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 Alpharius wrote:
Will someone quickly dissect and review this please?

I have to figure out if I want to pledge here, or hold off and wait for the upcoming SDE KS!

Basic Story of the universe:
*Planet was split into day and night. Elves were happy on the day side, Monsters happy on the night side.
*The gods made humans, Humans did stuff.
*A King made a grand city of Arcadia with a temple which put the sun and moon into motion. This meant daytime for the monsters and nighttime for the elves. Everyone got pissed off.
*A vampire who misses his eternal night got mad, sieged the city, and a whole bunch of monsters also moved in. Now the world is in eternal night. The monsters like living in houses and have a 'I smash your face and take your stuff' based economy.

*YOU* are a guild looking to overtake the city and become rich and famous for doing so!

So it basically sounds like the entirety of the game is raiding the city (MMORPG style) and trashing mobs who are basically on guard duty. Named mobs are more active and walk around like heroes do. Mobs come in 4 levels so the orcs and such level up closer you get to the center.

You start off with 3 heroes and 5 static pieces of loot. Everyone is pretty much 'equal'. Every turn you get to activate 1 hero, or you can 'rest' which is when your attacks get 'unspent' and heroes can be revived. Seems very much focused around 'players take their turns' like monopoly.

Campaigns are basically a series of games, and closer to the center of the city you get, stronger stuff gets.

Sounds fun to me. Sounds pretty quick to 'pick up' for a dungeoncrawl game. Also has a 'one-off' playstyle where basically whomever has the most coins 'wins'. I think this would be easy to play as a pick-up game opposed to MYTH which may be heavy for casuals.

The rules are fairly well-done and seem about as light as a boardgame. I feel like people wouldn't need to read the rules to pick up this game if someone was narrating the rules from memory.

 Alpharius wrote:
Will someone quickly dissect and review this please?

I have to figure out if I want to pledge here, or hold off and wait for the upcoming SDE KS!

First Impressions:

1. The Rules are clean and well laid out. Lots of diagrams and scenarios.

2. The overall rules for the game are pretty simple, which I don't think is a bad thing. You have two primary things you can do on your turn: Activate Heros and Rest your guild. I didn't expect this, and its actually a nice surprise. Basically, once you use a weapon, it's exhausted until you use your entire turn to "rest" your guild. You can also swap loot between heroes and Resurrect dead heroes during this time. It looks like balancing your rest with your activations will be a nice little press your luck aspect of the game.

3. Monster activiations are simple, but force you to pay attention to what you're doing. Monsters activate only when you leave a square 'close' to them (adjacent or in) or are in a close space and attack someone else. They basically get to take free shots at you if you dismiss them, which I thought was kinda cool. Its a simple mechanic, but looks like it'll be effective as a buffer between the PVP action people are going to want to do.

4. The campaign system looks really, really fun. I like the notion that your characters "grow" even it is simply, and its pretty neat that completing quests in one scenario will carry on later to benefit you. The notion of achievements also makes it pretty neat, so even if you don't "win" the campaign you can still have some accomplishment. The Death Curses are also kinda funny, and do a good job of holding folks to some accountability for being a Leroy Jenkins in the game.

Overall, the game isn't hugely complicated, but I don't see that as a bad thing. The rules are really really clear and look like they're going to be super easy to teach to non-gamers. I like that the game seems uncomplicated, and it looks like figuring out card combos is also going to be pretty fun.

nkelsch wrote:
Sounds fun to me. Sounds pretty quick to 'pick up' for a dungeoncrawl game. Also has a 'one-off' playstyle where basically whomever has the most coins 'wins'. I think this would be easy to play as a pick-up game opposed to MYTH which may be heavy for casuals.

The rules are fairly well-done and seem about as light as a boardgame. I feel like people wouldn't need to read the rules to pick up this game if someone was narrating the rules from memory.

Agreed with both of these points quite a bit. This game isn't Descent or Myth, and It doesn't seem like its trying to be. Sounds like a fun little game to drink a few beers and play.

Woooooooooo! Bob! New optional buy! Love the design!

 Alpharius wrote:
Will someone quickly dissect and review this please?

