40k 7th Edition release 24th may - All info in 1st post, psychic power cards added (5/21)

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**zachwho**

Spoletta wrote:
Demon factory will have many problems, mainly the fact that all those powers are WC 3. You are not going to summon more stuff than i can destroy in a turn, and you will do nothing in the mean time.

The only good power is sacrifice since it's WC 1, but it has it's downsides:

1) It comes after dice generation, so it will not contribute to that phase.
2) It's a fragile as hell model when you get it ML2, 2 guardsman can easily take him out. Worst of all he is conjured after the movement phase, so he can't be put inside a troop. He will NEVER make it to the next turn.

Also, what will you do when an assault army (which will now start appearing) gets on you? You are gonna defend with Tzeenthc heralds (without gifts) and pink horrors (without available dices)?

why do you think assault armies will start appearing now? I've seen nothing that has made them any better.

**MarkyMark**

torgoch wrote:
Key thing is whether summoned creatures come with warp charge (I suspect not) or if they can charge? Has this been answered?

They generate their powers when they appear, and no they cannot add to the warp charge pool or cast powers that psychic phase.

**Spoletta**

zachwho wrote:

why do you think assault armies will start appearing now? I've seen nothing that has made them any better.

Many small reasons (many gunlines nerfed, prescience less available, new move through cover, new night fighting rules etc...)
One BIG reason. Objectives are deployed before you choose your side of the field, this alone is almost game breaking toward assault armies.

**Crimson**

So what 'faction' are summoned daemons part of? Do they count as being from the Daemon faction, thus being Apoc level allies to most armies, or are they treated as part of the same faction as the summoner?

And I'd still like to hear clarification on the scoring status of the transports. Do dedicated transports for troops get 'Objective Secured' in battleforged armies.

**loki old fart**

Da Butcha wrote:
H.B.M.C. wrote:
[
What I mean by "done" is that I've reached the point where I don't want to be burnt any more.

I guess I feel that way, but I'm lucky in that my favorite army has always, always been Orks. I've never been a strong tournament player, and I've always been a "Collect the models I like" guy.
I can stand all of their stupid practices with the orks,. I do have multiple units of boys and nobs . I'm looking forward to orks just to get new models!

You could have wrote this for me, The boyz rule, also I have some thousand sons on hold ATM.

Da Butcha wrote:

So, I'm pretty insulated from edition changes and power creep and meta shifts. I don't have a lot of 'good stuff' nor do I have a lot of 'bad stuff'. However, I can't imagine how frustrating this whole thing is for the person with a competitive army or a themed army. "Just start over" seems to be their mantra at GW.

I would just shut up about it if GW was doing great. If I don't like the direction of the game, but sales are great, and your market share is growing, and your stock price is up? Maybe I'm wrong, or maybe I'm just in the minority. When I don't like the direction of the game, and your share price is down, your sales are down, and your market share is shrinking? Maybe I'm onto something.

I really, really don't want to see GW go belly up, but they seem determined to get out of that hole by digging faster.

Couldn't have put it better, me too, Just start over is ok if your the one receiving the money not paying it. So far this edition they have sold me 1 set of tactical cards. The rest is meh, at best.

**Spoletta**

Crimson wrote:

And I'd still like to hear clarification on the scoring status of the transports. Do dedicated transports for troops get 'Objective Secured' in battleforged armies.

This. I feel that this is the main point that still has to be clarified. This will make the difference between an healthy meta or a double FOC 12x WS spam fest.

**torgoch**

Can summoned demons charge the turn they appear? Whipping up 20 bloodletters in front of my opponent and then assaulting with them sounds pretty dangerous...

**Leth**

How is ramming different and are there any changes to walkers?

**L0rdF1end**

Hmmmm, how can abuse battlebrothers with CSM/Daemons by putting some deamons in a LandRaider...

**Shandara**

L0rdF1end wrote:
Hmmmm, how can abuse battlebrothers with CSM/Daemons by putting some deamons in a LandRaider...

Hmm.. now that's an idea...

**MarkyMark**

http://sanguinesons.blogspot.co.uk/2014/05/new-7th-ed-psychic-phase.html

Run down of how you now cast powers and how you deny them.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Crimson wrote:
So what 'faction' are summoned daemons part of? Do they count as being from the Daemon faction, thus being Apoc level allies to most armies, or are they treated as part of the same faction as the summoner?

And I'd still like to hear clarification on the scoring status of the transports. Do dedicated transports for troops get 'Objective Secured' in battleforged armies.

Already been answered to both questions.

**the shrouded lord**

Shandara wrote:
L0rdF1end wrote:
Hmmmm, how can abuse battlebrothers with CSM/Daemons by putting some deamons in a LandRaider...

Hmm.. now that's an idea...

perhaps they wanted a ride to burger king?

**MarkyMark**

torgoch wrote:
Can summoned demons charge the turn they appear? Whipping up 20 bloodletters in front of my opponent and then assaulting with them sounds pretty dangerous...

Counts as coming from reserve so no.

**jspyd3rx**

Can you give us any changes to chariots?

**HarryMason**

Do Immobilised vehicles are scoring?

Precisely, do we, now, have to kill Drop Pods that arrive near objectives and have the Secured Objectives rules because their unit are a troops?

