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Made in us
Sword-Wielding Bloodletter of Khorne





I've always wanted to include Traitor Guard with my Chaos Marines, and now I think they'd be really strong together.
What do ya'll think?

I'm particularly interested in the Eradicator. The tank can wipe out units arming a quad gun and free up space for the Heldrake on turn 1. CSM can kill Marines quite well, and the this tank can kill just about anything else.
I'm also not sure if the the Wyvern is better as an alternative. Both ignore cover, but this the Eradicator has higher strength and better armor. It's hard to know.

What do you guys think? Can the new IG counter balance the weaknesses of Chaos?
   
Made in ru
!!Goffik Rocker!!






Punisher (2*MM, LC, Pask, Dozer) + Eradicator (2xHB, HB, Dozer)

+Some troops. I prefer cammo vets with 3 sniper rifles and autocannon to sit on a point while my ork hoard aproaches backed with those mighty leman russes.

However, you have baledrakes so you shouldn't care bout cover-lurking guyz too much and drake's much more effective than eradicator, though is not around turn 1. However, Pask-punisher is an awesome tank you'll definitely find helpful in any situation.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/04/22 11:16:11


 
   
Made in us
Stone Bonkers Fabricator General





Beijing, China

Once you are thinking of taking CSM and AM together you start to question why you were ever taking cultists. Conscripts are SOOOO much better, with a priest.


I pretty quickly changed all my Dark Aposiles into Priests with cinematic armor and attached them to conscripts(my new cultists)

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Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




SC

How do they play out better for you Exergy? I'm sitting on 80 cultists (zombies really) and about 100 guard.

My thoughts were to use Basilisks and maybe now even a Leman Russ HQ tank to fill the long range holes in my CSM list and maybe 2 squads of vets in Chimeras with plasma. But if you've got a better thing going with conscripts I'd be interested in hearing about it.

 
   
Made in us
Stone Bonkers Fabricator General





Beijing, China

 Wingeds wrote:
How do they play out better for you Exergy? I'm sitting on 80 cultists (zombies really) and about 100 guard.

My thoughts were to use Basilisks and maybe now even a Leman Russ HQ tank to fill the long range holes in my CSM list and maybe 2 squads of vets in Chimeras with plasma. But if you've got a better thing going with conscripts I'd be interested in hearing about it.


well at least zombies are fearless, that requires typhus though who i am not a big fan of.

cultists are 4ppm but have to pay for their 10 point champion tax and then come with CCW and pistol, meaning minimal shooting, unless you buy them autoguns and then they are 5ppm.

I would much rather have 3ppm BS2 guys who can take orders. Yes there is a PCS/platoon tax but the huge number of bodies who can shoot with rapid fire weapons is priceless. When you are fielding 40 of them, that's 80 points less for the PCS and jazz taxes.

Dark Mechanicus and Renegade Iron Hand Dakka Blog
My Dark Mechanicus P&M Blog. Mostly Modeling as I paint very slowly. Lots of kitbashed conversions of marines and a few guard to make up a renegade Iron Hand chapter and Dark Mechanicus Allies. Bionics++  
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Vallejo, CA

There are three main things that guard offers chaos. Reliable access to divination (but the allies matrix makes this a problem), aircraft, and AV14.

Lascannon preds are cool, but they're not as cool as lascannon/multimelta vanquishers.


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Made in us
Sword-Wielding Bloodletter of Khorne





 Ailaros wrote:
There are three main things that guard offers chaos. Reliable access to divination (but the allies matrix makes this a problem), aircraft, and AV14.

Lascannon preds are cool, but they're not as cool as lascannon/multimelta vanquishers.



Also inexpensive and effective offensive weaponry. We've been limited in our tech (the bare bones SM equipment like Lascannons, Meltaguns, Autocannons, etc.) as our strong ranged stuff usually is equipped onto mediocre/expensive/unremarkable units.

The guard HS weapons in general are strong, inexpensive, and the tanks have decent to great armor. We should use these. I struggle with which Tank to take for the HS slot.
I think the top three are the Vanquisher, the Eradicator, and the Battle Tank.

Vanquisher:
Is a 165 point Vanquisher worth it? I usually end up facing ADLs. With guard BS and the 4+ cover, I feel like the vanquisher's shots be somewhat ineffective. I'd also have to move a bit to get close with the MMs, meaning I can only fire 1 weapon at a time and snap the rest. If you stay back, the you just get 1 LC and the Vanquisher Battle Cannon, which is meh for 165 points.

Eradicator:
I feel like the Eradicator will do a lot more for less points against these types of armies. If you face marines, yeah the Eradicator is not too effective, but it'll still deal out a fair number of wounds. Easily boostable with Heavy Bolters added.

