytango wrote:
So the fact that the Polynesian peoples live on islands in the Pacific ocean, in an area known for seismic activity and hence volcanoes, which formed a large number of those islands (therefore 'volcanic islands'), would mean nothing to you?

I'll grant you that there is a wide use of Greek mythology involved, but the flavor of the army was originally intended as being Polynesian. Its just like originally the Deathwing and in fact the Dark Angels themselves were intended to have a very strong Native American vibe, however many of their names did not reflect that. So names should be considered aside from flavor.


No, dude you're 100% right..Just refering to UM are Roman misconception, because Roman empire was gigantic and consistent from many nations...Climate is everything when we are talking about physical appearance...If you just go by the theory of ice melting and Africa being the birthplace of humanity ofc

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/06/24 00:39:29


ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."

Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan


 
   
Made in nz
Longtime Dakkanaut





xraytango wrote:
So the fact that the Polynesian peoples live on islands in the Pacific ocean, in an area known for seismic activity and hence volcanoes, which formed a large number of those islands (therefore 'volcanic islands'), would mean nothing to you?

Correct.

Volcanic activity is also present in the Mediterranean and the name of the Salamanders Primarch is the Roman god of fire, not a Polynesian god. The word volcano comes an Italian island called Volcano which was originally named for the god.

I'll grant you that there is a wide use of Greek mythology involved, but the flavor of the army was originally intended as being Polynesian. Its just like originally the Deathwing and in fact the Dark Angels themselves were intended to have a very strong Native American vibe, however many of their names did not reflect that. So names should be considered aside from flavor.

Give evidence of this polynesian theme to the early Salamanders. I've never seen anything to suggest this is true.
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran



South Portsmouth, KY USA

Darth, thanks for agreeing, though I was addressing cadbren's remark that the Salamanders were supposed to be Greek.

IIRC, the original fluff on them said that on their planet they lived on archipelagoes, hence islands. Now there are Greek islands, but that is not what one thinks of when we think of Greece.. Volcanoes + Islands = sounds a lot like Polynesia and a darker skinned people.

I believe the back story is in Codex: Armageddon, or Chapter Approved.

Conversley, if I say, "Hawaii", or , "Tahiti"; what do you think of?

Armies: Space Marines, IG, Tyranids, Eldar, Necrons, Orks, Dark Eldar.
I am the best 40k player in my town, I always win! Of course, I am the only player of 40k in my town.

Check out my friends over at Sea Dog Game Studios, they always have something cooking: http://www.sailpowergame.com. Or if age of sail isn't your thing check out the rapid fire sci-fi action of Techcommander http://www.techcommandergame.com
 
   
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Longtime Dakkanaut





 DarthMarko wrote:
Again, I wonder how average Roman looks like :-)


Theme =/= Ethnicity


Roman, as in ancient Romans. That is what is being referred to. The Ultramarines mainly use names derived from ancient Greek and Roman names. The use of Consuls, the short swords they use are based on the Roman gladius and so on.
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran



South Portsmouth, KY USA

I always understood the UMs to be based on the Roman Legions, but that doesn't mean that UMs are all Italian, lol!


Armies: Space Marines, IG, Tyranids, Eldar, Necrons, Orks, Dark Eldar.
I am the best 40k player in my town, I always win! Of course, I am the only player of 40k in my town.

Check out my friends over at Sea Dog Game Studios, they always have something cooking: http://www.sailpowergame.com. Or if age of sail isn't your thing check out the rapid fire sci-fi action of Techcommander http://www.techcommandergame.com
 
   
Made in hr
Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator




Croatia

xraytango wrote:
I always understood the UMs to be based on the Roman Legions, but that doesn't mean that UMs are all Italian, lol!





Imagine Gino, Paulie & Tony as UM....

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/06/24 01:08:00


ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."

Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan


 
   
Made in nz
Longtime Dakkanaut





xraytango wrote:
Darth, thanks for agreeing, though I was addressing cadbren's remark that the Salamanders were supposed to be Greek.

