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So me and my friends have noticed that orks have been getting stomped, at least at the places we play. So we have been playing them with the iron hands chapter tactic, also we let the weird boy use pyromancy. It seems to give the old codex a boost, well enough of one where they arnt getting tabled as much. Now does any agree this is a good idea? Or do you think we are messing with something that doesn't need it?

It's rumored that orkses are gona get 6+ fnp so u're probably just applying the rules that are gona be here anywayz It's not 100% ofc.
Orks are doing good with wagonspam and bikernobz. Slow hordes and walkers just don't work not cause of orks are old an weak but cause of a current ruleset and easy access to tons of s6-7 and ignore cover.
So, please tell from your experience, is that 6+ fnp really doing anything meaningful? And what lists do you play?

Yeah, I really don't believe it's very easy to say that the Ork codex in its entirety is unable to hack it in 6th right now; Kanwall is as bad as ever, sadly (at least if we're restricting the conversation to the basic Codex-- bring in FW Dreadmob and it's a whole different story), and footslogging Orks are largely lacking serious punch as well as not being necessarily as point-efficient as, say, a bunch of zombies might be.

But the book as a whole has just too many avenues to play on for everything in there to be totally bunk. Massed Trukks, Wagon Spam, Bikernobs, these are solid cores from which to build an army; throw down some nice support options from Lootas to Jets to Big Guns and you do have a force that can find ways to compete! Allies helps quite a lot as well, of course (I prefer Necrons), the sort dependent upon the general "strategic goals" and makeup of your army.

Orks in transports can be so cheap, and cen get across the board so quickly, that your opponent likely will just not have enough firepower to handle all the pressure. Plenty of Taudar armies still won't have a whole lot with which to respond when you plonk down five battlewagons and gun them in their face. I won the last tournament I played using twin bikernob units and necron wraiths (with attendant bikerbosses and destroyer lord), supported by dakkajets and nightscythes above.

Anyway, that's a pretty minor change, and the orks do need a little bit of help at the end of the day; sounds perfectly fine for you to play that way. I'm pretty sure that they'll need to do a lot more than that to help the myriad units in the book who really are bad right now, in fact. Just so long as your ork players are enjoying themselves and no one else is complaining, that's what matters.

I'm running a biker warboss with five biker nobs, bigmek with shoota boys in a battle wagon, lootas, tank bustas in a battlewagon, a group of walking boys and grots(for objectives and general mucking about). the 6+ only saves 5-10 boys a game, but the its will not die lets my battlewagons live that one extra turn

6+ fnp sounds like not really great but helpful! Espetially when you can't use cover cause here it's a plain 16.67% survivability increase. While in 5+ cover it's 11.11% - still some boyz live another day to fight back! Often i find every single ork needed to do the job. Though, not very useful for bikernobz. They got 5+ from a painboy anywayz.

When the 5th Tyranids book came out, the Venomthrope was basically a copy of the Ork Kustom Force Field.

Now in the 6th Edition Tyranid book, the Venomthrope no longer grants 5+ cover, but it grants Shrouded. I'm very curious if GW is going to reverse the trend, and this time have the KFF copy the rule for the Venomthrope. The other alternative I see is the KFF granting an Invulnerable instead of a Cover save to give us some protection against all that "Ignores Cover" weaponry.

Orks need the following IMO to be fine.
Trukks need to hold 15 boys.
Ork boyz units should be able to take 1 "oddboy" unit of either a painboy (for FNP), a mek (shrouded from unit only KFF), or a "yella" which is an ork "preacher" and carries a waaaghh banner.
Lootas should be able to use a "beamy deffgun" which is similar to a lascannon and twin linked.

Honestly Kans need to be AV12 to the front to be useful, dreads 13 AV, cheaper boyz, cheaper biker nobs (SM bikers beat the tar out of us in every category) improved ways to do CC as well. Trukks would be great if they were less useless in my mind and make flash gitz better all over and make them troops.

