New Sisters of Battle Codex Tactica

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**PanzerLeader**

MacPhail wrote:
Well done! Especially against drop marines, who have generally given me fits.

Really? What does your standard list look like? I've found Sisters to be a really favorable match up against most drop lists.

**MacPhail**

They are less troublesome now that I've learned to leave a unit back to protect the Exos on the back line. Before I made that change I was getting drop Dreds autocannoning my Exos into smoking wrecks on Turn 2. The other pain was getting a Dred charging into the back of my Sisters blob before they could advance to camp a midfield objective, sort of a reverse tarpit. We play pretty terrain heavy tables and they'd be not quite done squeezing through a bottleneck when the Dred would reel them in. A much lesser issue is that I can no longer leave minimized units to camp backfield objectives, sucking up valuable points from the speartip of melty flamey Imperial justice.

A recent pure Sisters list at 2k was 2 CADs: Jacobus, 20-strong blob, F/HF foot squad, 3x melta doms in Immos, 2x Exos, and HF Rets in a Rhino, plus Celestine, 2x min squads, and 2 units of flamer Seraphim. The blob slogs its way to an objective, the HF Rets Rhino advances to mop up behind the Doms, Seraphim harass soft spots and clear objectives, Exos sit back and try to deal with major threats. I've been holding back Immo Doms or the F/HF foot patrol depending on whether I expect Dreds or Sternguard in the pods. There are a few different versions of this list (single CAD, no Seraphim, no blob, etc.), and for the next overhaul I'm going to pick up a few more Rhinos to mount up the whole army to better protect the infantry. To be honest, I've been adding in White Scars of late rather than refining the pure list to better deal with drop armies-- bikes can quickly return from the front to deal with backfield threats and reclaim lost objectives.

**Mr Morden**

Good alt model for the Penitent Engine

or alt stats with more shooting than fighting..............

**pretre**

Yeah, not a super fan.

**MrFlutterPie**

Needs less pin up and more crazed lobotomized freak

**dracpanzer**

Does make you wonder what a pen engine would be like with a little more ranged weaponry. Giving them the option for meltaguns would give them a can opener before the shredding begins.

But the model itself, not so much.

**Inevitable_Faith**

As is I don't mind that model. As the core to a conversion/kit-bash however? I think it's a great option. The pewter pen engine is such a pain to keep together and transporting it scares me. This looks like it'd be a good base to build a pen engine out of that will weigh half as much. Interesting find none-the-less. This looks like it's made by the same company that does those inquisitors with their pimp rides.

**Drider**

Don't think i like the model but on the subject of kit bashing a conversion for a peni, how about something as simple as a dreadknight with pewter peni driver rather than the marine in the baby carrier.

**the_Armyman**

I think that model is a counts-as Kastelan, not a counts-as Pengine. I mean, you could convert it to fit, but then you'd have to ask why even bother. Also, pengines will never be modelling auto-pilot like most current plastics, but it isn't really as horrifying to put together as most people like to claim.

**MacPhail**

Quick battle report on my weekend matchup: I played pure Sisters against Necrons, my first time facing a Decurion. It was an 11-14 loss, but one that I'm still happy with tactically, as this is one of our club's better players running an army with a fearsome reputation.

He ran an almost all-gauss army, and I think a pretty typical Decurion (though I wouldn't know): Overlord with Command Barge, 4 units of Warriors, 2 Ghost Arks, Immortals, Tomb Blades, a Monolith, 2 Doom Scythes, and the formation that buffs 2 units of Praetorians with a Triarch Stalker (lots of rerolls). I ran 2 CADS: Jacobus, 2x F/HF Sisters in Rhinos, 3x melta Doms in MM Immos, 2x Exos, and HF Rets in a Rhino, plus Celestine, 2x small Sisters squads in the backfield, 2x flamer Seraphim, and HB Rets.

We played the mission with progressively fewer objective cards on a fairly dense Dawn of War board. He deployed first, so I set up Immo Doms, HF Rets, and both Exos to the left opposite his Praetorians and Triarch formation, 2 more Immo Doms centrally opposite his Monolith and Ghost Arks, and the two F/HF Rhino squads on the right opposite his Immortals and Tomb Blades. My 2 small squads of Sisters held backfield objectives and I reserved the Seraphim and Celestine.

