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IF only Nids could break the FOC like Tau...

I could see 3x Flyrant, 4x Crone being quite good at 1850.

 jy2 wrote:

I actually prefer the tervigon, both for his ability to generate troops as well as for his psychic powers, over 2x3 warriors but that's just my personal preference.

BTW, I think you mean Acid Spray on the T-fexes instead of Acid Maw, no?

Yeah. Keep typing that wrongly. But yeah either the Tervigon+30 terms+10 Terms, or MSU gants and 2x3 warriors (extra synapse is good too!).

I'm actually greatly considering the bastion + zoey (dominion) + venom bubble combination. Having a reliable wide synapse and cover core helps Tyranids immensely, coupled with a portable LOS blocking terrain is icing.

 LValx wrote:
IF only Nids could break the FOC like Tau...

I could see 3x Flyrant, 4x Crone being quite good at 1850.

let's hope for a supplement :X
soon.

 Nate668 wrote:
Hive commander might actually be worth it now that most of our damage dealers are forced to walk across the board. Having two outflanking units (devilgaunts, or maybe even warriors with deathspitters/venom cannon to threaten the rear armor of vehicles) might be enough to convince your opponent to stick to the middle of the board rather than castle up in a corner.

Now that termagants spawn at the end of the movement phase...I outflank a troop tervigon with the miasma cannon and cluster spines...spawn termagants for more shots or bubble wrap.

Deshkar wrote:
I'm actually greatly considering the bastion + zoey (dominion) + venom bubble combination. Having a reliable wide synapse and cover core helps Tyranids immensely, coupled with a portable LOS blocking terrain is icing.

It's a great combination. I used it my game against Tau. Put 1 in the building and the other hiding behind it. Preferably the venomthrope inside to increase its range and the zoan behind so that it can still use its psychic powers. It's also a guaranteed LOS-blocker in the case of a terrain-lite table.

Well, how about 3x 3 Carnifexes protected by shrouding walking through the centre?

 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, how about 3x 3 Carnifexes protected by shrouding walking through the centre?

9 Carnies with 3+/5++ saves? Sounds nasty. Screen them with gaunts, and they get 3+/3++

Unless you play against tau :/

Against tau? Take 9 stranglethorn cannons. Force saves. It works for me!

I am really looking at that 3x3 Carnifex build to be honest. The only problem is that I'd be in trouble running the Venomthropes to get them the cover buff. I'd not want to use up my entire elite slot with 3x2 Venoms.

I have to finish putting together an army list but I think a swarm of Hormas and 9 fexes are going to be a starting point for me... should be fun.

 Matt1785 wrote:
I am really looking at that 3x3 Carnifex build to be honest. The only problem is that I'd be in trouble running the Venomthropes to get them the cover buff. I'd not want to use up my entire elite slot with 3x2 Venoms.

I have to finish putting together an army list but I think a swarm of Hormas and 9 fexes are going to be a starting point for me... should be fun.

HQ
-Prime
-Prime

TROOP
-24 Hormagaunts
-24 Hormagaunts
-25 Hormagaunts

ELITE
-1 Venomthrope
-1 Venomthrope
-1 Venomthrope

HEAVY
-3 Carnifexes
-3 Carnifexes
-3 Carnifexes

1850

Break it down from there?

 ductvader wrote:

 Matt1785 wrote:
I am really looking at that 3x3 Carnifex build to be honest. The only problem is that I'd be in trouble running the Venomthropes to get them the cover buff. I'd not want to use up my entire elite slot with 3x2 Venoms.

I have to finish putting together an army list but I think a swarm of Hormas and 9 fexes are going to be a starting point for me... should be fun.

HQ
-Prime
-Prime

TROOP
-24 Hormagaunts
-24 Hormagaunts
-25 Hormagaunts

ELITE
-1 Venomthrope
-1 Venomthrope
-1 Venomthrope

HEAVY
-3 Carnifexes
-3 Carnifexes
-3 Carnifexes

1850

Break it down from there?

Take off the extra Hormagaunts. Leave them at blocks of 20, and throw in a Zoanthrope. Give yourself an extra Synapse creature and a chance for FNP on something.

Take stanglethorn/barbed and force saves if you kill one tgey have to take a pinning test, tau have poor leadership and a pinned unit can be assaulted without init drop and there snap shooting if not assaulted, it won't work all the time but each test means more chance to fail.