I have to figure out if I want to pledge here, or hold off and wait for the upcoming SDE KS!

Put a $1 in and wait for the pledge manager if you don't like what you see in the SDE ks?

How does that work if there is no 1 dollar pledge level?
Do you just put in 1 dollar and select the no reward level and you still get access to the pledge manager in a couple of months?
Is this normal for a CMON kickstarter? I've somehow managed to avoid backing one of their kickstarters until now:-)

 Nicktor wrote:
How does that work if there is no 1 dollar pledge level?
Do you just put in 1 dollar and select the no reward level and you still get access to the pledge manager in a couple of months?
Is this normal for a CMON kickstarter? I've somehow managed to avoid backing one of their kickstarters until now:-)

Is what normal? Could you clarify your question just a bit?

 Nicktor wrote:
How does that work if there is no 1 dollar pledge level?
Do you just put in 1 dollar and select the no reward level and you still get access to the pledge manager in a couple of months?
Is this normal for a CMON kickstarter? I've somehow managed to avoid backing one of their kickstarters until now:-)

With Sedition Wars, all I did was send them a message with my email address and asking for my name to be added to the pledge manager.

What I meant is that with most of the kickstarters I've followed/backed there generally was a 1 to 5 dollar pledge just to follow the campaign and get access to the pledge manager.
CMON does not have that with this kickstarter and I was wondering whether they never have such a pledge or whether they had specifically omitted one for this kickstarter.
Basically I was too lazy to check their previous kickstarters and wanted someone to do that for me
I've checked and they generally don't have a low pledge level, so there nothing different for this kickstarter.

So I'll put in a dollar and send them a mail and decide which Chibi game to back later.

 Nicktor wrote:
How does that work if there is no 1 dollar pledge level?
Do you just put in 1 dollar and select the no reward level and you still get access to the pledge manager in a couple of months?
Is this normal for a CMON kickstarter? I've somehow managed to avoid backing one of their kickstarters until now:-)

You HAVE to back at a recognised pledge level, otherwise KS does not pass your details on to the project creator

since this KS does not have the $1 'I just want to help' level which previous CMON projects have had it does not look like they want people putting in a token amount and waiting for the pledge manager this time round

(you could always contact them to see if it's possible and they've just forgotten to include it, but I don't think so this time)

My recommendation would be to just pledge the $100 if you can.

Firstly, because games like this are nearly always a good investment. I have loads of games and miniatures that I bought in the 90s like Space Hulk, Space Crusade etc... All of them are worth as much or more than I payed for them (even in used condition and allowing for inflation). I wish the same were true of my computer games and electronics from the 90s, but that stuff is just junk now. Miniature games, on the other hand, hold their value well. Even non-GW stuff like Confrontation will cost you both your kidneys and your firstborn now (if you can even find it).

Secondly, these kickstarters are excellent value to start with. And this one seems to be one of the better ones. For what is probably the cost of the retail game (at least in the UK), you get the expansion and a load of limited editions thrown in. My friend just recently sold off her extra Zombicide 2 stuff. She paid something like £102 for the kickstarter, and she sold off the extra bits for £170 a few months later. And she still has the game! And there is still more limited edition stuff to come in the 2nd wave. That's over 100% return in a few months, it was predictable, and almost no risk. Wallstreet guys would goo their pants at those kind of odds.

I don't know if this will turn out to be quite as popular as Zombicide, but there is no way that you would end up with less than you paid if you decide you want to ebay it later. Not for exclusives, which are probably going to be sought-after by SDE players too... And we know with the new Forgotten-King kickstarter about to drop, interest in SDE is about to hit 11. Also the not Harry Potter figures are going to be valuable, and with this you get spares.

Unless you are on such tight budget that you can't afford to invest a $100 in this for a few months without breaking the bank, I think it would be foolish not to pledge. Even if parents/wife have you on a short leash. Show them what the Zombicide figures fetch on ebay these days.

Smacks advice isn't bad- I ended up selling nearly everything from my Kings of War pledge and more than doubled my investment. And demand for a lot of Mantic's stuff isn't particularly high.

