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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 08:30:13
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Stalwart Veteran Guard Sergeant
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So not long ago I created a thread asking the general public on their predictions for the next army to get an update. If memory serves me right, everyone was saying Orks and Nids need an update bad, while some others said Space Marines were next up on the list.
But I can't help but wonder what will happen to the Sisters of Battle
Will they be retcon-ed out of existence like the Squats did? Because almost no explanation went into why the Squats were left out.
And why would GW do that? Is it because of poor Sisters sales and popularity? Wouldn't actual updates on the army work better to persuade players to give the Sisters a shot instead of that rinky-dink White Dwarf update article?
Discussion, GO!
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Only in Death does Duty end
3rd Company
Bravo Two Seven "Ironhides" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 08:50:38
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Grey Knight Psionic Stormraven Pilot
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Use the search, this thread has been done several times allready.
In the end it comes down to a downwards spiral between bad sales, and lack of updates, which are caused by each other.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 10:25:41
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Infiltrating Broodlord
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Squats looked terrible
Sisters look terrible
Most people who beg for them to get an update are doing it because it's the "in" thing and have no desire to actually collect them.
GWS Aren't going to update some chump codex that will sell poorly.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 10:30:27
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Dark Angels Librarian with Book of Secrets
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SoBs have one thing going for them. Die hard fanboys.
I think GW will eventually get around to plastic sisters and a new codex. Honestly when they make a plastic sister box, I'll probably buy some.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 11:14:21
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Stabbin' Skarboy
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I think sisters will get the dark elder treatment with a massive release but I don't think gw will want to interrupt the flow much so it's likely to be one of the last up dates to 6th IMO, or one of the first in the new year to get 2014 rolling. I don't think they will can them, they are an interesting side. We may even see them rolled into the next deamon hunter codex under the guise of codex inquisition with supplements for the different sections.
Zande4 wrote:Squats looked terrible
Sisters look terrible
Most people who beg for them to get an update are doing it because it's the "in" thing and have no desire to actually collect them.
GWS Aren't going to update some chump codex that will sell poorly.
Rude boy of the day award! /\
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/08/05 11:26:14
3500pts 1500pts 2500pts 4500pts 3500pts 2000pts 2000pts plus several small AOS armies |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 12:05:41
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Longtime Dakkanaut
Dundee, Scotland/Dharahn, Saudi Arabia
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I think they're going to be squatted.
I'd be happy to be proved wrong though.
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If the thought of something makes me giggle for longer than 15 seconds, I am to assume that I am not allowed to do it. item 87, skippys list
DC:70S+++G+++M+++B+++I++Pw40k86/f#-D+++++A++++/cWD86R+++++T(D)DM++ |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 12:08:47
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Battlewagon Driver with Charged Engine
somewhere in the northern side of the beachball
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Zande4 wrote:Squats looked terrible
Sisters look terrible
Most people who beg for them to get an update are doing it because it's the "in" thing and have no desire to actually collect them.
GWS Aren't going to update some chump codex that will sell poorly.
Dark Eldar looked terrible.
Dark Eldar sold poorly.
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Every time I hear "in my opinion" or "just my opinion" makes me want to strangle a puppy. People use their opinions as a shield that other poeple can't critisize and that is bs.
If you can't defend or won't defend your opinion then that "opinion" is bs. Stop trying to tip-toe and defend what you believe in. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 12:16:38
Subject: Re:SoB Go Extinct?
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Daring Dark Eldar Raider Rider
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I like the DE look, very sharp and dangerous looking. I get the feeling they don't sell so well is the cardboard armour
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Rangerrob wrote:
Since we have yet to get an answer as to why the Devilfish was on the floor, I'll take a different approach.
Why was the guy walking on the gaming table? |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 12:40:17
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Infiltrating Broodlord
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illuknisaa wrote: Zande4 wrote:Squats looked terrible
Sisters look terrible
Most people who beg for them to get an update are doing it because it's the "in" thing and have no desire to actually collect them.
GWS Aren't going to update some chump codex that will sell poorly.
Dark Eldar looked terrible.
