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Hey Alf...

Can I dream a little? This has me drooling:
http://www.rantsports.com/nfl/2014/01/28/5-potential-first-round-scenarios-for-st-louis-rams-in-2014-nfl-draft/?utm_source=RantSports&utm_medium=HUBRecirculation&utm_term=NFLSt.%20Louis%20RamsGrid1

But no trade scenario would trump the potential haul the Rams could make in an ideal world if the Browns get desperate. Some have pointed out that the Browns could potentially keep their No. 4 overall pick and still try to move up to No. 2 overall with the Rams. Such a scenario would entail sending No. 26 overall to the Rams with a second-rounder in 2014, a first-rounder in 2015 and a first-rounder in 2016. This deal would be Redskins-esque and leave the Rams loaded for bear in upcoming seasons just as GM Les Snead desires.

What the motive behind this would be for Cleveland is to add wideout Sammy Watkins at No. 2 and Johnny Manziel or Blake Bortles at No. 4 to complement Josh Gordon and Jordan Cameron in an already dangerous array of offensive weapons.

The team that would really benefit in such a scenario is the Rams, however, with the No. 13 and 26 picks in round one, picks No. 35 and 44 overall in round two and their own No. 75 overall in round three. That’s five picks from the top 75 players in this year’s draft class while still having an additional first-rounder in both 2015 and 2016. Desperate times call for desperate measures, and it seems like the Browns may be just anxious enough to make such a haul a reality.

So for the RAMs #2, the Brownies send the #26 & 2nd-rounder in '14 draft, a 1st-rounder in 2015 and a 1st-rounder in 2016.

Honestly, if the Browns have targeted Manziel as rumored, they can almost certainly sit tight and grab him at #4. You never really know who else may be high on him, but he's the kind of player that will probably have his detractors. I wouldn't be surprised at all if a number of teams like Bortles better. And I don't think either one of them would be the target for a team trading into the top 3. Clowney or Bridgewater would likely be the target at #2. Look for teams that could have their eyes set on one of them for your potential trade partners. Vikes? Falcons?

Trading up to #2 and #4 seems awfully foolish and unlikely for the Browns. You can get a WR later. Keep in mind that the Eagles under Banner really valued their draft picks, and mortgaging the future like that seems very out of character.

 gorgon wrote:
Honestly, if the Browns have targeted Manziel as rumored, they can almost certainly sit tight and grab him at #4. You never really know who else may be high on him, but he's the kind of player that will probably have his detractors. I wouldn't be surprised at all if a number of teams like Bortles better. And I don't think either one of them would be the target for a team trading into the top 3. Clowney or Bridgewater would likely be the target at #2. Look for teams that could have their eyes set on one of them for your potential trade partners. Vikes? Falcons?

Trading up to #2 and #4 seems awfully foolish and unlikely for the Browns. You can get a WR later. Keep in mind that the Eagles under Banner really valued their draft picks, and mortgaging the future like that seems very out of character.

Stop talking sense dammit!

 whembly wrote:

 gorgon wrote:
Honestly, if the Browns have targeted Manziel as rumored, they can almost certainly sit tight and grab him at #4. You never really know who else may be high on him, but he's the kind of player that will probably have his detractors. I wouldn't be surprised at all if a number of teams like Bortles better. And I don't think either one of them would be the target for a team trading into the top 3. Clowney or Bridgewater would likely be the target at #2. Look for teams that could have their eyes set on one of them for your potential trade partners. Vikes? Falcons?

Trading up to #2 and #4 seems awfully foolish and unlikely for the Browns. You can get a WR later. Keep in mind that the Eagles under Banner really valued their draft picks, and mortgaging the future like that seems very out of character.

Stop talking sense dammit!

Besides.. it doesn't work. Not on Whembly anyway.

I would argue gorgon is the one who isn't making sense. The browns as an organization have shown their willingness to feth the franchise over again and again. So it would totally make sense to for them to trade the farm for #2 and #4 ;p.

Don't worry whembly I got your back ;p

whembly wrote:Hey Alf...

Can I dream a little? This has me drooling:
http://www.rantsports.com/nfl/2014/01/28/5-potential-first-round-scenarios-for-st-louis-rams-in-2014-nfl-draft/?utm_source=RantSports&utm_medium=HUBRecirculation&utm_term=NFLSt.%20Louis%20RamsGrid1

But no trade scenario would trump the potential haul the Rams could make in an ideal world if the Browns get desperate. Some have pointed out that the Browns could potentially keep their No. 4 overall pick and still try to move up to No. 2 overall with the Rams. Such a scenario would entail sending No. 26 overall to the Rams with a second-rounder in 2014, a first-rounder in 2015 and a first-rounder in 2016. This deal would be Redskins-esque and leave the Rams loaded for bear in upcoming seasons just as GM Les Snead desires.