I managed to seize the initiative, something that has happened to this Necron player in the last three games, all of which he still won. Not sure if that points to his skill as a player, the strength of his army, or critical errors on the part of his opponent trying to exploit it. Probably all three.

On my left flank, the Immo Doms and 2 Exos ground down the Praetorians over 2 turns. That flank was a little overloaded so the HF Rets in their Rhino with Jacobus shifted toward the center to eventually burn some Warriors and score an objective before getting gaussed to death. In the center the other 2 Immos, having scouted hard, unloaded their meltas on the doorstep and took out the Monolith, with one of them surviving to hide in some ruins, score an objective, and take out the Triarch Stalker in turn 3. On the right flank, my two F/HF Rhinos advanced to take on the Tomb Blades, but with limited success; they then failed to dislodge the Immortals from an objective and got ground down by massed gauss fire. The small backfield squads claimed some objective VPs early, then went down to long-range fire as the Warriors advanced. The Seraphim DSed in on turns 2 and 3; one grabbed an objected on my side of the board that had lost it's campers early and the other, with Celestine landed in his backfield and took out the Overlord after a tedious multi-turn melee. His Doom Scythes circled the battlefield, got 1 Exorcist, 3 transports, and shot up various squads.

The game ended with 4 full squads of Warriors and both Ghost Arks firmly holding the center (he'd been repairing them as fast as I killed them), half his Tomb Blades and his Immortals holding two flank objectives, and only my remaining Exo and the HB Rets hiding in a corner. The ended on turn 5, and he'd have very likely tabled me on turn 6. An 11-14 loss despite having seized on him doesn't feel great, but given the reputation of the army and the player, I'll take it, and he noted that he hadn't expected that tough a fight from me or my army. But I really wanted to hand him his first defeat... did I mention he's undefeated with Necrons?

So, thoughts and questions:

Necrons are damned hard to take off the board... How does Jake's WT only give a 5+ invul to a single squad and Necrons get army-wide 4+ RP? Doesn't quite seem balanced.

I ignored Ghost Arks and Warriors to focus on Praetorians (everyone in our club talks about how nasty they are), but I may have over-committed by deploying both Exos on that flank.

Had I made slightly different moves with Doms on Turn 1, I could have taken out his Ghost Arks (which fixed every single Warrior I killed) instead of the Monolith... did I fall for a distraction Carnifex there?

Once I realized how Quantum Shielding works, I wished I'd spread the melta around a bit more to get the AVs down to where Exo missles and maybe even HBs could do some good.

The F/HF Rhino squads were the wrong thing to send after the Tomb Blades... I was thinking of them as jetbikes, flimsy and jinky, but they are more like Marine bikes, with a base 3+ and T5, and I wished I'd had an Exorcist on that side of the board.

Ignoring the Warriors and Ghost Arks resulted in so much rapid-fire gauss output, he went very quickly through all my transports and then through the squads they contained.

The Tomb Blades and Immortals showed the potency of S5 shooting against T3 infantry, power armor or no.

Finally, 2 flyers are hard to ignore... I'm the only non-flyer-non-superheavy army at our club, and my opponents always check before bringing them against me. I have always said yes to single knights and flyers and tried to win on the ground with objectives, but I may turn down the offer to face 2 Doom Scythes again... do those S10 Death Rays really have a 360-degree fire arc?

Anyway, I think we made a good stand and the Sisters are getting the reputation of an army that puts up a good fight. I'm happy with the close game, but I'd love advice on how to put the next on in the win column. Comments and condolences welcome!

**Jancoran**

MacPhail wrote:
Quick battle report on my weekend matchup: I played pure Sisters against Necrons, my first time facing a Decurion. It was an 11-14 loss, but one that I'm still happy with tactically, as this is one of our club's better players running an army with a fearsome reputation.