That said - it's very likely to be more than a "couple months" - and it does take a fair bit of time ebaying and going to the post office and whatnot.

 Smacks wrote:
My recommendation would be to just pledge the $100 if you can.

Firstly, because games like this are nearly always a good investment. I have loads of games and miniatures that I bought in the 90s like Space Hulk, Space Crusade etc... All of them are worth as much or more than I payed for them (even in used condition and allowing for inflation). I wish the same were true of my computer games and electronics from the 90s, but that stuff is just junk now. Miniature games, on the other hand, hold their value well. Even non-GW stuff like Confrontation will cost you both your kidneys and your firstborn now (if you can even find it).

Secondly, these kickstarters are excellent value to start with. And this one seems to be one of the better ones. For what is probably the cost of the retail game (at least in the UK), you get the expansion and a load of limited editions thrown in. My friend just recently sold off her extra Zombicide 2 stuff. She paid something like £102 for the kickstarter, and she sold off the extra bits for £170 a few months later. And she still has the game! And there is still more limited edition stuff to come in the 2nd wave. That's over 100% return in a few months, it was predictable, and almost no risk. Wallstreet guys would goo their pants at those kind of odds.

I don't know if this will turn out to be quite as popular as Zombicide, but there is no way that you would end up with less than you paid if you decide you want to ebay it later. Not for exclusives, which are probably going to be sought-after by SDE players too... And we know with the new Forgotten-King kickstarter about to drop, interest in SDE is about to hit 11. Also the not Harry Potter figures are going to be valuable, and with this you get spares.

Unless you are on such tight budget that you can't afford to invest a $100 in this for a few months without breaking the bank, I think it would be foolish not to pledge. Even if parents/wife have you on a short leash. Show them what the Zombicide figures fetch on ebay these days.

Investment? If you want to invest in items for real, try property or stocks, not toys, board games, comics and star wars figures. I also don't purchase electronics as "investments" (does anyone?), but as technology to use when it's bought. I've gotten a lot more value and use out of the computer I'm typing this on than any miniatures I own, and I've been into miniatures for more than 30 years. The KS are generally very good value if you live in the US, but the shipping costs can hurt. You'll be paying a big chunk of VAT on top of the value of the game, plus postage, which won't be insubstantial.

It won't be anywhere near as popular as Zombicide. Zombicide is somehow the gold standard for that sort of thing, along with Kingdom Death. Zombies are a lot higher on the cultural radar right now than Harry Potter (or super-deformed not-Harry Potter-alikes). There's always the chance that it'll backfire horribly (Sedition Wars, anyone?) though I'd hope the chances of that are much reduced now. But yeah, it's not $100. It's going to be quite a bit more with VAT and postage, and it's not going to be a "couple months". It'll be next year sometime - and probably close to a 12-month turnaround at the least. Which is, you know, fine and all. But it's not "a few months".

The KoW days are long over. That was a case of Mantic being very new to it all, and just continuing to throw items at the screen for dirt cheap (or free) as stretches as it blew up. Those same models go for a lot more then free at retail, even discounted retail.

I think CMON have done quite a few of these now, and they must be learning. This one looks a lot more finished than many of the previous kickstarters. With all the minis already sculpted and cast, even for Beyond the Grave (allegedly). It feels more like a pre-order than something that might still have a lot of development related delays. I'm actually 'fairly' optimistic about this one landing before Christmas.

With regards to ebay: my friend did her Zombicide stuff in 3 lots 'buy it now'. I think it was something like £30 for the extra Zombies, £100 for the 5 promo survivors, and £40 for Leah. I think everything sold in a matter of hours (though Zombicide was pretty crazy like that). I imagine she could have got more if she had auctioned everything off individually, but she was content to just get the game for free.

I have seen other people just selling the whole lot in one go, and they seem to do okay. I'm not sure if that was possible with Kings of War? I know I certainly wouldn't fancy the prospect of trying to double my money on project Pandora .

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Azazelx wrote:


Investment? If you want to invest in items for real, try property or stocks, not toys, board games, comics and star wars figures.

