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While currently a no-no, some units simply need this option to be functional. I propse allowing it with some restrictions.

1) Roll 2d3, rather than 2d6, for charge distance. This means that if you want to risk it, you have to get in close.
2) You do not gain the +1 attack for charging.

This is somewhat mitigated by the next point:

3) Due to the surprise nature of the sudden attack, you strike at Initiative if assaulting a unit in cover.

That last bit I might pull away, since it might unbalance things, but I at least wante dit 'on paper' as a discussable feature.

Thus, you lose a benefit of assault (the +1 attack) but you aren't left just standing around and tapping your toes, either. If you deep strike in close, thus risking a mishap, you may be rewarded by landing close enough to get stuck in. A mishap, however, will be fairly common since dropping in so close risks not having room to arrive.

Balanced? Too powerful? Any thoughts at all?

I don't like it being possible, but if it becomes possible, treating it as a disordered charge and difficult terrain seems the easiest way in the rules. Similar could be done with an assault from a transport.

But overall, the big problem is you have a number of armies out there able to execute first turn deep strikes with reduced chance of mishap. If they can assault off the bat then pretty much any shooting based army is negated turn 1.

I woudn't mind drop pod armies being able to stay int her pods for a turn before disembarking (and assaulting as they are open topped) though. A little more protection from the pod to survive a bit better for the next turn assault.

2d3 is not very reliable so this mechanics will be used mostly by those who can ensure deepstrikes.
Just look at stormboyz with Zaggy. They can charge from deepstrike without loosing attacks or such things (but they emidiately suffer d3 casualties if they try to assault). Even with 2d6 charge noone uses them competitively cause they're super unreliable and you don't want to waste 150-300 pts for a ~50% chance of mishap and not getting in combat at all.
Thus said, if they work - they're great. But they're hard to deepstrike cause of numbers. It's easier to operate with fewer models thus if termies could assault from deepstrike - they'd be used more frequently.

I'd make the squad forgo shooting, too. After all, 10 surprise Grey Hunters dropping in from the blue on Turn 1, firing 16 Bolt shots and 4 Plasma shots, before getting 20 S4 WS4 attachs that you can do nothing to stop is a bit much.

Technically it would be impossible to fire 16 bolter shots and 4 plasma shots. It would actually be 10 bolter shots most likely (Plasma guns aren't assault)

Grey Hunters can take plasma pistols, but only two of them.

It would certainly do Flayed Ones a few favours, and if anything needs it, it's them.

One possibility would be to allow deep striking squads to assault on the turn they arrive, but allow all overwatch fire against them to be at full BS.

I would be ok with it if units doing it had to test for difficult terrain and counted as a disordered charge plus were disallowed from shooting first.

Also only allow units in vehicles (including drop pods) to disembark and charge if they are in an assault vehicle.

 rohansoldier wrote:
I would be ok with it if units doing it had to test for difficult terrain and counted as a disordered charge plus were disallowed from shooting first.

Also only allow units in vehicles (including drop pods) to disembark and charge if they are in an assault vehicle.

Drop Pods are open-topped and thus Assault Vehicles.

I didn't plan on vehicles, if only because I faced Blood Angels back in the bad days.

And, yeah, the proposal should get an errata now.

"If the Deep Striking unit did not fire in the shooting phase, it may assault..." as originally proposed.

So, you can drop in and fire, or you can drop in and shortassault, but you can't do both.

disordered charge and can't shoot ought to be enough. If overwatch was ever updated to have any downside whatsoever (ie you can't shoot in the following turn or something) then a 3rd disadvantage for deep strike assaults could be made a case for.

This concept seems ok when coming at it from a full scatter deepstrike. However, considering the existence of reduced scatter units it becomes impossible to balance in my opinion. To make it useful for full scatterers it will be over the top for reduced scatterers.

For example, this would give my chaos termies a chance to assault albeit a very risky tactic and a reason to take them other than suicide combi. On the other hand, the thought several squads of BA dropping in with decent of angels, each getting a near guaranteed 1st turn charges on a unit of their choosing seems kinda busted.

Except...how are those BA descent of angel-ing in on turn 1?

I like the reduced distance, forgoing shooting and disordered penalties. I could see a case being made, even in the 6th Ed mindset.

It would mean I could swarm daemonettes off an icon right next to targets and jump on them, which could get bloody but suits the images of daemon incursions that are in my head.

Sounds like fun for St Celestine and her Serpahim bodyguards

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Grey Hunters can take plasma pistols, but only two of them.

It would certainly do Flayed Ones a few favours, and if anything needs it, it's them.

