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Made in gb
The Daemon Possessing Fulgrim's Body





Devon, UK

 Therion wrote:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Therion wrote:
What an awful post.


Backatcha big guy.

I'll say it again:

Your comparison is terrible. Games don't get "replaced". It's not even close to the same thing as getting a new set of rules for a miniature game. Comparing a new rules edition to annualised games (of which there aren't as many as you're making it out to be - most games don't have 2-3 dedicated studios pumping out new editions of the same game every year).


You'll repeat a terrible post again? Why would you do something like that?

You have yet to provide any reasons why a new miniature game should be treated differently than a new video game in this discussion. You're even arguing against yourself. Games don't get replaced.

EA and Activision pump games out as fast as they can. So there aren't many studios capable of that? How many miniature games companies are there like GW then? What do you think these companies might have in common in their markets? Many would say they are replacing and repackaging the old crap in new gift wraps in order to make money, but you don't believe in games getting replaced so let's not use that. Open your Warhammer 2nd edition book and go play.


Well, culture is certainly one reason. Videogames have been annualised since EA did it with their sport franchise titles way back on the 8 bit consoles. Traditionally, wargames haven't has that same sort of life cycle, and, in GW's recent history especially, those players wishing to stay near the top of the competition curve generally need to make a further investment in more stuff. If that life cycle, and associated expenditure suddenly accelerates, you can expect people to have a problem with it. Just like videogamers go apoplectic when something goes not to their liking in an update or new edition.

We find comfort among those who agree with us - growth among those who don't. - Frank Howard Clark

The wise man doubts often, and changes his mind; the fool is obstinate, and doubts not; he knows all things but his own ignorance.

The correct statement of individual rights is that everyone has the right to an opinion, but crucially, that opinion can be roundly ignored and even made fun of, particularly if it is demonstrably nonsense!” Professor Brian Cox

Ask me about
Barnstaple Slayers Club 
   
Made in us
Jovial Plaguebearer of Nurgle




Brighton, MO

Therion wrote:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Therion wrote:
What an awful post.


Backatcha big guy.

I'll say it again:

Your comparison is terrible. Games don't get "replaced". It's not even close to the same thing as getting a new set of rules for a miniature game. Comparing a new rules edition to annualised games (of which there aren't as many as you're making it out to be - most games don't have 2-3 dedicated studios pumping out new editions of the same game every year).


You'll repeat a terrible post again? Why would you do something like that?

You have yet to provide any reasons why a new miniature game should be treated differently than a new video game in this discussion. You're even arguing against yourself. Games don't get replaced.

EA and Activision pump games out as fast as they can. So there aren't many studios capable of that? How many miniature games companies are there like GW then? What do you think these companies might have in common in their markets? Many would say they are replacing and repackaging the old crap in new gift wraps in order to make money, but you don't believe in games getting replaced so let's not use that. Open your Warhammer 2nd edition book and go play.



Weren't you the one who originally said games get "replaced" all the time???

 
   
Made in fi
Jervis Johnson






 azreal13 wrote:
 Therion wrote:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Therion wrote:
What an awful post.


Backatcha big guy.

I'll say it again:

Your comparison is terrible. Games don't get "replaced". It's not even close to the same thing as getting a new set of rules for a miniature game. Comparing a new rules edition to annualised games (of which there aren't as many as you're making it out to be - most games don't have 2-3 dedicated studios pumping out new editions of the same game every year).


You'll repeat a terrible post again? Why would you do something like that?

You have yet to provide any reasons why a new miniature game should be treated differently than a new video game in this discussion. You're even arguing against yourself. Games don't get replaced.

EA and Activision pump games out as fast as they can. So there aren't many studios capable of that? How many miniature games companies are there like GW then? What do you think these companies might have in common in their markets? Many would say they are replacing and repackaging the old crap in new gift wraps in order to make money, but you don't believe in games getting replaced so let's not use that. Open your Warhammer 2nd edition book and go play.


Well, culture is certainly one reason. Videogames have been annualised since EA did it with their sport franchise titles way back on the 8 bit consoles. Traditionally, wargames haven't has that same sort of life cycle, and, in GW's recent history especially, those players wishing to stay near the top of the competition curve generally need to make a further investment in more stuff. If that life cycle, and associated expenditure suddenly accelerates, you can expect people to have a problem with it. Just like videogamers go apoplectic when something goes not to their liking in an update or new edition.


