Kickstarter - Dwarven Forge Game Tiles II: Caverns - Campaign Successful!

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**-iPaint-**

Yeah, I'm already in for $200 or so more than last time, so I can't imagine my wallet is gonna survive the chasms, floor, and elevation packs....

~iPaint

**Fugazi**

Elevations unlocked at 1.25m.

**Forar**

Damnit.

And here I thought Lava/Arctic paint jobs were going to test me.

Water? Elevation?

Man, I was doing so well this month putting a dent into the old credit card. April 8th (and whenever their pledge manager ends) are not going to go well.

**snurl**

Well, you probably won't be able to ever get a better deal.
Expensive, yes, but cheaper than their older resin stuff.
I know where you're at though. I'm considering dropping a few sets to be able to afford more add ons. Decisions.

Word of advice from last time: Do not wait until the last day to manage your pledge.

**Forar**

Oh, I was there, I saw how Amazon payments screwed them over. I'm pretty happy with the tier I'm at, and if they're saying the pledge manager is pretty much for add ons only, I'm okay with that.

Assuming it's like last time around, and the manager opens a week or two after the campaign, and is open for another week or two, that extra paycheque might help justify an add on or two beyond what I'm getting.

But painted and international S&H? Damn those things add up. $35 for rivers is great. $70 for rivers, awesome as they are, isn't quite as easy to justify.

Not that it'll necessarily stop me.

**RiTides**

I just have to try to get my ratio right- trying to weigh if four add-ons that are basically floors (3 water and 1 normal floor add-on, when they offer it) will be too much real estate. I think not, as I want Really big rooms, and their normal ones seem claustrophobic to me.

I'll be planning to add those on to my 5-set pledge in the pledge manager... so I just have to be sure I have enough sets pledged for to match it, since we can't add those on. But since I don't think there's any way to really pledge for 6 sets (two sets of 3, I guess, but not as good of a deal?) I'll likely lock it down at 5 and then just hope I'm not adding too many floors for the amount of walls I'll have

**NTRabbit**

Query: How much difference in price is there between getting the add ons in the KS/post-KS pledge manager, and picking up the add ons or their constituent parts later on through regular retail?

**RiTides**

I think in the last campaign, there was a much smaller difference in add-on price between the campaign and retail (although shipping is still a killer at retail). I'm still shocked that the water set is only $35 for 30 pieces, though- that seems really good and I can't imagine they'll be able to hit that at retail, even if the pieces are smaller / easier to make due to being all floors.

Edit: Elevation pack details are revealed, it will be $50 for 18 pieces... which is why I think the water pack is such a smoking deal! Granted, these are a lot bigger pieces:

The graphic was just posted here: http://www.dwarvenforge.com/caverns/ep2.jpg Please keep in mind that these are very big pieces with 2" x 2" footprints. -- Jeff

**Forar**

RiTides wrote:
But since I don't think there's any way to really pledge for 6 sets (two sets of 3, I guess, but not as good of a deal?) I'll likely lock it down at 5 and then just hope I'm not adding too many floors for the amount of walls I'll have

They've said you can't increase your tier post KS (IE: can't pledge 5 now and add a 6th with the pledge manager), but at least early in the campaign they were saying you could get an odd number by doing that. I imagine a 5 + 1 would be a better price per set.

Hrm, to the campaign!

5 + 1 = $400.

2 x 3 = $420.

5+1 is the way to go. I figured that would be the case; the more sets you get in one shot, the cheaper they are per set, so the savings found in the 5 tier far outweighs the extra you're paying for the single.

Edit: very nice, but 18 pieces (awesome as they are) for $90 after painting and shipping is definitely out of my range. Water has my attention, but that's 30 pieces for like $70. I'm sure the 'elevation pieces' are hefty as hell, and it's probably way more expensive at retail, but I simply can't justify that.

