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Quick question: Is there a single FW unit for Nids thats worth considering (non Apoc of course). I've seen Stone crushers get mentioned on here a little bit, I'm guessing they're in the Anphelion project IA from way way back? If not, where are the rules?

 jifel wrote:
Quick question: Is there a single FW unit for Nids thats worth considering (non Apoc of course). I've seen Stone crushers get mentioned on here a little bit, I'm guessing they're in the Anphelion project IA from way way back? If not, where are the rules?

They're actually much newer than that.

They're 2+ Crushing claws carnifex with regeneration that rerolls ones and -1 attack, but they get AP1 out of the deal and are actually cheaper than crushing claws fexes with regen by a good deal. They also have some special rules that only apply in certain scenarios and specialist games that nobody cares about but they're cheaper than vanilla crushing claws regen fexes so it's not like paying for them means anything.

You can find them in IA;A 2e.

Why would you mention Spore Mines and kill points in the same sentence? If you honestly think Spore Mines affect deployment, go for it, but they are a kill point each. So not only do you end up giving the enemy more kill points but they might not even wound anything.

What a strange thought... lol.

 jifel wrote:
Quick question: Is there a single FW unit for Nids thats worth considering (non Apoc of course). I've seen Stone crushers get mentioned on here a little bit, I'm guessing they're in the Anphelion project IA from way way back? If not, where are the rules?

Nids have 3 40k approved FW units;

The Stone Crusher Carnifex, which you already mentioned.

The Meiotic Spore Mine. Costing as much as shrikes, they deep strike unlike spore mines individually after the game begins as per normal reserve rolls. They blow up in an ap3 large blast and drop d6 -2 normal spore mines afterwards. 1-3 make up 1 fast attack choice and do not need to be in unit coherency.

And the Malanthrope. Dirt cheap 4w mc costing 50 clams less than a tervigon. statline of a harpy with more attacks, free regen, toxic miasma, fleet, and a neat special rule that gives PE to anything in synapse towards whatever unit type it just killed in close combat. 1-3 is an hq choice. Beautiful model with human faces pressing to get out of its digestion sacs.

Meiotic spores also have S5. MEQs don't like them very much.

Nice discussion... seeing the same list over and over put me off nids a bit. I hope to be able to run some more interesting variants, like you're trying to figure out

Cyaneye wrote:

 jifel wrote:
Quick question: Is there a single FW unit for Nids thats worth considering (non Apoc of course). I've seen Stone crushers get mentioned on here a little bit, I'm guessing they're in the Anphelion project IA from way way back? If not, where are the rules?

Nids have 3 40k approved FW units;

The Stone Crusher Carnifex, which you already mentioned.

The Meiotic Spore Mine. Costing as much as shrikes, they deep strike unlike spore mines individually after the game begins as per normal reserve rolls. They blow up in an ap3 large blast and drop d6 -2 normal spore mines afterwards. 1-3 make up 1 fast attack choice and do not need to be in unit coherency.

And the Malanthrope. Dirt cheap 4w mc costing 50 clams less than a tervigon. statline of a harpy with more attacks, free regen, toxic miasma, fleet, and a neat special rule that gives PE to anything in synapse towards whatever unit type it just killed in close combat. 1-3 is an hq choice. Beautiful model with human faces pressing to get out of its digestion sacs.

And about how many gants does a Stonecrusher cost? I'm seeing a bit of potential there.

Iirc exactly 40.

The potential isn't there IMO.

rigeld2 wrote:
Iirc exactly 40.

The potential isn't there IMO.

They are a viable alternative to Trygons, although most prefer biovores over melee MCs these days.

I believe Ductvader pointed it out: There are a lot of lists that Nids can win with.

Whether you're going for WAAC, Very-Competitive, Competitive, Fun-But-Has-A-Chance, All-Fun, or Fluffy is completely up to you. I'd argue that WAAC lists (as well as their rule sniping attitude) follows a specific army composition. The two forms of competitive lists always include 2 Flyrants, 2 Tervigons, Doom, and Heavies of your choice. There are other versions of course, but most include the ones previously listed. And of cours, the fun and fluffy lists are always an option. Those lists can win a majority of the time as well, if played to its fullest potential.