He ran an almost all-gauss army, and I think a pretty typical Decurion (though I wouldn't know): Overlord with Command Barge, 4 units of Warriors, 2 Ghost Arks, Immortals, Tomb Blades, a Monolith, 2 Doom Scythes, and the formation that buffs 2 units of Praetorians with a Triarch Stalker (lots of rerolls). I ran 2 CADS: Jacobus, 2x F/HF Sisters in Rhinos, 3x melta Doms in MM Immos, 2x Exos, and HF Rets in a Rhino, plus Celestine, 2x small Sisters squads in the backfield, 2x flamer Seraphim, and HB Rets.

We played the mission with progressively fewer objective cards on a fairly dense Dawn of War board. He deployed first, so I set up Immo Doms, HF Rets, and both Exos to the left opposite his Praetorians and Triarch formation, 2 more Immo Doms centrally opposite his Monolith and Ghost Arks, and the two F/HF Rhino squads on the right opposite his Immortals and Tomb Blades. My 2 small squads of Sisters held backfield objectives and I reserved the Seraphim and Celestine.

I managed to seize the initiative, something that has happened to this Necron player in the last three games, all of which he still won. Not sure if that points to his skill as a player, the strength of his army, or critical errors on the part of his opponent trying to exploit it. Probably all three.

On my left flank, the Immo Doms and 2 Exos ground down the Praetorians over 2 turns. That flank was a little overloaded so the HF Rets in their Rhino with Jacobus shifted toward the center to eventually burn some Warriors and score an objective before getting gaussed to death. In the center the other 2 Immos, having scouted hard, unloaded their meltas on the doorstep and took out the Monolith, with one of them surviving to hide in some ruins, score an objective, and take out the Triarch Stalker in turn 3. On the right flank, my two F/HF Rhinos advanced to take on the Tomb Blades, but with limited success; they then failed to dislodge the Immortals from an objective and got ground down by massed gauss fire. The small backfield squads claimed some objective VPs early, then went down to long-range fire as the Warriors advanced. The Seraphim DSed in on turns 2 and 3; one grabbed an objected on my side of the board that had lost it's campers early and the other, with Celestine landed in his backfield and took out the Overlord after a tedious multi-turn melee. His Doom Scythes circled the battlefield, got 1 Exorcist, 3 transports, and shot up various squads.

The game ended with 4 full squads of Warriors and both Ghost Arks firmly holding the center (he'd been repairing them as fast as I killed them), half his Tomb Blades and his Immortals holding two flank objectives, and only my remaining Exo and the HB Rets hiding in a corner. The ended on turn 5, and he'd have very likely tabled me on turn 6. An 11-14 loss despite having seized on him doesn't feel great, but given the reputation of the army and the player, I'll take it, and he noted that he hadn't expected that tough a fight from me or my army. But I really wanted to hand him his first defeat... did I mention he's undefeated with Necrons?

So, thoughts and questions:

Necrons are damned hard to take off the board... How does Jake's WT only give a 5+ invul to a single squad and Necrons get army-wide 4+ RP? Doesn't quite seem balanced.

I ignored Ghost Arks and Warriors to focus on Praetorians (everyone in our club talks about how nasty they are), but I may have over-committed by deploying both Exos on that flank.

Had I made slightly different moves with Doms on Turn 1, I could have taken out his Ghost Arks (which fixed every single Warrior I killed) instead of the Monolith... did I fall for a distraction Carnifex there?

Once I realized how Quantum Shielding works, I wished I'd spread the melta around a bit more to get the AVs down to where Exo missles and maybe even HBs could do some good.

The F/HF Rhino squads were the wrong thing to send after the Tomb Blades... I was thinking of them as jetbikes, flimsy and jinky, but they are more like Marine bikes, with a base 3+ and T5, and I wished I'd had an Exorcist on that side of the board.

Ignoring the Warriors and Ghost Arks resulted in so much rapid-fire gauss output, he went very quickly through all my transports and then through the squads they contained.

The Tomb Blades and Immortals showed the potency of S5 shooting against T3 infantry, power armor or no.

