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How powerful is the Emperor in his prime, both physically and his psychic powers?

Who are some opponents he could best, and some he could not.

Thanks.

All of the power.

I can speak with deadly certainty that he could best horus.

The also bested the Void Dragon, or at least a Shard of it.

Not powerful enough to win.

Physically he is about on par with his Primarchs, capable of tearing Marines apart with his bare hands with all the casual ease we would use to kill ants.

Psychically, he is the most powerful being ever to walk the materium. He could telepathically force over 100,000 Word Bearers to kneel, then telekinetically put them on their asses. He could force himself into Magnus the Red's mind, Magnus, whom with the merest shudder of telepathic power, could visit nightmares on an entire planet. He stood on the other side of the broken Webway Gate, and fought the hordes of Chaos for months to maybe even years, keeping them from spilling into Terra. Now, even crippled, he holds back Chaos from spilling into the galaxy and turning it into an Eye of Terror.

>9000

He's THIIIIIIIIIIIIS powerful.

 Super Ready wrote:
He's THIIIIIIIIIIIIS powerful.

Woah

Another purrrrrooof of feline superiority. Being made of rubber is obviously a superior quality.

 Grey Templar wrote:
>9000

You beat me to it..... good show sir

*And* it's not even his final form.

Ok, slightly more serious answer...a sizeable chunk of his physical prowess came from his psychic ability. That holds true for a lot of psykers, so with one as mentally strong as the Emperor, it made him capable of inhuman feats of strength.

Up to interpretation. I personally am fond of bringing up the story of the Ork Warboss who nearly killed the Emperor once whenever people get too hero-worshippy, but I'm unsure whether that bit's been retconned.

 AnomanderRake wrote:
Up to interpretation. I personally am fond of bringing up the story of the Ork Warboss who nearly killed the Emperor once whenever people get too hero-worshippy, but I'm unsure whether that bit's been retconned.

The second greatest Warboss ever recorded, in the middle of his own personal Waaagh! where everyone thinks he's the 'ardest, meanest Ork around. We all know what happens when enough Orks believe something, right?

 AnomanderRake wrote:
Up to interpretation. I personally am fond of bringing up the story of the Ork Warboss who nearly killed the Emperor once whenever people get too hero-worshippy, but I'm unsure whether that bit's been retconned.

Personally I am fond of pretending that never happened. Even as an Ork player, that bit has got to be one of the dumbest pieces of fluff I ever heard of. Right up there with The Beast's Waaagh! and Draigo beating up a Primarch.

The Emperor is practically a god. He's probably the single most powerful entity in the galaxy (other than Gork and Mork - and maybe the Hive Mind, if that one counts).

Oh, that a treat it is for me, to get another chance to denounce this false Emperor! :]


Now more seriously, I never understood our civilization's fascination with heroes, especially hideously overpowered ones, like superman. I see same fenomen and with Emperor and his primarchs. They usually are only vulnerable to even more ridiculously overpowered beings. They 99% of the time are immune to every type of damage that in fluff should kill them. Their enemies suddenly gain incompetence trait just to make them look better. Things like that only hurts lore overall. It makes fluff painfully predictable and bland. Also it creates plenty of fluff holes. For example, if Emperor was really so powerful then why he allowed to be almost beaten in wars or even crusades? Just go alone vs entire Waaaghhh and pwn it, but no, human suffering and deaths are demanded by Emperor.

Because even the Emperor can still only be in one place at a time. He wouldn't be able to accomplish anything in terms of strategic goals. He could be fighting Orks for decades while they pillage the planet for all its resources.

tgjensen wrote:
Because even the Emperor can still only be in one place at a time. He wouldn't be able to accomplish anything in terms of strategic goals. He could be fighting Orks for decades while they pillage the planet for all its resources.

Not necessarily. I don't remember the novel, but I do remember the Emperor stopping time at one point in order to speak to an Inquisitor without the Custodes getting in the way, and that was in his current corpse form. Who knows what he would be capable of if he a) had a working body and b) was not consigned to the Golden Throne.