6th Edition introduced SO many problems for Orks. I don't know how you manage to FIX Orks in 6th Edition without just going back to 5th!

- Our army has no armor. Nerfing cover nerfed our entire army's ability to weather shooting attacks. It's the only protection we have, and it was made 1/3 less viable.
- Casualties from the front hurt our ability to get into combat.
- Vehicle explosions kill way too many Orks. Even though we're T4, we can't afford to lose half our numbers in a transport explosion. On top of this, with 6th Vehicle rules, all our Vehicles are open-topped, which means they're much more likely to explode than anything else.
- Challenges work against the Orks favor in all cases. Because of this our Nobz can never get their Power Klaw attacks in, which was a major source of our infantry killing power.
- Vehicle movement changes make using the Deffrolla nearly impossible now.

I don't know how you fix that stuff. You can fix our horrible anti-flier ability by fixing our horribly over-priced aircraft with underpowered weapons. You can make our stuff cheaper to bring it in line with codex creep. But unless you do something radical like give 'Eavy Armor to all Orks, we're still going to crumple like newspaper to shooting, and we're still going to have a really hard time getting bodies across the table.

I'm really worried for our next codex. I just don't have faith GW cares about this stuff.

Yeah that about sums it up.

I mean look at our bikers, they cost more than the space marine ones!

FNP on a 6+. Just what everyone needs...more dice rolling.

 Dakkamite wrote:
Yeah that about sums it up.

I mean look at our bikers, they cost more than the space marine ones!

Well tbf our bikerz have a 4+ cover, Better weapons to start and 2 wounds.
But they still need a price drop majorly. Tankbustas need 4+ armor

2 wounds

Talking about warbikers, not Nob Bikers.

Cover is majorly overcosted now with the widespread ignore covers of markerlights, torrent, and allied psykers. Anything with AP4 and ignores cover targets our bikes and they die real fast - and in a game with massive range and wide open boards theres very little in the way of whatever AP4 ignores cover your opponent has being able to do just that.

Given the increase in weapons that ignore cover I would propose that the KFF instead gives off a 5+ invuln. save against shooting instead of a 5+ cover save similar to that of the Dark Angel's Power Field Generator. This way we have some solid basis for both our vehicles and infantry against the dakka-heavy meta in 6th ed. that doesn't involve relying on cover.

One thing I could see is having boyz drop down to 5 points w/choppa+slugga and paying 1 point to get a shoota. Or in the case where they don't do this they could also up the stats of the choppa to give something good like +1S AP6, thereby making them less reliant on the charge.

There should some sort of overhaul concerning Ork mobz or maybe just the WAAAGH! rule in general where we can (once per game I'm guessing) have our units take away casualties from the back rather than the front to show how overeager Orks simply trample over their fallen comrades to make up the dead ones in front. Or some variant of the mob up rule so that we can get ladz that flee from the fight back in the game from guys in reserve that roll in. Similarly, in challenges there should be an option to see if an Ork Boy gets uppity and takes the challenge away from the Nob, or some challenge buff dependent on how many Orks there are in the unit that makes the Nob able to not just get smooshed by a MC.

But in general I think we need to see more variety in weapon loadouts choices for our units. Moar choppy weapons! Moar types of dakka! I want to see burnas being able to be taken in boyz mobz, some sort of power-weapon equivalent on Nobz or at least give variants of a Big Choppa (like an 'Uge Hamma, or a Chain-Choppa). Maybe even throw the Ramshackle invuln. save rule from Forgeworld in for vehicles if we're going to keep the KFF providing cover via shrouded like the Venomthrope.

It'd also be nice to get some additional HQ choices like a Painboss or some form of an Ork Warlord (kinda like an orky equivalent to a Chapter Master) to represent the really big guys on par with Ghazghkull (Overfiend of Octarius, Arch-Arsonist of Charadon etc.)

Ork chaptur masta! Can throw garbage from the orbit!