I'm not talking about investing in games for your retirement or something (seriously? what the hell?). Personally I don't sell my stuff anyway, because I enjoy playing with it. But since almost everything else in our lives is disposable, and becomes worthless once owned or outdated, it' is easy to think of money spent as money gone. I'm just pointing out that that is not true with boardgames, they hold their value well, and can easily go up once they are OOP. Also taking $100 and trying to double it on stock in less than a year is not necessarily easy or work/risk free. I'd rather do like my friend did at get a completely free game + some bonus money, how is that ever a bad thing?

Also I never said a 'couple of months'. I said a 'few months' because the time is going to be measured in months, not years (even if it does end up being 14 months). I'm hardly going to say 'a few years' or a 'few hours' because those units are not appropriate, months is correct. I'm not trying to downplay the time scales.

The KS are generally very good value if you live in the US, but the shipping costs can hurt. You'll be paying a big chunk of VAT on top of the value of the game, plus postage, which won't be insubstantial.

Wait I thought they had learned their lesson with the VAT thing? Which was why everything was being posted from local hubs etc... I certainly didn't pay any extra VAT on Zombicide, and postage from Germany shouldn't rightly be that expensive.

EDIT: I just looked at the Q&A, and it says postage to the UK is 12 euros, + 5 for import fees etc... 17euros is less than the $30 for Zombicide, which actually ended up being $60 for me (as I also got a second pledge for someone else). With the new system the postage on the 2nd pledge would have been considerably cheaper.

It won't be anywhere near as popular as Zombicide. Zombicide is somehow the gold standard for that sort of thing, along with Kingdom Death. Zombies are a lot higher on the cultural radar right now than Harry Potter (or super-deformed not-Harry Potter-alikes). There's always the chance that it'll backfire horribly (Sedition Wars, anyone?) though I'd hope the chances of that are much reduced now.

It doesn't really matter how popular it is, as the popularity will be proportional to the number of people involved in the kickstarter, less popular equals more rare. And the retail cost will be the same as all games anyway. Like I said: my friend sold Leah for £40, which is comparable to what you'd pay for one of the Zomicide 1 promos, even though ebay was flooded with Zombicide 2 stuff. If anything the popularity made the figures worth a bit less.>

 Smacks wrote:
I think CMON have done quite a few of these now, and they must be learning. This one looks a lot more finished than many of the previous kickstarters. With all the minis already sculpted and cast, even for Beyond the Grave (allegedly). It feels more like a pre-order than something that might still have a lot of development related delays. I'm actually 'fairly' optimistic about this one landing before Christmas.

I do agree with you that they're much more polished and experienced, though the way they handled Zombicide S2 was far from impressive. I had to get help from a forum member here who is mates with their upper echelon to get my missing stuff (that was the S1 box, and my second Toxic City Mall and Prison Break boxes sent out. It took over a month to get my missing stuff sent out, and if I hadn't gotten help from a fellow Dakkanaught, it would surely have been another month or so. Terrance was taking 7-10 days to respond to my emails, and promised at least twice to "send it out on Monday" to no effect. - you can see how that can easily add up to another month. If they're aiming for September, you'll be very lucky to see it in December, and more likely after Chinese New Year. That's not snark, it's just speaking from KS-experience and knowledge of how so many of these projects keep going.

With regards to ebay: my friend did her Zombicide stuff in 3 lots 'buy it now'. I think it was something like £30 for the extra Zombies, £100 for the 5 promo survivors, and £40 for Leah. I think everything sold in a matter of hours (though Zombicide was pretty crazy like that). I imagine she could have got more if she had auctioned everything off individually, but she was content to just get the game for free.
I have seen other people just selling the whole lot in one go, and they seem to do okay. I'm not sure if that was possible with Kings of War? I know I certainly wouldn't fancy the prospect of trying to double my money on project Pandora .

Oh, I believe you on the Zombicide stuff. It's just that ZC (and KD) seem to be where the crazy stuff happens. So it's not nearly the norm there. KoW's freebies were a real mish-mash, but of course, getting buckets of figures for free made it reasonably easy to make a profit back from them, even sold at a substantial discount from RRP. I went in for a ton on Pandora, and it wasn't exactly a pleasant experience... though I hold McVey and CMON equally accountable for that clusterfeth.