If you want Flayed Ones to be better then just use IA12, they received a bit of a boost.

 BrotherOfBone wrote:

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Grey Hunters can take plasma pistols, but only two of them.

It would certainly do Flayed Ones a few favours, and if anything needs it, it's them.

If you want Flayed Ones to be better then just use IA12, they received a bit of a boost.

Not really. A minor one, I guess. I used the IA12 ones in my last game, they got blenderized. Admittedly it was a bad match-up since it was against Ovion's Penitent Order list. ^^;

 Slaanesh-Devotee wrote:
I like the reduced distance, forgoing shooting and disordered penalties. I could see a case being made, even in the 6th Ed mindset.

I like this as well. Obviously only certain units would have this as a special rule, as well as assault vehicles (aka Drop pods, Raiders and Venoms).

niv-mizzet wrote:
Except...how are those BA descent of angel-ing in on turn 1?

Ah, sorry, of course no reserves on turn 1 but I don't think it changes much whether such a thing happens on turn 1 or turn 2.

Did they get rid of Drop Pod Assault for Space Marines? How about 60 Grey Hunters drop podding into your army on Turn 1? You better believe I can get 12 Drop Pods in an Army. 3 for Wolf Guard, 3 for Long Fangs and 6 for Grey Hunters. Half of the Drop Pods come in one Turn 1.

60 Grey Hunters to the face on Turn 1.

krazyCarl wrote:
Did they get rid of Drop Pod Assault for Space Marines? How about 60 Grey Hunters drop podding into your army on Turn 1? You better believe I can get 12 Drop Pods in an Army. 3 for Wolf Guard, 3 for Long Fangs and 6 for Grey Hunters. Half of the Drop Pods come in one Turn 1.

60 Grey Hunters to the face on Turn 1.

1115 points for the Grey Hunters and their pods alone, without upgrades. So yeah, have fun with that.

I wouldn't mind assault from deep strike, as long as its only one or two units per codex, like vanguard vets (Warp Talons should). But if any unit could charge after deep strike then it would just be insane

So would my BA vanguard vets get a discount if every man and his dog got their rule for free?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Don't get me wrong - I like the idea.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 rohansoldier wrote:
I would be ok with it if units doing it had to test for difficult terrain and counted as a disordered charge plus were disallowed from shooting first.

Also only allow units in vehicles (including drop pods) to disembark and charge if they are in an assault vehicle.

Drop Pods are open-topped and thus Assault Vehicles.

I believe it's the deep striking that prevents assaults, not the vehicle. Unless your codex has a rule that says otherwise

 MechaBeast wrote:

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 rohansoldier wrote:
I would be ok with it if units doing it had to test for difficult terrain and counted as a disordered charge plus were disallowed from shooting first.

Also only allow units in vehicles (including drop pods) to disembark and charge if they are in an assault vehicle.

Drop Pods are open-topped and thus Assault Vehicles.

I believe it's the deep striking that prevents assaults, not the vehicle. Unless your codex has a rule that says otherwise

And this thread is about...?

Yes please.

Tactical Belial and Knight insertion would make me a VERY happy man.

How about instead of assaulting after deep strike you get to deep strike into cc. Place your template over the target and roll to scatter. If you hit you get hammer of wrath and no other attacks (think of the dawn of war II trailer "strike from the sky brothers!"). Then the target gets their normal attacks at their initiative step, and you're locked in combat for the next turn.
If you scatter you can't assault, or even shoot or run, and the target unit gets to overwatch you, maybe at normal bs.
And a warlord trait could allow re-rolls on scatter rolls on deep striking units or only on the unit he is deep striking with. That way if you are really a cc army you would spend your warlord trait on boosting your chances of deep striking into assault.

kps wrote:
How about instead of assaulting after deep strike you get to deep strike into cc. Place your template over the target and roll to scatter. If you hit you get hammer of wrath and no other attacks (think of the dawn of war II trailer "strike from the sky brothers!"). Then the target gets their normal attacks at their initiative step, and you're locked in combat for the next turn.
If you scatter you can't assault, or even shoot or run, and the target unit gets to overwatch you, maybe at normal bs.
And a warlord trait could allow re-rolls on scatter rolls on deep striking units or only on the unit he is deep striking with. That way if you are really a cc army you would spend your warlord trait on boosting your chances of deep striking into assault.

I personally thought the 5e SM book had the right of it with Heroic Intervention, you have to declare you're doing it before you roll for scatter, and if you declare it you can't shoot; it's a bit of a gamble.