Dark Eldar sold poorly.
Dark Eldar had nice fluff and lots of potential. Nuns with guns are just silly.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 13:00:00
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Trazyn's Museum Curator
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Zande4 wrote: illuknisaa wrote: Zande4 wrote:Squats looked terrible
Sisters look terrible
Most people who beg for them to get an update are doing it because it's the "in" thing and have no desire to actually collect them.
GWS Aren't going to update some chump codex that will sell poorly.
Dark Eldar looked terrible.
Dark Eldar sold poorly.
Dark Eldar had nice fluff and lots of potential. Nuns with guns are just silly.
I take it you aren't that familiar with the SoB...
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What I have
~4100
~1660
Westwood lives in death!
Peace through power!
A longbeard when it comes to Necrons and WHFB. Grumble Grumble
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 13:18:06
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Ichor-Dripping Talos Monstrosity
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GW has specifically stated that it won't squat anything again.
They're still getting backlash from that now.
And no, a lot of the Sisters models haven't really stood the test of time, but then lots of things haven't.
Sisters of Battle are an interesting army, more than just Nuns with Guns.
It's more a Police Force than anything overall - enforcing the law and will of the Ecclesiarchy.
I've only in the last year actually started looking into them, and some aspects are a little preachy for me (Super mega Emperor is god uber zealotry), I love the Sisters Penitent side of it.
Those that have caused some slight true or imagined that have either been sentenced to, or chosen to, join the Repentia, or are doomed to pilot a Penitent Engine, pumped full of chemicals that make them feel endless anguish and remorse until their inevitable death!
And as is fully 1/4 the army could be made using 1 plastic BSS kit.
The vehicles - all 3 transports could be 1 kit, the Exorcist a seperate kit or even combined with the transports.
The entire army as-is, could be done in 12-14 kits (5 single finecast/plastic clamshell, 3-5 plastic kits, a few vehicle kits, a flyer kit and the Penitent Engine kit).
Throw in 1-2 new flavour kits and a new 'big thing' that everything seems to be getting and it's job done.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 13:19:12
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Fixture of Dakka
Temple Prime
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Zande4 wrote:Squats looked terrible
Sisters look terrible
Most people who beg for them to get an update are doing it because it's the "in" thing and have no desire to actually collect them.
GWS Aren't going to update some chump codex that will sell poorly.
Ahahahaha!
Man that statement and your follow up is going to piss off a lot of people, including my wife.
While I like you as a person, what you have said is stupid and is going to ingnite some fires.
Me? While I think your declarations are dumb and wrong, I will be watching those more fond of the sisters tear you a new one with some popcorn.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/08/05 13:23:56
Midnightdeathblade wrote:Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 13:24:59
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Preacher of the Emperor
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Pretty much what Ovion said. Also, here's some relevant sources.
http://natfka.blogspot.co.uk/2013/07/enter-citadel-sisters-of-battleblack.html?m=0
http://natfka.blogspot.co.uk/2013/07/sisters-of-battle.html?m=0
Basically, Jervis Johnson says that all codexes are being worked on, and will be updated in time. There's also some other interesting nuggets in there that inicate that Sisters very much aren't forgotten.
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Order of the Righteous Armour - 542 points so far. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 13:37:43
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Ichor-Dripping Talos Monstrosity
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Yeah, at the rate we're going at the moment, even if it's the last book done, we'll have it within 18 months.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 13:39:07
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Fixture of Dakka
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The only explanation I know of is Tyranids ate them. That's it. Not sure if this is what you ment, fluff wise, or real life wise. Real life wise, I believe I read somewhere GW said, they didn't like the direction Squats were going, becoming too much of a Joke looking army and didn't know what to do with them, so they stopped.
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Agies Grimm:The "Learn to play, bro" mentality is mostly just a way for someone to try to shame you by implying that their metaphorical nerd-wiener is bigger than yours. Which, ironically, I think nerds do even more vehemently than jocks.
Everything is made up and the points don't matter. 40K or Who's Line is it Anyway?
