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The Spikey bits blog, wrote this,, it just came up on my facebook feed:

http://blog.spikeybits.com/2013/07/wargames-are-we-all-ferrari-collectors.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+SpikeyBits+%28Spikey+Bits%29

I have to say, this article hit me, because today is my birthday, and I'm deciding how to spend my birthday money. This, and Christmas, are really the ony times I can expand my Warhammer armies. And I just decided I had enough. I'm priced out. I had the option of spending my birthday cash on some boxes of Games Workshop's Warhammer, and I went for a Bandai 1/48 Gundam kit instead, to the tune of $107. The new Riptide suit is $85 and it's tiny, the new Eldar is $115 and it's half the sixze of the Bandai 1/48 scale Gundam, which is much higher quality and has fully posable joints. Games Workshop is just soaking the customers at this point and it's ridiculous.

Looking back at my GW purchases, I make the odd bits purchase on ebay, but for the last five years or so, it's been core boxes or nothing. I bought five boxes of Battle for Macragge, five boxes of Black Reach when it was $50, three boxes of Skull Pass, one box of Island of Blood and one box of the LE Dark Vengeance, I bought three boxes of Escape from Goblin Town, and I'll probably buy two more, but only because it tanked, and it's being blown out online for $75, and I can flip the spare rulebooks and Thorin's Company sprue on ebay to reduce the cost further.

My GW purchases are getting less and less each year. Last Christmas I asked for $100 worth of Infinity and today I bough a 1/48 scale Gundam for $107. Buying more GW wasn't even an option. Things like the Reaper Miniatures kickstarter proide so much more value it's a joke.

I have to say, that's it, I'm out.

So I gotta ask, how have your purchases worked out over the last five years. Are you all still Ferrari collectors?

Genuinely curious.

--Chris
www.chrisvalera.com

I'd have to sit down and take a long look at my last 5 years of paypal history for most of my purchases.

I know that in 5 years I've done the following:(most brand new items were bought at 30% off)
Bought a lizardmen army $325
Bought a Space Marines army. $350
Sold the Lizardmen to pay for High Elves (total out of pocket for this was basically just the new Army Book)
Sold the Space Marines to pay for Dark Elves (total out of pocket so far has been about $150)
Bought a new conversion heavy SM army ($490 roughly out of pocket)
Slowly acquired various OOP Empire models as well as select models I want to paint for fun. ($700, mostly ebay or through trade)
Bought about $150 of IoB Skaven from ebay or bartertown.

On average I spend about $500 a year in miscellaneous hobby related items, be it paint, brushes, models etc.

I certainly don't consider GW to be "Ferarri" or any comparable brand. At the end of the day, they are toy soldiers. I don't buy everything GW sells, and the items that I do buy I end up getting for at least 30% off brand new.

Lucky for me, my primary opponent is my wife, and we both have full armies, so I could drop GW purchases entirely without having to stop playing Warhammer. I've never been a FotM buyer, and I don't play competitively, so I don't feel the need to buy every new OP shiny that GW puts out for crazy money.

I agree that the Lord of Skulls is crazy money, as are a few of the upcoming Lizardmen releases.

I don't blame anyone for dropping GW games due to cost, as I agree it's getting out of hand, even with my discount.

Peace out. Let us know if you dump your stuff.

I'll answer your question too:

The increase of $$ from GW has actually turned me to purchasing more from Forge World. That and I'm finally getting stuff 100% painted. But when GW releases kits I like, I still buy them. I simply budget accordingly and then make the purchase.

Cheers.

Over five years? I have bought all my armies. TBH I owe 40k so much, it tought me alot of things, mostly social skills.
I definitly dont do impulse purchases like i used to, but I plan everything out now

Y'all are missing the main point of the article. Assigning car companies to TT games.

I'd leave the HHHobby but I don't think I have anything left to buy. I've got like 20k points of guard and 3k points of demons, plus 3 more armies I don't even want.(SW,Necrons,Tyranids)

I have bought a lot of FW since January over 2 grand worth of fantasy and 40k, I really like the models and it may be pricey but in the long run I know I will be more satisfied with them then the run of the mill GW stuff you always see.