Battle Tank: It's a battlecannon on a well armored tank. It's practically shooty version of our defiler at 50 points less, awesome. I think CSM can handle 3+ armor though without the battle cannon. The precious HS slot should be taken by a unit that can counter out some of the weaknesses of the CSM codex.


   
Made in gb
Junior Officer with Laspistol




Manchester, UK

crimson_caesar wrote:
Vanquisher: Is a 165 point Vanquisher worth it? I usually end up facing ADLs. With guard BS and the 4+ cover, I feel like the vanquisher's shots be somewhat ineffective. I'd also have to move a bit to get close with the MMs, meaning I can only fire 1 weapon at a time and snap the rest. If you stay back, the you just get 1 LC and the Vanquisher Battle Cannon, which is meh for 165 points.


Russes are heavy, so can move and fire all weapons normally (barring ordnance causing snap fire), so you can move the vanquisher as much as you want.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/04/23 12:19:46


The Tvashtan 422nd "Fire Leopards" - Updated 19/03/11

"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity." - Hanlon's Razor 
   
Made in us
Sword-Wielding Bloodletter of Khorne





 Trickstick wrote:
crimson_caesar wrote:
Vanquisher: Is a 165 point Vanquisher worth it? I usually end up facing ADLs. With guard BS and the 4+ cover, I feel like the vanquisher's shots be somewhat ineffective. I'd also have to move a bit to get close with the MMs, meaning I can only fire 1 weapon at a time and snap the rest. If you stay back, the you just get 1 LC and the Vanquisher Battle Cannon, which is meh for 165 points.


Russes are heavy, so can move and fire all weapons normally (barring ordnance causing snap fire), so you can move the vanquisher as much as you want.


Oh sweet! Sorry, not used to IG tanks. So you can fire a LC at full BS, but it'll still take a while to get in MM range.
   
Made in ru
!!Goffik Rocker!!






And they're 135 pts now. + multimeltas + lazcannon and you get 185. + Dozer and 190. But personally i prefer Pasknisher cause it's main gun is good at killing anything. And very often often better at killing tanks than vanquisher. Expensive though.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





VA, USA

I also have a CSM/AM combined army. The guard provide some much needed fire support in the form of a manticore along with some scouting sentinels for back field shenanigans that chaos usually dont have access to. My HQ is a CCS with quad sniper rifles and MoO. I love using guard and CSMs together. They synergize and it's very fluffy.

While they are singing "what a friend we have in the greater good", we are bringing the pain! 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka



Chicago, Illinois

I think the main thing to do when Allying with IG is taking advantage of possibly getting Two HS with the ability to take LRBT in the HQ section now.

Also the way Platoons Work w/ Access to cheap heavy weaponry.

The big things that Chaos doesn't have access to is mass cheap fire power and the IG have that in like tons.

Your Heldrakes are arguably the best vehicle/ flyer in the entire game for dealing with infantry.
The only thing that chaos really lacks is like someone stated Long Range Stopping Power which the Imperial Guard can more than make up for with it's Platoons , Tanks , and Heavy Support.

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Longtime Dakkanaut






I'm playing around with a CSM and IG list...

Typhus
2 x 35 Plague Zombies
2 Heldrakes w/ Bale Flamers

Pask Punisher & Demolisher

Vanquisher & Executioner

Vets w/ a Psyker in a Chimera


Hide the Chimera vets behind the 4 AV14 hulls and use the Zombies to create a nice melta-proof buffer zone up front. It largely doesn't care tooooo much about the S7 shooting. Sure it'll kill zombies but it won't really touch the Russes.

Tier 1 is the new Tactical.

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http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/30/355940.page 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




SC

I've been toying around with something like this, points irrelevant, just a bare bones idea with CSM and IG.

Huron
Chaos Lord on Bike, MOS
Noise Marines x10 (w/ sonic blasters) IoE
Noise Marines x10 (w/ sonic blasters) IoE
Oblit x2 (maybe MON)
Oblit x2(maybe MON)
Oblit x2 (maybe MON)
6 MOS bikers, 2 meltas
Heldrake with Baleflamer

Leman Russ Tank Commander, Vanquisher
2-3 Veteran Squads with w/e special weapons I need to tailor in OR a Platoon, Chimeras maybe
Manticore

Deep Strike 2 or 3 of the Oblit Squads, Infiltrate at least 2 squads of the noise marines into cover. IG hold the back field, Noise Marines hold the center, Bikers take a flank, Oblits and Manticore mess up their back field.

 
   
 
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