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luke1705 wrote:

 Sinful Hero wrote:
Sorry to keep stirring the pot, but Is the spudded Dimachaeron the best TAC choice? It enters play with no board impact other than forcing your opponent to deal with it. On the other hand a spudded Devilfex immediately impacts the board(12 S6 shots), and also forces your opponent to deal with it. It just seems to me to be more about making an assault TMC work than using the best TAC choices.

Forcing your opponent to deal with it is not an insubstantial consequence for your opponent. What many people (Tyranid players included) don't always remember is just how good our Flyrants are. Every bullet taken away from them is a huge win, especially because although they fly and are relatively tough, it doesn't take that many wounds to put them down. A 3+ is only a 3+, and sometimes you only get 4+ jink. Tyrants don't have as many wounds as we wish, but they can single-handedly deal with the vast majority of units in the game.

I think you and Sinful agree 100% on this. He is concerned that for however many turns the pod is in reserves, all of the shooting gets directed at the flyrants. It actually increases the fire they take rather than decreasing it.

luke1705 wrote:
Furthermore, the Dimachaerons are especially scary because they are pretty durable. They may very well be able to toe into cover when they come in, giving a 4++, more or less, because most things that ignore cover aren't also AP 3. Even then, getting through 6 T6 wounds in a single turn (12 if there are 2 of them) is no small task for most armies. And if they can't kill them, let me tell you - the do WORK. No other unit in the Tyranid army (and I would suggest most in the game) hit as hard as the Dimachaeron when it gets there. Previously, the argument had always been, "well yeah it wrecks face when it gets there but it'll never get there!" Now that argument is gone and we're left with a very good unit that won't mishap when it scatters, leaving a lot of room for scatter error (and more risky scatter placement). That's not to say that a Dakkafex in a pod isn't a good idea as well - for 50 points less, one could say that you're getting a bargain. You lose most of the potency in assault in exchange for a durable gun platform. The two units do completely different things and could even be used in tandem with each other to good effect. I think they're both good options - I just like building my list around the Dimachaeron and covering up for his weaknesses more. But that's a playstyle preference, not a tactical one

The armies that can't deal with it drop podding in, also probably can't deal with it walking across the board. The problem is, those armies aren't usually a challenge for us. The armies we struggle with (Tau, Eldar) can drop an MC on the turn it drop pods in without much problem. It really comes down to your play style, and the sort of missions you are doing. If you play in an aggressive fashion, you want that Dimacharon walking across the board, and you are hoping for a turn 2 charge. If you play more passively, keeping him off the board is a godsend, and being able to choose where he lands is a powerful bonus. But if you are an aggressive player you can still appreciate the dakkafex coming via drop pod, because he contributes immediately.

Before you all go gaga over drop podding consider the Trygon Prime. The Trygon Prime is just as tough as the Dimacharon. He is pretty good in assault. He deepstrikes without mishapping, and he shoots 12 S5 AP5 shots. Plus he is Synapse. All that for 45 points less than a Dima in a Pod or 5 points more than a Dakkafex in a pod, and he is overpriced and nobody takes him. So when you theory craft a pod list, ask yourself, how is my pod and contents better than a Trygon Prime? What Targets is it going to deal with that a Trygon Prime won't?

Tag,

You're 100% right about the fire being directed at the Tyrants while the pods are in reserves. However, you're looking at 1 turn at best (and in my list with Comms relay, 2 at worst - barring some spectacularly bad luck). The reason why I prefer this is because you can mitigate a lot of firepower directed at the tyrants if you need to. Most alpha strikes don't have the range to do what they need to if you deploy second since you can deploy kitty-corner and use your mobility to simply not care in subsequent turns. Also, there are a decent amount of armies with a very limited alpha strike turn 1 (hey there Necrons). You can take advantage of that, as well as the alternate deployment options (long ways and vanguard strike, anyone?) to maximize your mobility advantage, as well as your early game weaknesses. The downside is you are essentially conceding some early - game maelstrom points if you go too far down this particular rabbit hole

To address what the pod brings, in the strictest competitive sense, I don't know that it will make or break tournament lists. However, something that you cannot discount when comparing it to a Trygon prime is that the pod itself matters. Not just the shooting (which with those blasts is pretty ridiculous, as it negates much of the low BS of the pod). But it can move, score objectives, contest non-objective: secured objectives, and generally be a huge nuisance. Does losing objective: secured balance out by giving you tactical deployment options as well as actually being able to move once you land? Eh, I think I would have just preferred objective: secured, but I'll take it. Maybe it's just the Maleceptor, but I think most players are probably overreacting in a positive way because of how intensely disappointing that last kit was. And because it makes a lot of units much more fieldable, at least casually to semi-competitively.