Orbital Garbagement:
d3 s10 ap- Ordnance, Barrage, Orbital, Garbage!
Garbage! - distructtion range of garbage equals it's size! Roll 2d6 to see the radius of each 'explosion'.

Theres already a solid Orky bombardment rule in one the apocalypse books. 2d6 blast radius would be pretty nasty though

@Grimskul

5+ invuln sounds OP as hell... and it pains me to think that maybe its actually fine in the context of what other armies get these days. I'd expect to see a ton of Ork allies pop up in response though, since it affects everyone regardless of FoC

For the WAAAGH rather than making the rules weird and exceptional like that, I'd suggest just allowing run + assault in that one turn.

I won't be surprised if we see Orks become WS3 S4, given the changes to the basic Eldar statline in their major reboot. Cost wise, even making them cheaper wouldn't cut it - they're only good in trukks or wagons and the points saved there are minimal, on foot who cares if you pay 1pt less for something thats slow, squishy and choppy in edition dakka?

There are some nasty things Orks can do.

Nob bikers with a warboss on a bike is always scary! Also, scoring.
give them a painboy for a FNP as well

Lootas, lots of lootas.

Burna boyz in a battlewagon, due to open topped it's basically one flame template from anywhere on the wagon, multiplied by the number of burnas.

zzap guns and kannons etc are cheap and really good for shootin'

multiple Dakka jets. Wierboyz are good for comboing with these as they could get an extra WAAAAGH! which is the most use you can get out of a waaagh imo. To fuel the dakkajets firepower.

I think that the most popular units (shoota boys, warboss, biker nobs, meganobs, lootas, battlewagons, dakkajets, deffkoptas and lobbas) are basically fine as is. You can still make a competitive ork list without changing anything. All we need is a few tweaks to bring our less effective units up to scratch.

Many ork units (notably slugga/choppa boys) could be fixed with a few simple buffs; make Waaagh! worth using (run and assault maybe), make stikkbombs decent (at least offering a chance to strike simultaneously) and give choppas a slight advantage. A point or two reduction in the price of bikers, burna boys, tankbustas, kommandos and stormboys should make all of them pretty good.

That leaves us with only a few units really in need of a fix:

Weirdboys just need to have better powers. Easiest fix would be to make them normal psykers and let them buy biomancy, pyromancy and telekinesis powers.

Trukks can't really be made better by dropping their points, because their main downside is that they give easy first blood. Changing ramshackle to a re-roll on the damage table might help, as would giving them a smoke cloud rule like bikes.

Looted wagons need to be a dedicated transport or get a significant improvement in armour. Nobody is going to use a HS slot for a glorified rhino.

Deffdreads suffer from the default issues of assault walkers in 6th edition. A price drop or some extra protection would make them fine.

Killa kans and buggies both suffer from only having two hull points. Easy solution is a small price drop and maybe letting them take bigger units. Alternatively, give buggies smoke clouds like bikes.

Zzapp guns are really too weak; 15 points for a BS 2/3 plasma gun doesn't really cut it. Haywire or armourbane to make them effective anti-tank would be nice.

I think we're gona ge good with a general point-drop and 6+ fnp for all orky stuff. I'd like to see 1-2 pts grots with a special rule like in...3-d where they allowed orkses to 'run over grots' ignoring difterrain. That's strange and unusual rules but very orky.
If you overbuff mellee or walkers, it's not good also. Cause editions change. Orkses have a great codex atm! Just think of it, what could crons do back in 5-th when they were 3 ed? Nothing at all. And orkses are still pretty viable even though we've got a codex from 2007 iirc. And this old codex has the best assault transport ever! Battlewagon with 20 capacity and 14 front armor for like 100 pts. It's not hated like wave serpents just cause of other stuff being overpriced and underpowered compared to stuff other codexes have.
So i think that our dex just needs some overhaul like everyone else got. Lil point decrease, some new units and some general armywide buff. And we're better than ever. Though, i'm afraid we'll have to deal with something like tyranids faced.