I'm not talking about investing in games for your retirement or something (seriously? what the hell?). Personally I don't sell my stuff anyway, because I enjoy playing with it. But since almost everything else in our lives is disposable, and becomes worthless once owned or outdated, it' is easy to think of money spent as money gone. I'm just pointing out that that is not true with boardgames, they hold their value well, and can easily go up once they are OOP. Also taking $100 and trying to double it on stock in less than a year is not necessarily easy or work/risk free. I'd rather do like my friend did at get a completely free game + some bonus money, how is that ever a bad thing?

Well, you used the word "investment", and we know that a lot of people do "invest" in things like comics, toys, etc thinking that they're going to flip them down the line for serious money. So I was reading a different meaning into your statement, by the look of things. Internet misunderstanding.

I mean, I do understand what you mean - aside from things like antiques and fossils and a few heirlooms, a lot of the oldest things that I still own at this stage of my life are old RT and pre-RT miniatures, and certainly most of the things that I've owned the longest - ie since my childhood are miniatures (and my pull-string talking Bugs Bunny). And those old Imperial Army and 1st Gen Terminators and WFB 2nd edition Elves and Orcs still work as well on the tabletop as they ever did - and my 1st-Edition Space Hulk still works well on the table top as it ever did. Then again, I tend to get more use out of the technology I buy, disposable and obsolete as it might become. Probably my first "major" purchase as a teenager was selling my large Imperial Guard army made up of the original RT metals, along with Squats, Beastmen and so forth for $400 so I could buy an Amiga 500 of my dickish bother-in-law. Do I regret it? Kinda yes, but on balance, no. Even though I'd rather have those old IG figures now than an A500, the Amiga gave me years of constant entertainment, and really paid for itself.

Also I never said a 'couple of months'. The time is going to be measured in months, not years (even if it does end up being 14 months). I'm not trying to downplay the time scales.

OK, you said "a few months". I was re-reading from schmapi's post there. My bad. Though I still think a year for fulfilment is much more realistic.

It doesn't really matter how popular it is, as the popularity will be proportional to the number of people involved in the kickstarter, less rare. And the retail cost will be the same as all games anyway. Like I said: my friend sold Leah for £40, which is comparable to what you'd pay for one of the Zomicide 1 promos, even though ebay was flooded with Zombicide 2 stuff. If anything the popularity made the figures worth a bit less.>

Well, it does matter how popular it is. Because that's what makes the figures sought after or not later. I don't think the Arcadia exclusives will be anywhere near as sought after as Leah, but then they definitely will be more in demand than Dr. Hexen Phaedrus.

 Azazelx wrote:
So I was reading a different meaning into your statement, by the look of things. Internet misunderstanding.

Oh, hey no problem! . I'm sorry too if I came across argumentative, the little face-palm icon put me on the defensive a little.

I think I just used 'investment' for lack of a better word. I've spent so much on miniatures and games through the years (as I'm sure a lot of us have). I think knowing that they are still valuable is one of my few comforts. And I still do get a fair bit of use out of them, and even painting them doesn't necessarily hurt the value. It's nice that you can have something and enjoy it, and still be able to get a good bit of your money back at the end. That hasn't been the case with all my electronics sadly, and it's especially heartbreaking when you end up not really using something enough, and then it breaks just out of warranty, or the battery needs replacing because it was flat for so long *sigh*.

I agree that these figures probably won't go for anything close to the Zombicide promos. But they don't don't have to really. I don't think £8 would be unrealistic, and for 9 promo figures that would cover the cost of the game.

A link to the KS in the OP would be nice, had to search for it on KS to find it.

 Smacks wrote:

 Azazelx wrote:
So I was reading a different meaning into your statement, by the look of things. Internet misunderstanding.

Oh, hey no problem! . I'm sorry too if I came across argumentative, the little face-palm icon put me on the defensive a little.

