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 dogma wrote:
I think that's the crux of the issue. When I asked some of my colleagues if they wanted to go see it they unanimously declined. Mind, my colleagues are all huge nerds that geek out over anything Star Wars or Star Trek related, among other things. As a result I ended up going with a couple guys I used to canvass with who obsess over all things giant robot related.

The point being, of all the people I knew who wanted to see it, I was the only one who found the kaiju themselves at all interesting.

Yep. Giant robots and monsters fighting is a niche within a niche.

Now, I'm not saying it was a bad idea to make this movie because all kinds of niche material gets gambled on successfully (there was a time when only Batman and Superman were considered viable comic book characters for blockbusters, but studios took the punt on X-Men and Iron Man and changed that... in fact there was a time when the first Superman and Batman movies were huge gambles). But in the case of Pacific Rim it looks like this is a gamble that simply didn't pay off.

Its also a case of opportunity cost. Money spent on a profitable film may well have been better spent on established IP that is likely to be even more profitable.

Sure, though not that a lot of the final calculations comes back to the final pay off. A studio can fund another Star Wars movie, and know that $200 million in investment will almost certainly net a healthy box office, but that's all. A new Star Wars will boost merchandising sales but it won't massively change that cash cow. A new IP, even one that doesn't deliver a massive box office, can potentially create all kinds of new merchandising, potentially creating a new cash cow for years to come.

Look at Cars, for instance, which produced a solid but hardly remarkable box office, and is generally considered one of Pixar's more modest efforts. But it's a merchandising juggernaught worth probably in excess of a billion.

When I was a kid, we didn't have cable TV. It was kind of unusual to have it at the time. Instead, we had the WPIX movie of the week on sundays, and I watched a lot of the WPIX movies of the week.

Some were pretty recent, but a lot of them were of the Godzilla variety. Long story short, I think I was kind of pre-destined to like Pacific Rim.

 Ouze wrote:
When I was a kid, we didn't have cable TV. It was kind of unusual to have it at the time. Instead, we had the WPIX movie of the week on sundays, and I watched a lot of the WPIX movies of the week.

Some were pretty recent, but a lot of them were of the Godzilla variety. Long story short, I think I was kind of pre-destined to like Pacific Rim.

I think this is the case for most people who enjoyed it, they went into the film thinking "YEAH A FILM ABOUT GIANT ROBOTS, THIS WILL BE AWESOME" and came out feeling the same.

I went into the film without any particular predisposition towards giant robots and found it very average.

The point being, of all the people I knew who wanted to see it, I was the only one who found the kaiju themselves at all interesting

Agreed. While I would love a nice Macross style movie, monsters vs. robots is not greatly interesting. I do like the concept enough to rent it later, and its eminently better then many movies out there, just not my thing.

Its also a case of opportunity cost. Money spent on a profitable film may well have been better spent on established IP that is likely to be even more profitable.

Yes, the safe bet.

 chromedog wrote:
DREDD is getting a sequel.

The dvd/blu-ray sales will guarantee that.

So there's hope for you kaiju baka to get your sequel yet.

I stopped finding kaiju entertaining about the age of 8 (spaceships and stuff were better than giant monsters.).


For the record, Star Wars came out when I was 8.

Leave your mancard and testes on the way out. Heard that Wallmart was having a sale on tampons you might want to check that out. And did you actually use the Japanese word Baka? Seriously though bro, the vast majority of men find in this movie something absolutely wonderful and divine for the purposes of bro-time and father-son bonding.

Primordial, you just made me wish that the film had a scene with a robot bro-fist XD

ThePrimordial wrote:

 chromedog wrote:
DREDD is getting a sequel.

The dvd/blu-ray sales will guarantee that.

So there's hope for you kaiju baka to get your sequel yet.

I stopped finding kaiju entertaining about the age of 8 (spaceships and stuff were better than giant monsters.).


For the record, Star Wars came out when I was 8.