The other difference between the Trygon and the Dimachaeron has been pretty hashed out - it's so much better in close combat. It's like sending Dante up against Abaddon - you'd think it should be close, but it's not. The Dakkafex has much better shooting and a higher strength in close combat, good vs Eldar wraith constructs and the tanks that a Trygon fails to handle due to the nerfs to smash. I'm not saying that I wouldn't take a Trygon generally (although I personally would do Raveners because I like the model more) - just that I think what it does can be done better by other, more specialized units. It does a number of things sort of well, but I prefer to have units with a more clear-cut role that they are very good at and cover up for their weaknesses with synergy, force-multiplication, and other units that excel at their weaknesses (at least that's the plan. Sometimes I just make a list that looks like fun to play)

 BlaxicanX wrote:

 jy2 wrote:

 BlaxicanX wrote:
jy2, do you know off-hand where the rules are for needing a model on the board at the end of each round?

Sure.

p. 133 - Sudden Death Victory

"If at the end of any game turn, one player has no models on the battlefield his opponent automatically wins."

Awesome, thank you.

By "game turn"do they basically mean rounds? i.e. If I kill all my opponents models at the top of turn 5, he still has all of his turn at the bottom of turn 5 to get models on the board?

Yes, that is correct. 1 Game turn = 2 Player turns. The person going 2nd still has a chance to get his reserves in if the player going 1st wipes out all of Player 2's units on the table.

luke1705 wrote:
Tag,

Spoiler:

You're 100% right about the fire being directed at the Tyrants while the pods are in reserves. However, you're looking at 1 turn at best (and in my list with Comms relay, 2 at worst - barring some spectacularly bad luck). The reason why I prefer this is because you can mitigate a lot of firepower directed at the tyrants if you need to. Most alpha strikes don't have the range to do what they need to if you deploy second since you can deploy kitty-corner and use your mobility to simply not care in subsequent turns. Also, there are a decent amount of armies with a very limited alpha strike turn 1 (hey there Necrons). You can take advantage of that, as well as the alternate deployment options (long ways and vanguard strike, anyone?) to maximize your mobility advantage, as well as your early game weaknesses. The downside is you are essentially conceding some early - game maelstrom points if you go too far down this particular rabbit hole

To address what the pod brings, in the strictest competitive sense, I don't know that it will make or break tournament lists. However, something that you cannot discount when comparing it to a Trygon prime is that the pod itself matters. Not just the shooting (which with those blasts is pretty ridiculous, as it negates much of the low BS of the pod). But it can move, score objectives, contest non-objective: secured objectives, and generally be a huge nuisance. Does losing objective: secured balance out by giving you tactical deployment options as well as actually being able to move once you land? Eh, I think I would have just preferred objective: secured, but I'll take it. Maybe it's just the Maleceptor, but I think most players are probably overreacting in a positive way because of how intensely disappointing that last kit was. And because it makes a lot of units much more fieldable, at least casually to semi-competitively.

The other difference between the Trygon and the Dimachaeron has been pretty hashed out - it's so much better in close combat. It's like sending Dante up against Abaddon - you'd think it should be close, but it's not. The Dakkafex has much better shooting and a higher strength in close combat, good vs Eldar wraith constructs and the tanks that a Trygon fails to handle due to the nerfs to smash. I'm not saying that I wouldn't take a Trygon generally (although I personally would do Raveners because I like the model more) - just that I think what it does can be done better by other, more specialized units. It does a number of things sort of well, but I prefer to have units with a more clear-cut role that they are very good at and cover up for their weaknesses with synergy, force-multiplication, and other units that excel at their weaknesses (at least that's the plan. Sometimes I just make a list that looks like fun to play)

I agree completely. I am not sold a fan of the Dimacharon, because its contributions are so one-dimensional, and there is no point in rehashing my concerns about it, but it is definitely better in close combat than a Trygon, especially against things like Wraith Knights.