Auticus wrote: Or in summation: its ok to exploit shoddy points because those are rules and gamers exist to find rules loopholes (they are still "legal"), but if the same force can be composed without structure, it emotionally feels "wrong". |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 14:00:32
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Dakka Veteran
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Never squatted, just never updated. It's the true fate awaiting sisters.
Truth is they never sold well, even new. And look at all the signs. Model range being slowly discontinued due to being metal, a codex that no one can legally obtain, and GW dancing around updating them with lame excuses.
Even when people thought DE were being squatted it never got THIS bad. I mean at least they had a codex available and some models.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 14:13:42
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Crazed Zealot
Central MD
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I believe the success of the SoB depends upon 3 factors: model aesthetics, competitive flexibility, and fluff. The current push in 6th ed to "forge the narrative" indicates GW is trying to shift from meaningless power armies (barring ally spam) to interesting battle stories. IMO, this means the fluff will become more important in 40K 'verse. The Sisters backstory has unfortunately gone through (apparently) contradictory changes.
The original fluff (as I recall) had the SoB as the ultimate humanists, extolling the ultimate supremacy of the human race and seeking to purify it of any mutation or alien influence. The Emperor was the ultimate example of what "human" could become. Even the gene-seed alteration of the Marines was suspect.
With the release of the codices, this focus has changed to ultra-zealotry to the God-Emperor. The SoB have essentially continued what the Word Bearers were censored for and driven to chaos.
Each of these backstories can be interesting, but lead in different directions. It could even lead to internal strife and division.
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I know one thing: I know nothing {Socrates} |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 14:44:29
Subject: Re:SoB Go Extinct?
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Cosmic Joe
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I'll honestly be surprised if SOB get a proper update. I think GW will just let the slide into oblivion.
If they do get an actual update with codex and new models (which they desperately need) then no one will be happier.
They're my favorite army because for me they represent the soul of the Imperium, fanatic zealotry. My brother plays Word Bearers. I play Sisters. The two armies have a LOT in common.
I don't see how you can have WH4k without Imperial fanatics.
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Also, check out my history blog: Minimum Wage Historian, a fun place to check out history that often falls between the couch cushions. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 14:57:56
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Boom! Leman Russ Commander
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Personally I would be enterested to see a SOB stand alone codex, I've never collected Witch Hunters but I have delved into the SOB fluff and I think with a decent update they could become very popular for new players as in my experience most people I know who play them are the older die hard fans.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 15:31:27
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Preacher of the Emperor
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Note that the models haven't been updated previously due to modeling issues. They were attempting to make new models before. Why would they do this if they were going to squat them? Hopefully, by now they've found a solution of some sort and can update the Sisters from metal.
Also, the old metal models were a major factor as to why they didn't sell so well. Had they been updated to plastic in like with other armies, they likely would have sold far better.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/08/05 15:48:11
Order of the Righteous Armour - 542 points so far. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 15:37:10
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Fixture of Dakka
Temple Prime
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Troike wrote:Note that the models haven't been updated previously due to modeling issues. They were attempting to make new models before. Why would they do this if they were going to squat them? Hopefully, by now they've found a solution of some sort and can update the Sisters from metal.
Also, the old metal models were a major factor as to why they didn't sell so well. Had they been updated to elastic in like with other armies, they likely would have sold far better.
This Typo makes me smile and I don't know why. Maybe it's the thought of rubbery models.
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Midnightdeathblade wrote:Think of a daemon incursion like a fart you don't quite trust... you could either toot a little puff of air, bellow a great effluvium, or utterly sh*t your pants and cry as it floods down your leg.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 15:43:25
Subject: Re:SoB Go Extinct?
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Cosmic Joe
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But that's what worries me. That rumor about them working on plastic sisters was years ago. I think they tried and just gave up. Why would they sit on plastic sisters for years and not mention or do anything with them? Sounds more like one sculptor did a little work to try something out, didn't work and he tossed the project.
Again, I'd LOVE to be proven wrong.
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Also, check out my history blog: Minimum Wage Historian, a fun place to check out history that often falls between the couch cushions. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 15:49:01
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Hallowed Canoness
Ireland
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Ovion wrote:GW has specifically stated that it won't squat anything again.