That 9 carnifex, 20 gaunt lists looks like it would be fun to play with and against!

 gwarsh41 wrote:
That 9 carnifex, 20 gaunt lists looks like it would be fun to play with and against!

I ran something similar under the stress test of leafblower back in the day...we pretty much decimated each other in 5th Ed.

Regarding the Trygon tunnel, I suspect the guys at GW do not know their own rules and do it like this:

"Those units deploy normally, these units are in reserve and that one walks in, these 2 units will outflank and the rest will use the tunnel."

I'll have to hit the swap forum and see if anyone wants to trade their awful Tyranids for Eldar.

I'm looking at

Prime x2
Dakkafex x3
Dakkafex x3
Tervigon
Spinegants x30
Venomthrope x2 (2 units)

As points allow:
Tyrannofex(es)
Haruspex(es)

So this may be a situational one but can't our squishy fliers get that sweet sweet venomthrope shroud? I mead it would be hard to hit that 6 inch mark but it would help their survivability greatly.

rigeld2 wrote:
I'm looking at

Prime x2
Dakkafex x3
Dakkafex x3
Tervigon
Spinegants x30
Venomthrope x2 (2 units)

As points allow:
Tyrannofex(es)
Haruspex(es)

I think you're near 1580...fast math...2 Haruspexes are possible if you drop the Devourers on 2 of your fexes...then run those baddies out front to take the wounds.

EDIT: 2 Haruspexes or Tyrannos would require you losing a Carnifex or Venomthrope unit for FoC.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 sandant wrote:
So this may be a situational one but can't our squishy fliers get that sweet sweet venom throne shroud? I mead it would be hard to hit that 6 inch mark but it would help their survivability greatly.

Personally, I built my own Skynest (Skyshield) for such creatures...stay on the ground with the invuln and fire away...and take off as need be.

 jy2 wrote:

Deshkar wrote:
I'm actually greatly considering the bastion + zoey (dominion) + venom bubble combination. Having a reliable wide synapse and cover core helps Tyranids immensely, coupled with a portable LOS blocking terrain is icing.

It's a great combination. I used it my game against Tau. Put 1 in the building and the other hiding behind it. Preferably the venomthrope inside to increase its range and the zoan behind so that it can still use its psychic powers. It's also a guaranteed LOS-blocker in the case of a terrain-lite table.

Win or lose, please do put ur battle rep soon. haha just curious to see how other tyranid's virgin experiences are like.

Hmm.

Just reading through my shiny new Codex. Which I like, by the way.

1. Gargoyles - they have a Blind attack. Since a unit has to take an Initiative test every time it is hit by a Blind attack... essentially anything they charge is going to be WS/BS1. This seems good.
2. When you charge with a Harpy, the enemy are at -5 Initiative.
3. Ergo, most of things that get charged by a Harpy and some Gargoyles, are probably going to die...

Hmm.

 Loyalwatcher wrote:
Hmm.

Just reading through my shiny new Codex. Which I like, by the way.

1. Gargoyles - they have a Blind attack. Since a unit has to take an Initiative test every time it is hit by a Blind attack... essentially anything they charge is going to be WS/BS1. This seems good.
2. When you charge with a Harpy, the enemy are at -5 Initiative.
3. Ergo, most of things that get charged by a Harpy and some Gargoyles, are probably going to die...

Hmm.

this is how i was leaning, i would love to see a winged army, but sadly i have no winged troops.


what do you guys think of this as just a part of an army: (mind you this is for a 2k, double FOC game)

Void Relay Network: (1 promethium relay pipes, 2 Void shield generators all maxed at 3 shields apiece, 240pts, gives you 12in armour 12 bubbles that have 3hp each basically and can regen)
1x3 Provors (within 2in of pipes their weapons become torrent, so no one can charge your sheilds without being burnt, or you could add battlefield debre to throw up impassable terrain)
2x3 Biovors
1-2 Exo
1-2 Mawlocs
venos/zoeys accordingly,
maybe tervigons/gants for troops, or warriors for synap
basically take full advantage of shelling the tar out of them and use your mawlocs to bust whatever you cant reach, then march up and slap them around.


another idea is the skysheild pad with agies line, (adding ammo dump to agies line for rerolling all 1s to hit) then go tervigons/veno for extra cover and 4+invul on tervigon spawning..maybe biovores?

bascially im trying to get creative with the strong hold assault books. That or running a bunch of fex/tranofex/exo or haus at the enemy. big bugs are awesome! sad i cant use all my gants like i use to with my 3 tervigon spam. (now to figure out how to convert a glued tervigon into a magnetized trannofex)

 stormoffires wrote:
(now to figure out how to convert a glued tervigon into a magnetized trannofex)

Be sure to anaesthetise him first...

