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TyranidPainter wrote:
I'm planning on selling a fully painted to the standard of the hormagaunt at the top of this page, magnatized carnifex. Creating it will cost me approx £36. What are the chances of me making a profit? I know people have been saying I need practice before doing commissions but to practice I need the models and the paints and to get the models and the paints I need money :(. If only could keep a job........or get one in the first place. I blame Cammeron x x

The issue you are going to find with single models is that people are generally loath to purchase them if they do not match the rest of their army.

As far are affording models to paint for practice you have a few routes that are much cheaper. You can purchase Mantic or other less expensive than GW models. Or you can offer to paint models for locals for free or for other models. Its a great way to get your name out there.

Right now, your chance is approaching zero.

For single-mini jobs, to make profit you have to have a high level job in recognisable scheme (more chance of fitting in with buyers' armies). To make good profit on single minis, the work has to approach competition grade.

I'd agree you may find it hard to make back your money on selling thesingle minis. That said if you do have a bestbet it is inreplicating existing GW paint schemes from the codex's that new players may have taken up for their army and would be looking for more models in.

As an example:

Ultramarines
Dark Angels
Eldar Craftworld
Well painted Aspect Warriors.

If it is close enough to the default GW scheme you could find the right buyer.

Well my wolf lord just cost me £3 to send so I've lost a terminator and gained a quid for it :(. I hope this isn't a sign of things to come but it's not going to put me off. I'm goin to do the carnifex and possibly paint it in hive fleet leviathans scheme. For approx £45 I think it's very likely I'll at least make my money back x x

Always remember to charge adequate postage for whatever you're selling. Royal Mail second class runs at about 2.60 I believe so with a decent box/packing I usually charge about 3.60 for a single miniature to be posted on ebay. Reason being its in both my and the buyers best interest to ensure the model gets there in the best possible quality. The bigger.more expensive the item to more postage you need to charge especially if you wants to get insurance on it.

As an example my Wraithknight charged £10 postage because it took alot of wrapping and was insured for upto £500 in posting. (Cost about 55 from dark sphere, sold 110ish). Selling at a loss to start with might help get your name out there more but dont take that loss from postage (unless you make alot from the model). You can also look at other auctions before you pick what you're painting to see if there is alot of bids/demand on similar products to gauge how much you might make.

Buy some second hand minis for cheap, and then turn them into something awesome. Great way to gain experience.

 RavensNestPainting wrote:
Buy some second hand minis for cheap, and then turn them into something awesome. Great way to gain experience.

Sound advice. I may do that. Cheers x x

Well I uploaded that hormagaunt onto cool mini or not and scored just 4.6. I did think it was greater than that but I gues with the mold lines, running paint and it being unbased I shouldn't have expected any more. I like to think that if it were being judged on it's painting alone it'd have scored higher x x

TyranidPainter wrote:
Well I uploaded that hormagaunt onto cool mini or not and scored just 4.6. I did think it was greater than that but I gues with the mold lines, running paint and it being unbased I shouldn't have expected any more. I like to think that if it were being judged on it's painting alone it'd have scored higher x x

Hate to sound harsh, but that sounds pretty accurate. When you go on CMoN, you're competing with the BEST miniature painting artists out there. These guys and gals spend weeks or even months working on a single figure. A basic tabletop model with no basing and unfinished areas isn't gonna get that great of a rating. I've never been able to get up the balls to put my stuff on there.

~Tim?

CMoN can be pretty brutal, but it can be good motivation too. I think the highest I've scored yet is a 6.2, but I'm determined that I'll get a seven. Planning on spending some serious time on a couple of infinity models to try and reach a seven, and that includes building custom bases out of plasticard, making tiny spent ammo shells and the like, getting to grips with OSL, etc.

The thing about CMon, is you are being judged on everything - painting, basing, photography, lighting etc etc. You need to get the whole shebang right.

Edit - 6.4. Woohooo!

Aye I guess. I'm not upset. Just dissappointed. It's seems like a good way to gauge my progress tho so I'm gunna keep using it x x

To be honest, I wouldn't buy from you ... however, that is because I'm a pretty fast painter and can crank out tabletop quality pretty quickly. By table top, I mean:



I also farm out work to my 10-year old son, who is turning out solid quality work.



The advice:

You specialize in Tyranids, which is a good thing. Think about what Tyranid players really need. Any one who plays Tervigons, needs a shed load of basic gaunts, If you can find a way to a) buy gaunts on e-bay cheaply and b) turn out large quantities of them in the basic hive fleet colors ... you have a market. Other items that can do well if the quality is there: Swarmlord, Doom of Malentai, etc ... IC's where it might not be as important to have the same color scheme. Watch the tournament trends and look at what units always show up in Tyranid lists. Focus your efforts on those units.,

This is easily, hands down, the most entertaining thread I've ever read on dakka.