What the motive behind this would be for Cleveland is to add wideout Sammy Watkins at No. 2 and Johnny Manziel or Blake Bortles at No. 4 to complement Josh Gordon and Jordan Cameron in an already dangerous array of offensive weapons.

The team that would really benefit in such a scenario is the Rams, however, with the No. 13 and 26 picks in round one, picks No. 35 and 44 overall in round two and their own No. 75 overall in round three. That’s five picks from the top 75 players in this year’s draft class while still having an additional first-rounder in both 2015 and 2016. Desperate times call for desperate measures, and it seems like the Browns may be just anxious enough to make such a haul a reality.

So for the RAMs #2, the Brownies send the #26 & 2nd-rounder in '14 draft, a 1st-rounder in 2015 and a 1st-rounder in 2016.

You can dream, and you can drool, but the Browns would be dumber than I could imagine if they did something as stupid as trade away future picks just for a chance that Manziel would get taken before #4. I wouldn't do it based on the fact that Manziel likes to run, he's improved as a pocket passer but he still likes to run. If RGIII hadn't fethed up his knee last year and looked completely and utterly terrible, then I might be open to such an idea, but since then, feth that.

Chancetragedy wrote:I would argue gorgon is the one who isn't making sense. The browns as an organization have shown their willingness to feth the franchise over again and again. So it would totally make sense to for them to trade the farm for #2 and #4 ;p.

Don't worry whembly I got your back ;p

You shut your mouth The Browns made an excellent decision to get rid of Richardson, but that's about it this season .

Chancetragedy wrote:
I would argue gorgon is the one who isn't making sense. The browns as an organization have shown their willingness to feth the franchise over again and again. So it would totally make sense to for them to trade the farm for #2 and #4 ;p.

Don't worry whembly I got your back ;p

Heh....good point dude!

Yes trading Richardson was the right move this time alfindrate. But how high did they draft him in the first place? So it's a net draft loss of what 18 spots?

Chancetragedy wrote:
Yes trading Richardson was the right move this time alfindrate. But how high did they draft him in the first place? So it's a net draft loss of what 18 spots?

Not my fault Tom Heckert didn't know how to evaluate that gak player.

I'm sorry that not everyone has a stable football franchise, but the Browns have fethed up and fethed up hard. I really don't need randoms on the internet to remind me of that fact. I read it every day in the papers...

Prediction, if the Browns get Manz.... He goes the Tim Couch route and is out in 3 years.
Why?
Same stuff I mentioned previously.
They have added Loggains from the Titans as QB Coach... before they have an OC. I have seen this kind of move before... In Philly. We all saw what happened to Reid after that debacle.
Just remember ... There are reasons Heckert and Banner are no longer with Philly.

Hey, Bronco fans! Got something for ya.

Manziel is going to be Tim Tebow 2.0, only probably not even that good.

He really should have stayed for four years.

trexmeyer wrote:
Manziel is going to be Tim Tebow 2.0, only probably not even that good.

He really should have stayed for four years.

A while back I would have agreed with you. My opinion has changed somewhat, however.

Manziel is a freelancer who runs, but he isn't really a run-first QB like Tebow (who was really a FB playing QB). He threw the ball a ton, and far more than Cam Newton did in college. Of course, Newton has big-time "arm talent," as does Kaepernick. Wilson's is good also. But I've read things from scouts and such who think Manziel really does have special gifts and NFL-level passing ability, and that the main thing will be improving his mechanics, putting on some good weight (he's kind of a skinny kid), eliminating bad habits, etc. The arm strength and accuracy seems to be there, even at his size.

So there are NFL talent evaluators who really like the guy. He was obviously crazy productive, and a helluva competitor. Sure, Tebow had that too, but that's all he had. You still can't teach or coach the 'heart' part, and Manziel seems to have it.

