Trayvon Martin case: All female jury picked---Verdict Not Guilty

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**IronWarLeg**

Wow, this is pretty interesting information from the Ex Chief that resigned/forced out..

http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/10/justice/sanford-bill-lee-exclusive/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Automatically Appended Next Post:
"Bill Lee, who testified Monday in Zimmerman's second-degree murder trial, told CNN's George Howell in an exclusive interview that he felt pressure from city officials to arrest Zimmerman to placate the public rather than as a matter of justice."

That part especially...

**whembly**

IronWarLeg wrote:
Wow, this is pretty interesting information from the Ex Chief that resigned/forced out..

http://www.cnn.com/2013/07/10/justice/sanford-bill-lee-exclusive/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Automatically Appended Next Post:
"Bill Lee, who testified Monday in Zimmerman's second-degree murder trial, told CNN's George Howell in an exclusive interview that he felt pressure from city officials to arrest Zimmerman to placate the public rather than as a matter of justice."

That part especially...

Wait... this wasn't common knowledge? I thought something was obviously shady when the chief was forced out...

**IronWarLeg**

Well yeah but for him to actually come out and say it is a different story, up until now it just seemed obvious, now its been confirmed.

**Hordini**

This whole trial is a circus. There is a reason police didn't arrest Zimmerman the first time around.

**Dreadclaw69**

This is a great argument that law enforcement should be separate from politics.

**Rented Tritium**

The judge trying to insist on talking straight to Zimmerman is way out of line.

**d-usa**

Dreadclaw69 wrote:
This is a great argument that law enforcement should be separate from politics.

Many law enforcement positions are straight up political though. Judges and Sheriff are still partisan elections in places.

**Frazzled**

Rented Tritium wrote:
The judge trying to insist on talking straight to Zimmerman is way out of line.

Agreed. I wonder if that alone is reversible error. It immediately predjudices the jury.

**Rented Tritium**

The situation with that chief is a lot more complicated than the defense is making it out to be. The full details aren't really going to change this case, though, so nobody is going to press the issue.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Frazzled wrote:
Rented Tritium wrote:
The judge trying to insist on talking straight to Zimmerman is way out of line.

Agreed. I wonder if that alone is reversible error. It immediately predjudices the jury.

I wonder the same thing. There have been a lot of little nuggets that could be cited in an appeal in the nearly nonexistent chance that he gets convicted.

**Dreadclaw69**

Rented Tritium wrote:
The judge trying to insist on talking straight to Zimmerman is way out of line.

Agreed. He has legal representation for a reason, his counsel should have been addressed.

d-usa wrote:
Many law enforcement positions are straight up political though. Judges and Sheriff are still partisan elections in places.

Something that I do have some issues with, but I can see the reasons for it. Criminal investigations should be carried out on the basis of facts and evidence, not political expediency.

**Alfndrate**

Rented Tritium wrote:
The judge trying to insist on talking straight to Zimmerman is way out of line.

Are you referring to the parts of yesterday's trial where the judge asked Zimmerman if he was going to take the stand?

**Rented Tritium**

Alfndrate wrote:
Rented Tritium wrote:
The judge trying to insist on talking straight to Zimmerman is way out of line.

Are you referring to the parts of yesterday's trial where the judge asked Zimmerman if he was going to take the stand?

All times but the last time.

The last time it was the right stuff, "are you sure" "did you make this decision on your own and without coercion" etc etc. Those are questions that need to be asked.

What wasn't ok was the entire day of badgering and demanding that he decide under oath, despite the fifth amendment giving him the right to change his mind at literally any moment. He was under absolutely no obligation to decide at that time and the judge badgered him all day to decide, going so far as to cut off his lawyer.

**Alfndrate**

Okay, just wanted to make sure you and I were on the same page with that. I wasn't watching the trial, but caught that little bit on World News with Diane while waiting for dinner to finish, so while I saw some of the questions the judge asked, I wasn't sure if there were more.

**Dreadclaw69**

http://news.yahoo.com/fla-cities-guard-post-zimmerman-unrest-085204530.html

MIAMI (AP) — Police and city leaders in Florida say they have taken precautionary steps for the possibility of mass protests or even civil unrest if George Zimmerman is acquitted in the killing of unarmed teen Trayvon Martin, particularly in African-American neighborhoods where passions run strongest over the case.

For months, officials in Sanford and South Florida have been working with pastors, youth coaches, community activists and summer camp counselors to stress a non-violent approach if Zimmerman walks free. At the same time, police say they have quietly been making plans for dealing with any potential emotional flare-ups that could quickly turn into storefront-smashing, car-burning riots.

"It's all right to be vocal, but we don't want to be violent," said the Rev. Walter T. Richardson, a longtime pastor and chairman of Miami-Dade County's Community Relations Board, which has been holding town hall-style meetings about the case. "We've already lost one soul and we don't want to lose any more."