I know you can get sucked in and over buy and such but with a fairly robust second hand market, great deals abound. I personally just pull a small amount a week from my paycheck and that's more than enough for me to buy anything I want from GW. Budgeting is important and giving myself space between having money and making purchases lend itself to smarter and fewer buys. Does it annoy me to see these increases at a rate I find to be stupifying? Yup, but it's not really expensive unless you're one of those people who buy whole armies at a time. Try painting them entirely at the limit of your own quality and I'm sure the pace of spending will slow to a more reasonable level. But that's advice for people who are getting in or staying. Sorry to hear you're leaving us, but I understand entirely. I've cut my budgeting for movies by over 75% and find myself much happier for the loss.

Less GW means more X-Wing, Kings of War, and Deck Building games like Legendary, DC Heroes and Ascension. I still buy a ton of games-it's just everything except GW these days. I bought 1 Slaanesh and 1 Tzeentch chariot, both Daemon books, and the cards to go with them: those have been my warhammer purchases from last year, with the exception of a couple small eBay finds that I really wanted. In the past year I've spent $200 on GW. The year before that I spent quadruple that. The money that had been spent on GW went fully to Mantic this year-KoW kickstarter, Dreadball, LOKA (not sure about it, but kinda wanted a cool chess set) and Deadzone. It's easily been $800, plus $200 in deals on miniature market and miniwargaming. So I've found other games to fill the roll of GW. And I've gotten a LOT more product out of the other companies.

Edited by Mannahnin

 Aerethan wrote:
I'd have to sit down and take a long look at my last 5 years of paypal history for most of my purchases.

So like 2-3 new armies over the last five years, that seems to be the pattern. I start armies, but I never finish them, and the price seems tyo go up by the day...

 purplkrush wrote:
I know you can get sucked in and over buy and such but with a fairly robust second hand market, great deals abound. I personally just pull a small amount a week from my paycheck and that's more than enough for me to buy anything I want from GW. Budgeting is important and giving myself space between having money and making purchases lend itself to smarter and fewer buys. Does it annoy me to see these increases at a rate I find to be stupifying? Yup, but it's not really expensive unless you're one of those people who buy whole armies at a time. Try painting them entirely at the limit of your own quality and I'm sure the pace of spending will slow to a more reasonable level. But that's advice for people who are getting in or staying. Sorry to hear you're leaving us, but I understand entirely. I've cut my budgeting for movies by over 75% and find myself much happier for the loss.

If you go to cons, then yeah,. you can still get a deal, but on ebay, everything is very overpriced. I blew out some stuff on ebay and it all went for nothing. I had rare stuff too, old Zoats, Fantasy Adventurers, old Epic, and it all went for nothing. I blame the slow economy; nobody has any spare money to spend. I think GW is really just cannibalizing their fanbase. Only the core box sets are worth it, and sometimes not even then. I want a second island of Blood set, and some more basic Clanrats from island of Blood, but that's it. I want more Escape from Goblin Town box sets, but only if I can get them for $75 and flip the rulebooks, and the Thorin's company sprues, ie, only the goblins and terrain.

I used to buy multiples of the core games, now I can barely manage. I think GW wants it this way. I think they want you to buy just one core game, and then a bunch of add-ons, or not even that. Their business model revolves around a new crop of customers coming in to buy the core game. Maybe they stick around, maybe they don't. It doesn't matter either way, there's always a new crop of 12-year old coming in.

It amazes me that most businesses place such a premium on customer loyalty, and business books say it costs 10 times as much to acquire a new customer , as to retain an existing customer, but GW is oblivious to it.

The fact is, they're positioning the company for a sell-off, and damn the short term consequences. Higher prices and one-man stores are where it's at for them right now.

--Chris
www.chrisvalera.com

I've been a staunch GW supporter for a long time, but...

Yeah. The prices are finally getting too high even for me. I also agree with a lot of accusations that they've fallen out of touch with their player base and are generally behaving like bullies.

I don't hate GW. They've got a right to pursue a profit via whatever means they deem most effective. But, my spending on 40k has decreased this year, as I just can't justify shelling out these kinds of prices any more.

The fact that they didn't do an annual price increase does suggest that they finally reached the push-back point with their prices. So we'll see how things shape up.

So once you've posed your new Gundam a couple of different ways what are you going to do with it?

I budget, stick to one army, don't change factions like underwear and I manage with NZ pricing and a student income.

I'm fine with GW selling off the company. The current leadership has proven rather inept at growing the company.

I buy 100% Mantic, I play pretty much exactly the same games and have just as much fun as I did when I bought 100% GW, only now I'm paying less than a quarter of the price for it.

