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 mazzHammer wrote:
Another question I have about the Stormraven is, how often do you take advantage of the transport capacity? Is it only worth throwing some cheap scouts into, or would it be worthwhile (in some cases) to pop an assault squad or some vanguard vets in there?

This is also my question, at first I was going to transport my CC Crusader Squad in a Raven but however now I'm contemplating just running it as a anti-air / transport / Vehicle / MC unit.

I am planning on running this:

1 Stormraven

TL LC TL MM

1 Stormtalon as escort
Skyhammer Missle

Is this the right setup for this?

Barnie25 wrote:
1 Stormtalon as escort
Skyhammer Missle

Is this the right setup for this?

Don't ever escort with a storm talon. Its a disadvantage that brings no advantages

 labmouse42 wrote:

Barnie25 wrote:
1 Stormtalon as escort
Skyhammer Missle

Is this the right setup for this?

Don't ever escort with a storm talon. Its a disadvantage that brings no advantages

Ok, is this because this would only delay the arrival of the storm talon while not gaining anything in return? Just play it as it is then?

Its because by escorting you greatly increase the odds you getting nothing on the board when you need them to.

The only time I think it would be worth escorting is in the face of overwhelming interceptor fire. To the point where arriving piecemeal would be suicide. It's one of those rules that's useless 95% of the time. Just try to keep it in mind, for when that 5% comes up.

When you could escort outflankers there were some fun tricks you could do...

Raven is pretty expensive if you're not using the transport aspect but transporting is too dangerous I feel.

Dual Talons might be better for less points than Raven and Talon.

For GKs I always find that TL lC and Typhoon get me the best bang for my buck.

But the GK Missiles are S4...so you can either launch 4 s4 blasts and a machine spirited lascannon...or 3 S8+ shots...very useful to take out anything that needs to be more dead than it currently is.


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I also wouldn't take one without putting something in it...StormRavens are like Flying Godhammers, might as well have a small scoring unit in it at least.

 ductvader wrote:
But the GK Missiles are S4...so you can either launch 4 s4 blasts and a machine spirited lascannon...or 3 S8+ shots...very useful to take out anything that needs to be more dead than it currently is..

No, you cannot launch 4 S4 blasts; reread missiles on page 81 of the BRB

 Kommissar Kel wrote:

 ductvader wrote:
But the GK Missiles are S4...so you can either launch 4 s4 blasts and a machine spirited lascannon...or 3 S8+ shots...very useful to take out anything that needs to be more dead than it currently is..

No, you cannot launch 4 S4 blasts; reread missiles on page 81 of the BRB

Yes, you can. As two of them are the Typhoon alternative fire mode.

For those who are fan of the TLLC on the Talon, why take it over the cheaper and usually superior Skyhammer?

Mathhammer actually says the Typhoon is best

It depends what you want it to do.

How it synergises with what you already have.

And what you want to be shooting.

If you are having a go at Broadsides, TL/Lascannons are better than Assault Cannons or Krak Missiles. But if you are shooting at Heldrakes in the back after flying past them, the Assault Cannon are probably best. But then having a 360' fire arc on a turret mounted T/L Lascannon with POTMS means you can reach out and reliably hit something the other side of the board.

I don't see the merit in spending more points on the already slightly over-priced Raven. So try and stick with the base options. You don't REALLY need anti infantry firepower coming from your flyers when you have Thunderfire Cannons available.

The most effective load outs in my opinion on the flyers are:

Raven: T/L Multi Melta always + Lascannon or Assault Cannon

Talon: Skyhammer or Typhoon missiles.

The Talon is probably more flexible in its front facing load out, as the Lascannons are also worthwhile in a role. The ability to double out units and ignore their armour or reliably deal with AV13 is always powerful.

Ravens and TFCs are the same slot.