Interesting list-building tidbit:

We now have enough points to take a Harridan with Skyblight at 1850

Primary CAD:

Flyrant w/Devs, EGrubs - 240

Mucolid - 15
Mucolid - 15

Harridan - 735

Skyblight:

Flyrant w/Devs - 230

Harpy w/TL HVC - 140
Harpy w/TL HVC - 140
Hive Crone - 155
10 Gargoyles - 60
10 Gargoyles - 60
10 Gargoyles - 60

1850 on the nose. How about that. Minimum CAD for the win

luke1705 wrote:
Interesting list-building tidbit:

We now have enough points to take a Harridan with Skyblight at 1850

Primary CAD:

Flyrant w/Devs, EGrubs - 240

Mucolid - 15
Mucolid - 15

1850 on the nose. How about that. Minimum CAD for the win

It's crazy that Mucolid is troop. I must spend at least 110 points on troops to take one more CAD for SM. For Tyranids, it's only 30. This 30 points mean two S8 AP3 big blast. How can GW do this to us?

Anyway, you can take eight Flyrants with eight Mucolids in 2000pts game now.

Taitang wrote:

luke1705 wrote:
Interesting list-building tidbit:

We now have enough points to take a Harridan with Skyblight at 1850

Primary CAD:

Flyrant w/Devs, EGrubs - 240

Mucolid - 15
Mucolid - 15

1850 on the nose. How about that. Minimum CAD for the win

It's crazy that Mucolid is troop. I must spend at least 110 points on troops to take one more CAD for SM. For Tyranids, it's only 30. This 30 points mean two S8 AP3 big blast. How can GW do this to us?

Anyway, you can take eight Flyrants with eight Mucolids in 2000pts game now.

I'll bet in the same way that Tourney's are ruling against the 10 point DE HQ, they will rule against the 30 Point Tyranid Troop.

tag8833 wrote:

Taitang wrote:

luke1705 wrote:
Interesting list-building tidbit:

We now have enough points to take a Harridan with Skyblight at 1850

Primary CAD:

Flyrant w/Devs, EGrubs - 240

Mucolid - 15
Mucolid - 15

1850 on the nose. How about that. Minimum CAD for the win

It's crazy that Mucolid is troop. I must spend at least 110 points on troops to take one more CAD for SM. For Tyranids, it's only 30. This 30 points mean two S8 AP3 big blast. How can GW do this to us?

Anyway, you can take eight Flyrants with eight Mucolids in 2000pts game now.

I'll bet in the same way that Tourney's are ruling against the 10 point DE HQ, they will rule against the 30 Point Tyranid Troop.

That's a debatable rules dispute which is obviously not intended, and even if it was legally may not actually work, and makes sense to be ruled out. If they rule against the spore its just prejudice

tag8833 wrote:

Taitang wrote:

luke1705 wrote:
Interesting list-building tidbit:

We now have enough points to take a Harridan with Skyblight at 1850

Primary CAD:

Flyrant w/Devs, EGrubs - 240

Mucolid - 15
Mucolid - 15

1850 on the nose. How about that. Minimum CAD for the win

It's crazy that Mucolid is troop. I must spend at least 110 points on troops to take one more CAD for SM. For Tyranids, it's only 30. This 30 points mean two S8 AP3 big blast. How can GW do this to us?

Anyway, you can take eight Flyrants with eight Mucolids in 2000pts game now.

I'll bet in the same way that Tourney's are ruling against the 10 point DE HQ, they will rule against the 30 Point Tyranid Troop.