I read also that Heavy vehicle have some advantage at ramming, how does that works?

Concerning reserve, as it seems the 50% rules is gone, can a full Deathwing army in reserve is now possible or you auto-lose by not having unit on the table?

**jamopower**

It looks like this will be the Warhammer 40.000 Rhana Dandra edition (http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Rhana_Dandra)

**Devil**

Farseer with Spirit Stone can cast Presience with 1WC but my opponnent needs to roll 1 or 2 dices to deny?

**reds8n**

I gather that whilst one can fire witchfire powers from fire points one cannot cast ANY other psychic powers whilst still embarked....?

Movement phase is before the mindmelt phase so you can disembark of course but ... still ....

**xttz**

Devil wrote:
Farseer with Spirit Stone can cast Presience with 1WC but my opponnent needs to roll 1 or 2 dices to deny?

To deny you need to equal the number of successes the caster gets.

If he rolls two dice and one gets 4+, you need to roll at least one 6+ to deny, using as many dice as you want
If he rolls two dice and both get 4+, you need to roll at least two 6+ to deny, using as many dice as you want

**demontalons**

So let me get this straight, since Black Legion and Chaos Space Marines and Crimson Slaughter are in the same Faction then they go in the same Force Org under Combined Arms? So I could have a Sorceror with wargear from Black Legion and troops from Chaos Space Marines?

**tetrisphreak**

xttz wrote:
Devil wrote:
Farseer with Spirit Stone can cast Presience with 1WC but my opponnent needs to roll 1 or 2 dices to deny?

To deny you need to equal the number of successes the caster gets.

If he rolls two dice and one gets 4+, you need to roll at least one 6+ to deny, using as many dice as you want
If he rolls two dice and both get 4+, you need to roll at least two 6+ to deny, using as many dice as you want

The part I like is perils happening before the powers resolve. Players who use their Psykers (warlocks) haphazardly will lose them to the warp instead of summoning tons of daemons.

**Loopstah**

If you take multiple Allied detachments do they need to be from the same faction as each other? Could I take say Marines with a guard allied detachment and a sisters allied detachment?

**xttz**

The D-weapon change made me think of something...

Since it inflicts D3 wounds with saves now allowed, how will you need to save against it? Is it:

A) Roll D3, roll one save per wound, unsaved wounds go through,
or
B) Roll save, if failed roll a D3 and apply that many wounds

**MarkyMark**

In the case of older publications, the faction of all the units described in a codex is the same as the codex title. In the case of supplements, the faction of all the units descibed in that publication is the same as the codex it is a supplement of.

Faction rules are under the detachment rules. I think factions is something that will be in new books (And of course affect supplements).

Automatically Appended Next Post:
You can have as many allies as you want....

**tetrisphreak**

xttz wrote:
The D-weapon change made me think of something...

Since it inflicts D3 wounds with saves now allowed, how will you need to save against it? Is it:

A) Roll D3, roll one save per wound, unsaved wounds go through,
or
B) Roll save, if failed roll a D3 and apply that many wounds

If the chart is worded like the current one it would be apply d3 wounds after 1 save. But I am not sure either.

**MarkyMark**

Nope its not like fantasy, you generate the wound pool then roll saves.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
So just imagine, one guard blob with Dragio, Azreal, Dante, Tiggy, Celestine, Calgar etc in it, LOL.

Also rhino rush may be back, 6 squads of 10 tac marines in rhinos, is 1050, combat squad everything and you have 18 scoring units there alone....

**Mark kelly**

Mark anything on the USR not the hole thing the big ones are hit and run and stealth/shrouding is it still one has it all have it?

**pizzaguardian**

MarkyMark wrote:
Nope its not like fantasy, you generate the wound pool then roll saves.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
So just imagine, one guard blob with Dragio, Azreal, Dante, Tiggy, Celestine, Calgar etc in it, LOL.

Also rhino rush may be back, 6 squads of 10 tac marines in rhinos, is 1050, combat squad everything and you have 18 scoring units there alone....

Rhino rush has been a legitimate tactic for white scars since the 6th dropped. 6 tac marine squads ın rhınos wıth scout...

**MarkyMark**

pizzaguardian wrote:
MarkyMark wrote:
Nope its not like fantasy, you generate the wound pool then roll saves.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
So just imagine, one guard blob with Dragio, Azreal, Dante, Tiggy, Celestine, Calgar etc in it, LOL.

Also rhino rush may be back, 6 squads of 10 tac marines in rhinos, is 1050, combat squad everything and you have 18 scoring units there alone....

Rhino rush has been a legitimate tactic for white scars since the 6th dropped. 6 tac marine squads ın rhınos wıth scout...

It has but hasnt done very well in the UK tourny scene.

**zachwho**

demontalons wrote:
So let me get this straight, since Black Legion and Chaos Space Marines and Crimson Slaughter are in the same Faction then they go in the same Force Org under Combined Arms? So I could have a Sorceror with wargear from Black Legion and troops from Chaos Space Marines?

it appears that way, black legion sorcerer, crimson slaughter possessed as troops, cultists (or zombies) data slates, yada yada....

alot to chose from before you start adding in demon allies in landraiders, lulz!