I agree completely and I everyone has the right to be upset about anything they want. What I'm saying is that I'm used to games companies behaving in this way, and that seeing GW slowly change the way they sell their games comes as no surprise. Noone here can deny that a lot hasn't changed in the past year. GW's experimenting with microtransaction rules packages even which while common to the video gaming industry is quite new to miniature gaming. In addition to all the change regarding dataslates and new rules supplements like escalation, they're using the digital channel to vastly accelerate the pace of releasing new army lists to the game. I think they released like four codex books a year during the 4th edition. I wonder what the amount was this year? Fifteen?

Weren't you the one who originally said games get "replaced" all the time???

It's arguing about semantics. Yes, I do believe games get replaced (In the sense that the community en masse moves on to the new game. Physically of course nothing gets replaced and your product is still available for your enjoyment), but HBMC doesn't, so I told him to go play 2nd edition instead of whining about the 7th coming too quickly.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2013/12/27 03:10:16


 
   
Made in us
Shas'o Commanding the Hunter Kadre




Missouri

Yeah, and EA and Activision are both looked down on or mocked heavily for precisely those reasons. I don't think it's a good idea for GW to emulate that behavior, because not only is GW's customer base much smaller, but GW's updates require you to spend much, much more than $60 a year, and people aren't going to be cool with that. If everyone had to buy a new console every time a new CoD game came out for example I almost guarantee you they wouldn't have anywhere near the same amount of success with that franchise.

 Desubot wrote:
Why isnt Slut Wars: The Sexpocalypse a real game dammit.


"It's easier to change the rules than to get good at the game." 
   
Made in us
Willing Inquisitorial Excruciator





Philadelphia

 azreal13 wrote:


...Traditionally, wargames haven't has that same sort of life cycle, and, in GW's recent history especially, those players wishing to stay near the top of the competition curve generally need to make a further investment in more stuff. If that life cycle, and associated expenditure suddenly accelerates, you can expect people to have a problem with it.


If I were wearing my tinfoil hat, I might think that GW was purposefully doing this to drive the competitive gamers further away. But that would be crazy talk, and way too organized for GW.

Back in reality land, we continue to froth and foam about a RUMOR that is incredibly unlikely based on GWs track record. With only two years in, and books just having been printed, why would they consolidate them at this point, UNLESS they were just pulling the rulebook, escalation, and stronghold into a "collector's edition" of 40k, and charging a premium. Now that I can envision.

Legio Suturvora 2000 points (painted)
30k Word Bearers 2000 points (in progress)
Daemonhunters 1000 points (painted)
Flesh Tearers 2000+ points (painted) - Balt GT '02 52nd; Balt GT '05 16th
Kabal of the Tortured Soul 2000+ points (painted) - Balt GT '08 85th; Mechanicon '09 12th
Greenwing 1000 points (painted) - Adepticon Team Tourny 2013

"There is rational thought here. It's just swimming through a sea of stupid and is often concealed from view by the waves of irrational conclusions." - Railguns 
   
Made in fi
Jervis Johnson






 Sidstyler wrote:
Yeah, and EA and Activision are both looked down on or mocked heavily for precisely those reasons.

I know, and despite all the mocking their games are wildly popular and generate a ton of profit. GW is mocked on a daily basis at every message board I know of and they too are still profitable. I guess they're trying to make those profits even bigger? Who would have thought?
   
Made in us
Badass "Sister Sin"






Camas, WA

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 pretre wrote:
Yeah, good luck with that. You want a free kitten too?


No need to be a dick about it pretre. Another massive and super-expensive hard-back book right after someone's bought the current super-expensive hard-back book and both its expensive hard-back expansions? I think people have a right to go "No. Feth that noise." After only two years it's the gaming equivalent of a baint'n'switch.