 Loyalwatcher wrote:

1. Gargoyles - they have a Blind attack. Since a unit has to take an Initiative test every time it is hit by a Blind attack... essentially anything they charge is going to be WS/BS1. This seems good.

I was thinking of trying to incorporate this in some way. I was planning on having a small unit of Gargoyles running (flapping?) up a flank, hopefully in my Flyrant's Synapse Turn 2. My opponent will likely ignore them in the face of the other threats that'll be slogging it up the board (and if they don't, that's fine too!) and with luck I'll be able to charge, blind and my opponent will have a WS/BS1 unit. Maybe my Gargoyles will even survive for a turn if my opponent is hitting on 5s...

Hive Guard are bs3. Wait what?!

Well, 3 zoans it is.

Personally, I love running swarm lists. I played my friend's Nids occasionally when I wanted a break from my Tau. Over the holidays, I traded him and now I have my own Nids to run. Unfortunately, I'm still waiting on my codex to arrive so I can start working on lists. However, this is my first idea based on what others have posted and some point values I know.

HQ:
Tervigon w/ Miasma (x2)

Troops:
Max Horm squad w/ poison (x2)
Max Term squad w/ fists (maybe borers. w/e kind the tervigons spawn) (x2)
Max Gargoyle squad w/ poison (x2)

Elites:
Venomthrope (x3) or Zoanthropes (x3) depending on if I want synapse or shrouded

This would be my base. I would probably add either 2 harpies, carnifexes, or 2 trygons depending on what I felt like.

Question:

Is this correct?

Step 1 - Mawloc arrives from reserves on turn 2 with deep strike.
Step 2 - Mawloc deep strikes onto the enemy unit and does a large blast template.
Step 3 - Mawloc can not be placed and does the template again.
Step 4 - Mawloc can not be placed and so rolls on the mishap table.
Step 5 - Mawloc rolls the go back to on going reserves thing.
Step 6 - Mawloc deep strikes again the following turn 3.

Repeat steps 2 through 5

So... the Mawloc has the potential to cause 8 x Str 6 AP2, ignores cover large blasts (between turns 2-5) without actually ever being on the table?

 Freytag93 wrote:
Personally, I love running swarm lists. I played my friend's Nids occasionally when I wanted a break from my Tau. Over the holidays, I traded him and now I have my own Nids to run. Unfortunately, I'm still waiting on my codex to arrive so I can start working on lists. However, this is my first idea based on what others have posted and some point values I know.

HQ:
Tervigon w/ Miasma (x2)

Troops:
Max Horm squad w/ poison (x2)
Max Term squad w/ fists (maybe borers. w/e kind the tervigons spawn) (x2)
Max Gargoyle squad w/ poison (x2)

Elites:
Venomthrope (x3) or Zoanthropes (x3) depending on if I want synapse or shrouded

This would be my base. I would probably add either 2 harpies, carnifexes, or 2 trygons depending on what I felt like.

Only one miasma cannon can be taken per army.

bodazoka wrote:
Question:

Is this correct?

Step 1 - Mawloc arrives from reserves on turn 2 with deep strike.
Step 2 - Mawloc deep strikes onto the enemy unit and does a large blast template.
Step 3 - Mawloc can not be placed and does the template again.
Step 4 - Mawloc can not be placed and so rolls on the mishap table.
Step 5 - Mawloc rolls the go back to on going reserves thing.
Step 6 - Mawloc deep strikes again the following turn 3.

Repeat steps 2 through 5

So... the Mawloc has the potential to cause 8 x Str 6 AP2, ignores cover large blasts (between turns 2-5) without actually ever being on the table?

If it survives it can go into ongoing reserves, There was dispute however as to where ongoing reserves comes in from. Not sure if it has ever been resolved as too if you must enter from your board edge or is allowed to enter via deepstirke again.

Hi I'm completely new to the game and new to Tyranids. I've been following this thread closely but I'm still confused as to what a good build will be in this codex. Since it is sooo expensive to make an army I don't want to be buying and painting units that I don't use. Can anyone give me some feed back on this list and If I'm over looking something?


