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And generally any other armors.

Depends where it hits?

Even terminators can sometimes die to a lucky las shot.

MarsNZ wrote:
Depends where it hits?

Even terminators can sometimes die to a lucky las shot.

Thickest part of the armor.

The only real answer is:

Depends on your headcanon.

We are shown far too many examples in either direction to give a real answer.

Even finding an average seems all-but impossible.

 Imperial_Arson wrote:

MarsNZ wrote:
Depends where it hits?

Even terminators can sometimes die to a lucky las shot.

Thickest part of the armor.

Hundreds at the most, thats at the top end of the spectrum, where the armor is built well by master Mechanicus priests, and enhanced or upgraded by chapter artificers. If not, then I'd say around the hundred rounds mark. Although I don't think a Space Marine will allow himself to get into such situations where he can be easily hit by a hundred rounds.

 LumenPraebeo wrote:

 Imperial_Arson wrote:

MarsNZ wrote:
Depends where it hits?

Even terminators can sometimes die to a lucky las shot.

Thickest part of the armor.

Hundreds at the most, thats at the top end of the spectrum, where the armor is built well by master Mechanicus priests, and enhanced or upgraded by chapter artificers. If not, then I'd say around the hundred rounds mark. Although I don't think a Space Marine will allow himself to get into such situations where he can be easily hit by a hundred rounds.

Holy feth..that's...unexpected.
They're tanks pretty much..
Terminator armor must be crazy..

Yea, but that's just bolter rounds. Power Armor can easily take any conventional weapon the Imperium throws at it. Even then, there are specialized bolter ammunition that are designed to penetrate power armor, and they can be produced easily as well. Then there's the fact that more than half of the enemies the Astartes faces out in the galaxy don't use Imperial weapons. There are many more weapons out there that are more than powerful enough to tear through power armor. I don't know enough about Eldar armor to form a reasonable opinion on it, but I do know a Fire Warrior can go toe to toe with an Imperial Guardsman, so I would say their armor is equal to Guardsman armor, although it wouldn't be surprise me if it's actually better. Their suit systems are definitely equal to power armor systems though, again if not better. As for the Battlesuits, from books I've read and from what I've seen people say online, I can only say I think they are comparable to Space Marine power armor. But where an Astartes armor amplifies his strength, the battlesuit only provides the strength. A Battlesuit can definitely take an enormous amount of bolter fire though.

i think this is entirely dependant on who is writing the book. in some cases one bolt round can punch through the chest plating on power armour in other cases 5 shots wont penetrate the armour. i think it also depends on who the character is shooting/being shot by. i think we can all agree that Kharn being shot buy generic ultramarine 1 isnt going to do any damage but kharn shooting at generic ultramarine 1 will blow the marine into thousands of tiny pieces spraying bone fragments which are traveling at hyper volicty and punch through the armour and kill the rest of the squad...

see where im going with this? its the same with every race and every weapon. wouldnt be suprised if various main characters armour could hold out against melta guns. and im pretty sure farsight could get trod on by an imperator class titan and get up afterwards shouting "armour save is 1+ motherf*****r!!!"


Automatically Appended Next Post:
and im not talking about plot armour im just saying that we are told so many extremes that its hard to guage it

Depends entirely on what the author feels like portraying that day.

I watched a Dawn of War video the other day, where the marines were cut down left, right and centre by ork weapons fire. And my marines die in droves every time I play, so I'd say not that many!

I think I read somewhere (BRB?) that when we roll to hit, it's not a single shot but a a few rounds going off - BRRRAP BRAAAP!

Do not take Dawn of War as an indication of anything.

In DoWII, a Tactical Sergeant deals almost seven times as much melee damage as a Guardsmen sergeant with the same weapon does.

And in that game a single Chaos Marine outdamages an entire Guardsman Infantry Squad in melee.

Oh, and Catachans hit harder than Nobs in melee in that game, rofl.

 monders wrote:
I think I read somewhere (BRB?) that when we roll to hit, it's not a single shot but a a few rounds going off - BRRRAP BRAAAP!

The shooting rules in 40k are an abstraction of reality. A single dice roll to hit does not necessarily represent a single round (or energy bolt or whatever) being fired, but represents the likelihood of the model that is firing causing damage to their target. assault cannon are supposed to have firing rates of thousands of rounds per minute, but we roll 4 dice to hit in a turn. Similarly standard infantry weapons are generally depicteds as semi or fully automatic with soldiers firing bursts at the enemy, but you only roll 1 or 2 dice in game to represent their actual effetiveness. In other cases, say lascannon or missile launchers, a single roll to hit may actually represent a single shot, but not necessarily.

Didn't the OP mentioned 'the thickest part of the armour?' Hundreds of bolt round would be a good answer

wufai wrote:
Didn't the OP mentioned 'the thickest part of the armour?' Hundreds of bolt round would be a good answer

But one that is impossible to verify by any of the available sources.

One, two , many, lots

There is no correct answer

 Flinty wrote:

 monders wrote:
I think I read somewhere (BRB?) that when we roll to hit, it's not a single shot but a a few rounds going off - BRRRAP BRAAAP!

The shooting rules in 40k are an abstraction of reality. A single dice roll to hit does not necessarily represent a single round (or energy bolt or whatever) being fired, but represents the likelihood of the model that is firing causing damage to their target. assault cannon are supposed to have firing rates of thousands of rounds per minute, but we roll 4 dice to hit in a turn. Similarly standard infantry weapons are generally depicteds as semi or fully automatic with soldiers firing bursts at the enemy, but you only roll 1 or 2 dice in game to represent their actual effetiveness. In other cases, say lascannon or missile launchers, a single roll to hit may actually represent a single shot, but not necessarily.