IIRC, the original fluff on them said that on their planet they lived on archipelagoes, hence islands. Now there are Greek islands, but that is not what one thinks of when we think of Greece..

For those of us who have studied ancient Greece, yes it is. The Aegean islands are very important to the Greek World.
In regards Volcano I had to look it up. It is part of a chain of islands off the northern coast of Sicily. It is part of the Volcanic chain that includes Mt Vesuvius to the north on the Italian mainland and Mt Etna to the south on Sicily.
Many of these places were Greek colonies that eventually got swallowed up by the Roman Empire.

Volcanoes + Islands = sounds a lot like Polynesia and a darker skinned people.

The complete absence of any polynesian names or cultural references would suggest this is not the case. The Japanese also live on an archipelago with volcanic activity.


Conversley, if I say, "Hawaii", or , "Tahiti"; what do you think of?

Polynesia, and the absence of such names from the Salamanders background tells me they were never considered to be polynesians.
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran



South Portsmouth, KY USA

Hmm, that's funny I've studied ancient Greece as well, but to me the Salamanders didn't represent that culture as well as a distinct Polynesian did.. I don't deny the connection there what with the maritime activities of the ancient Greeks, but to represent them there would be a stronger bend toward more popular subjects as the city-states, the Spartans, Phillip's Macedonian unification, and the emergence of democracy and philosophy.

As we know the writers at GW like to hodge-podge things together in their fluff, so is it really so unreasonable to think that physically Sallies could represent Polynesians yet mine the Greeks for names.

I believe that there was in fact something said at a Games Day about them representing Polynesians.


Armies: Space Marines, IG, Tyranids, Eldar, Necrons, Orks, Dark Eldar.
I am the best 40k player in my town, I always win! Of course, I am the only player of 40k in my town.

Check out my friends over at Sea Dog Game Studios, they always have something cooking: http://www.sailpowergame.com. Or if age of sail isn't your thing check out the rapid fire sci-fi action of Techcommander http://www.techcommandergame.com
 
   
Made in hr
Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator




Croatia

cadbren wrote:


The Japanese also live on an archipelago with volcanic activity.



Yes but you have to look at shifting tectonic plates through history, which made Japan - Japan...Ice age and all that factors...

I mean we are talking about skin pigmentation?

My soon to be wife is geophysicists and I can't belive that I actually remeber that.....

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/06/24 01:43:07


ADB: I showed the Wolves revealing the key weakness at the heart of the World Eaters; showing Angron that his Legion was broken and worthless compared to the others; that he was the one primarch who couldn't trust his own warriors, and that they didn't care if he lived or died; showing that loyalty to brothers and sons is the heart of success for the Legiones Astartes, to the point even Lorgar makes a big deal out of saying the World Eaters and their primarch were massively outclassed by Russ, and Angron was too stupid to see the lesson Russ had sacrificed time, sweat, and blood, to teach. We're talking about a battle the Wolves won, by isolating the enemy general through pack tactics, and threatening to kill him, without a hope of defending himself. It was a balance, 50/50 - Angron overpowered Russ, and the Wolves were losing ground to the World Eaters; but Russ and his warriors had Angron by the balls, and barely broke a sweat. They won, no question. Lorgar even says: "The Wolves won, meathead."

Dorn won’t help you either. He’s too busy being the Emperor’s groundskeeper, hiding behind the palace walls. The Wolf is too busy cutting off heads as our father’s executioner, while the Lion holds on to his secrets, and has no special fondness for you. Who else will come? Not Ferrus, certainly. Nor Corax either. Even as we speak, I suspect he flees for Deliverance. Sanguinius?’ Curze laughed cruelly. ‘The angel is more cursed than I. The Khan? He does not wish to be found. So who is left? No one, Vulkan. None of them will come. You are simply not that important. You are alone.’ Konrad Curze to Vulkan


 
   
Made in nz
Longtime Dakkanaut





 DarthMarko wrote:
cadbren wrote:


The Japanese also live on an archipelago with volcanic activity.



I mean we are talking about skin pigmentation?



