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Cross posting this from the KS thread

 winnertakesall wrote:
I worked with DF a little bit in the past, just playtesting their rules and giving feedback on the early company, been in the email group ever since, jrecieved an email from Gary a few days ago, I hope it clears some things up:

Hey all.

I don't know how many people actually come our here but I wanted to update you all as best I could with the Situation at Defiance Games.

I know there's been a lot of confusion as to what's actually going on. The fact is that myself and the team that had been working on the Kickstarter have left the Company.
Tony is now running things and we're moving on. Howard has been around giving our team valued advice but otherwise he's been pretty much out of the company for a long time. I know he's asked Tony to remove his rules from the Website. He's moving on as well.

Take care.
Gary

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/240/553141.page

Tony taking over full responsibility ... guess that's the official end of the kickstarter

It's a new week... cue the management shuffle!

http://defiancegames.com/news/item/welcoming-new-ceo-john-morse-to-defiance-games


John's not a "new" employee he's been part of this since they were wargames factory, nice to see that the management shell game is still in full swing. With several members of the defiance team reportedly having left I'm curious if the "team "is now the magic duo of just Tony and John?

 paulson games wrote:
I'm curious if the "team "is now the magic duo of just Tony and John?

I think that's more accurate

So, didn't the words of the immortal bards, The Who, say, "meet the new boss/same as the old boss..."? Humorously enough, how many people said that they "won't get fooled again"?

 Alfndrate wrote:

 paulson games wrote:
I'm curious if the "team "is now the magic duo of just Tony and John?

I think that's more accurate

So, didn't the words of the immortal bards, The Who, say, "meet the new boss/same as the old boss..."? Humorously enough, how many people said that they "won't get fooled again"?

And this, ladies and gentlemen, is the new dictionary definition of "irony".

Tony should team up with Daniel Mandelbaum. Both have no time to produce anything because they are too occupied with inventing new excuses why nothing happens

Saying that name is like saying "What's the worst that could happen?" "That was easier than expected." or "At least it is not raining."

Or my personal favourite ..."At least it's cold out!"

Say that in the middle of winter to people when they just come in from being outside for a while and you will get some of the FUNNIEST looks.

I just saw this over on Frothers, It looks like Defiance Games has already started to invest some of that Kickstarter money...
https://www.facebook.com/DefianceGames/likes?ref=ts

Mr Gutsy wrote:
I just saw this over on Frothers, It looks like Defiance Games has already started to invest some of that Kickstarter money...
https://www.facebook.com/DefianceGames/likes?ref=ts

Well I had no idea São Paulo, Brazil was such a big base of sci-fi troop miniature fans, I must redirect my marketing strategy immediately

Mr Gutsy wrote:
I just saw this over on Frothers, It looks like Defiance Games has already started to invest some of that Kickstarter money...
https://www.facebook.com/DefianceGames/likes?ref=ts

Hilarious.

FWIW, we sell regularly to Brazilian gamers... its definitely a growing market.

I hadn't thought it was growing quite that much though...

..

.

Maybe Sao Paulo offered an Xmas bundel of likes for a cheap price

 Antenociti wrote:
FWIW, we sell regularly to Brazilian gamers... its definitely a growing market.

I hadn't thought it was growing quite that much though...

..

.

I also have a few great Brazilian customers (shipped to one yesterday)
Just not quite as many as Defiance seems to have.

See 'John' is already creating new markets for the three things that Defiance sells. The bold "hot potato" management technique is paying off!

I remember when this management technique was big in the 80's.

Some interesting comments from Ed Fortae on Debacle Games on the Trollforged FB Page:

https://www.facebook.com/trollforgedminiatures

Have a look at the posts on 4th and 5th Jan

For ease of use:

Ed Fortae on January 4th wrote:Read this gak. Sick as always.

https://m.facebook.com/DefianceGames/posts/676691439029577?comment_id=7128980¬if_t=comment_mention&refid=52

The above quote is regarding a Facebook thread where Defiance posts about how many likes they're getting... while users discuss that they are paid for likes.

Ed Fortae on January 5th wrote:This is one of the funniest things I've seen in a while. It's also sad at the same time. I had high hopes in the start with this company over a year ago when I first started working as a mold maker but then found out the very short term of pay was to rip off my process of working. Sculpts I did we're never paid for and besides me several others were ripped off.