More in line with Ifurita's advice:
the old 3rd edition metal hive tryrants that look like adult warriors can make awesome tyranid primes. I've seen some go for less than $10, and with the core of the model being metal... it's easy work to strip the model and get some new life into it.

 Ifurita wrote:
The advice:

You specialize in Tyranids, which is a good thing. Think about what Tyranid players really need. Any one who plays Tervigons, needs a shed load of basic gaunts, If you can find a way to a) buy gaunts on e-bay cheaply and b) turn out large quantities of them in the basic hive fleet colors ... you have a market. Other items that can do well if the quality is there: Swarmlord, Doom of Malentai, etc ... IC's where it might not be as important to have the same color scheme. Watch the tournament trends and look at what units always show up in Tyranid lists. Focus your efforts on those units.,

Why thank you, that is very helpful. And bloody well done on your models. They are awsome x x


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 poda_t wrote:
More in line with Ifurita's advice:
the old 3rd edition metal hive tryrants that look like adult warriors can make awesome tyranid primes. I've seen some go for less than $10, and with the core of the model being metal... it's easy work to strip the model and get some new life into it.

Thanks, I'll look for them on ebay x x


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Thokt wrote:
This is easily, hands down, the most entertaining thread I've ever read on dakka.

Glad to have been of service x x

This thread has been a good read

I applaud your optimism and drive, but you just need to practice. I came back into the hobby after about 10-15 years away, and as a youngster I was a great painter, won my local hobby centre comps and entered into the '94 Golden Demon young bloods. I came back into it and thought 'I can fund this hobby through some commissions maybe' but soon realised that a) I had lost a lot of skill that I'm still trying to get back and b) the competition for people offering this service is harsh!

I've been using the myriad of painting blogs, advice on here and just practice practice practice. It'll come dude.

Is there a local club or something you can attend to get into the scene around you? I started painting minatures for people as a kid because I went to a local club and people saw my work. It's the easiest way to get out there in the short term, and would solve the fact you havent got the equipment to take pictures to the standard of others that paint for money.

Wow, I'm impressed. When I first read this wreck-train of a thread in the beginning I was assuming it would be locked because of so hostility from the OP. Nice to read a 180º turn from you mate, best of luck to your endeavors but I feel like I must add my 2 cents, as low and they are because I'm just an apprentice as well.

What I found most surprising is how you didn't know about the 2 brush blending. It's not to sound like an a$$ or painting snob like that, no, but I just feel there's a real necessity for you, who wants to do commissions (Hey, I'm somewhat in the same boat ), to at least have a general idea of the different painting techniques out there.

2 brush blending, wet-blending, Non Metallic Metal, Zenithal Highlighting, they are all ugly words that really push the quality of a miniature up. Granted, I don't think you'll ever paint an entire army to display standard using these techniques (unless your client has MASSIVE quantities of money) but you gotta study, learn, practice them. You gotta keep pushing yourself and learn new stuff to keep on improving.
Eck, the simple layering technique is already a massive improvement to any miniature, even if you just do 3-4 different layers.

Search around in youtube, blogs, there's massive quantities of information for these techniques and see how they turn a simple miniature to a work of art.

TyranidPainter wrote:
Well I uploaded that hormagaunt onto cool mini or not and scored just 4.6. I did think it was greater than that but I gues with the mold lines, running paint and it being unbased I shouldn't have expected any more. I like to think that if it were being judged on it's painting alone it'd have scored higher x x

Don't take it too harshly man, CMoN is the best of the best, they're a harsh and critical community that pushes people to do better or to get out of the way... One of the best painters I've seen on CMoN is Nakatan, who has a history of some... controversial pieces, but he's been uploading to CMoN since at least June of 2009 (4 years now)... This was his first piece:


That scored an 8.7

This is his piece from March of last year, which scored a 9.8:


Compare that to his Crystal Brush entry this year, which also scored a 9.8:


Now here is the kicker with that... Nakatan didn't win with that entry...

Stick around with CMoN if you wish to improve as a painter, they generally won't lead you the astray, but you have to be willing to hear criticism and take it very well. I'm terrible at that, so I paint to try and get my army looking better on the table, you're looking to make OTHER peoples' armies looking better on the table.

Here's a little tid bit to give a better grasp on how tough the commission road can be:

From Mini Freek:

"No Longer Accepting Commissions!
Due to my finances needing a bit of a lift, I'm going to be going back to work full-time, as my commissions pay me about 50% of minimum wage. It's a tough decision to make, but I'd like to attend some more conventions next year, and in order to do-so, I have to increase my income substantially."