I bought 5 GW products in the last 2 years.
And they were all pre- embargo.

I stopped adding to my stuff in 2011 and even started downsizing.

Sold some Eldar (Do I really need 12,000pts of Eldar - given I never play apoc and won't use it all?

Not going to sell/get rid of it ALL, but a large chunk is earmarked to go - whether to a buyer, the skip or crucible, I don't really care.

There are other rules and games out there. Some of them I can even use my 40k stuff with. That's why I'm keeping some of it.

The fact that they didn't do an annual price increase does suggest that they finally reached the push-back point with their prices. So we'll see how things shape up.

Stealth price increases. Repackaging on key items. Different tactic = Same result. Price increase.

Edited for rule #1 - MT11

Let me know if you're selling your stuff on ebay!

Seriously though, the hobby is expensive but so are LOTS of other hobbies. Do you play golf? You'll spend a lot more on stuff like that. GW games has really helped me find friends no matter where I've moved to in the world. You're not buying a $100 display model (if you have the money to do that, more power to you) you are buying a gaming model that you will hopefully assemble, paint, and play with for many years afterwards. Have you been playing with your latest video game for 2-3 years? Have you had the same emotional and socially stimulating experience with that copy of Skyrim that you've had with that GW model?

If you don't think the superior quality sculpts and insane customization and conversion potential from across the entire GW range is worth the price tag, good for you, champ.

I don't really keep track of specific GW expenses as it just comes right out of my leisure budget. As a ballpark figure, however, over the past six months expenses are roughly USD 1500 mostly from bits sites, the Dakka Swapshop, or GW direct.

My last true GW purchase (minus White Dwarf $10) was a direct order for goff rockers about a month ago. Before that the DV LE box set. I have traded for anything else new and shiney in my collection. Been painting alot however. Complete 3rd DA company, finished my DW and RW and about 10 tanks of various types.

With me it wasnt so much the price of GW but other priorities. See my avatar??

 scarletsquig wrote:
I buy 100% Mantic, I play pretty much exactly the same games and have just as much fun as I did when I bought 100% GW, only now I'm paying less than a quarter of the price for it.

I went the other way; I realised that the prices GW want for their deformed five-heads side-of-beef-hands clown-feet models had gone up so much, I was spending the same amount of money on them I would be buying incredibly beautiful OOP Rackham minis on eBay, or really intricate boutique resin sculpts from small companies and one-man-bands online, so I just started buying the nicer stuff instead. I still buy the occasional GW model if the scale issues aren't too egregious, or it has some nice bitz in it I really want, but I actually find it fun and rewarding scouring around for better quality minis that fit with the 40K/Mordheim aesthetic.

I'm not against buying GW minis on principle, but most of the time the value proposition just isn't there anymore.

I love hearing people say "Golf is dearer! GW Sculpts are the BOSS'.

Well I have been playing GW for over 25 years - and yes - I agree with the OP - the price hikes are ridiculous - the new money grabbing flyer inclusive rules make me sick.

And before I her "Yo dawg, I heard you #are a GW H8r" etc etc - I have built, and own, a 40K scale Imperator Titan - so I know my stuff. I have 5 Thunderhawks, and multiple other Titans, and a CHAPTER of Marines. *That's 1000 to those who don't know - and their support vehicles.

"See ya. One day, if you ever get a job, you won't have only two opportunities a year to intake money and therefore have to ration it." - Antagonistic, and ultimately, uninteresting. See ya.

Yeah, the price changes and their tactics have made me pretty much stop most of my purchases from GW. Normally, I would impulse buy a box of marines or yet another CSM lord... or something.

You can't (well, not even this impulsive gamer) impulsively buy a stormraven. After a certain price point, it's hard to instantaneously rationalize the purchase.

Sure, other hobbies are more expensive. They are also less litigious and less obnoxious in how they try to sell you.

Maybe I'm old, but I won't just take it anymore.

I feel your pain. I still find myself buying GW stuff, but only at a discount or on Ebay. Most of my recent GW purchases were either the terrain kits, or stuff from Forgeworld. I do look at alternatives, though. Building up a nice IG force using Dreamforge's stuff.

See, here's the funny thing -

I totally understand people ribbing the OP and saying "get a job" and stuff like that. I've probably made comments like that myself in the past.