That's two times a week I agreed with Ductvader. I might be getting soft. But he has a point this time: Nids have a lot of different units that can be used. They might not be optimal but there are quite a few valid units. (P.S.-Sky-slashers are terrible and you should feel terrible)

Hormagaunts are underused, in my opinion. If your takimg Swarmlord as an HQ, you can take Hormagaunts with Toxin Sacs instead of Gargoyles. Fast as freak with more attacks and scoring. Use Swarmy to give em FC or PE.

I've been playing this with a lot of success. The only real underused unit is the Carnifex brood, though.

2 Flyrants, Dual Devs
2 Tervigons, Sacs, Glands, Talons, 3 Powers
2x 10 Gaunts
2 Zoanthropes
15 Gargoyles, Sacs, Glands
2 Carnifex, Dual Devs
2x 2 Biovores

I've thought about taking out the Biovores for Harpies.. They look good on paper, at least. And I like monsters, cause theyre fun.

 ductvader wrote:
At least then we'd have a use for rippers.

My rippers ate an enemy Carnifex once, so they do have some use :p Granted that Carnifex had been whittled down to 1 wound before but still.

Baktru wrote:

 ductvader wrote:
At least then we'd have a use for rippers.

My rippers ate an enemy Carnifex once, so they do have some use :p Granted that Carnifex had been whittled down to 1 wound before but still.

My "friend" used to play an all bloodcrusher list in 5th with skulltaker and many heralds...the list was ungodly then...so I decided to have some fun with him and take an all poison ripper army.

annihilated those stupid 2 wound 3+/5+ EW jerks



Also, I use the Stone Crusher often, Old One Eye can be used for a Stone Crusher as he has crushing claws and scything talons. Stone Crushing is AP1, has regeneration and it will not die...on top of a 2+...for 195 points. Unfortunately...his BS is one lower than the average Carnifex...so there's that. Oh, and they cannot take a pod and the can only be a brood of one.

But, the Stone Crusher plays well alongside dakkafexes...it gives you one of those...whatever you dont shoot will kill you feelings.

I still want to buy the stonecrusher carnifex model from FW but for now i just made do with what comes in the carnifex box and some extra bits and such glued on.

The wrecking ball looks amazing, though it can be difficult to place at some moments.

Saythings wrote:
Why would you mention Spore Mines and kill points in the same sentence? If you honestly think Spore Mines affect deployment, go for it, but they are a kill point each. So not only do you end up giving the enemy more kill points but they might not even wound anything.

This is incorrect. The Living Bomb rule (pg 48) specifically states that Spore Mines are ignored for any and all mission purposes (Kill Points, First Blood, etc.). Still probably not the best use of points given how easily they are neutralized, but not non-functional.

Well played good sir, could have sworn that got changed in a FAQ. But after some interwebz searching I could not find anything.

I still think Biovores aren't worth it. There are simple better models that the Nids have access to.

Saythings wrote:
Well played good sir, could have sworn that got changed in a FAQ. But after some interwebz searching I could not find anything.

I still think Biovores aren't worth it. There are simple better models that the Nids have access to.

Biovores are great for killing ADL camping pansies like the Tau.

Tau....TAU.....TTTTTAAAAAAUUUUU!!!!!

Saythings wrote:
Why would you mention Spore Mines and kill points in the same sentence? If you honestly think Spore Mines affect deployment, go for it, but they are a kill point each. So not only do you end up giving the enemy more kill points but they might not even wound anything.

What a strange thought... lol.

They do not give VP in any case. They are always ignored for mission objectives (including Purge the Alien, The scouring, scoring in the scouring, First Blood and Linebreaker).

Im planning to create a list based on getting to the enemy really freaking quick. I thinking of having 6 Raveners and a Harpy, plus 2 Flyrants (2x TL Dev of course).

I just bought 6 crappy warriors on ebay which im going to turn into Shrikes with 2x BS. So thats my 3 FA maxed out. Then ill add 2 broods of 20 Hormagaunts with TS, and a small brood of Stealers with a Broodlord to Infiltrate. For Elites ill take Deathleaper (because I love the model and ive never tried him) just for kicks and a unit of Ymgarls.