HQ
- Flyrant + TLD
- Flyrant + TLD

Troops
- 30 x Termagants
- 1 x Tervigon + Regen. + Miasma Cannon
- 10x Hormagaunts
- 10x Hormagaunts

Elites
- 3x Zoanthroes
- 2 x Venomthropes

Heavy Support
- 4 x Biovores
- 1 x Exocrine
- 1 x TrygonPrime + Regen. + Reaper of Obliterax
- 1 X Tyrannofex + Regen. + Adrenal Glands

Whats the point value on this list? If its over 2000 you can run double force org. If nomt its not legal as you have too many heavy support options. Also 3 is the max number of biovores on a brood.

Personally when I look over the new codex, looking at everything we lost and everything that was adjusted in some attempt to make up for it... overall the codex simply has not worstened OR improved. It's simply changed the old status quo into something more.... expansive.

It seems that the whole purpose was to try and push people to use more than just Tervigon Gaunt swarms with the same elites in Hive guard and Zoanthropes/doom.

When I look at what was lost I see a few primary things in a few categories...

Models, we lost a great GREAT deal of good models... Doom, Parasite, Ymgarl, and Pods... these MADE many tyranid armies, like the utter backbone. Now yes they did reduce SOME point values to make up for it... and the new models are cool, but none are as great as Doom or pods.

Abilities, Tyrant has no more "stable" Armor 2, scything talons lost their ability, unecessary change to the Old Adversary, lost psychic powers, Tervigon had its abilities destroyed in buffing and killing gaunts, Leaper lost some of its special abilities, and we were NOT given an ability to allow us to deploy and assault or run/assault in the same turn.

Cost, Swarm lord, Prime, and Tervigon, especially last two, saw a NEEDLESS point increase, as well as a minor point increase in Hive Guard, genestealers and gargoyles which again was not necessary

But with that came a lot of gains, in the way of Heavy unit point decreases, 3 new models which are all decent, I mean heck they even made an attempt to give us some more bulk by giving Bio and Pyro vores +1 atk, wound, and initiative. Hive guard are now great, autopassing any LOS rolls, so as long as its not instant kill they're just pure extra wounds on your tyrant or swarm lord at least, not adding what they could do if they can force their way into Melee.

I do think that the downsides for each unit make many individual units in the codex worse than they were, even with some point decreases (I still don't like what ground tyrant's look like anymore). But overall it all evens out as a whole with regards to synergy and what you can and can't or want to use anymore. Also I do have one massive pet peve with it as all of this has been put in some ways before... Instinctive behavior is GARBADGE as it is right now. We now absolutely require under every circumstance minus a few fearless units to have synapse which generally forces us into taking up several slots with synapse creatures we may not want to take. Without any access to new survivabilty in this game of AP3 and AP2 weapons, templates, and blast markers, tyranids are still sadly going to come up fairly short in comparison to what they could manage to get.

 Leth wrote:
I think people are missing the point I am making with the tunnel. You are not taking the trygon FOR the tunnel, as multiple people have said you are going to take or not even if it didnt have the rule. However now it does not force you to make choices at deployment, it allows for a OPTION during the course of a game. You don't plan around it but are aware of the possibility. For example you roll for reserves and 1-2 units dont come in but your trygon does. Now you can strategically place your trygon taking advantage of this information. However if you dont get to use it, it doesnt matter you are still getting your worth out of the trygon.

Right.

Look at the trygon hole as a side benefit, but don't revolve your strategy around it. The trygon is still a pretty good buy for his price and a beast that requires immediate attention from your opponent. That's what you are mainly paying for when you get the trygon. The hole just gives you some flexibility but it shouldn't be relied on completely. Instead, you can rely on the trygon to wreck face if your opponent doesn't spend the resources to deal with him.

 LValx wrote:
IF only Nids could break the FOC like Tau...

I could see 3x Flyrant, 4x Crone being quite good at 1850.

Yeah, the more flyrants in the army, the better they are.

At least you can run double-FOC at 2K, assuming, of course, that your opponent doesn't mind.

 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, how about 3x 3 Carnifexes protected by shrouding walking through the centre?

That's a scary build if you can surround them with the right supporting units. Not very balanced, but a lot of people will have problems with it.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
Well, how about 3x 3 Carnifexes protected by shrouding walking through the centre?

9 Carnies with 3+/5++ saves? Sounds nasty. Screen them with gaunts, and they get 3+/3++

Unless you play against tau :/

Gants may not be tall enough to give them 25% cover, especially if the opponent is on higher ground or have taller models. Moreover, they are kind of slow. Roll a 1" on your run and they become a bottleneck for your carnifexes.

Either run gargoyles instead, or don't run a screening unit.

