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 Colpicklejar wrote:
So I know that the last-minute jetbike boost strategy is much maligned recently, but does anyone think that with the advent of these new tactical objectives, having a mobile force will be more important than ever?

Quite interesting.

I think the most important thing in 7th with be a survivable mobile force. 3 man jetbike squads will be killed en-route to the objective, but marines in a rhino may have a better chance of making it.

What happened to this rumor a few days ago?

Edition is presented in a new format, 3 hardcover books in a slipcover. Page count of all three is about 450 pages in total:

The Rulebook: @200 pages, only rules

The Grimdark: @100 pages - Fluff and history of the Warhammer universe

The Hobby: @100 pages - Full miniatures and hobby book. All splash pics, and intro to the hobby stuff.

 xttz wrote:

 undertow wrote:

It's been said a few times already, but it's a bit early to get worked up about this. We don't know the rules for conjured units yet, we don't know if they have to DS onto the field, or if they're placed and can act normally. The sky isn't falling ... yet

I'm a little more curious as to the rules for picking / re-rolling conjuration powers. How many people are going to buy and paint up a greater daemon model based on the 1 in 6 chance they roll Possession? What if you don't own enough daemons to cast the Primaris more than once? It would be poor form to stick people with useless powers all game all under the aim of BUY MORE DAEMONS.

I don't know, but one of my sons plays CSM, and I'd have no issue letting him use the Daemons I'm not planning on putting on the table. I have a Bloodthirster model, but as someone else already said, putting a GD on the table without any Master Levels or Gift results in a much less durable unit. A naked LoC will have a 5++, and no way to gain any additional durability through Daemonic Rewards. It looks like the Heralds can get 30 points worth of options, but the larger Daemons cannot. And if you can't start them Swooping, they're going to die fast.

 undertow wrote:

 xttz wrote:

 undertow wrote:

It's been said a few times already, but it's a bit early to get worked up about this. We don't know the rules for conjured units yet, we don't know if they have to DS onto the field, or if they're placed and can act normally. The sky isn't falling ... yet

I'm a little more curious as to the rules for picking / re-rolling conjuration powers. How many people are going to buy and paint up a greater daemon model based on the 1 in 6 chance they roll Possession? What if you don't own enough daemons to cast the Primaris more than once? It would be poor form to stick people with useless powers all game all under the aim of BUY MORE DAEMONS.

I don't know, but one of my sons plays CSM, and I'd have no issue letting him use the Daemons I'm not planning on putting on the table. I have a Bloodthirster model, but as someone else already said, putting a GD on the table without any Master Levels or Gift results in a much less durable unit. A naked LoC will have a 5++, and no way to gain any additional durability through Daemonic Rewards. It looks like the Heralds can get 30 points worth of options, but the larger Daemons cannot. And if you can't start them Swooping, they're going to die fast.

Maybe GWs idea of balance?

 Colpicklejar wrote:
So I know that the last-minute jetbike boost strategy is much maligned recently, but does anyone think that with the advent of these new tactical objectives, having a mobile force will be more important than ever?

Quite interesting.

Stuff like Bikes, Jetbikes, Jump infantry and possibly troops with DS ability (although this is a one-shot) could mean the difference between victory and defeat.

Either that or play AM/ Nids and flood the board with troop choices so you can score all the objectives at once and damn the casualties.

 MWHistorian wrote:
Here's a write up about why D&D 4th ed failed. There are many similarities to design, player base and what makes a good game that I think are interesting and sometimes highly applicable to the situation GW and us players face right now. One thing I like was when he said "but what the players want and what is good for the game is seldom the same thing."
I also think that 4th ed is an example of bad marketing and bad design (in a certain way, it was a well crafted game, but it wasn't much fun.)

How is this applicable to 40k?
Here's the first paragraph. Switch some names and editions to GW, 40k, 7th ed, etc and you get the picture. I suggest reading more in the article because its very well written and very interesting.

So, Dungeons & Dragons 5th Edition has been announced, and the news has struck the sort of reaction I expected it to. People are hoping for this feature or that. Others are expressing their dismay at the fact that a new edition is coming so soon on the heels of D&D: Essentials. Yet others are suggesting that this heralds the end of Dungeons & Dragons, that a new edition will make the already split RPG community even more fractious. There are yet others that have met the news with incredible, soul-crushing apathy. So, there’s that.

http://giantsbridge.blogspot.com/2012/01/why-fourth-edition-died.html

This is one of the worst write ups on 4e I have ever seen. Seriously.

I would love to see "explodes" removed from the damage chart. if 5-6 immobilized, then suddenly vehicles matter again.

Makes Tervigons very interesting.

Are there any underused units that make a comeback? I have 10 breacher marines on their way in the mail.

Big IMO, but if there was ever a time the community should be patient is now. Let the book hit and let reviewers do their thing. Watch battle reports, read articles, etc. if the book is $85 USD, that's equivalents to the rules for three other games. The HHHobby book and fluff will be recycled content and you can find better on Dakka or one of the many 40k wikis.

