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To be fair, I am coloring my expectations through Rose-tinted Glasses. I was operating under the assumption that a Tank commander might make tanks scoring troops, similar to how a primary detachment of Imperial Knights makes Imperial Knights scoring. I suppose this is viewed as a slim proposition based on some of the reactions.

 Ravenous D wrote:

 Perfect Organism wrote:
If I'm reading that right, 'Take Aim' allows you to assign all hits, including from heavy weapons and suchlike to whoever you want? That could make a lot of deathstar builds very precarious - letting you either avoid the guys with good saves or take out a lynchpin model providing buffs.

All-tank armies seem like they could be nasty, but in a game where you can take an entire army of super-heavy walkers I don't think they will stand out as the most broken option out there.

No it gives the ability to assign hits if they roll 6s. Unlike eldar pathfinders where all hits are precision shots.

Except it doesn't say 6's give Precision Shots, it simply says the unit gains Precision Shot. Compare that to the wording for Sniper weapons and Characters, which say something along the lines of 6's to hit result in Precision Shots.

Though I think it's probably intended to be only 6's, that's not how it's worded.

That's how I interpret it.

Precision shots only occur on a 6. You shoot normally and any 6's you roll to hit you can place the hit on a specific model in a squad. You then roll to wound against that specific model and if you get a wound, then the model makes its save against that wound if is has one (Armor, Cover, or Invulnerable) as normal.

I can see it being useful if you want to force a wound or two on a sergeant or equivalent character in a squad near your line (Veteran Sergeant, Exarch, Warlock, etc.)

Good times. I'm excited to see some more of this info come down the pipe in the near future. Maybe one more new tank revealed this weekend? We'll see.

Take it easy for now.

-Red__Thirst-

Unless Games Workshop tm the dead latin language, they should just stop creating nonsense names.

I would hope the ST codex allows for more than just valks/chimeras but seeing as they are the most effective I'll take it.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
And armored company was awesome when they came out.

 Red__Thirst wrote:
That's how I interpret it.

Precision shots only occur on a 6. You shoot normally and any 6's you roll to hit you can place the hit on a specific model in a squad. You then roll to wound against that specific model and if you get a wound, then the model makes its save against that wound if is has one (Armor, Cover, or Invulnerable) as normal.

I can see it being useful if you want to force a wound or two on a sergeant or equivalent character in a squad near your line (Veteran Sergeant, Exarch, Warlock, etc.)

Yeah, I think that's what is intended, but its definitely not how it's worded. The reason precision shots for snipers and characters happen on a 6 is because it is specifically stated in their respective rules that it only happens on a 6.

Sniper rifles:

"each To Hit roll of a 6 results in a Precision Shot"

For Characters:
"If any of your character's shots roll 6 To Hit, these are Precision Shots. Wounds from Precision Shots are allocated agaisnt a model (or models) of your choice in the target unit"

So a Precision shot = you allocate the wounds. The fact they occur on 6's is due to the way the Sniper and Character rules are worded... the "Take Aim!" order is not worded the same way.

Though I think it's intended to only be 6's otherwise it ends up being very powerful, give the order to an infantry blob with a couple of Lascannons and watch special weapons vanish.

Well what exactly does the precision shot entry in the BRB say?

If it doesn't get errata'd the low guardsman may have just become the greatest shot in the galaxy.

Not that I'd complain.

And that shows us again how much GW's design team reads and playtests their own rules

M.

I've been thinking about swapping the tracks for wheels and using the tracks to make some rapiers. as the transport would look nicer with wheels IMO.

 Las wrote:
Well what exactly does the precision shot entry in the BRB say?

If it doesn't get errata'd the low guardsman may have just become the greatest shot in the galaxy.

Not that I'd complain.

This is the EXACT entry for precision shots, page 63 of the BRB. Sniper rule directs to this entry to understand precision shots

PRECISION SHOTS
If any of your character's shots roll 6 To Hit, these are Precision Shots.
Rounds from Precision Shots are allocated against
a model (or models) of your choice in the target unit,
as long as it is in range, rather than following the normal
rules for wound allocation. This means that Precision Shots
can be allocated against enemies with specialist weaponry, or
even characters! A character that has a Precision Shot Wound
allocated to it can still make a Look Out, Sir roll

The guard order does not grant the sniper rule. It grants Precision Shots. This is how Precision Shots are worded in the BRB.

 brochtree wrote:
I've been thinking about swapping the tracks for wheels and using the tracks to make some rapiers. as the transport would look nicer with wheels IMO.