Given the Semi-fungal nature of the Ork physique, a 6+ FnP makes perfect sense. Certainly from a fluff point of view at least.

I can't find the page or passage, but I remember reading a section of the Ork Codex that said Orks are innately Psychic.
So from a Fluff perspective, I think all Orks getting +1 to Deny the Witch Rolls makes sense.
whether it's due to their low-level psychic nature, or their simplicity of mind lol ... after all, how can you Mind-F*ck a mind that is already f*cked

Like that idea of +1 DTW, especially since we have zero psychic defense whatsoever which means psyker heavy lists just maledict at will - making for super crappy games in my experience

 Dakkamite wrote:

2 wounds

Talking about warbikers, not Nob Bikers.

When I look at my 4th edition codex it shows warbikers having 2 wounds. If this was FAQ'd out fine. But that's what mine shows.

They absolutely, 100% do not have two wounds man.

Deffkoptas have two wounds. Nob Bikers have two wounds. Basic warbikers have one wound.

I'd like to see something like:

-Ork boyz [stats like they're now] - 5 pts
WAAAGH!, Furious Charge, Mob Rule, 6+ fnp
Slugga and Choppa
An Ork Boy may replace Slugga and Choppa with Shoota for 1pts
An Ork Boy may take 'eavy Armour for 3 pts

So that boyz get this lil fancy 6+ fnp, shootas cost 6 pts like they used to be, sluggas cost 5pts and you can combine shootaboyz with sluggaboyz and some of them may have 'eavy Armour. This will open opportunities to combining squads and 'eavy armour boyz will see some use. Just imagine how many different possibilities are here! Wagonboyz, 15 shootaboyz, 4 'ard Boyz with sluggas and choppas - so now you can endure kaboomed wagonz better and be slightly more threatening in mellee with more attacks and armored boyz! Or just 'eavy Armour on shootaboyz as they footslog forward for the front rows to endure some more small gun'z fire. Or move them in the back of the mob so that regular boyz will be downed with heavy bolters and autocannons while 'ard boyz will be the ones who make it there and start wrecking faces. At least, that's an alternative to omnipresent KFF and a few 'ard Boyz will be a must in every truck mob or wagon mob.


-Grots [stats like they're now] - 2pts

They really need to be cheaper. And probably some nice rule to make them helpful on the frontline. Maybe runthreads should get Stubborn to make a grot mob decent tarpitters and not just backfield point-holders coming from reserve.


-WAAAAAGH! Once per game an ork player may call WAAAAAGH! For the turn's duration models with this special rule may shoot or attempt an assault after they run. But for every roll of 1 for determining a run move or charge distance - a squad suffers 1 wound.

Don't know about fleet, though.


I hope this is what's gona happen with our new dex. At least it seems logical and not too overpowered. A tiny buff to boyz, WAAAAGH back to it's 5 ed glory with some shooty overhaul, cheaper grots.

Edit: Btw, i've got an interesting idea, why not make "barebonez" ork boyz.
4pts - Ork Boy with a Choppa.
May buy a Slugga for 1 pts
May exchange Choppa and Slugga(if he has one) for a shoota for 2pts.

Thus we have: Choppaboyz - 4 pts, Sluggaboyz - 5 pts, Shootaboyz - 6 pts.

I don't really see the point of one CCW Ork boyz, except purely as ablative wounds at the front of the unit - seems like wasted potential

Really want to see Choppaz have some special rule, shred or something. I know they won't get that and will just get the incredibly useful AP6 but a guy can dream

Blaktoofs Orky wish listing for next codex.

HQ

Wargear- A shooty weapon option to go on Mega Armor. Something like the kustom blasta X nazdreg had in a past codex. Or options to have their gun "kitted out" with more blasta, dakka, shooty.

-An idol of Gork, and an Idol of mork. Gives some benefits to ork units within x distance. Gork= Rampage on the charge, Mork = Hit and run. Mork is kunnin.