But, you know what? Even I am starting not to see value in some of these kits. It is getting to the point that it's just more than I am willing to pay. And you know what else? Between my wife and I, my household income is comfortably in the six figures. I'm not trying to brag here at all - just illustrating that everyone's perception of value is different, and even someone who does fairly well like me is beginning to think the value isn't there.

Someone mentioned better quality sculpts - that is arguable these days. In the past, I felt like GW had nothing but hits, but lately I've been seeing a lot of misses. The Riptide was awesome, IMO, the Wraithknight really nice. But this new Khornate chainaxe wielding wheelchair gimp? Excuse me? The Dreadknight? The Dark Angel flying Cadillacs? I realize this is all entirely subjective, but that's an awful lot of misses in my book for a company that charges so much.

Again, I do not hate GW at all nor begrudge them their right to pursue a profit. I'll probably still buy boxes here and there. But I just don't see myself buying as much as I used to.

Ha GW games are games for Kings not peasants!


Just kidding try some other games systems!

chris_valera wrote:and I went for a Bandai 1/48 Gundam kit instead, to the tune of $107. The new Riptide suit is $85 and it's tiny, the new Eldar is $115 and it's half the sixze of the Bandai 1/48 scale Gundam, which is much higher quality and has fully posable joints. Games Workshop is just soaking the customers at this point and it's ridiculous.

To give people an idea about 1/48 Gundam kits, you can see the feet of one in this picture of other 30mm or so (also 1/48) tall resin figures:



There's no problem gaming with a gundam kit if you wanted to as well. But for many, the modelling side of the hobby is reason enough to enjoy an amazing model kit like the 1/48 gundams.

As for myself, the last GW thing I bought was a box worth of chaos warriors and a box worth of chaos knights when the stupid forsaken came out. They really made me question GW's artistic direction and I wanted to finish my chaos collection before that design aesthetic infected the rest of the line. Before that, i bought a couple boxes of bloodletters. The chaos warriors were bought through Discount Games Store on eBay while the Bloodletters were ordered through my local store right before they stopped carrying GW products. I also bought 3 bestigors and a couple gors from Blackdagger Games on eBay.

All of the above are used for skirmish gaming and not for Warhammer Fantasy as I find GW's rules to be poor.

 akira5665 wrote:
I love hearing people say "Golf is dearer! GW Sculpts are the BOSS'.

Well I have been playing GW for over 25 years - and yes - I agree with the OP - the price hikes are ridiculous - the new money grabbing flyer inclusive rules make me sick.

And before I her "Yo dawg, I heard you #are a GW H8r" etc etc - I have built, and own, a 40K scale Imperator Titan - so I know my stuff. I have 5 Thunderhawks, and multiple other Titans, and a CHAPTER of Marines. *That's 1000 to those who don't know - and their support vehicles.

"See ya. One day, if you ever get a job, you won't have only two opportunities a year to intake money and therefore have to ration it." - Antagonistic, and ultimately, uninteresting. See ya.

So what I am hearing you say is that you have won at your Space Marine collection and don't need to buy anymore! Just play with what you have! Unless it isn't enough.....

Yeah - I have not bought any GW in more than a year now.

The main reasons have been:
Price.
Really not liking the current editions.
Not liking a lot of the recent releases.
Price.

That said... I still play Mordheim, and still love the game. But... the number of GW miniatures in my warbands has been shrinking for quite some time.

But - if you like the games then don't let GW's pricing drive you away.

There are miniatures from other companies that will work fine - I can suggest Mantic and Avatars of War. And, Hell yeah, Reaper!

As for the folks that compare wargaming to golf.... The reason I don't try to compare a hobby that I enjoy to a sport that in no way, shape, or form interests me may be connected to the fact that it is an overpriced sport that in no way, shape, or form interests me.

I am just as likely to say 'You spent how much on that five iron?!' as I am to say 'You spent how much on that Warhound Titan?!' (See * below.)

Heck, the only golf that I have spent any money on... ever... is minigolf... played by black light, which I am not going to pretend that I take seriously.....

But I take it more seriously than I do real golf.

The Auld Grump

*EDIT* * Mind you, I had the same reaction when a friend bought a Barret .50 for his 50th birthday.... But at least I could understand that.

*EDIT 2* Or when a friend payed $600 for a carbon fiber penny whistle... sweet sound, but....

Ramshackle Games has a unique style that fits well with the 40k look. They have a Kickstarter for their new Brothers of Iron which might make good marine or storm trooper replacements:
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/179741323/brothers-of-iron