GENIUS!
Thanks for this marvelous idea.

 Las wrote:
Well what exactly does the precision shot entry in the BRB say?

If it doesn't get errata'd the low guardsman may have just become the greatest shot in the galaxy.

Not that I'd complain.

Interestingly enough, Precision Shot is a rule that is only spelled out in the Characters section, not the Special Rules section. In there, it specifies that "any of your character's shots roll 6 to hit, these are Precision Shots", following which, it explains what Precision Shot does. Sniper similarly points out that a weapon with "Sniper" or a model with the same, benefits from the "special rule" of "Precision Shot" on a to hit of 6.

The order card doesn't say anything about needing a specified roll to get "Precision Shot", and so I expect a day 1 FAQ.

Ork mobs with painboys and other assorted infantry characters are going to love that order as is :O

M.

I think its safe to say that while the rule says, right now, that technically all the shots are precision shots, doing it against another player is probably a bad idea. It's pretty clear that the order was only intending for you to get the shot on 6's. If it was allowing all hits to be allocated at will, it would be a very expensive order and extremely powerful.

It'll probably be part of a day 1 errata, but if it isn't, players will remember the IG guys who abused it and odds are they will avoid playing you.

This is no comment on whether its "right" or "wrong", merely that if you try to play it that way, people WILL remember it. Especially when their own special loophole becomes available.

So while I may technically be able to play that way, I certainly wouldn't. Its hard enough to find a good group these days without ticking off the other players.

 MrMoustaffa wrote:
I think its safe to say that while the rule says, right now, that technically all the shots are precision shots, doing it against another player is probably a bad idea. It's pretty clear that the order was only intending for you to get the shot on 6's. If it was allowing all hits to be allocated at will, it would be a very expensive order and extremely powerful.

It'll probably be part of a day 1 errata, but if it isn't, players will remember the IG guys who abused it and odds are they will avoid playing you.

This is no comment on whether its "right" or "wrong", merely that if you try to play it that way, people WILL remember it. Especially when their own special loophole becomes available.

So while I may technically be able to play that way, I certainly wouldn't. Its hard enough to find a good group these days without ticking off the other players.

A worse idea than Vendetta spam, screamerstar, or any other lamented tactic with how things are? Lets actually play with the orders with the new dex before we declare it the most broken thing in the world that's guaranteed to be fixed immediately.

And again, if you read my post, I didn't make one comment on whether it was game breaking, "right or wrong", or anything like that. I just stated that that's how most OTHER players will probably view it.

Think what your reaction would be as a non IG player. Some IG player walks into your store, plays a game vs you, and suddenly says "that 40 man platoon with lascannons and plasma all have precision shot this turn for all their hits, not just 6's." If Tau or Eldar got an ability like that, people would be having a cow right now.

That's all I'm saying. Other players will not like the rule being played that way and will probably view you the same as a guy who ran screamerstar, vendetta spam, whatever.

I don't give a gak how you play it, just realize that others will

When you make comments such as "It will probably recieve a day 1 erratta" and "other plays will remember you played it this way", it implies either a negative connotation, or that others may. If it is your negative connotation, my statement stands. if you are merely implying that others may feel upset about it, bugger for them. In a game where we've had to deal with Nob Wound rotating, Screamerstars, Deep Striking Landraiders, and other schenanigans, I will NOT stare a gift-horse in the mouth, even if it means I can use lascannons to snipe a character and all specials out of a squad.

I play the game by the rules. Morality or preceptions of jackassery quite simply do not factor into it. If you play against people that cry unfair, tell them to play by the European Team Championship ruleset. I play with the understanding that this game will never be made fair by Games-Workshop, and there are certain things that are extremely difficult to deal with. But the point is I don't stop playing with someone over it. I move on to the next game.

 kir44n wrote:

 MrMoustaffa wrote:
I think its safe to say that while the rule says, right now, that technically all the shots are precision shots, doing it against another player is probably a bad idea. It's pretty clear that the order was only intending for you to get the shot on 6's. If it was allowing all hits to be allocated at will, it would be a very expensive order and extremely powerful.