Finally, 2 flyers are hard to ignore... I'm the only non-flyer-non-superheavy army at our club, and my opponents always check before bringing them against me. I have always said yes to single knights and flyers and tried to win on the ground with objectives, but I may turn down the offer to face 2 Doom Scythes again... do those S10 Death Rays really have a 360-degree fire arc?

Anyway, I think we made a good stand and the Sisters are getting the reputation of an army that puts up a good fight. I'm happy with the close game, but I'd love advice on how to put the next on in the win column. Comments and condolences welcome!

First, well done in a very difficult match against a worthy opponent.

As for your questions:
1. Fairness? Balanced? ecurions have no Objective Secured so the only armies that cannot compete with them are those who share that limitation. I would learn something pretty importand from that statement and utilize Objective Secured to advantage against them and many armies. Battle Companies are the Ridiculous ones that make it all Obsec. Stupid. But Necrons? Nah. I have now lost to just one guy playing a Decurion in all my many matches against them. Obsec just kills em. I play Necrons as well as my other armies and I can say that I have never used a Decurion. who needs it?

2. Killing the Ghost Arks would have "killed" more Warriors nd Immortals probably than the alternative targets would. Food for thought. Obviously it depends on whether you had the firepower to do it (you did). One thing I have done is sacrificed Celestine and a few things you took to Rhino up. This has made an enormous difference inthe speed and protestion I can give my army. Consider it.

It sounds like you make sound observations here so there's not much else to add. I think that the Aerial problem goes away quite a bit if you strike hard and fast and then use Rhinos to cower and position, then hit hard and fast again. You dont have to fire every gun every round. Sometimes prudent wasting of the enemies resources can get you victories also.

=)

**Drider**

On the subject of Aerial problems; I've been giving thought to putting a few points into an Inquisitorial Detachment specifically to give Prescience to Exorcists/Rets. If your talking about only hitting flyers on 6s then re-rolling "all failed To Hit rolls" is pretty huge. Or even for your Rets on that turn you really want to Rend something to death, although you'd want to get Litanies into the Ret squad to guarantee that the AoF goes off.

Setup for the detachment looks like this:

HQ
25 pts Inquisitor (bare bones and ordo of choice)
Elites
18 pts Inquisitorial Henchmen Warband: Psyker, Acolyte, Acolyte.
18 pts Inquisitorial Henchmen Warband: Psyker, Acolyte, Acolyte.
18 pts Inquisitorial Henchmen Warband: Psyker, Acolyte, Acolyte.
79 points

You'd get 3+d6 dice for manifesting powers and if your lucky enough, get prescience off on 3 targets.

And.... if you really wanted to abuse it, the henchmen could each take Land Raider (240-250pts +X for vehicle equipment) or Valkyrie (125pts + X equipment) as Dedi Transports. You could also add in Servo Skulls(up to 3, 3 pts each) on the inquisitor if you want some scout/infiltrate protection or if you Deep strike within 6" of one you only roll 1D6 for scatter.

upgrading the Inquisitor to a Psyker (ML1) and adding 2 sevo skulls, gives you a 4th Psyker and comes out at 115 points for the detachment exactly the same as a 5 girl BSS squad with F/HF in a Rhino.

**MacPhail**

Jancoran-- I think you're dead-on about ObSec... I maybe should have used my mobility as much to challenge his claims on objectives as to engage his forces. Not sure how it would have played out if I had tried to take down the Arks and his Warrior blob, but we will meet again, I'm sure. You'll be glad to know there are 3 more Marine Razorbacks on the way this month to do double duty as Sisters Rhinos... bring my total to 9. When they come I'll put together a list that drops Celestine and the Seraphim in exchange for a Canoness and mounting up those squads from the second CAD, maybe even squeeze in another HF Retributer unit. Whatever I do for units, I should be able to send 1-2 hulls against every objective, some of them with ObSec units of my own. When going against non-ObSec armies, especially tough ones like Necrons, do you add extra Troops choices in order to claim objectives without clearing them first, or do you go with minimum Troops selections?