Leave your mancard and testes on the way out. Heard that Wallmart was having a sale on tampons you might want to check that out. And did you actually use the Japanese word Baka? Seriously though bro, the vast majority of men find in this movie something absolutely wonderful and divine for the purposes of bro-time and father-son bonding.

Except its going to losemoney for the studio so you are what we would call, wrong.

ThePrimordial wrote:
Leave your mancard and testes on the way out. Heard that Wallmart was having a sale on tampons you might want to check that out.

Movie watching as a manly activity? How fat and lazy have we gotten that sitting your ass on a chair and watching a movie is how we judge manliness?

ThePrimordial wrote:

 chromedog wrote:
DREDD is getting a sequel.

The dvd/blu-ray sales will guarantee that.

So there's hope for you kaiju baka to get your sequel yet.

I stopped finding kaiju entertaining about the age of 8 (spaceships and stuff were better than giant monsters.).


For the record, Star Wars came out when I was 8.

Leave your mancard and testes on the way out. Heard that Wallmart was having a sale on tampons you might want to check that out. And did you actually use the Japanese word Baka? Seriously though bro, the vast majority of men find in this movie something absolutely wonderful and divine for the purposes of bro-time and father-son bonding.

There aren't enough faces or palms in this world.

 sebster wrote:

ThePrimordial wrote:
Leave your mancard and testes on the way out. Heard that Wallmart was having a sale on tampons you might want to check that out.

Movie watching as a manly activity? How fat and lazy have we gotten that sitting your ass on a chair and watching a movie is how we judge manliness?

It's not a manly activity and I never implied it was. It just that this is the kind of movie that I honestly can't see a lot of women loving, and also the kind that appeals to a vast number of men.If you're a man and you don't like boatswords, 600 foot monsters, Del Toro, & billion dollar robots and massive amounts of destruction that would make Michael Bay blush (without the raping of your childhood) then you're not the typical man simply put.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Frazzled wrote:

ThePrimordial wrote:

 chromedog wrote:
DREDD is getting a sequel.

The dvd/blu-ray sales will guarantee that.

So there's hope for you kaiju baka to get your sequel yet.

I stopped finding kaiju entertaining about the age of 8 (spaceships and stuff were better than giant monsters.).


For the record, Star Wars came out when I was 8.

Leave your mancard and testes on the way out. Heard that Wallmart was having a sale on tampons you might want to check that out. And did you actually use the Japanese word Baka? Seriously though bro, the vast majority of men find in this movie something absolutely wonderful and divine for the purposes of bro-time and father-son bonding.

Except its going to losemoney for the studio so you are what we would call, wrong.

No there's still the already successfull NECA toyline (great figures as expected from NECA), the video game (might actually be good), and DVD's. All of these are included in the 180 million budget. Plus Legendary is primarily a group of geeks & they love doing this kind of stuff. There's probably no way they won't at least make their money back (might already have, I for one bought the entire NECA figure set) & if they lose a million or so they won't care as they enjoyed doing it. Legendary isn't the normal soulless Hollywood company you know.
EDIT: probably should have mentioned the massive thousand people showing room I was in was completely full

I think we've made contact with a strange alternate universe where niche geeky films are the pinnacle of masculinity and always make large amounts of money.

 sebster wrote:

ThePrimordial wrote:
Leave your mancard and testes on the way out. Heard that Wallmart was having a sale on tampons you might want to check that out.

Movie watching as a manly activity? How fat and lazy have we gotten that sitting your ass on a chair and watching a movie is how we judge manliness?

I can only speak for myself, but... pretty fat, super lazy.

In Perth at least, there was about a 50% attendance rate. We've had some pretty good filler (I think though thats cause Sydney gets flattened, and two of the bigger stars have Aussie Accents)

Pacific rim is essentially like Starship troopers the movie. Leave out the politics, leave out your intelligence and just enjoy bashing monsters apart and a bit of fun.

 Corpsesarefun wrote:
I think we've made contact with a strange alternate universe where niche geeky films are the pinnacle of masculinity and always make large amounts of money.