It'll probably be part of a day 1 errata, but if it isn't, players will remember the IG guys who abused it and odds are they will avoid playing you.

This is no comment on whether its "right" or "wrong", merely that if you try to play it that way, people WILL remember it. Especially when their own special loophole becomes available.

So while I may technically be able to play that way, I certainly wouldn't. Its hard enough to find a good group these days without ticking off the other players.

A worse idea than Vendetta spam, screamerstar, or any other lamented tactic with how things are? Lets actually play with the orders with the new dex before we declare it the most broken thing in the world that's guaranteed to be fixed immediately.

I'm not going to say it's worse than whatever spammy lists are around right now, but it would be pretty damned powerful and makes sniper squads pretty damned pointless. Why buy a sniper who wounds on a 4, the enemy still gets their armour save and needs a 6 to pick out a special weapon in a squad when you can instead just order a Heavy Weapons unit of Lascannons to fire at a unit, all of them can pick their targets, wounding on a 2+ and no armour saves allowed.

Honestly I would be pretty excited if that means my sabre platforms get auto precision shots. Even if you need 6's, with TL that's a good chance.

At the same time I totally agree that it would be ridiculously powerful.

precision shots are only on 6's calm yourselves

jae4x4 wrote:
precision shots are only on 6's calm yourselves

Reread the exact rules for Precision shots higher up the page, taken directly from page 63 of the BRB if you don't take it at face value.

 PuddlePirate wrote:

General Hobbs wrote:

Have we seen the heads in the red box?

Right is from the hellhound and left is from the baneblade

I want that green, and I want that orange, right now. What colors are those!?!?

 kir44n wrote:

 Las wrote:
Well what exactly does the precision shot entry in the BRB say?

If it doesn't get errata'd the low guardsman may have just become the greatest shot in the galaxy.

Not that I'd complain.

This is the EXACT entry for precision shots, page 63 of the BRB. Sniper rule directs to this entry to understand precision shots

PRECISION SHOTS
If any of your character's shots roll 6 To Hit, these are Precision Shots.
Rounds from Precision Shots are allocated against
a model (or models) of your choice in the target unit,
as long as it is in range, rather than following the normal
rules for wound allocation. This means that Precision Shots
can be allocated against enemies with specialist weaponry, or
even characters! A character that has a Precision Shot Wound
allocated to it can still make a Look Out, Sir roll

The guard order does not grant the sniper rule. It grants Precision Shots. This is how Precision Shots are worded in the BRB.

The only precedent for getting precision shots is on a to hit roll of a 6. I believe there are a few units that may get them on 5s, or something, but the baseline is a to hit roll of 6, so odds are that is what the order means.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
I'm not going to say it's worse than whatever spammy lists are around right now, but it would be pretty damned powerful and makes sniper squads pretty damned pointless.

I'm not actually convinced that Ratlings had much of a use in the first place. Bless 'em. I don't think they've been changed for three editions (apart from gaining Stealth and becoming cheaper), so maybe GW will change them slightly this time around so that they have more of a use.

 BunkerBob wrote:

 PuddlePirate wrote:

General Hobbs wrote:

Have we seen the heads in the red box?

Right is from the hellhound and left is from the baneblade

I want that green, and I want that orange, right now. What colors are those!?!?

Hmmm, orange is probably Tau light Ochre and i will assume the dark green is Caliban Green and the lighter is probably Castellan Green

Heafstaag wrote:

 kir44n wrote:

 Las wrote:
Well what exactly does the precision shot entry in the BRB say?

If it doesn't get errata'd the low guardsman may have just become the greatest shot in the galaxy.

Not that I'd complain.

This is the EXACT entry for precision shots, page 63 of the BRB. Sniper rule directs to this entry to understand precision shots

PRECISION SHOTS
If any of your character's shots roll 6 To Hit, these are Precision Shots.
Rounds from Precision Shots are allocated against
a model (or models) of your choice in the target unit,
as long as it is in range, rather than following the normal
rules for wound allocation. This means that Precision Shots
can be allocated against enemies with specialist weaponry, or
even characters! A character that has a Precision Shot Wound
allocated to it can still make a Look Out, Sir roll

The guard order does not grant the sniper rule. It grants Precision Shots. This is how Precision Shots are worded in the BRB.