The other guy was suggesting that Salamanders were Polynesians because they have dark skin and live on volcanic islands. No polynesians have black skin though and none of their culture is represented in the fluff. Polynesians speak a similar language to one another, have the same basic gods and share a practice of tattooing themselves. It wouldn't be difficult to have called the Primarch of the Salamandars Ra, it would even have fit in with Horus' name, or said they heavily tattoo themselves or given them Polynesian names. Instead their Primarch is named after the Roman god of fire and their main legion/chapter icon is fire, other than the dragon head of course and what are dragons famous for - breathing fire.
I looked at the name Nocturne. I figured it had something to do with nocturnal (relating to the night) but it actually refers to a christian prayer said at midnight by priests,monks and the like. Matins or Nocturne includes the recital of Psalm 94 (look it up yourself) which is interesting in that it has an "the Emperor Protects" feel about it.

   
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Mutating Changebringer





New Hampshire, USA

If humans are around in the year 40k after years of nuclear war and disease and such...

There wouldn't be enough diversity left in the gene-pool to have multiple races. There would only be brown haired, brown eyed, brown skinned humans.

Khorne Daemons 4000+pts
 
   
Made in gb
Sinewy Scourge




 DeffDred wrote:
If humans are around in the year 40k after years of nuclear war and disease and such...

There wouldn't be enough diversity left in the gene-pool to have multiple races. There would only be brown haired, brown eyed, brown skinned humans.


This makes no sense... What's your basis for this assumption, it doesn't gel with my understanding of genetics.
   
Made in us
The Conquerer






Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios

Especially given that humans began leaving earth's system roughly around M15(and prior to that had colonized the solar system)

That would create different gene pools for the future colonists.


If anything, there is more genetic diversity in M41.

Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines

Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.

MURICA!!! IN SPESS!!! 
   
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Consigned to the Grim Darkness





USA

Or there should be anyway, but everyone is instead depicted as Caucasian.

The people in the past who convinced themselves to do unspeakable things were no less human than you or I. They made their decisions; the only thing that prevents history from repeating itself is making different ones.
-- Adam Serwer
My blog
 
   
Made in us
Mutating Changebringer





New Hampshire, USA

Drager wrote:
 DeffDred wrote:
If humans are around in the year 40k after years of nuclear war and disease and such...

There wouldn't be enough diversity left in the gene-pool to have multiple races. There would only be brown haired, brown eyed, brown skinned humans.


This makes no sense... What's your basis for this assumption, it doesn't gel with my understanding of genetics.


Once upon a time Humans had striped hair, spotted hair, wildly long eyebrows, purple eyes and many other variations of pigments and genetic "flaws".

Giants and Hobbits existed in the ancient past (see National Geographic). As did trolls and ogres (see Da Vinci's grotesques).

People also had horns, eyestocks, scales, and other odd external bone growths (see Mutter Museum, Pennsylvania).

There would be a much wider range of genetics if we hadn't had events like the Black Death and WW2.

Edited to add further citation.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/06/24 18:29:02


Khorne Daemons 4000+pts
 
   
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Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter




Seattle

<0.o>

None of that is remotely true.

It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised. 
   
Made in us
Mutating Changebringer





New Hampshire, USA

 Psienesis wrote:
<0.o>

None of that is remotely true.


I guess you decided not to check my citations. Denial is fun.

For instance, the Mutter museum is the museum of the "worlds strangest remains".

They have thousands of wax molds of different genetic defects and diseases that no longer exist. It is a chaos players dream come true for all things inspiring.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/06/24 18:30:50


Khorne Daemons 4000+pts
 
   
Made in us
Mekboy Hammerin' Somethin'





Papua New Guinea

Just to reiterate, ethnicity is not the same as race. As an eaxample an italien and african could have still been ethnically 'Roman' despite different racial backgrounds. In that sense Ultramarines do have a Roman ethnicity although have read in White Dwarf that the Ultramarines are styled 'classically' and are neither Roman nor Greek but inspired by both.

As to the Salamanders, they all used to be blonde too back during Rogue Trader so I don't see the Polynesian link which I would have given to the Space Sharks given the tattoo styling from Forge World.