**RiTides**

I think if you did 5 + 1, you wouldn't get stretch goals for the "1", though... I'll just stick to 5 so it won't matter anyway

What do you think of the elevation pack? Too pricey for me, and also too square- I want a natural looking cavern. But if others go in for it it will only help the campaign progress, which is really starting to take off even just starting into the last week here.

**Forar**

RiTides wrote:
I think if you did 5 + 1, you wouldn't get stretch goals for the "1", though... I'll just stick to 5 so it won't matter anyway

I don't think that's true. They say that any backer getting 2 or more sets gets stretch goals. I don't see why they wouldn't apply that for the 6th set for someone giving them $400. I guess it's worth asking, but worst case scenario, $20 for the extra set of goals isn't a terrible burden at that level.

What do you think of the elevation pack? Too pricey for me, and also too square- I want a natural looking cavern. But if others go in for it it will only help the campaign progress, which is really starting to take off even just starting into the last week here.

Yeah, as noted in my edit, it's nice, but I could see it really shining in larger numbers. Painted and shipped it's $90 for 18 tiles. No, not all tiles are made equal, but something like the water ($70 for 30 tiles) seems like it'd give me more options. If I want to build 'up' I suppose I can already do so in a fashion with some floor bricks, the right size book/box, and some sticky tack. Not ideal, but $350 is probably the limit I can justify at this time, and that's already $70 over what I was considering my limit to start with. $370-440 would likely be... unwise.

**-iPaint-**

Elevation pack is functional, but priced at a point where I can't see myself getting more than 2 unpainted. The pics of the deep ravines with 3-4 layers of tiles stacked up looks cool, but is prohibitively expensive if you use the elevation pieces and stack them. I'd probably use insulation foam painted black as a filler, then cover the walls with normal cavern tiles. Create some sort of filler for the walls so you could stack them without them collapsing in on themselves.

The cavern elevation pack is probably great for adding a centerpiece elevation area to a large cavern room (especially with the semi-elevated floor pieces to create some varied elevation leading up to them), but I wouldn't want to run the risk of 3-4 layers of pieces toppling over if they're bumped because they're all stacked on top of one another.

~iPaint

Automatically Appended Next Post:
From the KS comments, a bit of insight into the photo gallery setups:

Nate Taylor wrote:Hello fellow backers,
I'd love to chime in and shed some light on the Elevation pieces and the pictures of the large set-ups featured in the photo gallery.
I'm a DF backer, collector, and long-time gamer. I'm also a filmmaker and volunteered my services to help Stefan & Jeff make a cool finale video for this project. We just released the teaser for it today.
One of the best parts of the project was getting a solid week of hands-on time with these tiles. They are even cooler in person than I'd hoped.
After a week of experimenting with the prototypes, I spent this last weekend in Stefan's studio, with a the full collection of tiles where I built all the big set-ups you've seen pictured in the last few days.
Here are the pieces we had available:
- Approximately 10 sets of the Basic tiles (Walls A-C, Floors A-C, Corners A-C)
- 1 complete Lava Set
- 8 Floor D in the "standard" paint style (these weren't completed until Sunday so they're only in a few of the builds)
- Roughly 5 Narrow Passage Sets (but only 10 of the 45° passages, and 2 boulders)
- Roughly 5-6 Water Sets (the set composition wasn't finalized at that stage - we had a ton of Straight and Curve tiles, but only a few Full Water, Diagonal, and Little Corner tiles, and the cave opening pieces)
- 40 of the Elevation 2x2 pedestals
- 20 or so of both types of Elevation stairs
- 2 Elevation narrow bridges
- A dozen of each stalagmite (all three types)
- A handful of free-standing walls
- A variety of the incomplete Ledges & Crevices pieces
- 3 of each mushroom type (we also didn't get these until Sunday, hot off the presses)
- A handful of some other specialty pieces which haven't been seen yet (well I guess the Mine door is in the photo gallery, and you can see one of the pieces in the opening video)
General Build Facts:
- We didn't use up all the pieces for any of the builds (we tended to have walls and corners left)
- We did tend to run out of floors. Luckily Stefan is hard at work on a 4x4 floor which will certainly help in that area.
- We tended to use all the 2x2 Elevation Pedestals. I really love those pieces. It's amazing how quickly they can make a build get very interesting and 3D.
- When working with the water we tended to run out of the little corner pieces (we had very few in relation to the other tiles)
- We almost always used up the stalagmites
- I wished we'd had more 45° pieces, they really make for interesting builds.
Elevation Builds:
- For a almost all of the vertical work we used boxes or foam for a base structure and then built up and over it with the tiles. These were really nothing fancy - literally old cardboard boxes Stefan had lying around which we cut to a height to match the tiles.
- Next time I think I'd pre-cut several sheets of 2" foam/insulation into various size squares and rectangles so my interior backing pieces could be more modular. The boxes were very, well, boxy.
- We used a mixture of the 2x2 pedestals and the regular wall/corner pieces to make the tall sections. Wall A, Wall B, Corner C, and the Passage End Cap were the most useful for building high. We used Pillars from the Dungeon Dressing Pack/CoS to support the tiles above when stacking on most of the Wall sections.
- For the extended bridge over the chasm, we stuck two Narrow Bridges together with an as-of-yet-unrealeased Ledge piece and some blu-stik.
Summary:
Don't be intimidated by those massive builds. They aren't that difficult and were incredibly fun. Anyone could build those with enough tiles. I'm sure if anyone in this KS could spend a weekend in Stefan's studio they could come up with even cooler ones.
The organic shapes and textures you can configure with these tiles (compared to the dungeon ones) are just staggering. My cameraman had never laid eyes on and DF products and by the end of two days was addicted.
I hope this gives clarity to some or your questions and speculations. I'll try to answer more questions as they come, but I really should be working on the finale video.
In parting I have to say that with everything I have seen, I can confirm that Stefan & Jeff are working very hard to make everyone happy and provide you with the Caverns tiles of your dreams. There is a ton of behind-the-scenes effort that goes on to keep this Dwarven juggernaut trudging forward, and they are in the thick of it.
You might think I'm lucky to have had such an epic hands-on preview of the new tiles. But now that I've had a taste, I think it makes the wait until November even worse. I want my tiles NOW! It's going to be a long 7 months, but certainly worth it...

~iPaint

**ced1106**

NTRabbit wrote:
Query: How much difference in price is there between getting the add ons in the KS/post-KS pledge manager, and picking up the add ons or their constituent parts later on through regular retail?

Is Dwarven Forge available retail? AFAIK, It's not available US retail, except eBay.

Anyway, if you bought a three-pack of add-ons on the US site, it would cost about the same as on the KS, but that's before shipping.

Here are the EU prices for the KS product : http://www.dwarvenforge.eu/products?page=shop.browse&category_id=12

Caverns is too pricey for me, especially since I'm interested in the add-ons. I think with their first KS, we got a *really* good price for the base set.

**RiTides**

Free floor "D" piece for every set just unlocked

**-iPaint-**

RiTides wrote:
Free floor "D" piece for every set just unlocked

Actually getting close to unlocking the Elevation pack as an add-on, too, only about $1300 to go for that.

~iPaint

**NTRabbit**

ced1106 wrote:
NTRabbit wrote:
Query: How much difference in price is there between getting the add ons in the KS/post-KS pledge manager, and picking up the add ons or their constituent parts later on through regular retail?

Is Dwarven Forge available retail? AFAIK, It's not available US retail, except eBay.

Anyway, if you bought a three-pack of add-ons on the US site, it would cost about the same as on the KS, but that's before shipping.

Here are the EU prices for the KS product : http://www.dwarvenforge.eu/products?page=shop.browse&category_id=12

Caverns is too pricey for me, especially since I'm interested in the add-ons. I think with their first KS, we got a *really* good price for the base set.

By retail I meany outside of the Kickstarter, since I'm presuming they actually continue to make these tiles after backer fulfillment.

The shipping is going to be horrific in any event, because the US apparently can't even manage a postage system effectively.