Drider-- I had been trying to cook up an Inquisition unit to be an asset in the Shooting phase, but couldn't make the points add up advantageously. I know people have had luck with the Assault Inquisitor, but your idea about the Psychic phase is food for thought. I actually did Snap Shot an Exorcist at his Doom Scythes at one point when the game was nearly over and there were no other targets, got two hits, but couldn't Pen the temporary AV13 thing all his vehicles had. Let us know if you give the Prescience mob a try, and I'll do the same.

Thanks to both!

**Jancoran**

I think 4 Obsec units is enough. I make judicious use of reserves as well toprotect my swissters that are important. The mission really dictates that. In my current list I have four obsec things: Two sisters units plus their rhinos. I feel exposed though so I would definitely recommend to other people that they take 3-4 small sisters squads if they dont want/have the rhinos. less than 4 Obsec units has been a bad idea since fifth edition in my opinion.

**ERJAK**

Saint Celestine (135pts)

+ Troops (280pts) +

Battle Sister Squad (140pts)HF/F
Immolator DB MM
Battle Sister Squad (140pts) M/M
Immolator MM

+ Fast Attack (560pts) +

Dominion Squad (190pts) 4xM Combi
Immolator DB Laud MM

Dominion Squad (180pts) 4xM Combi
Immolator DB MM

Dominion Squad (190pts) 4xMelta Combi
Repressor

++ Space Marines: Codex (2015) (Formation Detachment) (524pts) ++

Chapter Tactics * [White Scars]

'Hunting Force * (524pts)
Attack Bike Squad MM
5xBikes 2 Grav
5xBikes 2Grav

Kor'sarro Khan [Moondrakkan]

Scout Bike Squad

So this is my hyper aggro alpha strike list for a tourney that only allows 1 CAD + 1 formation or w/e else, Khan is warlord for WS scout. Basically, if he deploys anything within 36 inches of my line it dies, or if he deploys anything in H&A at all it dies turn 2(with some lucky rolls admittedly)

Which leaves my 2 obsec units completely ignored, OR forces him to dive pass my line to stop me from scoring.

(I REALLY like shotgun lists)

**pretre**

Only one repressor? Doms are twice as good with repressors.

**ERJAK**

pretre wrote:
Only one repressor? Doms are twice as good with repressors.

Firstly I only have the 1 repressor anyway, secondly, I almost always need to disembark the domis to get range(or melta range) on the target, saving 15 points and having a tank that's still useful on its own means that more than 2 repressors are unlikely to fit how I play dominions in general.

**pretre**

I find keeping them on board is important in keeping them alive. It also allows you to go more heavy on melta since you have HF on the Repressors. YMMV though.

**Drider**

I tried out the the dirt cheap triple psyker henchmen tonight and was actually really surprised about how fun and effective it was!

Spoiler:

Prescience on HB Rets is supper effective! On the turn they popped their AoF, prescience meant that all 12 shots hit, which made a huge difference to how many rending wounds i inflicted. It doesn't feel like you get as much bang for your buck from prescience on Exos and my opponent didn't field any flyers so i couldn't test out the "poor man's skyfire". The extra couple of dice on top of the community dice to deny the which came in extremely useful as my opponent was using a combination of Precog and shadow fields to give his warlord a re-rollable 2++. Despite this, a clutch deny the which roll (with my entire dice pool) bagged me a turn without the re-roll and i was able to drop his warlord.

But with all that being said it is incredibly fun and satisfying to declare "this psyker is manifesting prescience on X' then rolling 5 dice (about 80% chance to manifest and 20% chance to peril) and just not giving a f**k if the psyker's head explodes. it just feels like thats how sisters would use psykers. 'Use' being the operative word, as psykers are a tool of the Imperium. you don't care if you break a tool, you just go and get another.

**ERJAK**

pretre wrote:
I find keeping them on board is important in keeping them alive. It also allows you to go more heavy on melta since you have HF on the Repressors. YMMV though.

Flamers tend to be borderline useless in my meta, almost everyone plays marines not being able to fire it after moving more than six hurts too.

Also, I really don't ever try to keep dominions alive, I just try to kill more than 115 points of models with them and then keep the tanks alive.

**pretre**

/shrug Guess it depends on the person.