Deff Klaw- Power Klaw with armorbane

Generic Painboss- Can buy Cybork bodies for any unit thats non vehicle +5 pts per model IC status and gives FNP to unit joined.

Weirdboy- Option to have a battlewagon but loses IC status battlewagon must take weirdboy tower upgrade, cannot transport any boys, cannot take turret weapon upgrades. Weirdboy tower grants better psyker attacks from weirdboy.

Elites-

Tankbustas- tankhammers are ap 1 in addition to current effects.

Kommandos- Can take burnas.

Troops- No limit on Ard boyz squads

Madboyz return as troop, have some d6 ork table of ork fun/killy/bad stuff. Get to reroll chart if weirdboy is in unit

Fast Attack- Other than new kits for buggys/trakks its ok to me

Heavy Support-

Flash Gitz- points reduction to 22 points per model. More Shooty- 3 points per Model, More Dakka-3 points per model, More Blasta- 4 points per model. May buy a looted wagon as a transport option, looted wagon may not take a turret gun.

Snazzgun before upgrades becomes Str 5 Ap d6 salvo 2/3

Add gunwagon squads. 1-3 gunwagons, they carry a gun in front, either big shoota, skorcha, or rokkit and a gun in back- zapp, lobba, kannon, or flakk gunz.

Add flakk gunz option to battlewagons. Same stats as FW flakk guns.

Looted wagons. 1-3. option to buy Supa Rokkit Launcha

Suppa Rokkit Launcha- Loses transport capacity may fire d3+1 Supa Rokkits per turn. Suppa Rokkits are Str8 ap3 blast.

Army wide changes-

Waaggh- Once per game, lasts until the start of the orks next turn. All orks falling back automatically rally, any orks gtg or pinned automatically get up and may act normally this turn. All orks with the "Waaggh" special rule gain the fleet USR. Any orks in assault during a Waaghh that would be removed before their intiative step may still strike their blows in the phase they are removed before being removed from play. All orks with the "Waaggh" special rule may double the number of shots they fire with any ranged weapons they may use.

Choppa- Str- as user, Shred

A good ol' wishlist thread? Here's my 2 teef:

Army Wide Rules:

Battle Brothers: Dred Mob, Freebooters (use Codex: Orks, but mandatory Kaptin HQ and Flash Gits as Troops)

Footsloggin: Mobs that do not have a dedicated transport have the Fleet special rule.
Tuff: 6+ FnP, 5+ on a WAAAGH!, Mobs with a Painboy let's these be rerollable.
WAAAGH!: Once a turn, at the beginning of the movement phase, after psykic powers have been used, the Ork player may call a WAAAGH! (he gains .5 of a victory point if the player actually calls a "WAAAGH!" at the table). All models in the army receive +1 Attacks and gain +3 to their move and assault distance, this cannot exceed a 12" charge. If a unit, other than Big Gunz, Lootas, Flash Gits, or Non-Walker Vehicles, do not move or assault this turn that unit deals D6 hits amongst themselves as their majority strength and resolved on their majority toughness.
Ramshackle: All Ork vehicles have an odd way of functioning that the Imperium has yet to understand. All Ork vehicles have a 6+ invulnerable save because sometimes, through will alone, a Trukk manages to not fall apart.

HQ:

Painboss - Exactly the same as the FW one but gives Nobz good stuff instead of Cybork Slashas.
Ghazghkull - Can bring Grotsnik without taking up an HQ slot, like a 2 man squad.
Grotsnik - Rage replaces the current "get to cc super fast" rule
Wazdakka - Cybork Body, Dakka Cannons become Twin Linked, which ever unit he joins can turbo and shoot at the risk of Gets Hot!
Zogwort - 4+ FnP
Warboss - Base points reduced but can take upgrades to increase his stats in order to make him more specialized other than "MAB, Biker Boss, or normal".
Big Mek - Does not get SnP from wearing Mega Armour, also can take Mega Armour and a KFF. A Big Mek can be upgraded to a Kustom Meka-Dread for +150pts, same rules as FW but KFF is +50pts. If the Kustom Meka-Dread is destroyed, the Big Mek dies.
Weirdboy - New psyker tables; one for Gork (offense), one for Mork (Tactiks), and one that is a buffed version of the current version (possible SAG shot, 'Ere We Go auto assaults like the SAG mishap)
Kaptin Badrukk - Baseline of a Warboss but keeps the rest of his current rules, bring Flash Gits as Troops.

Possibly also a few more named HQs, such as Nazdreg, Tuska, and Kaptin Bluddflagg.

Elites:

Nobz - More melee weapon choices, naturally equipped 'Eavy Armour, Bikes are +20 instead of +25. 10 Nobz may use a Rok as a dedicated transport.
MANz - Can take a Painboss without taking up an HQ slot. 5 MANz may use a Rok as a dedicated transport.
Burna Boyz - New special rule "Burning for You!" A burna boy can use his template over friendly burna boyz of the same mob, allocate wounds as normal, roll a D6. On the role of a 1, the boy who got burned has his gas tank rupture, dealing S4 hits on any models, whether friend or foe, within D6" range (this kills the Burna that blew up). On the role of a 6, nothing bad happens. Burna Boyz may use a Trukk, Battlewagon, or Rok as a dedicated transport.
Tankbustas - Rokkits, Bomb Squigs, and Tankhammas are AP2. They can take a Trukk or Battlewagon as a dedicated transport.
Lootas - Meks can take a "Beemy Deffgun" for free. Beemy Deffgun's profile is as follows: 48" STR8 AP2 HeavyD3 Get's Hot!. All Meks may take Mega Armour for +40. Lootas can take a Looted Wagon as a dedicated transport.
Kommandos - Allowed to assault from reserves. Stealth when in cover. With Snikrot, the Kommandos get +1 to strength to represent their experience on the battlefield. Snikrot is now I6 when assaulting from cover and Mork's Teeth have the Shred special rule.

Troops:

Boyz - Nobz have more melee upgrade options, including an option to replace his Slugga or Shoota with a Burna. Sluggas are 5pts and Shootas are 6pts each. Boyz may use a Trukk or Rok as a dedicated transport.
Grots - 2pts each and do not receive any FnP bonuses, if a Grots get's shot and fails a cover save it will die. A Runtherd can be upgraded to a Big Slaver for +30pts. A Big Slaver gains the statline of a Nob can manage a mob of 30 Grots on his own. A Big Slaver confers the Fearless special rule to his mob. Now with nothing else to do with it's time, the Squig Hound counts as CCW for the Big Slaver. "It's a Grot's Life" special rule reworked: Any mob within 12" of the Grot Mob can execute D6+2 Grots to auto-pass any morale or leadership test, killing a Grot always help a Boy feel better about himself.

Dedicated Transports:

Trukk - Any Trukk can take "Krumpin' Time!" for +10pts. "Krumpin' Time" let's any Trukk that would normally roll on the Ramshackle table to always Kareen! towards the nearest enemy unit. The enemy unit must be within 12" of the Trukk's front armour (within the front arch). After the Trukk has reached it's target, apply the Kaboom! result.
Rok : An Orky Drop Pod for 35pts, armour 10 10 10. If scattered on top of an enemy, confers a STR 4 AP 6 Large Blast. After the damage is resolved the unit moves out of the way and rolls a morale check as if Tank Shocked (no Death or Glory). A Rok's carrying capacity is 10 models or 1 Deff Dread, models wearing Mega Armour count as 2. Once deployed, the Rok cannot be embarked but Ork models can move through it as if they had the Move Through Cover special rule. If exploded, the Rok deals STR D6 wounds to all models within D6". The Rok is equiped with warp energy that shoots any non-Daemon, non-CSM units with the following profile at BS2: Range 12", Str 4, AP 6, Assault 4.