Whoa, down boy. I thought I was being nice. Let me remind you that he was writing an obviously silly post (quoted below) asking for the a bunch of things that obviously wouldn't happen.
Do I think that rereleasing 40k / a new edition is premature? Yes. I also don't think it is true.
Do I think a collected book cleaning up some bits and including all of the 'expansions' is premature? Nah, I think that's fine.
Was the 'just the rules' 40k rulebook a cash grab? No, people bought it if they wanted it, which will probably be the same thing when this RUMORED book comes out (if it does).

Bring it I say. Just be sure to roll all Marines into one book, and give refunds to anybody who bought the BRB, Escal, or Stronghold. Or simply let them trade in. Remember those poor saps who bought DftS only to buy a Codex with the same rules immediately after?

Looking for great deals on miniatures or have a large pile you are looking to sell off? Checkout Mindtaker Miniatures.
Live in the Pacific NW? Check out http://ordofanaticus.com
 
   
Made in us
Infiltrating Broodlord





I'm afraid I don't give this rumor much credence simply because this edition is far too young. Maybe a book that has a lot of the expansions rolled up into it, maybe just that. But if they DO actually release another edition already I'd be shocked as it just feels far too early.

I refuse to join any club that would have me as a member. -Groucho Marx

 
   
Made in us
Most Glorious Grey Seer





Everett, WA

If this is an updated 6th edition, my iTunes version better get updated automatically. And Cypher better find his way into my Dark Angels codex, too.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/27 03:33:47


 
   
Made in us
Jovial Plaguebearer of Nurgle




Brighton, MO

 Breotan wrote:
If this is an updated 6th edition, my iTunes version better get updated automatically. And Cypher better find his way into my Dark Angels codex, too.



I thought Cypher wasn't allowed to be taken by Dark Angels?

 
   
Made in us
Morphing Obliterator





The Frigid North of Minneapolis

Initial reaction: WTF. Really?

After a moment's thought: if they produce miniatures as high quality and as much of a bargain as Dark Vengeance, then I'll buy at least a couple of boxes (like DV).

-C6
   
Made in us
Most Glorious Grey Seer





Everett, WA

 PlaguelordHobbyServices wrote:
 Breotan wrote:
If this is an updated 6th edition, my iTunes version better get updated automatically. And Cypher better find his way into my Dark Angels codex, too.
I thought Cypher wasn't allowed to be taken by Dark Angels?
He isn't but that's the most logical place to put him.


 
   
Made in us
Is 'Eavy Metal Calling?





Affton, MO. USA

Does anyone else believe they actually figured out a revamp of fantasy would do nothing to bring the game back, since the costs are too crazy anyway. So if they repackage 40k they might still get the sales to come close to the previous years sales.

LOL, Theo your mind is an amazing place, never change.-camkierhi 9/19/13
I cant believe theo is right.. damn. -comradepanda 9/26/13
None of the strange ideas we had about you involved your sexual orientation..........-Monkeytroll 12/10/13

I'd put you on ignore for that comment, if I could...Alpharius 2/11/14 
   
Made in us
Jovial Plaguebearer of Nurgle




Brighton, MO

 Breotan wrote:
 PlaguelordHobbyServices wrote:
 Breotan wrote:
If this is an updated 6th edition, my iTunes version better get updated automatically. And Cypher better find his way into my Dark Angels codex, too.
I thought Cypher wasn't allowed to be taken by Dark Angels?
He isn't but that's the most logical place to put him.



Personally, wouldn't Chaos Space Marines be the most logical place to put him? considering he was a character in the old Chaos book?

 
   
Made in us
Thunderhawk Pilot Dropping From Orbit





The wilds of Pennsyltucky

If they do put out the next edition so soon...well, I am just done.

ender502

"Burning the aquila into the retinas of heretics is the new black." - Savnock

"The ignore button is for pansees who can't deal with their own problems. " - H.B.M.C. 
   
Made in us
Stalwart Veteran Guard Sergeant




 -Loki- wrote:


If you want to throw a hissy fit, at least read the rumour first. It's not a 6 month window. The 6th edition rulebook has been out for 18 months now. The rumour is late 2014, which gives it roughly 2 and a half years. It's not GW's fault you got into the edition 18 months late, and you getting in late doesn't make it their fault you don't get to use your books as long as other people.

Though I agree, late 2014 is very early for a new edition.


lol..