There are some curious specimens in that Mutter Museum aren't there. Chaos inspiration indeed!

Be Pure!
Be Vigilant!
BEHAVE!

Show me your god and I'll send you a warhead because my god's bigger than your god.
 
   
Made in us
Mutating Changebringer





New Hampshire, USA

 Gogsnik wrote:
There are some curious specimens in that Mutter Museum aren't there. Chaos inspiration indeed!


I like the skulls and skeletons. The largest man and the smallest woman with her infant is amazing.

Khorne Daemons 4000+pts
 
   
Made in us
Mekboy Hammerin' Somethin'





Papua New Guinea

I only viewed some images via Bing just to see, but was struck by one of a man whose face looked to be flattened out onto a skull like a pumpkin, a literal moon face. It would make an excellent Chaos character.

To come back on topic though it does emphasise the variability og human DNA. Multiplied across a thousand differet regions onA million worlds then you have nigh on limitless racial and ethnic trends. What Games Workshop covers is really only the merest taste but it would be impossible for half a dozen blokes in an office to cover all of the Imperium even if they were allowed to.

Be Pure!
Be Vigilant!
BEHAVE!

Show me your god and I'll send you a warhead because my god's bigger than your god.
 
   
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Esteemed Veteran Space Marine






Northumberland

cadbren wrote:
xraytango wrote:
So the fact that the Polynesian peoples live on islands in the Pacific ocean, in an area known for seismic activity and hence volcanoes, which formed a large number of those islands (therefore 'volcanic islands'), would mean nothing to you?


Correct.

Volcanic activity is also present in the Mediterranean and the name of the Salamanders Primarch is the Roman god of fire, not a Polynesian god. The word volcano comes an Italian island called Volcano which was originally named for the god.

xraytango wrote:I'll grant you that there is a wide use of Greek mythology involved, but the flavor of the army was originally intended as being Polynesian. Its just like originally the Deathwing and in fact the Dark Angels themselves were intended to have a very strong Native American vibe, however many of their names did not reflect that. So names should be considered aside from flavor.


Give evidence of this polynesian theme to the early Salamanders. I've never seen anything to suggest this is true.


I have to say, I'm heavily leaning on the side of the Salamanders being based on the Greek volcanic regions and not Polynesians. Much of their lore is centered around isolationism, pragmatism and stoicism - incidentally all of which are Greek philosophy. In addition to this, Salamanders are known for their intense devotion to humanity and equality for all humans - incidentally Greece is the very founding place of Democracy!

On nomenclature, the vast majority of Salamanders names I've come across have a distinctly Greek ring to them: Chaplain Elysius, (The Elysian Fields - Greek Paradise) Master of the Forge Argos (Argos - Greek City State), Persephion, a Firedrake (Male version of Persephone, Queen of the Underworld). Even Vulkan is simply the Roman rendition of the Greek God of smithing - Hephaestus. Now I'll grant names such as Dak'ir, Tu'Shan of Tsu'gan don't sound Greek - possibly they are African or Polynesian (Personally, they sound invented to me, but I'll not claim an encyclopedic knowledge of names so please correct me if otherwise).

On the subject of locations: They have a Chapter Monastary on Prometheus - ring any bells for the Greek Titan who gave fire to humanity? Included on Prometheus is the seat of the Salamanders chapter council named the 'Pantheon' - which again, is the Greek gathering of gods.The Sanctuary cities, of which I'm missing two here admittedly: Themis (Greek Titaness of law and order), Hesiod (Greek poet, major source of modern studies of Greek Mythology), Epimethus (Epimetheus - Greek Titan of Hindsight, brother of Prometheus), Clymene (Greek Titan, Mother of Atlas and Epimethus), Heliosa (Oh look - Helios is the Greek God of the Sun!) - all sound distinctly Greco-Roman.

xraytango wrote:IIRC, the original fluff on them said that on their planet they lived on archipelagoes, hence islands. Now there are Greek islands, but that is not what one thinks of when we think of Greece.. Volcanoes + Islands = sounds a lot like Polynesia and a darker skinned people.