Whenever I want to do something manly I play full tackle football with my cadre of 6'6 friends. Something I don't see you doing given your avatar. And It's not a niche film based on the showing I was at.
And you never actually made comments or refuted the arguments I made . I'm pretty sure that w/ all the other stuff included in the budget they've probably already made MOST of their money back.

Also Iron man & Transformers did well & they're not niche movies. To the average viewer who doesn't know about kaiju or mecha this will simply like those movies but on a MUCH bigger and more epic scale.
I've just realized you've been looking at this wrong. To the average viewer who knows nothing about kaiju or mecha they'll come for the same reasons they would go to Iron Man or Transformers. The fact that it's Kaiju or Mecha will only matter to a niche that's a small minority in the number of people who like the movie.

 sebster wrote:

Look at Cars, for instance, which produced a solid but hardly remarkable box office, and is generally considered one of Pixar's more modest efforts. But it's a merchandising juggernaught worth probably in excess of a billion.

But that's Pixar and, more importantly, a movie aimed at children. Its difficult to sell merchandise when a film is aimed at adults or, more problematically, a particular group of adults who share a trait that many children would be admonished for.

I just saw it. One question

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
I just saw it. One question

Spoiler:

Why was it pregnant? That makes no sense what so ever

The kaiju were shown to be sapient & they have genders. (that one was female obviously) The one you're talking about was a female called Otachi & I think there was a male Otachi in the comics.
Also they're completely alien so while it doesn't look like a mammal (I know live birth doesn't define mammalian but you know what I mean) but that doesn't mean It isn't a mammal.

Also, Dinosaurs didnt have two brains.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
I just saw it. One question

Spoiler:

Why was it pregnant? That makes no sense what so ever

How woulld that eliminate the threat to the brain?

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

Spoiler:

But the movie said they where genetically engineered by the alien race

Also, Dinosaurs didnt have two brains.

Sauropods did. And them being genetically engineered doesn't mean anything. There are multiples of the kaiju shown in the film. Think of it like a production model.

Ok, So what? It said they where grown, like it showed when the guy drifted. They are grown.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
How woulld that eliminate the threat to the brain?

It doesn't and wasn't meant to. The kaiju just got preggers in it's time when it wasn't purging worlds or making Idris Elba look awesome.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Ok, So what? It said they where grown, like it showed when the guy drifted. They are grown.

If the kaiju were also capable of reproduction it would make them a better fighting force & allow them to replenish their numbers on their own. Growing giant monsters is expensive you know.

ThePrimordial wrote:
It's not a manly activity and I never implied it was. It just that this is the kind of movie that I honestly can't see a lot of women loving, and also the kind that appeals to a vast number of men.If you're a man and you don't like boatswords, 600 foot monsters, Del Toro, & billion dollar robots and massive amounts of destruction that would make Michael Bay blush (without the raping of your childhood) then you're not the typical man simply put.

Therefore tampons?

And while most guys love action movies, it's just way out there to claim that typical men must therefore love this particular kind of action movie. And it appears enough men don't love this particular kind of action movie, and the box office is disappointing because of that.

 sebster wrote:

ThePrimordial wrote:
It's not a manly activity and I never implied it was. It just that this is the kind of movie that I honestly can't see a lot of women loving, and also the kind that appeals to a vast number of men.If you're a man and you don't like boatswords, 600 foot monsters, Del Toro, & billion dollar robots and massive amounts of destruction that would make Michael Bay blush (without the raping of your childhood) then you're not the typical man simply put.

Therefore tampons?

And while most guys love action movies, it's just way out there to claim that typical men must therefore love this particular kind of action movie. And it appears enough men don't love this particular kind of action movie, and the box office is disappointing because of that.

It's obvious from your avatar that you're not a real man.