 Matt1785 wrote:
I am really looking at that 3x3 Carnifex build to be honest. The only problem is that I'd be in trouble running the Venomthropes to get them the cover buff. I'd not want to use up my entire elite slot with 3x2 Venoms.

I have to finish putting together an army list but I think a swarm of Hormas and 9 fexes are going to be a starting point for me... should be fun.

Here's a simple solution.

Get a bastion. Place it 8" ahead of your deployment zone. Hide your venomthrope behind it and on your Turn 1, move to within 2" of it and embark.

Now you've added about 12" of range to your shrouded bubble....and you only need 1 venomthrope for this to work!

Moreover, take 1 zoanthrope and give it Dominion. Then on your turn, move and run him to hide behind the bastion for some synapse relief.

 ductvader wrote:

Spoiler:

HQ
-Prime
-Prime

TROOP
-24 Hormagaunts
-24 Hormagaunts
-25 Hormagaunts

ELITE
-1 Venomthrope
-1 Venomthrope
-1 Venomthrope

HEAVY
-3 Carnifexes
-3 Carnifexes
-3 Carnifexes

1850

Break it down from there?

Naked hormagants really aren't that great. As a wound soaker for your primes, I'd recommend 30 termagants instead. I'd also recommend breaking down 1 unit of hormagants into 2 or 3 units of 10 termagants. Finally, consider the bastion for your army and perhaps 1 or 2 zoans to spread the coverage of synapse.

rigeld2 wrote:
I'm looking at

Prime x2
Dakkafex x3
Dakkafex x3
Tervigon
Spinegants x30
Venomthrope x2 (2 units)

As points allow:
Tyrannofex(es)
Haruspex(es)

I recommend some zoanthropes, not just for synapse, but for a chance at catalyst. Your 2 deathstars could use FNP. Also, you need to think about how you can deal with flyers.

 sandant wrote:
So this may be a situational one but can't our squishy fliers get that sweet sweet venomthrope shroud? I mead it would be hard to hit that 6 inch mark but it would help their survivability greatly.

Yes they can.

 Loyalwatcher wrote:
Hmm.

Just reading through my shiny new Codex. Which I like, by the way.

1. Gargoyles - they have a Blind attack. Since a unit has to take an Initiative test every time it is hit by a Blind attack... essentially anything they charge is going to be WS/BS1. This seems good.
2. When you charge with a Harpy, the enemy are at -5 Initiative.
3. Ergo, most of things that get charged by a Harpy and some Gargoyles, are probably going to die...

Hmm.

They won't really die. Harpies and gargoyles aren't really meant to be close-combat units. Instead you can use them to tarpit units for your more deadly assault units to come in to finish the job.

 The Shadow wrote:

 Loyalwatcher wrote:

1. Gargoyles - they have a Blind attack. Since a unit has to take an Initiative test every time it is hit by a Blind attack... essentially anything they charge is going to be WS/BS1. This seems good.

I was thinking of trying to incorporate this in some way. I was planning on having a small unit of Gargoyles running (flapping?) up a flank, hopefully in my Flyrant's Synapse Turn 2. My opponent will likely ignore them in the face of the other threats that'll be slogging it up the board (and if they don't, that's fine too!) and with luck I'll be able to charge, blind and my opponent will have a WS/BS1 unit. Maybe my Gargoyles will even survive for a turn if my opponent is hitting on 5s...

If you're concerned about synapse, you could always string them along with the trailing gargoyles staying in range of your backfield synapse creatures.

 Freytag93 wrote:
Personally, I love running swarm lists. I played my friend's Nids occasionally when I wanted a break from my Tau. Over the holidays, I traded him and now I have my own Nids to run. Unfortunately, I'm still waiting on my codex to arrive so I can start working on lists. However, this is my first idea based on what others have posted and some point values I know.

HQ:
Tervigon w/ Miasma (x2)

Troops:
Max Horm squad w/ poison (x2)
Max Term squad w/ fists (maybe borers. w/e kind the tervigons spawn) (x2)
Max Gargoyle squad w/ poison (x2)

Elites:
Venomthrope (x3) or Zoanthropes (x3) depending on if I want synapse or shrouded

This would be my base. I would probably add either 2 harpies, carnifexes, or 2 trygons depending on what I felt like.

A pure horde list isn't a viable one because it can't take on vehicles. You need to have something there that can take out vehicles, either through shooting or assault. Don't rely on just 3 zoanthropes to do the job because they won't.