Martin, from the suburb of Miami Gardens, was 17 when he died. He was in Sanford visiting his father and father's fiancee when Zimmerman, a neighborhood watch volunteer, fatally shot him during a physical confrontation in a gated community in February 2012.

Martin's supporters portrayed the shooting as racially motivated, while Zimmerman, who identifies himself as Hispanic, claimed self-defense. Charged with second-degree murder, Zimmerman is pleading not guilty at the trial unfolding in a Sanford courthouse.

After police initially refused to arrest Zimmerman, there were many large but peaceful protests in both Sanford and the Miami area — as well as in New York and other cities. Those demonstrations included a mass walkout at nearly three dozen South Florida high schools.

Many in Sanford say they doubt the trial's outcome would spark local residents to take to the streets.

"The main focus was to get Zimmerman arrested and have him tried before a jury of his peers in a court of law," said Clayton Turner Jr., president of the Seminole County branch of the NAACP. "That was the main issue, not how we felt about whether he's innocent or guilty."

Not everyone is so certain.

Shantree Hall, 37, a lifelong Sanford resident who is black, said a Zimmerman acquittal might anger many in the African-American community who already feel they are less likely to obtain justice. The protests that led to Zimmerman's arrest taught many people that was the only way to get things done, she added.

"With Trayvon, the noise was too loud for them. That's why they couldn't sweep it under the rug," she said.

Recent Miami-area high school graduate Jude Bruno, 18, said he doesn't sense from friends and peers that there is a powder keg in South Florida waiting to explode should Zimmerman be found innocent. Bruno is chairman of the Miami-Dade County Youth Commission, which has been working with local youth groups to stress a peaceful reaction.

"We want to be the example to the world because the whole world is watching us," Bruno said.

Bruno spoke after a Community Relations Board meeting this week that drew several hundred people to a Miami Gardens library auditorium, some of them wearing "Justice for Trayvon" T-shirts and many asking sharp-edged questions about the trial. Still, the overall theme was peace.

"Please, no violence. We don't want any violence. None," said Miriam Martin, one of Trayvon Martin's aunts.

One potential advantage mentioned by several law enforcement officials: school is out for summer, meaning there is no ready-made rallying point for young people to gather.

Still, authorities are taking no chances, particularly in the Miami area which has had riots in the past connected to racially-charged court cases.

The worst rioting occurred in 1980 in the mostly-black Liberty City and Overtown neighborhoods of Miami, after four white police officers were acquitted in the death of Arthur McDuffie, a black Marine Corps veteran. McDuffie was beaten to death by police trying to stop him for a traffic violation. The three-day riot killed 18 people and did some $100 million in damage.

The Miami-Dade Police Department's intelligence operation, known as the Southeast Florida Fusion Center, has been combing social media to monitor signs of unusual interest in Zimmerman's trial. The center also acts as a platform for South Florida's numerous police agencies to quickly share information.

The department's deputy director, Juan Perez, said law enforcement's goal is to allow for peaceful rallies or protests but be ready in case violence flares. Perez said plans call for establishment of "First Amendment Zones" in certain neighborhoods if crowds do gather, so people can exercise their rights.

"We want to make sure people have the right to protest," Perez said. But if there are problems, he added: "Our job is going to be to minimize those opportunities to rob a store or shoplift."

To the north in Broward County, Sheriff Scott Israel and his staff have organized several meetings with African-American church and community leaders and recently began airing a public service TV ad featuring Miami Heat player James Jones. The ad's theme is "Raise Your Voice, Not Your Hands" and it also stresses a nonviolent approach.

"We don't have information about a specific event that might take place at the conclusion of the trial, but we encourage everyone to keep any protests peaceful," Israel said.

Similarly, in central Florida, religious leaders have been encouraged to attend the trial and discuss it with their congregations. Up to four courtroom seats were reserved for clergy on a rotating basis, and more than a dozen churches have held regular Monday prayer sessions during the trial.

**Rented Tritium**

I think they're right to prepare for it just in case, but I don't believe there will be any problems after he's acquitted. The region this is happening in is not very conducive to big riots in july. Seminole county doesn't have any areas with uninterrupted city blocks. There are canals and ditches everywhere breaking up the ability for a crowd to move freely. That's going to cut down on the critical mass.

Also, there hasn't been sufficient ramp-up and preparation for anger. I know it seems to you guys like there's something brewing, but I've seen brewing and this isn't it.

Even in Miami, where this is ostensibly brewing, there just isn't enough anger prep happening.

**Breotan**

Am I reading this correctly? The judge is allowing additional charges after the prosecution and defense have both rested their cases? o.O

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_NEIGHBORHOOD_WATCH?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2013-07-11-10-13-00

Jury in Zimmerman case may consider other charges

By MIKE SCHNEIDER and KYLE HIGHTOWER
Associated Press

SANFORD, Fla. (AP) -- Prosecutors in George Zimmerman's second-degree murder trial want to ask jurors to consider lesser charges of third-degree murder and manslaughter.