Points wise Ill just see how it stacks up, but I think around 2000 is do-able with a little brood trimming. This list is mainly just to use a lot of models I havent used before or dont often use. Plus I think itll be fun.

 Deadshot wrote:

They do not give VP in any case. They are always ignored for mission objectives (including Purge the Alien, The scouring, scoring in the scouring, First Blood and Linebreaker).

I've been corrected twice in the same post. No less than 3 posts away even...

Well played good sir. Well played.

Sorry, I was a page behind

 HerbaciousT wrote:

I just bought 6 crappy warriors on ebay which im going to turn into Shrikes with 2x BS.

I kitted my Shrikes with LW/BS

Very difficult to play but very very fruitful to the more intelligent players.

They definitely need a lot of support and other threat vectors for their high cost?

Played a game recently, gave stock t-fexes a try, and MAN are they fun. I do really wish they could take spore pods, but with endurance, 2 of them is just a fun silly time. My opponent had a hell of a time trying to take them down and with double flamers or torrent flamer and large blast, they were roastin dudes left and right. Honestly, felt like I had two godzillas marchin up radiation breathing everything.

Deathleaper didnt have too much of a target for his LD drop, was playin necrons so I just targeted imhotep, though he did take out an annihilation barge when he arrived which was awesome.

once again faced an army that doom was not meant to fight, he just kinda wandered never really in range of anything.

used support zoans for the first time in a long time and had a blast with them, managed to snag enfeeble and endurance in the squad AND iron arm on the third.

I liked the flyrant to a point, but it seemed like I couldnt make a 3+ to save my life! I only made 3 fnp's and he just died in one turn of lucky rolls to annihilation barges.

In any case, fun game and got to use some units I have been dieing to try

Ooooooooooo....

Play Screamer Fexes...Stock with just a Bio Plasma upgrade.

Even more fun and even more radiation breathing feeling.

I always get a similar feel when I onslaught dual tyrranofexes with rupture cannons...moving, running, and shooting tanks in the first few turns...then just moving and dual templating infantry before assaulting later in the game.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
They pair really well with the Swarmlord and dual tervigons

 ductvader wrote:
Ooooooooooo....

Play Screamer Fexes...Stock with just a Bio Plasma upgrade.

Even more fun and even more radiation breathing feeling.

I always get a similar feel when I onslaught dual tyrranofexes with rupture cannons...moving, running, and shooting tanks in the first few turns...then just moving and dual templating infantry before assaulting later in the game.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
They pair really well with the Swarmlord and dual tervigons

But Stonecrushers give you more bang for the buck, and are much better at soaking up the wounds that will be dumped onto them.

Undoubtedly...that's why I have two...unfortunately not everyone allows IA and they can't be taken in broods...Endurance on a Brood of 2 can go farther than a single Crusher...more points of course...it all just depends on what you want to accomplish.

 ductvader wrote:
Undoubtedly...that's why I have two...unfortunately not everyone allows IA and they can't be taken in broods...Endurance on a Brood of 2 can go farther than a single Crusher...more points of course...it all just depends on what you want to accomplish.

Has anyone run the numbers on two Fexes with endurance vs a Single stonecrusher with endurance? Taking it's own version of IWND into account?

Sorry, just gotta say... great thread!

We run a single flyrant list 'cos we're bored with the oblgatory two flyrant (drew last night against a super-competitive Tau-Space Wolves list)... maybe we need something even more different...time to start looking for more Zoeys on eBay maybe...

Way back to the OP, I have found a few tricks with infiltrating genestealers.

Version 1) You need a fast synapse for (flyrant, shrike, PoM) and some area terrain to inflitratr in to that is about at the end of the synapse movement range + synapse range. Thanks to the FAQ on Fearless cancelling GtG, if you go second have the genestealers eat dirt, then pop the synapse in to range on your turn, they jump up and can move and assault like normal.

Version 2) Need a broodlord or Zoe with the TP power that grants fearless, then do the same as above. But you can inflitrate much deeper in to enemy territory.