If they did that why not ban Wave Serpants too? Or Riptides?
Or any of the other stuff that is considered brokenly good.

 dan2026 wrote:

tag8833 wrote:

Taitang wrote:

luke1705 wrote:
Interesting list-building tidbit:

We now have enough points to take a Harridan with Skyblight at 1850

Primary CAD:

Flyrant w/Devs, EGrubs - 240

Mucolid - 15
Mucolid - 15

1850 on the nose. How about that. Minimum CAD for the win

It's crazy that Mucolid is troop. I must spend at least 110 points on troops to take one more CAD for SM. For Tyranids, it's only 30. This 30 points mean two S8 AP3 big blast. How can GW do this to us?

Anyway, you can take eight Flyrants with eight Mucolids in 2000pts game now.

I'll bet in the same way that Tourney's are ruling against the 10 point DE HQ, they will rule against the 30 Point Tyranid Troop.

If they did that why not ban Wave Serpants too? Or Riptides?
Or any of the other stuff that is considered brokenly good.

Considering Mucolids can't score, and move 3" a turn, I doubt gimping yourself on Objective Secured or scoring units could be considered broken. It's more of a big trade off.

luke1705 wrote:
As for the spore mines, it's well-documented that Biovores often miss when they're not in LAN. What's less-documented is that if you want to create more spore blockades (with somewhat reasonable placement), you don't really need this new thing either. Just take Biovores with LAN. Whenever you miss, great. If you hit, re-roll it (you are twin-linked, after all) so that you have another chance to miss. Or, you could adapt your tactics and just hit stuff if you want

Not that it really matters (because who wants to reroll hits?) but you can't do the underlined.


Unless you meant if you roll an arrow but still hit a unit... meh. Still worth pointing out.

 Sinful Hero wrote:
Considering Mucolids can't score, and move 3" a turn, I doubt gimping yourself on Objective Secured or scoring units could be considered broken. It's more of a big trade off.

It allows you to get to 7 Flyrants pretty easy in unlimited CAD.

HQ: Winged Dakka'rant, ES Grubs 240
HQ: Winged Dakka'rant, ES Grubs 240

Elite: Zoey Brood: x2 100
Elite: Veno Brood: x2 90 (both split)

Troops: Termagants, x20 5 w/ devourers 100
Troops: Termagants, x20 5 w/ devourers 100
Troops: Hormagaunts, x15 75
Troops: Warrior Brood, x3, x2 Deathspitters, Venom Cannon 110

Heavy: Dakkafex 150
Heavy: Mawloc 140

Dima w/ Tyranocytes 275

Total cost: 1620

Formation: Living Artillery: 400

Warrior Brood: x3, X2 Deathspitters, Venom Cannon 110
Biovore Brood, x3 120
Exocrene 170

Comes out to 2020, the people I play with allow a 1% rule so instead of 2000, it is 2020....

comments, concerns, suggestions? main armies I play against are Space Wolves and Orks

rigeld2 wrote:

luke1705 wrote:
As for the spore mines, it's well-documented that Biovores often miss when they're not in LAN. What's less-documented is that if you want to create more spore blockades (with somewhat reasonable placement), you don't really need this new thing either. Just take Biovores with LAN. Whenever you miss, great. If you hit, re-roll it (you are twin-linked, after all) so that you have another chance to miss. Or, you could adapt your tactics and just hit stuff if you want

Not that it really matters (because who wants to reroll hits?) but you can't do the underlined.

Spoiler:

Twin-linked Blast Weapons
If the scatter dice does not roll a hit, you can choose to re-roll the dice with a Twin-linked Blast weapon. If you choose to do so, you must re-roll both the 2D6 and the scatter dice.

Unless you meant if you roll an arrow but still hit a unit... meh. Still worth pointing out.

I thought the same thing until I read the Living Artillery Node rules:

“Organic Bombardment: All ranged weapons fired by models in this Formation have the Pinning special rule. In addition, models in this Formation that are within 12" of this Formation’s Tyranid Warrior Brood can re-roll the scatter dice when firing weapons with the Blast or Barrage special rule"

And to clarify, the reason why you might do this is if you don't have any good/viable targets for the Biovores, or to roadblock units from advancing/running away. It's not going to do that much all the time, but it is often better than plinking a blast on AV 10 or T6

So that's better than Twin-Linked then (I didn't have the LAN rules and was going by what you said)

Well, I suppose I am eating crow now. I didn't think they would actually make a spore pod model. That being said...think they might update the codex pdf with these new unit rules?