Regarding staying in school, would it have really helped him? The main adjustment he'll have to make is to NFL-style offenses and defenses, and he wasn't going to exposed to that if he stayed. It'd have just been another year in the same wide-open college offense playing against college defenders. He is a raw talent who you probably want to ease into the pro game (unlike many rookie QBs these days). But there wasn't anything left for him to learn or prove where he was.

tl;dr I've decided that I won't sleep on Manziel...he might end up being PDG after all. If Bridgewater fell to the Browns, I'd take him instead. But otherwise sure, roll the dice on greatness. There'll be QB prospects like Blake Bortles in next year's draft, and the next, and the next.

I think the teams that will be sour on Manziel already are. He has a lot of "down-side" to go with his arguable talent. Bad mechanics should have been addressed already by his coaches, same with his bad in game habits.
His out of game habits are also a concern.

Eh...if you're a college coach and have a good thing going like Manziel, you probably don't fuss with his mechanics or game. You just ride that horse. The point is winning games (because your job's on the line), not preparing players for pro ball.

Lots of superior athletes get away with bad technique, etc. in college. Linemen on either side of the ball are a prime example. I'm not sure most o-lineman even hit their prime until their late 20s.

I believe I read recently that some scouts aren't sure how to grade Greg Robinson, the big LT from Auburn, just because the offense he played in was so screwy and unlike anything he's going to be asked to do in the NFL. He almost never had to pass block on a traditional drop-back pass. The athleticism is there, but he's going to need a lot of coaching.

The off-the-field stuff is a concern for Manziel. But then at least the financial impact isn't quite what it was now that the rookie wage scale is in place. Obviously it still really hurts if a top 5 pick goes bust. But hey, Cleveland has built up enough scar tissue there.

Go Texans!

 gorgon wrote:
Eh...if you're a college coach and have a good thing going like Manziel, you probably don't fuss with his mechanics or game. You just ride that horse. The point is winning games (because your job's on the line), not preparing players for pro ball.

I think this statement greatly depends on the coach at hand. Certain guys like (disgustingly) Nick Saban, alot of the Miami coaches in the past, Bobby Bowden, etc. were known to produce NFL "ready" players. There are more NFL coaches, usually assistants who are going on to HC jobs in college, bringing in a "pro" system, which helps out a ton of players, especially in regards to future employment in the NFL.

 kronk wrote:
Go Texans!

PLEASE! Bring back the BOC Reaper Cowbell! Something seems... unnatural...

Today is the day!

Playing 40K from when the pre game starts to kick off, going to be a great night, win or loose.

Go Broncos!

 Morathi's Darkest Sin wrote:


Playing 40K from when the pre game starts to kick off, going to be a great night, win or loose.

Go Broncos!

Hopefully Aura doesn't get too upset when the Broncos win

I'm going out to a casino with my team where there's a free buffet and £2.50 drinks

 helgrenze wrote:
I think the teams that will be sour on Manziel already are. He has a lot of "down-side" to go with his arguable talent. Bad mechanics should have been addressed already by his coaches, same with his bad in game habits.
His out of game habits are also a concern.

I see two major problems with picking Manziel. First of all is that numerous athletic/mobile quarterbacks that were stellar in college have been busts in the NFL or at best failed to reach their perceived potential. The most successful of these quarterbacks has been Vick and he has really only had two outstanding seasons. Cam Newtwon has been decent. Vince Young and Tebow were failures. Even the best D1 defensive units pale in comparison to NFL defenses. NFL players are quicker, stronger, more agile, and simply better. It is one thing to tear up college teams, it is an entirely different thing to perform at a professional level. There is a long history of successful college QBs failing to make the transition. It seems as if it is nearly impossible to predict who will become a star NFL QB. I don't recall Favre, Brady, Brees, Rodgers, or Warner being lauded as the next big thing. Russell Wilson was an afterthought in the draft.

Manziel's off the field antics are the biggest red flag. He is a big fish in a small pond. A prima donna. Full of himself. Arrogance is good to a point, but I think combination of confidence and humility will take a player much farther.


Also, go Seahawks!

 d-usa wrote:
Today is the day!

This picture is so much win!

 Morathi's Darkest Sin wrote:


Playing 40K from when the pre game starts to kick off, going to be a great night, win or loose.

Go Broncos!

Hopefully Aura is a gracious winner, and doesnt rub it in too much the Broncos losing

The World Championship is on the line! I'll be watching it with Dakka!

Loving that Kurt Russell intro. <3

And Seattle wins the toss.

lol Namath

OMG! GO DENVER!!!! HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHA

Safety! First play of the game!

And then Seattle marches down the field. If they don't win this challenge of the spot I'm calling shenanigans. Wilson ABSOLUTELY had that first down what a garbage spot they have him.