Fast Attack:

Stormboyz - Now 10pts each. Gain the Exhaust Cloud special rule for the remainder of any turn that they move more than 12" on the movement phase, this cannot be used after Deep Striking. Zagstruk is now STR5 and is equiped with a Big Choppa.
Warbuggies - Now 25pts each
Warbikers - Now 20pts each
Deffkoptas - Now 30pts each
Dakkajet - Price increased to 120pts. Can take a fourth TL-Supa Shoota. TL-SS is now Str 7.
Burna-Bommer - Price reduced to 120pts. Skorcha-Missiles reduced in price by 5 and the Bommer can now take 10 Missiles.
Blitza-Bommer - Price reduced to 120pts. Bombz are now STR8 AP2 Large Blast that scatters D6. When rolling 2D6 for mishaps: on the role of a 10+, the Bomb is now a STR10 AP1 Small Blast and the Grots 2 Big Shootas get some shots off and become TL; on the role of a 4 or less the Bommer crashes into it's target as a STR10 AP1 Large Blast that scatters D6 in the direction that it was flying.
Killa Kans - Cost increased to 40pts each. Moved from Heavy Support. Mobs increase in size 1-5. Big Shootas and Rokkits are Twin Linked. Kans move D6 +4 inches. One Killa Kan may use a Rok as a dedicated transport.

Heavy Support:

Battlewagon - Price increased to 100pts, armour 14 12 12. Big Gunz, are manned by Grots so they are fired at BS3.
Deff Dread - Can now be taken in mobs of 1-3. Big Shootas and Rokkits are Twin Linked. One Deff Dread may use a Rok as a dedicated transport.
Mega Dread - Same as Forgeworld but no Supa-Skorchas.
Big Trakk - Same as Forgeworld but now armour 12 12 10 no Supa-Skorcha, Big Zzappa, or Big Lobba.
Flash Gits - Price reduced to 15pts per model, Mob size increased to 5-15. If Kaptin Badrukk is not chosen as an HQ he may still be allowed to lead a Mob of Flash Gits. Flash Gits may take a Looted Wagon as a dedicated transport.
Big Gunz - Zzap Guns are not +5 instead of +10 per gun.
Looted Wagon - Cost increased to 50pts, armour 12 12 10.Transport capacity increased to 15. Boomgun is now +50pts.

 Dakkamite wrote:
I don't really see the point of one CCW Ork boyz, except purely as ablative wounds at the front of the unit - seems like wasted potential

Really want to see Choppaz have some special rule, shred or something. I know they won't get that and will just get the incredibly useful AP6 but a guy can dream

The potential is more cheaper bodies to be removed as casualties. The point is to give an opportunity. If you find it useful - go for it. If not - just get a slugga or shoota u're not loosing anything. I'd just like to see different unit composition possibilities.

 Grimskul wrote:
Given the increase in weapons that ignore cover I would propose that the KFF instead gives off a 5+ invuln. save against shooting instead of a 5+ cover save similar to that of the Dark Angel's Power Field Generator. This way we have some solid basis for both our vehicles and infantry against the dakka-heavy meta in 6th ed. that doesn't involve relying on cover.

One thing I could see is having boyz drop down to 5 points w/choppa+slugga and paying 1 point to get a shoota. Or in the case where they don't do this they could also up the stats of the choppa to give something good like +1S AP6, thereby making them less reliant on the charge.

There should some sort of overhaul concerning Ork mobz or maybe just the WAAAGH! rule in general where we can (once per game I'm guessing) have our units take away casualties from the back rather than the front to show how overeager Orks simply trample over their fallen comrades to make up the dead ones in front. Or some variant of the mob up rule so that we can get ladz that flee from the fight back in the game from guys in reserve that roll in. Similarly, in challenges there should be an option to see if an Ork Boy gets uppity and takes the challenge away from the Nob, or some challenge buff dependent on how many Orks there are in the unit that makes the Nob able to not just get smooshed by a MC.