Examples of his work:

If he was earning half minimum hourly wage for painting those model, he was either (a) really slow, or (b) targeting the wrong market. With the work he was doing he should have been getting $30-$50 a model, easy.

Anyways, the real money is in infantry. If you can churn out lots of uniformly painted, above tabletop miniatures quickly, you can make around $10-$15 an hour. It takes me ~8 hours to paint a unit of 10 Space Marines up to tabletop level, and I get paid $100 for that unit. That's $12.50 an hour. Seeing as I'm 18 and would normally be bagging groceries for $7.50 an hour, I think I'm gonna stick with doing commissions as a way of saving for college (or whatever I end up doing...)

~Tim?

 Some_Call_Me_Tim? wrote:
Anyways, the real money is in infantry. If you can churn out lots of uniformly painted, above tabletop miniatures quickly, you can make around $10-$15 an hour. It takes me ~8 hours to paint a unit of 10 Space Marines up to tabletop level, and I get paid $100 for that unit. That's $12.50 an hour. Seeing as I'm 18 and would normally be bagging groceries for $7.50 an hour, I think I'm gonna stick with doing commissions as a way of saving for college (or whatever I end up doing...)

~Tim?

That much! Well I'm doing this to top up what I get so 50% minimum wage would be fine. However I don't chage by the hour. If something takes me a long time to finish that's not the clients fault. Besides, I like to keep my pricing systems simple. However I'm goind to start with selling monstrous creatures on ebay untill I can afford a spray gun then I'll get started on infantry. That'll save time x x

I'd make sure you stick with ones that people use in this case.
Painting up things like mawlocs really wont do that well compared with a tervigon.
Also, since your charging per model then your really going to have to be strict on time as it will cost heavily if you stray even a bit.

 Jackal wrote:
I'd make sure you stick with ones that people use in this case.
Painting up things like mawlocs really wont do that well compared with a tervigon.
Also, since your charging per model then your really going to have to be strict on time as it will cost heavily if you stray even a bit.

What do you mean by strict on time? Do you mean quick x x

No, he means you need to charge appropriately for the time it takes you to do a proper job. This boils down to the axiom:
Slow is steady, steady is fast, fast is good.
Bit of a mind bender to get your head around at first, but it's actually a good mindset to be in.

winterdyne wrote:
No, he means you need to charge appropriately for the time it takes you to do a proper job. This boils down to the axiom:
Slow is steady, steady is fast, fast is good.
Bit of a mind bender to get your head around at first, but it's actually a good mindset to be in.

Ah I see. Well like I said I want to sell my items cheap to give poorer people access to quality mercandise. Besides, it should also increase the portential market x x


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Will this page never end? Having to scroll down this far on a touch screen phone is rather annoying :( x x

To sell cheap, you need to be fast. Extremely fast. And to achieve quality that people will buy (as opposed to rip the gak out of) means serious skills with rapid painting methods - dipping and or airbrush techniques, and above all big batch work.

You need to be extremely organised and methodical to achieve this; when dipping you work your block base colours a little lighter to counteract the toning the dip gives, and you pay attention to cleanup- mould lines and flash lines will screw the flow of the dip. Highlighting is often done with a fairly harsh drybrush before the dip, or a simple edge highlight afterward.

winterdyne wrote:
To sell cheap, you need to be fast. Extremely fast. And to achieve quality that people will buy (as opposed to rip the gak out of) means serious skills with rapid painting methods - dipping and or airbrush techniques, and above all big batch work.

You need to be extremely organised and methodical to achieve this; when dipping you work your block base colours a little lighter to counteract the toning the dip gives, and you pay attention to cleanup- mould lines and flash lines will screw the flow of the dip. Highlighting is often done with a fairly harsh drybrush before the dip, or a simple edge highlight afterward.

I hate to sound thick but....dip? X x

Dipping is using a thick polyurethane toned varnish to shade the entire model by literally dunking it in. Excess is removed and gravity does the work of pooling the pigment in recesses. Because the varnish is quite viscous, you get a smooth gradient in the shade. Extremely efficient for large batches but takes some practice to get the right knack.

A while back there was an extremely nice Imperial Fists army (by a German dude IIRC) that was dipped for the main shading pass. Many of his modes were shown on the GW blog.

winterdyne wrote:
Dipping is using a thick polyurethane toned varnish to shade the entire model by literally dunking it in. Excess is removed and gravity does the work of pooling the pigment in recesses. Because the varnish is quite viscous, you get a smooth gradient in the shade. Extremely efficient for large batches but takes some practice to get the right knack.

A while back there was an extremely nice Imperial Fists army (by a German dude IIRC) that was dipped for the main shading pass. Many of his modes were shown on the GW blog.

Ah I see. Sounds like it requires alot of shade paint. Where on earth does one buy it in that quantity x x

Dude. Google. Minimum effort.