Also in an older write up of the final battle between Empy and Horus, all 4 chaos gods are afraid of his power. As they had each possessed Horus to an extent, when they realized that the Emperor had decided to end it and gathered his full psychic power, they fled Horus' body to avoid the attack. That speaks volumes of his power that he could have possibly wounded the chaos gods themselves from the materium side.

Well, we don't know much about his time-stopping powers. It could be horrendously taxing. He might not be able to do it for very long at a time. We do know that he employed his Primarchs in order to focus on stuff on Terra, which implies that at least he isn't willing to use time-stops all the time. He didn't use time-stops against Horus either, though that would have come in handy.

And even so, unless he is able to teleport from solar system to solar system, the Emperor would have to spend time in transit, which means he won't be able to be elsewhere. So great generals and their great armies are still the go-to method for conquering a galaxy.

Oh, but orks are simple brutes. Just go to their leaders in person and ''assassinate" them by burning away their armies and cities.

In any way, that is my point exactly. You will believe any exaggerated tale as long as it promotes power of your's personal favorite being.

tgjensen wrote:
Well, we don't know much about his time-stopping powers. It could be horrendously taxing. He might not be able to do it for very long at a time. We do know that he employed his Primarchs in order to focus on stuff on Terra, which implies that at least he isn't willing to use time-stops all the time. He didn't use time-stops against Horus either, though that would have come in handy.

And even so, unless he is able to teleport from solar system to solar system, the Emperor would have to spend time in transit, which means he won't be able to be elsewhere. So great generals and their great armies are still the go-to method for conquering a galaxy.

Well thats the thing, his power seems to have expanded quite a bit since being interred on the Golden Throne. Most likely due to the near limitless number of humans worshipping him every day. And saying that it might be horrendously taxing does not take anything away from how impressive it is that he can stop time.

Time-manipulation is not reserved for the God-Emperor alone. The Necrons (Orikan the Diviner, especially) have that on lock-down as well.

There's a hell of a difference, though. With the Necrons it's done with technology. The Emperor does it under his own steam. Then again...for a being with so much power in the warp, where time really doesn't hold any sway, perhaps it's to be expected?

Magnus the Red can also stop and slow the flow of time. On a planetary scale, actually.

It's a power that more powerful psykers have access to.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ernestas wrote:
Oh, that a treat it is for me, to get another chance to denounce this false Emperor! :]


Now more seriously, I never understood our civilization's fascination with heroes, especially hideously overpowered ones, like superman. I see same fenomen and with Emperor and his primarchs. They usually are only vulnerable to even more ridiculously overpowered beings. They 99% of the time are immune to every type of damage that in fluff should kill them. Their enemies suddenly gain incompetence trait just to make them look better. Things like that only hurts lore overall. It makes fluff painfully predictable and bland. Also it creates plenty of fluff holes. For example, if Emperor was really so powerful then why he allowed to be almost beaten in wars or even crusades? Just go alone vs entire Waaaghhh and pwn it, but no, human suffering and deaths are demanded by Emperor.

Superman is a cultural icon, where the fun in his stories is not in whether or not he will win (Though he has struggled to do so from time to time), but in seeing him win in spectacular ways and learning something along the way.

Why "should" it kill them?

What incompetence do their enemies get?

The Emperor has only ever been threatened in single combat by one being. Horus, suckling on the power of Chaos.

And as said, he can't be everywhere at once.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 AnomanderRake wrote:
Up to interpretation. I personally am fond of bringing up the story of the Ork Warboss who nearly killed the Emperor once whenever people get too hero-worshippy, but I'm unsure whether that bit's been retconned.

It hasn't, though a bit more context is in place.

Was some Ork Warboss bigger than a dreadnought, and the Emperor was laying into an army at the time, before being hit by an Ork plasma battery.

Sorry for late reply, exams...

Superman is a cultural icon, where the fun in his stories is not in whether or not he will win (Though he has struggled to do so from time to time), but in seeing him win in spectacular ways and learning something along the way.

Seeing him winning in spectacular ways and learning something along the way is a reason why he is so popular? Well, I guess it's just me who just don't get along with our current civilization culture.


Also, It bores me then I know that he is the main protagonist and he will never die. Story authors might try to hide this fact about ''hey look, he is about to loose'', but cold fact is that main heroes never die and it's why I care little for their adventures. I know ultimate outcome even before reading book or watch movie.