I'd recommend to not preorder and wait. Don't allow what feels to be a cash grab to be successful. The having three books is nice, but if you can't just buy what's important on its own for day one for $35 or less, then it's entirely a rip off. Don't let the sunk cost of your armies clout your better judgement. Use your 6E rules and keep dice rolling. The mere fact that your $75 rule book from less than two years ago hasn't received any FAQs for over a year should be incredibly telling. They'd rather sell you new rules than support you as a customer.

Personally I'll be pre-ordering the new BBB (book, book, book), the objective cards and the psychic cards as soon as possible. I like the look of what I've seen and I like the idea of splitting the big book into 3 mini ones. Much easier to cart around.

What can I say, I'm a hopeless GW junkie and I'll happily throw money at them for whatever they want.

 Lobukia wrote:
I would love to see "explodes" removed from the damage chart. if 5-6 immobilized, then suddenly vehicles matter again.

And melta becomes useless. Yeah! Great idea! Do not forget to nerf flamethrower too.

I to will be getting one for preorder, more to support (and be able to play at) my flgs than anything else.

 TheKbob wrote:
Big IMO, but if there was ever a time the community should be patient is now. Let the book hit and let reviewers do their thing. Watch battle reports, read articles, etc. if the book is $85 USD, that's equivalents to the rules for three other games. The HHHobby book and fluff will be recycled content and you can find better on Dakka or one of the many 40k wikis.

I'd recommend to not preorder and wait. Don't allow what feels to be a cash grab to be successful. The having three books is nice, but if you can't just buy what's important on its own for day one for $35 or less, then it's entirely a rip off. Don't let the sunk cost of your armies clout your better judgement. Use your 6E rules and keep dice rolling. The mere fact that your $75 rule book from less than two years ago hasn't received any FAQs for over a year should be incredibly telling. They'd rather sell you new rules than support you as a customer.

I'm with you, TheKbob. I am going to give this release time to sort itself out and a review consensus to build up. If everyone waited to verify the release, it would send a strong message to GW. And if the release turns out to be good, then by all means pick it up after some time and enjoy it to your heart's content.

But don't send the message that half the regular lifespan is something you're on-board with.

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

 Lobukia wrote:
I would love to see "explodes" removed from the damage chart. if 5-6 immobilized, then suddenly vehicles matter again.

And melta becomes useless. Yeah! Great idea! Do not forget to nerf flamethrower too.

A lucky shot shouldnt be able to take out a large point costed vehicle in one hit

 spartanlegion wrote:
What happened to this rumor a few days ago?

Edition is presented in a new format, 3 hardcover books in a slipcover. Page count of all three is about 450 pages in total:

The Rulebook: @200 pages, only rules

The Grimdark: @100 pages - Fluff and history of the Warhammer universe

The Hobby: @100 pages - Full miniatures and hobby book. All splash pics, and intro to the hobby stuff.

Confirmed, but those page numbers are wrong:

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

 Lobukia wrote:
I would love to see "explodes" removed from the damage chart. if 5-6 immobilized, then suddenly vehicles matter again.

And melta becomes useless. Yeah! Great idea! Do not forget to nerf flamethrower too.

Wow, or some simply thinking works too... give melta the ability to remove 2 HP or say that if an AP 1 or 2 weapon removes the last hull point, then we get an explodes... or something like that.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 spartanlegion wrote:
What happened to this rumor a few days ago?

Edition is presented in a new format, 3 hardcover books in a slipcover. Page count of all three is about 450 pages in total:

The Rulebook: @200 pages, only rules

The Grimdark: @100 pages - Fluff and history of the Warhammer universe

The Hobby: @100 pages - Full miniatures and hobby book. All splash pics, and intro to the hobby stuff.

Confirmed, but those page numbers are wrong:

Oh. okay. BTW, it says right there this is a 3 book package. I know a few pages ago people were speculating if it was individual books, or a set. There's that answer at least...

Loopstah wrote:
Personally I'll be pre-ordering the new BBB (book, book, book), the objective cards and the psychic cards as soon as possible. I like the look of what I've seen and I like the idea of splitting the big book into 3 mini ones. Much easier to cart around.

What can I say, I'm a hopeless GW junkie and I'll happily throw money at them for whatever they want.

I'll get both card sets next month. But the book... probably pdf for now, the real deal way later

 WrentheFaceless wrote:

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

 Lobukia wrote:
I would love to see "explodes" removed from the damage chart. if 5-6 immobilized, then suddenly vehicles matter again.

And melta becomes useless. Yeah! Great idea! Do not forget to nerf flamethrower too.

A lucky shot shouldnt be able to take out a large point costed vehicle in one hit

I'd like to see the explodes result a 7+ and have AP2 add 1 and AP1 add 2 to your dice roll. Removes the chance for crap weapons to get a lucky explode result but still makes meltaguns useful.