I have yet to see a quote on that. It certainly wasn't included in the big statement from Jervis Jonson.
It would be cool, but from where I'm standing, this is just another urban rumour like the "everything is canon" schpiel.
I still don't think they would be dropped - not after the recent updates, which GW would have otherwise just not invested in. But at the same time, I am not so naive to believe that anything big is coming our way soon. The army will continue to suffer in want as it did throughout the past couple years, until the time GW either changes its business practices or someone in the studio picks up interest in them. Back then, Andy Hoare was the driving force behind anything SoB-related. It shows that he's gone.
CleansingFire wrote:The Sisters backstory has unfortunately gone through (apparently) contradictory changes.
The original fluff (as I recall) had the SoB as the ultimate humanists, extolling the ultimate supremacy of the human race and seeking to purify it of any mutation or alien influence. The Emperor was the ultimate example of what "human" could become. Even the gene-seed alteration of the Marines was suspect.
With the release of the codices, this focus has changed to ultra-zealotry to the God-Emperor. The SoB have essentially continued what the Word Bearers were censored for and driven to chaos.
I don't really see the contradictions - it's really just a question of focus. Their first mention was a blurb in the Rogue Trader rulebook about how they fly around in space and do purity checks on other Imperial forces. They still do this, just that later fluff (which was released in the wake of 2E and already pictured the SoB in the way we know) shifted to place their zeal (which was already mentioned in passing in the RT text) to the front and focus on their role as holy crusaders.
"The personnel and fleets of each fortress are commanded by a Prioress under the direct supervision of the Abbess on Earth. The Adepta Sororitas is a penitent organisation where constant hardship, deprivation and arduous work are part of an unrelenting devotional regime. The slightest deviation from approved stricture results in the severest chastisement. Unquestioned loyalty to the Imperial Cult is vital, because the Sisters are expected to maintain a close eye upon all servants of the Imperium. Every single day, squads of Battle Sisters descend upon unsuspecting departments of the Adeptus Terra, administering genetic and psychological tests in order to expose wrongdoers, mutants and malcontents. Whole companies of Battle Sisters travel out to warzones, to the fortress-monasteries of the Adeptus Astartes, to the fleets and to the scattered worlds of the Imperium. No-one is free from their vigilance."
- Rogue Trader core rulebook (1987), p. 268
Sounds pretty similar to how they are today. The 3E Codex added their alliance to the Ordo Hereticus, but this, too, is not incompatible with their earlier descriptions - and in fact, the designer's notes from the Witch Hunters Codex include Andy Hoare mentioning how the studio took great care not to invalidate anything the studio has published before. In summary, I would say that the Sisters of Battle are probably one of 40k's least changed armies, compared to the fluff changes in the backgrounds of the Space Marines or the Imperial Guard.
On a sidenote, I dig the current design of the SoB. Don't anyone dare to change them.
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This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/08/05 15:52:06
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 15:50:31
Subject: Re:SoB Go Extinct?
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Preacher of the Emperor
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MWHistorian wrote:But that's what worries me. That rumor about them working on plastic sisters was years ago. I think they tried and just gave up. Why would they sit on plastic sisters for years and not mention or do anything with them? Sounds more like one sculptor did a little work to try something out, didn't work and he tossed the project.
Again, I'd LOVE to be proven wrong.
I'd wager that if and when they have plastic Sisters, they'd save them for a codex release. A codex/model update for the Sisters would more than likely make a nice amount of money for GW.
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Order of the Righteous Armour - 542 points so far. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 16:43:23
Subject: Re:SoB Go Extinct?
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Dakka Veteran
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Troike wrote: MWHistorian wrote:But that's what worries me. That rumor about them working on plastic sisters was years ago. I think they tried and just gave up. Why would they sit on plastic sisters for years and not mention or do anything with them? Sounds more like one sculptor did a little work to try something out, didn't work and he tossed the project.
Again, I'd LOVE to be proven wrong.