Ok, first try at making a list with this.

HQ
1 Hive Tyrant
1 Wings
2 Devourers
1 E-Grubs

1 Hive Tyrant
1 Wings
2 Devourers
1 E-Grubs

Elites
1 Malanthrope

Troops
3 Ripper Swarms
3 Deepstrike

3 Ripper Swarms
3 Deepstrike

Fast Attack
1 Dimachaeron

1 Dimachaeron

Heavy Support
4 Tyrannocite
4 Barbed Strangler

1 Carnifex
2 Devourers

1 Carnifex
2 Devourers

Fortification
1 Bastion
1 Comms-Relay

Quick anecdote here -

Our local gaming group meets on Mondays for casual games. Last night my opponent (who was running sentinels of terra) let me make a last minute change to my list to include a Tyrannocyte. I dropped enough models to make up the points, and just happened to be using Swarmlord in the list so he got the ride.

Thanks to his reserves roll bonus the pod showed up on turn 2, along with a Trygon Prime in his backfield. While he was busy shooting at my shrouded raveners (thank you Malanthrope) and my two yo-yo Lictors (G2G in a ruin for 2+ cover, move synapse closer to pop them back up and assault with them) the Swarmlord was left to do what he does best.

By the end of the game I had killed everything in his army except for Lysander and 3 Assault terminators. They didn't arrive until turn 3 and he placed them far away from my melee-focused MC's.

My overall impression was that this is going to be a HUGE boon to tyranid players, as another tool to re-vamp our lists that focus on Melee. We used an old Epicast Spore as the proxy for the T-cyte, which was about the same size but blocked line of sight. The T-cyte will not, as it sits up on some tendrils. Aside from that i think it was a pretty fair play experience to see what happens when Swarmlord plonks down right in front of a scout unit, a techmarine and servitors, and a devastator team.

Edit to include the army lists (approximate). We played 1500 points.

Tyranids:

HQ: Swarmlord
>Tyrannocyte
Troop - 3 warriors, 2 Deathspitters, 1 LW/BS
Troop - 16 Hormagaunts
Troop - 15 Termagants
Elite - Malanthrope
Elite - 2 Lictors
Fast Attack - 4 Raveners, Rending Claws x4
Fast Attack - 4 Raveners, Rending Claws x4
Heavy - Trygon Prime, Acid Blood, Toxin Sacs
Heavy - Carnifex - 2x TL Devourers w/ BL Worms

Sentinels of Terra:

HQ arnath Lysander
Troop - 7(?)x Sniper Scouts, 1x Heavy Bolter
Troop - 10 x Tactical marines, Plasma Cannon, Grav Gun, Rhino
Elite - Dreadnought - MultiMelta, Powerfist, Storm Bolter
Elite - Dreadnought - MultiMelta, Powerfist, Storm Bolter
Elite - 5x Assault Terminators - TH/SS x5
Heavy - Devastator Squad - 4x Lascannons, 5x Bolters
Heavy - Devastator Squad - 4x Missile Launchers, 5x Bolters
Techmarine w/ Conversion Beamer, 2x Servitors, heavy bolter


I'm not 100% sure on everything in my opponent's list, but that's what i remember seeing on the table from last night.

 tetrisphreak wrote:
Quick anecdote here -

Our local gaming group meets on Mondays for casual games. Last night my opponent (who was running sentinels of terra) let me make a last minute change to my list to include a Tyrannocyte. I dropped enough models to make up the points, and just happened to be using Swarmlord in the list so he got the ride.

Spoiler:

Thanks to his reserves roll bonus the pod showed up on turn 2, along with a Trygon Prime in his backfield. While he was busy shooting at my shrouded raveners (thank you Malanthrope) and my two yo-yo Lictors (G2G in a ruin for 2+ cover, move synapse closer to pop them back up and assault with them) the Swarmlord was left to do what he does best.

By the end of the game I had killed everything in his army except for Lysander and 3 Assault terminators. They didn't arrive until turn 3 and he placed them far away from my melee-focused MC's.