With the Talon, I'd agree that the TML is a highly flexible loadout but that price tag really high compared to the Skyhammer.
My gut tells me Speeders are better TML platforms since they're nearly half the price.

 minigun762 wrote:
With the Talon, I'd agree that the TML is a highly flexible loadout but that price tag really high compared to the Skyhammer.
My gut tells me Speeders are better TML platforms since they're nearly half the price.

Yes you get 2x as many missiles if you buy speeders. The advantage you gain when buying the stormtalon is skyfire and the ability to attack from a wide variety of angles. You can easily strike side armor on many vehicles and can maneuver to easily outflank cover your opponent is attempting to use against you main fighting position. Speeders are rather fragile and don't take much effort to knock down. The hard to hit rule the stormtalon has will go a long way towards it's survivability.

Martel732 wrote:
Ravens and TFCs are the same slot.

And in a SM list you have possibly 4 HS slots to play with.

And I doubt anyone ever will run more than one raven.

one Raven plus 2 TFCs would be good

I've got several dual raven lists written up now. There are some SM airforce lists with 3 ravens/ 3 talons.

I find best thing to do is add magnets to mine so you can swittch the weapon loadouts out for a better one if you have a planned game and you know your opponent.
this prevents you being stuck with the same weapons for ALL OF TIME :O
hope this helps

Martel732 wrote:
I've got sever al dual raven lists written up now. There are some SM airforce lists with 3 ravens/ 3 talons.

I'm interested in seeing what you've come up with for your lists, if you wouldn't mind sharing. I'm toying with some ideas for dual raven lists right now as well.


Edit: Also, in a flyer heavy list (multiple ravens/talons) how are people dealing with stupid eldar flyer cover save shenanigans? when I don't use flyers I just don't bother shooting at them, but in a list with talons, I feel like they're much more of a threat that needs to be dealt with...

 HawaiiMatt wrote:
Lascannon and multi-melta.
If you're using it as a transport, you really want to be able to pop transports.
2 missile shots, lascannons and multi-melta does a pretty good job on the armor.

-Matt

Exactly what I run, has worked very well for me.


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For the Talons, I like keeping them cheap and dedicated to anti-flyer.... skyhammer for me

 Awesomesauce wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
I've got sever al dual raven lists written up now. There are some SM airforce lists with 3 ravens/ 3 talons.

I'm interested in seeing what you've come up with for your lists, if you wouldn't mind sharing. I'm toying with some ideas for dual raven lists right now as well.

Actually, I switched to raven/cent drop and double storm talon for the present.

 IHateNids wrote:
And I doubt anyone ever will run more than one raven.

one Raven plus 2 TFCs would be good

I disagree with this statement. Ravens are awesome.

 labmouse42 wrote:

 IHateNids wrote:
And I doubt anyone ever will run more than one raven.

one Raven plus 2 TFCs would be good

I disagree with this statement. Ravens are awesome.

I still think they're a bit fragile to be "awesome". I'll agree to "good".

I didn't think dual ravens was considered that much, considering how "Awesome" TFCs became, or something like that

Im glad to be proved wrong in favour of a unit I like for once though

TFCs are awesome, no debating it. But they don't do much to helldrakes

Martel732 wrote:
TFCs are awesome, no debating it. But they don't do much to helldrakes

Or Riptides, or Waveserpents, or Vendettas, or LR, or 2+ armor...

i run this at 1000 ...

Iron Hands 1000

250: Chapter Master; Artificier Armour; Shield Eternal; Power Fist; Auspex; Bike  

120: Dreadnought: 2 TL Autocannons; Smoke Launchers; Searchlight

145: 5 Bikers: 2 Graviton Guns; Combi-Graviton  
160: 5 Tactical Squad; Graviton Gun; Razorback; Twin Linked Lascannon
084: 5 Scout Squad: 4 Sniper Rifles; 1 Missile Launcher; Camo Cloaks

140: Storm Talon Gunship: Twin Linked Assault Cannon; Typhoon Missile Launcher
100: Thunderfire Cannon

I have very few match ups with the Talon whre it has not proved useful.