But in general I think we need to see more variety in weapon loadouts choices for our units. Moar choppy weapons! Moar types of dakka! I want to see burnas being able to be taken in boyz mobz, some sort of power-weapon equivalent on Nobz or at least give variants of a Big Choppa (like an 'Uge Hamma, or a Chain-Choppa). Maybe even throw the Ramshackle invuln. save rule from Forgeworld in for vehicles if we're going to keep the KFF providing cover via shrouded like the Venomthrope.

It'd also be nice to get some additional HQ choices like a Painboss or some form of an Ork Warlord (kinda like an orky equivalent to a Chapter Master) to represent the really big guys on par with Ghazghkull (Overfiend of Octarius, Arch-Arsonist of Charadon etc.)

These are some of the better ideas I've seen. I dunno about WAAAGH! allowing 5th edition wound allocation. That's just too complicated with 6th now. I think WAAAGH! would best be used to either:

- Run and Shoot, or Run and Assault
- Orks get to Overwatch the unit they're Assaulting... BEFORE the enemy gets to Overwatch them!
- If Ork Boyz are granted FNP 6+, WAAGH! improves this to 4+ FNP for one turn.

You are very right though, Ork weapons need redone.

KillKannon - need I say more. This weapon needs to cost half of what it does, and for god's sake remove Ordinance. Who needs Ordianance on a S7 weapon?
Boomgun - Probably OK as it is as long as it comes down in cost a tad. I'd like to have it available on more units than the Looted Wagon.
SupaKannon - introduce this weapon from Forgeworld
Kustom Mega Blasta - This gun is just useless in the hands of a BS2 Ork with no armor save. They need to be made a cheaper upgrade (most KMB are +15 points, this should be +10 at most) and making them twin-linked would be nice. Even if KMB were 5 points, not many people would take them. You're just never going to hit with the things, and it isn't a weapon that we can spam.
Zzap Gun - Just needs serious re-tooling like the KMB. Also the same argument about paying too many points for a weapon that never hits as the KMB.
Grotzookas - I'd like to see these come out to 24 or 36" range. In the world of 6th Edition and 12" assaults, an 18 inch blast weapon just doesn't cut it anymore.
The bombs and missile loadouts for our jets need redone. We don't need more S5 AP4 weapons. For the amount of points we pay for those missiles, you'd think they should be 60" range S6 AP3. But no. They're 24" S5 AP4. For Mork's sake our biggest bomb is only S7? Give us some kind of huge Ork Bunker-Busting S9 bomb!

Shootas, Big Shootas, Rokkits, Deffguns, Snazzguns are probably OK. Rokkits I think could be cheaper. Other armies pay 10 points for a missile that is fired at BS4 and goes 48". We pay 10 points for a missile that only goes 24" and is fired by a BS2 model in most cases. Snazzguns have cost problems, but some of their cost problems are tied up in the cost problems of Flash Gitz.

Not going to get into melee weapons too much, I agree that Choppas need a rule, and we could use a "Power Choppa" type weapon to be somewhere in between strength of the Big Choppa and the Power Klaw.

 Iiswin wrote:


Lootas - Meks can take a "Beemy Deffgun" for free. Beemy Deffgun's profile is as follows: 48" STR8 AP2 HeavyD3 Get's Hot!. All Meks may take Mega Armour for +40. Lootas can take a Looted Wagon as a dedicated transport.
Kommandos - Allowed to assault from reserves. Stealth when in cover. With Snikrot, the Kommandos get +1 to strength to represent their experience on the battlefield. Snikrot is now I6 when assaulting from cover and Mork's Teeth have the Shred special rule.

please, give me those 2!! make kommandos worth taking cause the idea behind them has alot of potential.
And make the meks in the lootasquads worth it with the anti armor beemy deffgun.