Prosecutors said they would ask that the lesser charges be included as they hammer out of jury instructions on Thursday.

Defense attorneys say they want the six jurors to only consider the second-degree murder charge or not guilty.

Judge Debra Nelson said Thursday she would allow jurors to consider manslaughter. Arguments on third-degree murder had yet to be made.

The six jurors could begin deliberating as early as Friday.

Zimmerman is pleading not guilty to second-degree murder. He claims he shot 17-year-old Trayvon Martin in self-defense last year.

CBS Tampa Bay wrote:Prosecutors are also seeking a child abuse charge against Zimmerman since Martin was 17 at the time of his death.

Seriously? I wasn't on Zimmerman's side before but after this... holy

that's some serious railroading going on down there.

**Dreadclaw69**

It's certainly unusual to add charges to an indictment after the trial has commenced, and especially after the Defense has rested. This might prejudice his right to a fair trial, the defense was only dealing with second degree murder.

These are all matters that Zimmerman should have been indicted for before the trial started.

**Rented Tritium**

Breotan wrote:
Am I reading this correctly? The judge is allowing additional charges after the prosecution and defense have both rested their cases? o.O

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_NEIGHBORHOOD_WATCH?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2013-07-11-10-13-00

Jury in Zimmerman case may consider other charges

By MIKE SCHNEIDER and KYLE HIGHTOWER
Associated Press

SANFORD, Fla. (AP) -- Prosecutors in George Zimmerman's second-degree murder trial want to ask jurors to consider lesser charges of third-degree murder and manslaughter.

Prosecutors said they would ask that the lesser charges be included as they hammer out of jury instructions on Thursday.

Defense attorneys say they want the six jurors to only consider the second-degree murder charge or not guilty.

Judge Debra Nelson said Thursday she would allow jurors to consider manslaughter. Arguments on third-degree murder had yet to be made.

The six jurors could begin deliberating as early as Friday.

Zimmerman is pleading not guilty to second-degree murder. He claims he shot 17-year-old Trayvon Martin in self-defense last year.
CBS Tampa Bay wrote:Prosecutors are also seeking a child abuse charge against Zimmerman since Martin was 17 at the time of his death.

They're called "lesser included offenses" and they're technically always included by law, there's just leeway on if the judge instructs the jury to consider them.

I doubt child abuse will work as a lesser included charge, though.

**Alfndrate**

Child abuse? That seems to be a weird charge to tack on...

**CptJake**

They need the felony (child abuse) to get a 3rd degree murder charge (murder while committing a felony).

**Dreadclaw69**

I'm impressed they haven't added littering to the list of charges, I'm sure he left a spent shell case at the scene.

**Frazzled**

That shell casing was not picked up by Z - guilty!!!

**Relapse**

It's like the Ridney King trial. The cops were found not guilty, so they threw some other charges in after the riots started. They aren't going to let him walk because they're scared of riots. The boy was hosed going into court.
When you have the President saying that Trevor Martin could have been his son, you know Zimmerman is getting convicted of something.

**xole**

I seriously doubt Zimmerman is going to be convicted, but it is Extremely worrying how far the Judge is going to make it happen.

**whembly**

Is this America?

I thought you had to right to defend against any charge.

o.O

If Z is convicted of anything, the appeals process should be straight forward.

**Rented Tritium**

Lesser included charges are not some crazy new thing, guys.

**CptJake**

Rented Tritium wrote:
Lesser included charges are not some crazy new thing, guys.

Not sure how 3rd degree murder is 'included' in the 2nd degree charge though. And if a necessary element is 'during a felony' and the prosecution has not brought the felony charge (in this case child abuse) into play to allow the defense to argue against it, it doesn't seem right.

**whembly**

Rented Tritium wrote:
Lesser included charges are not some crazy new thing, guys.

But, are they usually tacked on after the prosecution/defense rested?

**Frazzled**

Rented Tritium wrote:
Lesser included charges are not some crazy new thing, guys.

Manslaughter yes. Third degree murder is a completely different charge. Battery, littering, assault, and sexual harrassment could be included too.
If she puts that to the jury thats an easily winnable appeal argument (assuming no acquittal).

**whembly**

Frazzled wrote:
Rented Tritium wrote:
Lesser included charges are not some crazy new thing, guys.

Manslaughter yes. Third degree murder is a completely different charge. Battery, littering, assault, and sexual harrassment could be included too.
If she puts that to the jury thats an easily winnable appeal argument (assuming no acquittal).

What's weird to me is that... as I understand from Florida's case law, the lesser charge is Manslaugter. They should've stuck with that....

Now, the state is arguing for Aggravated Child Abuse (a felony) in order to get Murder in the 3rd degree. That's 10-20 years in prison, as opposed to manslaugter, which is 9.5 - 15 years.

o.O

Just an overall weird tactic.

Just saw a tweet that that judge gave the defense until 1pm to research and respond to the lesser charges.