The only precedent for getting precision shots is on a to hit roll of a 6. I believe there are a few units that may get them on 5s, or something, but the baseline is a to hit roll of 6, so odds are that is what the order means.

All of Illic Nightspear's shots (and his unit of Pathfinders) are Precision Shots regardless of roll.

"Sharpshot: Shots fired by models with this special rule (excluding Snap Shots) are always precision shots."

It appears that the intent is that there is a distinction between the rule regarding 6's to hit and the hits which can be allocated by the firing player. However they gave both concepts exactly the same name, which undermines any attempt to figure out which of the two they're talking about.

Heafstaag wrote:

 kir44n wrote:

 Las wrote:
Well what exactly does the precision shot entry in the BRB say?

If it doesn't get errata'd the low guardsman may have just become the greatest shot in the galaxy.

Not that I'd complain.

This is the EXACT entry for precision shots, page 63 of the BRB. Sniper rule directs to this entry to understand precision shots

PRECISION SHOTS
If any of your character's shots roll 6 To Hit, these are Precision Shots.
Rounds from Precision Shots are allocated against
a model (or models) of your choice in the target unit,
as long as it is in range, rather than following the normal
rules for wound allocation. This means that Precision Shots
can be allocated against enemies with specialist weaponry, or
even characters! A character that has a Precision Shot Wound
allocated to it can still make a Look Out, Sir roll

The guard order does not grant the sniper rule. It grants Precision Shots. This is how Precision Shots are worded in the BRB.

The only precedent for getting precision shots is on a to hit roll of a 6. I believe there are a few units that may get them on 5s, or something, but the baseline is a to hit roll of 6, so odds are that is what the order means.

The only precedents (that I can recall off-hand) being character shooting attacks(as above on a 6) and the sniper special rule (which states within ITS rules that rolls of 6 to hit grant Precision Shot).

However the order as it is presently written does not say that it grants the shooting unit sniper. The order states that the unit has the Precision Shot Special Rule, which means all hits are resolved as precision shots.

Heafstaag wrote:

 kir44n wrote:

 Las wrote:
Well what exactly does the precision shot entry in the BRB say?

If it doesn't get errata'd the low guardsman may have just become the greatest shot in the galaxy.

Not that I'd complain.

This is the EXACT entry for precision shots, page 63 of the BRB. Sniper rule directs to this entry to understand precision shots

PRECISION SHOTS
If any of your character's shots roll 6 To Hit, these are Precision Shots.
Rounds from Precision Shots are allocated against
a model (or models) of your choice in the target unit,
as long as it is in range, rather than following the normal
rules for wound allocation. This means that Precision Shots
can be allocated against enemies with specialist weaponry, or
even characters! A character that has a Precision Shot Wound
allocated to it can still make a Look Out, Sir roll

The guard order does not grant the sniper rule. It grants Precision Shots. This is how Precision Shots are worded in the BRB.

The only precedent for getting precision shots is on a to hit roll of a 6. I believe there are a few units that may get them on 5s, or something, but the baseline is a to hit roll of 6, so odds are that is what the order means.

Low on a normal model, but think of a 40 man squad going at something...because i am...an enjoying it!

Plus i use snipers, do i get a double precision shot? (Or re-rolls?).

 snorri788 wrote:

 Lone Cat wrote:
The new vehicle. "Wyvern" looks very 'new'. it looks nothing historical and it is quite like mounting Thudd gun on Chimaera chassis and its functions suppressed Griffon. nice!

Spoiler:

Or did anyone try this thing in WW2? how good it is?

I like that. Looks quite nice.

If the Barrels were a little bit wider it would be a great Angry Marine delivery system

 generalchaos34 wrote:

 BunkerBob wrote:
I want that green, and I want that orange, right now. What colors are those!?!?

Hmmm, orange is probably Tau light Ochre and i will assume the dark green is Caliban Green and the lighter is probably Castellan Green

I could be wrong, but I think Castellan Green is much darker than lighter green on those models. If I were to have a guess, I'd say the lighter green is maybe Elysian Green.

stop trying to find loopholes in the wording of the text!

Give the order...
Shoot...
On 6's you get the precision shots...

Not every shot in the squad automatically has precision shots!