I think I just used 'investment' for lack of a better word. I've spent so much on miniatures and games through the years (as I'm sure a lot of us have). I think knowing that they are still valuable is one of my few comforts. And I still do get a fair bit of use out of them, and even painting them doesn't necessarily hurt the value. It's nice that you can have something and enjoy it, and still be able to get a good bit of your money back at the end. That hasn't been the case with all my electronics sadly, and it's especially heartbreaking when you end up not really using something enough, and then it breaks just out of warranty, or the battery needs replacing because it was flat for so long *sigh*.

I guess I see what you mean there, though I see hobby money as "money spent" really. I'll probably never sell any of my models. Aside from the odd one I paint for charity, I prefer not to part with any of them. Might be a combination of the Amiga-thing, knowing how hard they can be to find and replace (if at all), and my rampant collecting OCD.

I agree that these figures probably won't go for anything close to the Zombicide promos. But they don't don't have to really. I don't think £8 would be unrealistic, and for 9 promo figures that would cover the cost of the game.

So out of interest, do you think you might pick up extras of the exclusives to cover your KS costs?

I'm still debating this one, purely because two mates are also pledging, so ending up with three plus copies might be over the top.

As a ridiculous aside, my initial Zombicide Season 1 Pledge went for....$1800 on ebay.

I bought another copy, for myself, but I wasn't so attached to the promos that I was foolish enough to not give it an eBay whirl when I saw that lots were creeping close to $1000.

The Funniest part? I had my BiN set at $800.

We were at adepticon as the number continued to climb. Needless to say I paid for lunch that afternoon.

 Azazelx wrote:
So out of interest, do you think you might pick up extras of the exclusives to cover your KS costs?

You mean like a second pledge, just to sell?

With Zombicide 2 I got a second pledge and did that. But that was largely because my friend really wanted the game but couldn't afford it. She was happy to deal with the ebaying and pay me back the initial pledge, and she got a free game and +£70 for her trouble, and she also has a few limited editions left over to boot. So that made a lot of sense.

I guess I could do that with Acadia Quest... But I don't know anyone else who wants the game that bad. And since I would already have all the exclusives there isn't much incentive for me personally. I guess it would be a fairly easy $200... It's not exactly a life changing amount of money though.

I was looking over the kickstarter contents just now, trying to decide if I should drop out, when it struck me just how much of it is KS exclusive. Does that make sense to anyone here? Why would CMON do that? It seems less like a crowdfunding endeavor and more a KS-only store front.

 Dentry wrote:
I was looking over the kickstarter contents just now, trying to decide if I should drop out, when it struck me just how much of it is KS exclusive. Does that make sense to anyone here? Why would CMON do that? It seems less like a crowdfunding endeavor and more a KS-only store front.

Because they don't want people to say 'Huh... looks neat, I will wait for retail'. Some games failed to fund due to people saying 'I will wait for retail'.

Exclusives force people to say 'I will back now and worse comes to worse I can flip it for a profit at fulfillment'. people are flipping 100$ Myth pledges for 400$ right now due to exclusives and people who missed the boat.

If everything is guaranteed to be available later at retail, then it comes down to raw money... and some people are fine waiting and paying more.

If the cost to create the KS exclusives is less than the 40% they lose by selling through a distributor, making a KS only storefront is not a bad plan.

nkelsch wrote:
Because they don't want people to say 'Huh... looks neat, I will wait for retail'. Some games failed to fund due to people saying 'I will wait for retail'.

For better or worse, I don't think any CMON game "published" on Kickstarter is in danger of failing to fund... exclusives or not.

skarsol wrote:
If the cost to create the KS exclusives is less than the 40% they lose by selling through a distributor, making a KS only storefront is not a bad plan.

Unless said plan leads to distributors and stores deciding to not stock said product!

I gave this one last look over this morning, but the shipping issue really killed it for me. I saw that they've removed the "probably $40 to Australia" part and have now replaced it with ...nothing. Not even a ballpark anymore. How 'bout that gak, nklesch?

The other thing is that even with $40 in the back of my mind, there's no mention of what the addition of the expansion box or extra KS models might do to the total postal cost. - so it really is a completely undefined "It could cost anything!" amount for Aussies now.