Read my post again bro. I said Escalation came out this month. Not 6th edition rulebook. But with 7600+ posts in 3 years on this board, its a good bet you make a habit of insulting, arguing, trolling etc. not sure why I'm even bothering to respond to your post, in which you insulted me for a remark I didn't even make.
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

 pretre wrote:
Do I think that rereleasing 40k / a new edition is premature? Yes. I also don't think it is true.
Do I think a collected book cleaning up some bits and including all of the 'expansions' is premature? Nah, I think that's fine.


We agree on both. I don't think this'll happen (a whole new edition that is - a collated book I can see happening) and I think a collated rulebook that contains Escalation and Stronghold Assault is a good idea, just as long as it's those rules put into the rulebook, not a totally new rule set. It also makes sense form a practical business standpoint.

Which is better:

1. Three full-colour hardback books that have to be interdependently printed, shipped and stocked?
2. One full-colour hardback book?

Having one SKU to achieve the same result as three can't be a bad thing.

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in au
Norn Queen






sand.zzz wrote:
 -Loki- wrote:


If you want to throw a hissy fit, at least read the rumour first. It's not a 6 month window. The 6th edition rulebook has been out for 18 months now. The rumour is late 2014, which gives it roughly 2 and a half years. It's not GW's fault you got into the edition 18 months late, and you getting in late doesn't make it their fault you don't get to use your books as long as other people.

Though I agree, late 2014 is very early for a new edition.


lol..

Read my post again bro. I said Escalation came out this month. Not 6th edition rulebook. But with 7600+ posts in 3 years on this board, its a good bet you make a habit of insulting, arguing, trolling etc. not sure why I'm even bothering to respond to your post, in which you insulted me for a remark I didn't even make.


You said 'rulebooks'

by giving us s 6 month window to use hardbound rulebooks


So I assumed you were talking about the rulebook. Escalation is a supplement. My reading comprehension is fine, you are just not very clear when ranting.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/12/27 04:51:27


 
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

He explained what he meant. No need to split hairs.

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in us
Stalwart Veteran Guard Sergeant




 -Loki- wrote:
sand.zzz wrote:
 -Loki- wrote:


If you want to throw a hissy fit, at least read the rumour first. It's not a 6 month window. The 6th edition rulebook has been out for 18 months now. The rumour is late 2014, which gives it roughly 2 and a half years. It's not GW's fault you got into the edition 18 months late, and you getting in late doesn't make it their fault you don't get to use your books as long as other people.

Though I agree, late 2014 is very early for a new edition.


lol..

Read my post again bro. I said Escalation came out this month. Not 6th edition rulebook. But with 7600+ posts in 3 years on this board, its a good bet you make a habit of insulting, arguing, trolling etc. not sure why I'm even bothering to respond to your post, in which you insulted me for a remark I didn't even make.


You said 'rulebooks'

by giving us s 6 month window to use hardbound rulebooks


So I assumed you were talking about the rulebook. Escalation is a supplement. My reading comprehension is fine, you are just not very clear when ranting.


I mentioned several books, two of which were just released. You chose to ignore that fact, and respond as if I'd only been talking about 6th ed., because otherwise you'd have nothing to flame. Best part is, in your last statement you agree with the remark you were flaming me for. which I never even said.
So yea, 7600+ posts in three years. thanks for illustrating my point.
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

What did I just say about splitting hairs?

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in ca
Wing Commander






 H.B.M.C. wrote:
What did I just say about splitting hairs?



This is the internet, where semantics and subtleties of language choice are under greater scrutiny than an English PhD Thesis.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/27 05:21:06


Therefore, I conclude, Valve should announce Half Life 2: Episode 3.
 
   
Made in au
Pustulating Plague Priest




Apparently you encouraged it?

There’s a difference between having a hobby and being a narcissist.  
   
Made in us
Most Glorious Grey Seer





Everett, WA

 PlaguelordHobbyServices wrote:
 Breotan wrote:
 PlaguelordHobbyServices wrote:
 Breotan wrote:
If this is an updated 6th edition, my iTunes version better get updated automatically. And Cypher better find his way into my Dark Angels codex, too.
I thought Cypher wasn't allowed to be taken by Dark Angels?
He isn't but that's the most logical place to put him.
Personally, wouldn't Chaos Space Marines be the most logical place to put him? considering he was a character in the old Chaos book?
Look at who he can ally with. Also, his fluff is exclusively DA related. The screenshots of his eBook clearly state that Chaos want him as badly as the DA so I'm thinking he really doesn't belong in CSM.