For example: ''In dead men walking'' and ''Pawn of chaos'' novels ending is unpredictable compared to usual bolter-porn novel. It's grim, unique,surprising and most of all interesting. In comparision, take most of books written today. Good guys will win no matter that, happy ending is guaranteed in advance and because of that, movies and books looses all tension that they could have generated otherwise.

Why "should" it kill them?

It's superman's issue. Primarchs powers was never explained as far as I know. Why should they be leagues away from best of astrates warrior?

What incompetence do their enemies get?

Simple, don't challenge them in single combat. Where is assassination attempts? Where is usage of tactical nukes just to take out their leaders? No, it always must be a spectacular battle for ours entertainment. Screw all arsenal and tools that particular force can muster.

In w40k only feasible solution to take out extremely high-value targets like for example alpha-psykers should be only assassins, other psykers who specialises in that and: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCbfMkh940Q


Most famous example of incompetence of which I'm speaking was commited by the Emperor. Horus didn't just lowered his shields for a personal duel. He was gambling. His heresy and siege of Terra resulted entire Imperium drawing its martial might from everywhere and speeding to support its Terra's defenders. I think it was written that two chapters was on realistic time limit to make a real difference in a fight. Ultramarines and other that I can't remember other.
Due to that, Horus had an edge, but not such great as he could crush defenders and defenders had enough force left that victory was a possible outcome. It's why Horus had gambled and it's why Emperor actions have doomed humanity to its current state. All that he had to do is to focus all their firepower on Horus flagship since in order to teleport shields must be lowered. And as we all know, shields in w40k are a primary line of defense. If they fail, then unit's armor can't handle punishment that it's receiving for any prolonged period of time.

The Emperor has only ever been threatened in single combat by one being. Horus, suckling on the power of Chaos.

And as said, he can't be everywhere at once.

But he can be at the concentration of enemy forces. Instead of sending his armies to fight them, why not to send only his flagship in order to take out the might of entire race?

Also, why threat was only Horus? Why suddenly powerful psykers are immune to headshots and other gak? We have in a lore alpha-level psykers dieing in combat vs astrates task forces and no one seems to care much, but then question turns to Emperor's unexplained powers and in lesser degree- primarchs, then everyone comes to defend them.

Heroes almost never lose. It's what makes them heroes. That hasn't changed in several thousand years of human civilization.

It doesn't matter how powerful a hero is, as long as the author is good you can still make a good story even with main characters who use entire universes as throwing knives.

And it's a difference between me and you. I like then heroes actually follow inner rules of particular universe.
For example: Emperor can be easily assassinated by an experienced Culexus temple assassin if his personal security force would be non-existant. Same applies to any psyker.


I prefer Martin's A Song of Ice and Fire tales approach. Everyone is suspectable to end up in most miserable situation. Look at our supposedly good guys, Starks. Things weren't going well for them at all!

That's because GRRM takes standard fantasy tropes and upends them. It's his schtick. There are so many fan-theories regarding the lineage of certain characters and how things will end up in the end that I am convinced that none of them are possibly true, because it's what the fan-base is expecting.

The Emperor is an extremely powerful psyker, the most powerful human psyker to ever live. Easily assassinated by a Culexus? Probably not, because the Emperor probably foretells the assassin's arrival a week ahead of the event, and so the poor bastard dies in a freak speeder accident on his way to the job (or is accosted and killed by Custodes upon arrival).

The EoM's power fluctuates, as with any story, to fit the plot. Its a pitfall of heroes in lit.
Its the same with the primarchs, they always portrayed as these divine faultless, breath taking persons; and in reality they are complete douches (El Jonson is a prime example).
I personally like a hero that gets the ever loving sh1t beaten out of them, and then triumph, just to be even more of a bamf.
In respect to his physic might, I think its less to do with sheer power (which he has of course) but more the profound understanding of the warp and later the webway that enables him to do as he does. Post heresy, his power would be both diminished AND amped up, because of the soul bindings and daily sacrifices (always thought that would be a logistical nightmare btw).
And on the note of him not being able to leap across the galaxy with his power; Librarians use the gate of infinity don't they? Just a matter of skill and power I guess.

Sorry for the essay.