My overall impression was that this is going to be a HUGE boon to tyranid players, as another tool to re-vamp our lists that focus on Melee. We used an old Epicast Spore as the proxy for the T-cyte, which was about the same size but blocked line of sight. The T-cyte will not, as it sits up on some tendrils. Aside from that i think it was a pretty fair play experience to see what happens when Swarmlord plonks down right in front of a scout unit, a techmarine and servitors, and a devastator team.

If Swarmy could take his entourage along with him it would work even better.

Here is a tactic I'd like to discuss.

Is there possibly any merit in putting 19 DevilGaunts with a LW+BS Prime in a pod to go Wraithknight hunting?

Pod drops down you unload 60 str 4 shots into a unit near the Wraithknight or problem unit, next turn you assualt the Wraithknight. Thats a big tar pit for it to get through, it can single out your Prime and it will eventually roll a 6 to wound it.

Eldercaveman wrote:
Here is a tactic I'd like to discuss.

Is there possibly any merit in putting 19 DevilGaunts with a LW+BS Prime in a pod to go Wraithknight hunting?

Pod drops down you unload 60 str 4 shots into a unit near the Wraithknight or problem unit, next turn you assualt the Wraithknight. Thats a big tar pit for it to get through, it can single out your Prime and it will eventually roll a 6 to wound it.

Warriors and Warrior Primes are Very Bulky, so you'd have to drop the devilgaunts to 17 in order to make capacity.

Also I'd give the prime 2 CC weapons rather than his stock devourer - the extra attack with his bonesword is far more valuable in-game than 3 s4 ap- shots, especially when you're already getting 51 from the termagants, and an additional 15 s5 shots from the pod. Otherwise i say go for it. The Wraithknight is not a character, so he can't challenge out the Prime and will waste his attacks stomping little bugs. Then all the T. Prime has to do is roll fairly decent to instant-kill the wraithknight.

That requires an opponent who lets you drop a pod with the cargo and then wait his 12" moving WK in assault range.

I think the idea will be to present multiple threats to the enemy at once. Perhaps a second spore with a Dimachaeron or even a Toxicrene nearby so whichever way the wraithknight goes, he's going to have to face melee retribution in some fashion.

In your opinion, what is the best 1000 point list to take against Grey Knights?

 tetrisphreak wrote:
I think the idea will be to present multiple threats to the enemy at once. Perhaps a second spore with a Dimachaeron or even a Toxicrene nearby so whichever way the wraithknight goes, he's going to have to face melee retribution in some fashion.

It's still at the loss of a Flyrant slot for a gamble on things going right. Id take the Flyrant over that any day.

As tyranid players, what do you most fear from Space Marine armies?

Dedicated anti-air? (stalkers, stormtalons, icarus emplacements)?

MSU's in rhinos or razorbacks?

drop-pod sternguard?

From the other side - the new tyrannocyte has me really excited to play nids again!

Verviedi wrote:
In your opinion, what is the best 1000 point list to take against Grey Knights?

Just off the top of my head:

Hive Tyrant - wings, 2x devourers, e. shock grubs
3x rippers, deep strike
3x rippers, deep strike
23 termagants
1 malanthrope
Exocrine
Exocrine
Carnifex with 2x Devourers

-997 points

Focus all your AP 2 shooting at terminators or dreadknights, everything else pours into power armour. Devourers and exocrines can handle the rhinos or razorbacks you might see. Ignore a storm raven and kill the threatening units first. "Closest weapon, best target" ideology.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Iechine wrote:

 tetrisphreak wrote:
I think the idea will be to present multiple threats to the enemy at once. Perhaps a second spore with a Dimachaeron or even a Toxicrene nearby so whichever way the wraithknight goes, he's going to have to face melee retribution in some fashion.

It's still at the loss of a Flyrant slot for a gamble on things going right. Id take the Flyrant over that any day.

Oh i agree that it's a tradeoff for sure. Personally however I love the fact that multiple list options are soon opening up, instead of absolutely 100% needing double flyrant in every list.

A quick discussion of the Tyrannocite upgrades.