 
   
Made in us
Archmagos Veneratus Extremis




On the Internet

Peredyne wrote:
This rumor came from 40K radio, who, if I'm not mistaken, received a C&D from GW legal not that long ago. Sounds more like someone in GW legal parsed out specifically bad information to track down who was slipping info to 40K radio.

It's possible, but then again maybe not. They got C&D about the Space Marine stuff they had up, not everything they had IIRC.

Honestly an updated 6.5 edition branded as 7th really does fit into what GW would do in my mind. It's basically monetizing a lot of large errattas, or maybe they've finally dropped the need to keep carrying 3rd edition's corpse around and redid it from the ground up. We'll have to wait and see what, if anything, comes of this.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut






Eternal Plague

 ClockworkZion wrote:
Peredyne wrote:
This rumor came from 40K radio, who, if I'm not mistaken, received a C&D from GW legal not that long ago. Sounds more like someone in GW legal parsed out specifically bad information to track down who was slipping info to 40K radio.

It's possible, but then again maybe not. They got C&D about the Space Marine stuff they had up, not everything they had IIRC.

Honestly an updated 6.5 edition branded as 7th really does fit into what GW would do in my mind. It's basically monetizing a lot of large errattas, or maybe they've finally dropped the need to keep carrying 3rd edition's corpse around and redid it from the ground up. We'll have to wait and see what, if anything, comes of this.


And more to the point, if the new cycle of editions is every 2-3 years, with revamps of every codex finished within that 3 year time span, how much are we looking at from a purchasing standpoint just to keep up to date on all book releases and edition changes instituted at a much quicker pace now more so than ever?

   
Made in ca
Longtime Dakkanaut




i hope they make even bigger and even more super fabulous looking robots and tanks for 7th edition.

and "hoplites" - can be a centurion put into an even bigger and more super fabulous mech suit. how awesome would that be?

all factions could probably use even more gemstones, jewelery and definitely more man servants.
   
Made in gb
Elite Tyranid Warrior




I can absolutely see this happening. In fact, I think at this point it might even be necessary.

We have so many supplements to the BRB now that it makes sense for them to be incorporated into the BRB at some point rather than having to whip out 3 or 4 books every time you want to refer to a specific rule in your game.

- "I'll just whip out out my BRB to look that up. Wait, it's not in here, must be in one of the others... I'll check... Wait, it's not this one either, I'll have to get the other one out..." And ten minutes go by while you try to figure out which book and section it's in.

If GW can make a bit more money out of it's customer base by centralising the rules in one book (even after making you buy 3 or 4 of them already) then that's obviously what they're going to do.

This is totally a viable rumour.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/27 08:50:06


 
   
Made in au
Dakka Veteran






In da middle of da WAAAGH! Australia.

I don't like this thread.

WAAAGH! Gutsnagga Mo-ork- 5000pts Kult of speed + goffs
red space marines, (almost angry enough!) 2000 points
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'You have that the wrong way around. Space Hulk teaches the inmates how large numbers of fast moving vicious hand to hand combatants can over come a small number of gun armed adversaries, in a sequence of narrow corridors.' -Orlanth
 
   
Made in gb
Battle-tested Knight Castellan Pilot




Poole, Dorset

Once again tin foil hat time.

The hobbit as a game has been a disaster for GW, it's simply not generating the revenue LotR did. This means there is a great big hole in their financial forecasting.

To keep the shareholders happy you need a sticking plaster.

A big revamp of fantasy may be in the works but would be difficult to rush out, plus does not have as big a market appeal as 40k.

So you combine existing 6th ed with stronghold and escalation into one book, make very few rule changes but sufficient to make it a 'compulsory purchase' and slap it out on the market. This is a quick, dirty easy to create edition which would provide a financial shot in the arm and if marketed as essentially 6.5 they could return to their regular cycle in two years time once all the codexes are updated.

I have no inside info but that would make sense to me, min effort max profit.

   
 
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