I ask because my budget is finite, there are some add ons I like the look of, but the consensus seems to be "get as many base sets as you can afford" so you make the most of free stretch additions. Still not sure whether or not I can afford it at all, with the postage prices so off the wall insane.

**RiTides**

-iPaint- wrote:
RiTides wrote:
Free floor "D" piece for every set just unlocked

Actually getting close to unlocking the Elevation pack as an add-on, too, only about $1300 to go for that.

~iPaint

It unlocked at 1.25M, which was just passed. This is taking off!

**Forar**

Honestly, we're having better days earlier than I anticipated. Glad to see it. I'd settled in to expect another week of drudgery, but there's definitely been an uptick in the last few days. Here's to hoping it continues!

**Fugazi**

NTRabbit wrote:
Query: How much difference in price is there between getting the add ons in the KS/post-KS pledge manager, and picking up the add ons or their constituent parts later on through regular retail?

Well, a couple of things: the KS had a discount for multiple add ons and free shipping in US. At retail, they have the "buy 3" deal which is close to the KS price. But they also split one of the add ons into two packs.

It's tricky. The best deals in terms of bang for your buck are the main sets bc the postKS packs don't have stretch goals. But the add ons make the regular sets come to life. You have to find a balance.

**snurl**

Getting very close to 1.3 Million. Freestanding straight walls up now, freestanding curved walls next.

**Forar**

Yeah, as much as I adore the add ons this time around, I'm thinking the river one is the only one I should even think about getting. That's a lot of floor space to play with, and can be used to change things up with both the caverns set and my dungeon sets without much imagination.

But man, if we were all independently wealthy... all the add ons. All of them.

**snurl**

Yep. I knew this one would be expensive, budgeted for it, and still went way over what i thought it would cost, and yet there's still more to come.

**RiTides**

I am looking forward to that 4x4 floor add-on!

**Bossk_Hogg**

Forar wrote:
RiTides wrote:

What do you think of the elevation pack? Too pricey for me, and also too square- I want a natural looking cavern. But if others go in for it it will only help the campaign progress, which is really starting to take off even just starting into the last week here.

Yeah, as noted in my edit, it's nice, but I could see it really shining in larger numbers. Painted and shipped it's $90 for 18 tiles. No, not all tiles are made equal, but something like the water ($70 for 30 tiles) seems like it'd give me more options. If I want to build 'up' I suppose I can already do so in a fashion with some floor bricks, the right size book/box, and some sticky tack. Not ideal, but $350 is probably the limit I can justify at this time, and that's already $70 over what I was considering my limit to start with. $370-440 would likely be... unwise.

You can also get decent elevation effects by using walls in the middle of the room and laying floor tiles over them. Its how I've used my existing cavern sets. Though they need bigger tiles than just 2"x2". They said something about a floor pack, so a 4x4, 6x4 and 6x6 would help a lot.

**snurl**

Those Water tiles take up a good bit of floor space.
Jeff said there will be more stuff announced this weekend.

**Fugazi**

What's this? No pix of the Narrow Passage set or Mushrooms?

Automatically Appended Next Post:
3k away from mystery add on pack (chasms/ledges?)

**snurl**

Stalagtites set is up.
New free archway piece is next.
Chasems looming just beyond.

**RiTides**

Where's that 4x4 floor piece? Stalagmite and chasm sets both seem a bit pricey compared to rivers set.

**Ace Histoli**

Narrow Dungeon add-on got even better, actually. Now includes two transition pieces for going "2 square wide corridor" to "one square wide". Same price.

**Forar**

Damn, nice to see the add on get an upgrade. One off would be understandable, but if the add ons saw upgrades as well as we skyrocket in the next 3 days, that'd be fine too.

Bit the bullet for one add on. Unless some friends hook me up with birthday cash (unlikely, as most of them are poor), I think that's all I can manage. Maybe, MAYBE a second add on if the right one comes along, but I really need to show some restraint here.