People have been asking who is the owners etc. well there is one legitimate owner with people given ownership in equity. I had paper work years ago putting me down to try and work for equity. I knew what it was and never took it instead leaving unable to continue with no pay. Equity means when defiance makes $1 profit you would split that with the other 15 owners at a percentage of 7% or something.

There were so many owners I believe the percentage would be hard to divide into anything reasonable.

Link to "Defiance Games are Gak" Facebook page

This is from a post where he followed up linking to someone's "Defiance Games are Gak" facebook page. It's already at 1400 Likes.

 RiTides wrote:
For ease of use:

This is from a post where he followed up linking to someone's "Defiance Games are Gak" facebook page. It's already at 1400 Likes.

To be fair, most of the joke is that those are pretty much all paid for likes

This is from Tonys blog on the website.

For the last several months, we here at DFG have been working with some top-notch pro painters on developing a system to make painting miniatures easy, fast, and above all - fun! We've experimented with a number of different products and techniques and believe we've found something that is going to make wargamers' lives REALLY easy.

I bet its acrylic paint - and a brush.

Also - have the pro painters been paid or are they like eBay brand 'pro-painters'?

richred_uk wrote:

 RiTides wrote:
For ease of use:

This is from a post where he followed up linking to someone's "Defiance Games are Gak" facebook page. It's already at 1400 Likes.

To be fair, most of the joke is that those are pretty much all paid for likes

Even better

 Mr. Burning wrote:
This is from Tonys blog on the website.

For the last several months, we here at DFG have been working with some top-notch pro painters on developing a system to make painting miniatures easy, fast, and above all - fun! We've experimented with a number of different products and techniques and believe we've found something that is going to make wargamers' lives REALLY easy.

I bet its acrylic paint - and a brush.

Also - have the pro painters been paid or are they like eBay brand 'pro-painters'?

Exclusive images from inside DG..

 Mr. Burning wrote:
This is from Tonys blog on the website.

For the last several months, we here at DFG have been working with some top-notch pro painters on developing a system to make painting miniatures easy, fast, and above all - fun! We've experimented with a number of different products and techniques and believe we've found something that is going to make wargamers' lives REALLY easy.

I bet its acrylic paint - and a brush.

Also - have the pro painters been paid or are they like eBay brand 'pro-painters'?

Leak of actual product used on actual Defiance miniatures:

[/spoiler]

is that their new improved production method?

 Mr. Burning wrote:
This is from Tonys blog on the website.

For the last several months, we here at DFG have been working with some top-notch pro painters on developing a system to make painting miniatures easy, fast, and above all - fun! We've experimented with a number of different products and techniques and believe we've found something that is going to make wargamers' lives REALLY easy.

I bet its acrylic paint - and a brush.

Also - have the pro painters been paid or are they like eBay brand 'pro-painters'?

I'm envisioning something along the line of Homer Simpson's make-up shotgun.

Maybe they should get a handle on sculpting and producing models before they get too worried about how we paint them.

 plastictrees wrote:


Maybe they should get a handle on sculpting and producing models before they get too worried about how we paint them.

Maybe they are going to expand their business to include selling but not providing hobby tools and paints?

Shrewd. There really is no limit to the items and services you can sell and then not provide.

With apologies to those who did hop on the kickstarter, I feel really good about pulling my money out before it ended. I feel like I dodged a bullet.

Honestly I feel bad for ED and the other people tony screwed over. To the other hand why did so many gamers trust anything he was involved in because he showed his true colors with wargames factory.

 Empchild wrote:
Honestly I feel bad for ED and the other people tony screwed over. To the other hand why did so many gamers trust anything he was involved in because he showed his true colors with wargames factory.

To be fair to those who trusted in him, the background is only available to those who are actively looking for it, and it's a fairly recent (as in the last year or so) development. As for the WGF thing, the details of that took a long time to truely come to life. I recall that for quite a while it was the general opinion of the wargaming community that Tony had been screwed by a Chinese investor and had been the wronged party.

It wasn't until WGF post-Tony established a good track record, DG's second round of products began to show issues (the UAMC were fairly well received), and former supporters of Tony came forward to shed light on DG and his time at WGF that the community's opinion really began to shift against Tony.

That said, anyone who was aware of the history and bought in anyway, was definitely taking a gamble that I wasn't willing to make.