At BS 2, 5 deathspitters are going to hit something within 18" 5 times on average. That isn't much dakka. For 25 points we can put blasts on the thing, which would seem to be very worth it. But which blast?

Barbed Strangler is a far better choice when taken with warriors. Large Blast + Pinning is a killer combinations. Great range. However, it works well because the warriors are able to pick their target. Without being able to pick a target those 5 large blast could end up being much dice rolling for little results. The Venom Cannon is S6 AP4 small blast. Not near as good when you can pick your target but better if you can't, because S6 is capable of wounding most things, and glancing most armor.

I do not think that ends the discussion, however. Despite the automated fire of the pod, sometimes we can still pick our target. Dropping in the right place, taking the right cargo, etc, etc. Therefore I'm thinking that the following upgrades make sense.
Barbed Strangler for the following:
Dakkafex
Exocrine
Hive Guard
Dakka Tyrant (should have just make it a flyrant)

These things are all capable of coming in and popping a vehicle to create a viable target for the Barbed stranglers even if one does not exist prior to drop. Also, they have long enough range that the drop can take place closer to viable targets.

Venom Cannon for everything else. That way, you can come in right next to a Riptide or Wraith Knight, and still have your shots be possibly meaningful. Furthermore, if you are bringing in something like a Dimacharon, the pod may be able to pop vehicles and reveal potential targets for a charge. If you are bringing in something like Pyrovores, you are already stacked with templates, and because the Pyrovores must be close to whatever they are shooting at, it may be difficult to target survivors with a large blast.

Am I missing anything?

 tetrisphreak wrote:

Verviedi wrote:
In your opinion, what is the best 1000 point list to take against Grey Knights?

Just off the top of my head:

Hive Tyrant - wings, 2x devourers, e. shock grubs
3x rippers, deep strike
3x rippers, deep strike
23 termagants
1 malanthrope
Exocrine
Exocrine
Carnifex with 2x Devourers

-997 points

Focus all your AP 2 shooting at terminators or dreadknights, everything else pours into power armour. Devourers and exocrines can handle the rhinos or razorbacks you might see. Ignore a storm raven and kill the threatening units first. "Closest weapon, best target" ideology.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Iechine wrote:

 tetrisphreak wrote:
I think the idea will be to present multiple threats to the enemy at once. Perhaps a second spore with a Dimachaeron or even a Toxicrene nearby so whichever way the wraithknight goes, he's going to have to face melee retribution in some fashion.

It's still at the loss of a Flyrant slot for a gamble on things going right. Id take the Flyrant over that any day.

Oh i agree that it's a tradeoff for sure. Personally however I love the fact that multiple list options are soon opening up, instead of absolutely 100% needing double flyrant in every list.

How do I deal with LRs?

 tetrisphreak wrote:

Eldercaveman wrote:
Here is a tactic I'd like to discuss.

Is there possibly any merit in putting 19 DevilGaunts with a LW+BS Prime in a pod to go Wraithknight hunting?

Pod drops down you unload 60 str 4 shots into a unit near the Wraithknight or problem unit, next turn you assualt the Wraithknight. Thats a big tar pit for it to get through, it can single out your Prime and it will eventually roll a 6 to wound it.

Warriors and Warrior Primes are Very Bulky, so you'd have to drop the devilgaunts to 17 in order to make capacity.

Also I'd give the prime 2 CC weapons rather than his stock devourer - the extra attack with his bonesword is far more valuable in-game than 3 s4 ap- shots, especially when you're already getting 51 from the termagants, and an additional 15 s5 shots from the pod. Otherwise i say go for it. The Wraithknight is not a character, so he can't challenge out the Prime and will waste his attacks stomping little bugs. Then all the T. Prime has to do is roll fairly decent to instant-kill the wraithknight.

Yeah so other than those other little details it seems pretty legit, I have massive problems dealing with Wraithknights and I'm already going to be getting a Dima in a pod and I think I'll run a second pod with that unit in it. Even in a TAC list it will have its uses when coming up against other armies.

Also to the comment about a Wraithknight moving away, it's not as easy to get away from that unit as it will just deep strike as close as possible, disembark 6" and then the wraith only has one turn to move 12" away before the unit moves 6" and charges 2d6.