HRR Broadsides would be useful! (stupid nerf, mutter mutter).

 rabidguineapig wrote:

 WrentheFaceless wrote:

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

 Lobukia wrote:
I would love to see "explodes" removed from the damage chart. if 5-6 immobilized, then suddenly vehicles matter again.

And melta becomes useless. Yeah! Great idea! Do not forget to nerf flamethrower too.

A lucky shot shouldnt be able to take out a large point costed vehicle in one hit

I'd like to see the explodes result a 7+ and have AP2 add 1 and AP1 add 2 to your dice roll. Removes the chance for crap weapons to get a lucky explode result but still makes meltaguns useful.

One of my friends told us such idea. It got quite the approval among us.

Co'tor Shas wrote:HRR Broadsides would be useful! (stupid nerf, mutter mutter).

I'm with you. :/

 Jaceevoke wrote:
I to will be getting one for preorder, more to support (and be able to play at) my flgs than anything else.

You could, instead, buy the rules to three to four different games and buy models for each. This supports your FLGS more and it allows them to not to deal with the terrible GW business practices.

If $85 dollars is correct, this could get you the Malifaux rule book, starter box, and a pack of game cards. If everyone in your store did this and waited on the GW book, you'd all be card flipping and supporting a game company that actually listens to their customers.

Spend your money how you wish. I'll be keeping my 40k armies, but until I can get a copy of 7E at $35 or less, it'll be a pass.

I have yet to see a FLGS genuinely enthused about carrying GW products. It's more a necessary beast than a much loved product line.

 TheKbob wrote:

 Jaceevoke wrote:
I to will be getting one for preorder, more to support (and be able to play at) my flgs than anything else.

You could, instead, buy the rules to three to four different games and buy models for each. This supports your FLGS more and it allows them to not to deal with the terrible GW business practices.

I have yet to see a FLGS genuinely enthused about carrying GW products. It's more a necessary beast than a much loved product line.

But my FLGS IS a Games Workshop store!

I'm fine with tank kills being somewhat "random", that's really how they should be, it either penetrates the armor and does something critical, or it doesn't. HP's are really what I don't like, tank's don't just stop working or die after X number of hits, if it doesn't hit something critical it keeps going.

 spartanlegion wrote:

 TheKbob wrote:

 Jaceevoke wrote:
I to will be getting one for preorder, more to support (and be able to play at) my flgs than anything else.

You could, instead, buy the rules to three to four different games and buy models for each. This supports your FLGS more and it allows them to not to deal with the terrible GW business practices.

I have yet to see a FLGS genuinely enthused about carrying GW products. It's more a necessary beast than a much loved product line.

But my FLGS IS a Games Workshop store!

:/ sorry... I drive 45min to get to an awesome game store but they support all the games.

Loopstah wrote:
Personally I'll be pre-ordering the new BBB (book, book, book), the objective cards and the psychic cards as soon as possible. I like the look of what I've seen and I like the idea of splitting the big book into 3 mini ones. Much easier to cart around.

What can I say, I'm a hopeless GW junkie and I'll happily throw money at them for whatever they want.

I agree with you 100%. Ill probably pre-order 2 collector's editions as well as all the cards. One for me, and one for a good friend of mine.

Just thought I would share this.

Apparently vehicles only explode on a "7" on the chart.

So I am guessing that the ap modifiers are staying in, but now if you are not ap 2 or 1 you cant destroy a vehicle in one shot.

Pretty big IMO

 TheKbob wrote:

 Jaceevoke wrote:
I to will be getting one for preorder, more to support (and be able to play at) my flgs than anything else.

You could, instead, buy the rules to three to four different games and buy models for each. This supports your FLGS more and it allows them to not to deal with the terrible GW business practices.

If $85 dollars is correct, this could get you the Malifaux rule book, starter box, and a pack of game cards. If everyone in your store did this and waited on the GW book, you'd all be card flipping and supporting a game company that actually listens to their customers.

Spend your money how you wish. I'll be keeping my 40k armies, but until I can get a copy of 7E at $35 or less, it'll be a pass.

I have yet to see a FLGS genuinely enthused about carrying GW products. It's more a necessary beast than a much loved product line.

Shame that my FLGS only stocks the basics for Malifaux and Flames of War, besides GW products.

 Leth wrote:
Just thought I would share this.

Apparently vehicles only explode on a "7" on the chart.

So I am guessing that the ap modifiers are staying in, but now if you are not ap 2 or 1 you cant destroy a vehicle in one shot.

Pretty big IMO

Are you sure that's not just speculation or wishlisting? It was mentioned earlier in this thread.

 Leth wrote:
Just thought I would share this.

Apparently vehicles only explode on a "7" on the chart.

So I am guessing that the ap modifiers are staying in, but now if you are not ap 2 or 1 you cant destroy a vehicle in one shot.

Pretty big IMO

Sounds great. Source?