Excellent round up, cheers flinty.

I think I had my wires crossed with a discussion on Genestealer effectiveness against Terminator armour in CC... Sooo many interesting topics on these hallowed pages!

wufai wrote:
Didn't the OP mentioned 'the thickest part of the armour?' Hundreds of bolt round would be a good answer

The Horus Heresy works would tend to contradict that. Single bolt rounds go clean through Astartes armor all the time in the series, or at least tear off large bits of it. About the only place this doesn't occur is in the shoulders. Otherwise guys get limbs blown off, helmets smashed in, sucking chest wounds, etc to single shots.

And in other sources the thickest parts of the armour are effectively invincible to small arms.

Take your pick OP, nothing is right or wrong here.

 Imperial_Arson wrote:

MarsNZ wrote:
Depends where it hits?

Even terminators can sometimes die to a lucky las shot.

Thickest part of the armor.

Think of it like this.

It takes an anti-tank missile to guarantee that you punch through Power Armor.

So anything else is basically hoping to hit a weak spot on the armor, like a joint or eye lens.


Eldar armor might be the same strength as Power Armor, but because the person wearing it is frailer its a little easier to damage the target. You might not penetrate their armor, but the impact can still pulp organs and break bones.

The same with Tau. A battlesuit has the same protection as power armor, but is a little more durable represented by the extra wounds.


I always kinda viewed passing my armor save as the attack hitting the strongest part of the armor and being absorbed. Failing the save is the attack hitting a weak spot or a joint.

 Grey Templar wrote:

 Imperial_Arson wrote:

MarsNZ wrote:
Depends where it hits?

Even terminators can sometimes die to a lucky las shot.

Thickest part of the armor.

Think of it like this.

It takes an anti-tank missile to guarantee that you punch through Power Armor.

So anything else is basically hoping to hit a weak spot on the armor, like a joint or eye lens.


Eldar armor might be the same strength as Power Armor, but because the person wearing it is frailer its a little easier to damage the target. You might not penetrate their armor, but the impact can still pulp organs and break bones.

The same with Tau. A battlesuit has the same protection as power armor, but is a little more durable represented by the extra wounds.


I always kinda viewed passing my armor save as the attack hitting the strongest part of the armor and being absorbed. Failing the save is the attack hitting a weak spot or a joint.

Tau armour is quite interesting because it is ceramitite that is lighter and easier to make (at least fo tau). And for the most part, unless you punch a hole straight though the suit, you are damaging the suits, not the pilot.

Just one.

Flak: One unless it grazes. Even then it would probably hurt.

Carapace: Multiple though if you hit the weak spot they're dead.

Power: Depends on the source. Ultramarines: The Move depicts power armor as being about as good as flak armor. Just pick your favorite. Mine is that Power Armor is near invulnerable to small arms fire unless you hit a weak spot.

Terminator: You won't get through it unless you hit a weak spot with anything short of a plasma gun. Then they're just dead.

Bolts are an artillery munition disguised as a small-arm.

 TheCustomLime wrote:


Terminator: You won't get through it unless you hit a weak spot with anything short of a plasma gun. Then they're just dead.

TDA is very hit and miss, eh?

 Psienesis wrote:
Bolts are an artillery munition disguised as a small-arm.

In the world of 40k, Boltguns are pretty much bog standard for a small arm if the rules are anything to go by.

@BrotherHaraldus

I think armor is just like that. If it can penetrate the armor effectively then the armor might as well not be there. An all or nothing sort of thing, really.

 TheCustomLime wrote:
if the rules are anything to go by.

Newsflash, they aren't.

Fair enough. Alright, well, Boltguns are powerful for an Imperial small arm. I am not sure how other race's weapons have been compared to it in the fluff.

 TheCustomLime wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
Bolts are an artillery munition disguised as a small-arm.

In the world of 40k, Boltguns are pretty much bog standard for a small arm if the rules are anything to go by.

@BrotherHaraldus

I think armor is just like that. If it can penetrate the armor effectively then the armor might as well not be there. An all or nothing sort of thing, really.

The bog-standard small-arm is a lasweapon. A boltgun fires an armor-piercing, explosive round that can deploy all kinds of crazy munitions (mutagenic acids, incendiary chemicals, etc.). Space Marines of any flavor are elite forces for a reason.

Terminator armor is close to impervious to bolter rounds in the hard spots like the torso, gorget around the head, and pauldrons, able to walk right into heavy bolters with little care. Normal PA varies by the mark, with MK's IV, VI, and VII being around the same, MK's V and I being terrible to use, and MK's II and III being better than all the others to some degree in the strength of the armor itself, at the cost of speed. Generally, anything aimed at the pauldrons simply isn't going to work, but at the torso I think it's safe to say that generally a full 20-30 rounds emptied at the torso is always going to end up with either a kill, or in rare cases, incapacitation.

Eldar Guardian armor is gak, and doesn't stand up to bolter rounds nearly as good as PA, and while the most flexible and granting the most agility due to being a second skin, yeah. Burst fire will punch through it fairly easy. Semiautomatic even.

Flak just sucks and always will suck. It's great protection against autoguns and in the modern day would be fantastic armor, but against bolters? Even if it just detonated against it and didn't penetrate, it'd kill the wearer from the force and rupture organs. Carapace armor is a lightyear jump ahead in comparison, able to take glances or even a direct hit.

To my understanding, Tau armor is similar to IG carapace.

Steelmage99 wrote:
Depends entirely on what the author feels like portraying that day.

This.

Also, Plot Armor is 10x more durable than Ceremite!