Like I said before, I've paid more for international shipping for hobby items than anyone who tries the usual white knight bs on will ever do, so I'm not after a free ride, but a couple of decent, proper estimates that includes info on the $100 level and the $100 set + all the extras. Anything in between can be extrapolated from those two.

 Azazelx wrote:
I gave this one last look over this morning, but the shipping issue really killed it for me. I saw that they've removed the "probably $40 to Australia" part and have now replaced it with ...nothing. Not even a ballpark anymore. How 'bout that gak, nklesch?

The other thing is that even with $40 in the back of my mind, there's no mention of what the addition of the expansion box or extra KS models might do to the total postal cost. - so it really is a completely undefined "It could cost anything!" amount for Aussies now.

Like I said before, I've paid more for international shipping for hobby items than anyone who tries the usual white knight bs on will ever do, so I'm not after a free ride, but a couple of decent, proper estimates that includes info on the $100 level and the $100 set + all the extras. Anything in between can be extrapolated from those two.

The rewards have grown to more than twice the size... So the shipping is probably more than twice the size... US shipping is now about 20$ Which is twice the size, So I would expect you now get to pay 80$ Which is twice the size. That is how it is. SDE is going to be in the exact same boat. And new KS are moving to this model of "pay what you owe" and "we can't promise shipping costs".

If you don't like it, don't pledge. Other people seem to be getting their estimates just fine... But estimates can and will change, so if you are unwilling to pay what it costs and want a guaranteed set in stone price, you may not be backing KS much after all the KS go to this model to avoid having to eat it on shipping costs.

Vote with your wallet.

For those that wonder this is the latest shipping info



We base it on how much it cost to ship our past box game projects, such as Zombicide and Rivet Wars.

In the USA, this works out to about $11 per package when shipped via Fedex Home

In Europe, costs increase the further you go out of Germany. The base cost is around 5 Euros for import and logistics fees, with actual shipping in Germany at under 5 Euros (so 10 Euros total), France, and UK at 12 Euros (17 Euros total), Italy and Spain at 17 Euros (23 Euros total). This is for shipment via the very reliable courier service rather than national post. We'll accept shipping payment for European backers in Euros instead of US$ so as to avoid double conversion fees (your Euros to our US$ to our shipper's Euros... madness!)

In the Asia Pacific region, the base cost is $3, and shipment increases the further out from Shenzhen it is to ship. Hong Kong will be under $10 and Singapore under $20. This is via Fedex international - Australia is particularly expensive for Fedex but we're investigating China Post if you are willing to take the risk of the public post losing your item.

Closer to the ship date, once we have all the weights and box dimensions of unlocked add ons we'll be able to give you all a very clear idea of how much shipping will cost, but we don't expect it to deviate very far from this unless there's a major change in courier rates.



so quite a lot of us have more certain info than before (but those poor Australians have less)

nkelsch wrote:

The rewards have grown to more than twice the size... So the shipping is probably more than twice the size... US shipping is now about 20$ Which is twice the size, So I would expect you now get to pay 80$ Which is twice the size. That is how it is. SDE is going to be in the exact same boat. And new KS are moving to this model of "pay what you owe" and "we can't promise shipping costs".

If you don't like it, don't pledge. Other people seem to be getting their estimates just fine... But estimates can and will change, so if you are unwilling to pay what it costs and want a guaranteed set in stone price, you may not be backing KS much after all the KS go to this model to avoid having to eat it on shipping costs.

Vote with your wallet.

That's not how shipping costs actually work. It's not a linear increase. It goes by categories, and even those offer economies of scale. But you are correct, I won't be backing anything that can't give me a reasonably firm estimate (which is different from "set in stone", if English is your first language). Shipping from China, even via EMS also costs a fraction of shipping from the US, so anything shipping from there and willing to do their homework beforehand (because we know CMON would have had everything to be offered planned beforehand) will still be able to do well. Also KS that mass-ship to Australia, like SWM, or ones located in the UK. It's just US-based projects who do it garage-style that will have issues, I think.

I shall indeed vote with my wallet, though. A shame, because my wife looked a little interested in it, but with 10 or so KS-exclusive characters, it might not be worth doing in the end.

I'll be selling my Cthulhu promo because I hate Cthulhu on principle.