**deviantduck**

She who bails, fails.
- Pretre

**PanzerLeader**

deviantduck wrote:
Those who bail, fail.

Quoted for truth!

I used to run the immolator set-up with dominions. I've found that the damage output from the tanks is marginal compared to extra turns of shooting from the squad. You can only move 6" anyway to fire the girls at full effect and heavy flamers are generally quite useful at killing the typical backfield objective holders like scouts and nurglings.

**Hoitash**

PanzerLeader wrote:
deviantduck wrote:
Those who bail, fail.

Quoted for truth!

I used to run the immolator set-up with dominions. I've found that the damage output from the tanks is marginal compared to extra turns of shooting from the squad. You can only move 6" anyway to fire the girls at full effect and heavy flamers are generally quite useful at killing the typical backfield objective holders like scouts and nurglings.

Indeed. For whatever reason when they roll up in the Repressor, they don't seem as much a threat. Plus that 13 Front Armour.

One thing I've started debating is the use of Outflank. Is it better to trust in Random Number Tzeentch, or just start them on the field and hope they aren't a priority target (Presuming I don't bring a Knight, which then becomes the priority target.)

**pretre**

deviantduck wrote:
Those who bail, fail.

It's 'She who bails, fails'. I made that one up.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Hoitash wrote:
PanzerLeader wrote:
deviantduck wrote:
Those who bail, fail.

Quoted for truth!

I used to run the immolator set-up with dominions. I've found that the damage output from the tanks is marginal compared to extra turns of shooting from the squad. You can only move 6" anyway to fire the girls at full effect and heavy flamers are generally quite useful at killing the typical backfield objective holders like scouts and nurglings.

Indeed. For whatever reason when they roll up in the Repressor, they don't seem as much a threat. Plus that 13 Front Armour.

One thing I've started debating is the use of Outflank. Is it better to trust in Random Number Tzeentch, or just start them on the field and hope they aren't a priority target (Presuming I don't bring a Knight, which then becomes the priority target.)

I've always been a fan of Overload as a concept (jy2 did a lot of battle reports on this concept). Put a ton of threats on the board turn 1 and make them choose.

**MacPhail**

I had been Outflanking mine almost exclusively until recently, and I'm inclined to think it is overrated. If your opponent knows how hard they hit, and you go second, and you deploy them centrally or in the open, you'll probably lose them. Otherwise, I've gotten greater impact from mine Scouting up on a flank, using BLoS terrain advantageously, maybe losing one to the first shooting turn, but otherwise hitting hard. Even when a squad gets dismounted early, they can grab cover, or I'll disembark a BSS squad to free up a transport for them, and they'll usually get at least some of their points back later in the game by busting someone's jink save as they zoom by. Outflanking runs the risk of all the juicy stuff being gone from the flanks by the time they arrive, either because your opponent deployed their high-yield targets centrally, advanced them out of melta range, or has bubble-wrapped them effectively. I've definitely had Dominions show up too late to catch the enemy knight in the DZ.

**PanzerLeader**

Outflanking is situational. In hammer and anvil deployment it is very good if your opponent knows how to exploit the additional depth to avoid an alpha strike. It also lets you respond to their moves up the board.

In vanguard and dawn of war, objective placement really determines utility. If there are objectives on both flanks and your opponent has high value targets that like to camp them (artillery, rip tides, etc.) it can be worth outflanking.

My point is: it's a good ability but it should never be considered a must use.

**Jancoran**

PanzerLeader wrote:
Outflanking is situational. In hammer and anvil deployment it is very good if your opponent knows how to exploit the additional depth to avoid an alpha strike. It also lets you respond to their moves up the board.

In vanguard and dawn of war, objective placement really determines utility. If there are objectives on both flanks and your opponent has high value targets that like to camp them (artillery, rip tides, etc.) it can be worth outflanking.

My point is: it's a good ability but it should never be considered a must use.

Agreed here. The option to do something isnt a mandate to do something.

**deviantduck**

deviantduck wrote:
She who bails, fails.
- Pretre

Fixed it for ya.

**pretre**

It has served me well for editions.