I'd wager that if and when they have plastic Sisters, they'd save them for a codex release. A codex/model update for the Sisters would more than likely make a nice amount of money for GW.
But they did get a "codex" update. And along with it...nothing. I really would not be entirely surprised to see them get another WD "codex" and nothing new just to keep the illusion that they aren't a dead army.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 17:11:27
Subject: Re:SoB Go Extinct?
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Preacher of the Emperor
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Mr.Church13 wrote: Troike wrote: MWHistorian wrote:But that's what worries me. That rumor about them working on plastic sisters was years ago. I think they tried and just gave up. Why would they sit on plastic sisters for years and not mention or do anything with them? Sounds more like one sculptor did a little work to try something out, didn't work and he tossed the project.
Again, I'd LOVE to be proven wrong.
I'd wager that if and when they have plastic Sisters, they'd save them for a codex release. A codex/model update for the Sisters would more than likely make a nice amount of money for GW.
But they did get a "codex" update. And along with it...nothing. I really would not be entirely surprised to see them get another WD "codex" and nothing new just to keep the illusion that they aren't a dead army.
Right, because they were still having modeling issues with the Sisters back then, so they couldn't release new models. And I don't think that an army has ever gotten two consecutive WD codexes. Remember, they are meant as stop-gaps between proper codexes.
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Order of the Righteous Armour - 542 points so far. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 18:52:48
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Stalwart Veteran Guard Sergeant
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Kain wrote: Zande4 wrote:Squats looked terrible
Sisters look terrible
Most people who beg for them to get an update are doing it because it's the "in" thing and have no desire to actually collect them.
GWS Aren't going to update some chump codex that will sell poorly.
Ahahahaha!
Man that statement and your follow up is going to piss off a lot of people, including my wife.
While I like you as a person, what you have said is stupid and is going to ingnite some fires.
Me? While I think your declarations are dumb and wrong, I will be watching those more fond of the sisters tear you a new one with some popcorn.
*snort* Popcorn
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Only in Death does Duty end
3rd Company
Bravo Two Seven "Ironhides" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 19:00:42
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Acolyth
Fairborn, Ohio
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Not really worth fighting over. The SOB are fanatics, and have their own fanatics. The fact remains though, the Dark Eldar used to look terrible and sell terrible, then they got some love and look amazing (best 40k models IMO**) but still sell very poorly. SOB are a niche army and will get the niche treatment.
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Successful swap shop trades: 3 |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 19:02:35
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Boosting Black Templar Biker
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I really like many of the SoB models. Their type of power armor is nice. Aside from the price one of the main things that has kept me from buying is the ridiculous Allies-table that makes the desperate allies with BT. Now, I could of course ally them with my SM instead, but most of my matches are with BT, so...
I honestly can't see them being retconned out of the universe or even out of the game. But it may take quite some time yet until they get updated.
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Armies:
Primary: Black Templars Crimson Fists Orks
Allied: Sisters of Battle Imperial Guard |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2013/08/05 19:10:42
Subject: SoB Go Extinct?
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Ancient Venerable Dreadnought
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I remember seeing the quote about them not Squatting anything thing again, but I can't be bothered to look for it because it doesn't mean enough to me to do so.
However, if the source is found or not, I don't believe they'd Squat any other armies anyway. It's better customer service to release new rules for them every so often, even if it is half-hearted like the recent Sisters WD codex.
I don't see them being a priority for a re-release though. With 6th Edition just dropping, they have other first-tier armies to revamp in the mean time. Codex Space Marines, Orks, Tyranids, Space Wolves to start with, just based on their past publishing schedule and army precedence. Imperial Guard are likely to be up there too.
I would say that the Sisters of Battle are probably one of 40k's least changed armies
Heh.
Well, except for going from fanatical, ultra-disciplined religious zealots whose job was galactic internal affairs, to crusading D&D Clerics with magical powers, least changed.
I'd say that aside from Tyranids, they're probably one of the most changed. Not much has changed about Space Marines, Eldar, Orks, Imperial Guard, etc, in terms of concept from Rogue Trader to now.
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