You are in fact a dog.

 sebster wrote:

ThePrimordial wrote:
It's not a manly activity and I never implied it was. It just that this is the kind of movie that I honestly can't see a lot of women loving, and also the kind that appeals to a vast number of men.If you're a man and you don't like boatswords, 600 foot monsters, Del Toro, & billion dollar robots and massive amounts of destruction that would make Michael Bay blush (without the raping of your childhood) then you're not the typical man simply put.

Therefore tampons?

And while most guys love action movies, it's just way out there to claim that typical men must therefore love this particular kind of action movie. And it appears enough men don't love this particular kind of action movie, and the box office is disappointing because of that.

I was making a joke, calm down. Plus there's only him and like three other people who didn't like the movie on this thread.

ThePrimordial wrote:
Also Iron man & Transformers did well & they're not niche movies.

Yes they did. And this, to date, hasn't done well. And so the sensible conversation to have would be why those movies did well, and Pacific Rim hasn't.

A lot of it probably comes down to the basics of brand recognition. People know Godzilla, but mostly as an ironic joke (and not helped by that lamentable Matthew Broderick movie), and from they don't really know the rest of the genre at all, and certainly don't care about it.

Whereas Iron Man and Transformers are properties people know. Even if you'd never read an Iron Man comic you likely still know the character, and Transformer toys were owned by probably half the potential audience for that movie, and known by almost all of the rest. And from there you add in film specific factors (Robert Downey Jr suddenly revealed himself as a big a-list drawcard, and for Transformers it appears Michael Bay signed a deal with the devil that means his films always make money).

I've just realized you've been looking at this wrong. To the average viewer who knows nothing about kaiju or mecha they'll come for the same reasons they would go to Iron Man or Transformers. The fact that it's Kaiju or Mecha will only matter to a niche that's a small minority in the number of people who like the movie.

That was probably the theory the producers had when they decided to fund this thing. From the numbers we've seen far, they were wrong. Big robots and big monsters hasn't been the draw they were hoping for.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 dogma wrote:
But that's Pixar and, more importantly, a movie aimed at children. Its difficult to sell merchandise when a film is aimed at adults or, more problematically, a particular group of adults who share a trait that many children would be admonished for.

There is an outrageous amount of money in merchandise aimed at older fans. It isn't Cars type money, but then other than Star Wars probably nothing is, and it is still a massive revenue stream.

There's a reason that the studio behind Prometheus decided very late in pre-production to make the film its own thing, the start of a new franchise set. They didn't want to boost Alien merchandise sale, they wanted a whole new line of merchandise they could sell to nerds for the next 50 years.

And it's why the people behind John Carter were already in panic mode a year before the film hit the box office. They took their stills and concept stuff to the toy fairs and couldn't get any interest at all.

Neither the Alien or John Carter franchise were aimed at kids, but both had merchandise as a major part of their business plans.

 Corpsesarefun wrote:

 sebster wrote:

ThePrimordial wrote:
It's not a manly activity and I never implied it was. It just that this is the kind of movie that I honestly can't see a lot of women loving, and also the kind that appeals to a vast number of men.If you're a man and you don't like boatswords, 600 foot monsters, Del Toro, & billion dollar robots and massive amounts of destruction that would make Michael Bay blush (without the raping of your childhood) then you're not the typical man simply put.

Therefore tampons?

And while most guys love action movies, it's just way out there to claim that typical men must therefore love this particular kind of action movie. And it appears enough men don't love this particular kind of action movie, and the box office is disappointing because of that.

It's obvious from your avatar that you're not a real man.

You are in fact a dog.

WOOF.

 Corpsesarefun wrote:
It's obvious from your avatar that you're not a real man.

You are in fact a dog.

But if I see Pacific Rim I can be a real man, yeah?

 sebster wrote:

 Corpsesarefun wrote:
It's obvious from your avatar that you're not a real man.

You are in fact a dog.

But if I see Pacific Rim I can be a real man, yeah?

For those 131 minutes every woman, dog and child in the theatre is a wolf-punching, bear-eating, moose-drinking uber-man.