Whaaat!?! Have you seen how many Islands are included in the nation of Greece? Wikipedia alone counts as many as 1400 independent, significant islands. Indeed many of them feature in arguably the most famous sagas of ancient literature - the Illiad and the Odyssey. In addition, Wikipedia notes that over 80% of Greece includes mountainous regions and whaddya know, fold mountains are often formed by intense seismic activity at continental crust-continental crust convergence zones, which tend to produce massive amounts of volcanic and seismic activity. I'm assuming if you've studied Greece, then you'll be aware of the eruption of Thera, which destroyed most of Crete and Knossos (Giving rise to the Atlantis myth) or you'll be familiar with the eruption of Mt Etna, so you'll also know that the Greek colony of Syracuse was very close to it, and would have witnessed quite a few of it's frequent eruptions.

You may as well have said Iceland, because that's incredibly volcanic and is an island itself. The volcanoes there are even producing new islands (Heard of Surtsey, created in the 1963 - 1967?). However, Icelandic tradition couldn't be further from the Salamanders as it's derived from the Norse who settled there on their way to America - Space Wolves!

Now, I'm not going to completely discredit you, because I'm sure GW will purloin bits and bobs of other fire related objects for the Salamanders, but I think it's reasonable to argue that the Salamanders were probably based on, or at least take a heavy, heavy lending, of Greek culture and bits of Roman (Which in turn took a heavy lend of Greek itself). And I could go on way more if that's not enough...

EDIT: I had the quotations wrong for the first quote so it looked like it was cadbren who had written it, when it was a quote within a quote - quoteception Also, just to say that it's xraytango whom I'm humbly disputing, not cadbren.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/06/24 21:41:02


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South Portsmouth, KY USA

Not to mention Santorini.

I can appreciate Greek thing, but on the other hand I've been collecting and digesting GW for 26 years, I'm pretty sure I know what I am talking about.

This is the whole of it:

Rick Priestley is an archaeologist, it is not outside of his purview to find similarities between ancient societies or use an amalgam of them as fluff for a silly game that he was one of the line developers of.

So let's settle it like this:

The people that the Sallies draw from are notionally Polynesian, however the Chapter has its traditions, which are reflected by a heavy use of Greek names and iconography.

'nuff said.


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 DeffDred wrote:
 Psienesis wrote:
<0.o>

None of that is remotely true.


I guess you decided not to check my citations. Denial is fun.

For instance, the Mutter museum is the museum of the "worlds strangest remains".

They have thousands of wax molds of different genetic defects and diseases that no longer exist. It is a chaos players dream come true for all things inspiring.


Individual abberant mutations are not evidence of greater genetic diversity in the past, particularly when referencing something you do not have a genetic sample of. Further your claims of hobbits and trolls appear to be exaggeration from the existence of other hominid lines that are now extinct.

Also human genetic diversity is not decreasing and the rate of its increase is used as an important marker when studying human evolution (Tishkoff & Verrelli 2003)
   
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 DeffDred wrote:
 Psienesis wrote:
<0.o>

None of that is remotely true.


I guess you decided not to check my citations. Denial is fun.

For instance, the Mutter museum is the museum of the "worlds strangest remains".

They have thousands of wax molds of different genetic defects and diseases that no longer exist. It is a chaos players dream come true for all things inspiring.


Those are birth defects and other "freaks", not previous living examples of human sub-types.

What you said was:

Once upon a time Humans had striped hair, spotted hair, wildly long eyebrows, purple eyes and many other variations of pigments and genetic "flaws".

Giants and Hobbits existed in the ancient past (see National Geographic). As did trolls and ogres (see Da Vinci's grotesques).

People also had horns, eyestocks, scales, and other odd external bone growths (see Mutter Museum, Pennsylvania).

There would be a much wider range of genetics if we hadn't had events like the Black Death and WW2.


... implying that these people bred true, and that one guy with eyestalks meant that he came from an entire culture of people with eyestalks, which is a complete fabrication.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/06/25 08:47:10


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