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There is a somewhat similar case that just closed in Minnesota.
A man had been broken into several times. Two teens broke in again. He shot and killed them both.
The man is going to jail for murder. Apparently, after he shot them and incapacitated them, he walked up and put a few more rounds in them for good measure.
That was where he supposedly crossed the line between protecting himself and killing someone. Seems like a pretty fine line to me.
What a horrible, horrible piece of gak homeowner. It is people like him that give responsible gun owners a bad name.
We were once so close to heaven, St. Peter came out and gave us medals; declaring us "The nicest of the damned".
“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'”
There is a somewhat similar case that just closed in Minnesota.
A man had been broken into several times. Two teens broke in again. He shot and killed them both.
The man is going to jail for murder. Apparently, after he shot them and incapacitated them, he walked up and put a few more rounds in them for good measure.
That was where he supposedly crossed the line between protecting himself and killing someone. Seems like a pretty fine line to me.
I read that the women he executed was still alive at that point, possibly able to be saved with emergency care, and he had hid the bodies for a day before reporting it to police.
The audio, which was played several times in court, captured the sound of glass shattering, Brady descending the basement stairs and Smith shooting Brady three times. Smith can be heard saying, "You're dead." Prosecutors said Smith put Brady's body on a tarp and dragged him into another room, then sat down, reloaded his weapon and waited.
About 10 minutes later, Kifer came downstairs. More shots are heard on the recording, then Kifer's screams, with Smith saying, "You're dying." It's followed soon after by another gunshot, which investigators said Smith described as "a good, clean finishing shot."
The tape continued to run, and Smith was heard referring to the teens as "vermin." Smith waited a full day before asking a neighbor to call police.
Edit: Guilty in my eyes.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2014/05/01 18:54:08
"So, do please come along when we're promoting something new and need photos for the facebook page or to send to our regional manager, do please engage in our gaming when we're pushing something specific hard and need to get the little kiddies drifting past to want to come in an see what all the fuss is about. But otherwise, stay the feth out, you smelly, antisocial bastards, because we're scared you are going to say something that goes against our mantra of absolute devotion to the corporate motherland and we actually perceive any of you who've been gaming more than a year to be a hostile entity as you've been exposed to the internet and 'dangerous ideas'. " - MeanGreenStompa
"Then someone mentions Infinity and everyone ignores it because no one really plays it." - nkelsch
I guess the good news is, in this case the system seems to be working. Guy was arrested and charged with homicide instead of being set free after claiming the castle doctrine defense.
Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings.
Easy E wrote: Now all we need to know is if he would have taken the same actions if it hadn't been a Castle Doctrine state.
Indeed. This very much reads like he thought he'd found a loophole in the law to legally do what he wanted to(and did) do.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/05/01 19:13:06
You know you're really doing something when you can make strangers hate you over the Internet. - Mauleed
Just remember folks. Panic. Panic all the time. It's the only way to survive, other than just being mindful, of course-but geez, that's so friggin' boring. - Aegis Grimm
Hallowed is the All Pie The Before Times: A Place That Celebrates The World That Was
daedalus wrote: I mean, for all you know, the kid was all like, "Oh crap, they forgot to lower their garage door. I'll get that shut for them so they don't get robbed.
I've done this with peoples' cars before.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
CptJake wrote: I guess the good news is, in this case the system seems to be working. Guy was arrested and charged with homicide instead of being set free after claiming the castle doctrine defense.
That's complete BS. It should be Murder One.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/05/01 19:17:23
djones520 wrote: Important life lesson. Don't wander into someones garage after midnight if you don't want a buckshot sandwich.
IN their defense they are in Montana and were actually trying to entrap a very effeminate bear that had been wandering the neighborhood. When hearing German, the wife bounced from PTSD from the Great Oompah Band War and reacted instinctively.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
There is a somewhat similar case that just closed in Minnesota.
A man had been broken into several times. Two teens broke in again. He shot and killed them both.
The man is going to jail for murder. Apparently, after he shot them and incapacitated them, he walked up and put a few more rounds in them for good measure.
That was where he supposedly crossed the line between protecting himself and killing someone. Seems like a pretty fine line to me.
Incorrect. He's going to jail for FOUR COUNTS of cap 1 and cap 2 murder (and damn right too). Thats about as much throwing the book at someone as you can get, considering he was effectively convicted of murdering the same two people, TWICE.
My appreciation for the Minnesota legal system jumped big time.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
daedalus wrote: I mean, for all you know, the kid was all like, "Oh crap, they forgot to lower their garage door. I'll get that shut for them so they don't get robbed.
I've done this with peoples' cars before.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
CptJake wrote: I guess the good news is, in this case the system seems to be working. Guy was arrested and charged with homicide instead of being set free after claiming the castle doctrine defense.
That's complete BS. It should be Murder One.
That is what he is being charged with. Deliberate Homicide is pretty much the same as Murder 1 in Montana. What he is being charged with is punishable by death.
Easy E wrote: Now all we need to know is if he would have taken the same actions if it hadn't been a Castle Doctrine state.
Indeed. This very much reads like he thought he'd found a loophole in the law to legally do what he wanted to(and did) do.
The Minnesota one? Wouldn't have mattered. He's an absolute nut and seriously sounds borderline serial killer. Well technically he is a serial killer.
Killed them and then went to Thanksgiving dinner. Thats Mafia cold.
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sing your life wrote: I guess this is why civilian gun ownership is rare in this country. Atrocious.
yes. It is atrocious that gun ownership is rare in your country. Killers however, aren't.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/05/01 19:41:46
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
This is why I hate things like this, Kansas past a law that says you can shoot a police officer if they illegally enter your home.
Just because you have the means and the ability doesnt mean you have the right to take a life.
Remember that next time you try to steal paperclips.
Dang you Daedalus
I was stapling some reports together and rocket came struck right near the building I was in. I ended stapling the crap out my finger. My commander wanted to put in a Purple Heart for me. Also during the impact we found someone who was carrying a loaded weapon (one in the chamber) and shot the Folger Coffee container to Hell and through the floor into the "Smaj" Tea Maker
Proud Member of the Infidels of OIF/OEF
No longer defending the US Military or US Gov't. Just going to ""**feed into your fears**"" with Duffel Blog Did not fight my way up on top the food chain to become a Vegan...
Warning: Stupid Allergy
Once you pull the pin, Mr. Grenade is no longer your friend
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RIP Muhammad Ali.
Jihadin, Scorched Earth 791. Leader of the Pork Eating Crusader. Alpha
hotsauceman1 wrote: This is why I hate things like this, Kansas past a law that says you can shoot a police officer if they illegally enter your home.
Just because you have the means and the ability doesnt mean you have the right to take a life.
Why is that a bad law? If the police illegally enter your home and you are not sure they are police, why should you be charged for firing on an officer when you legitimately believed you were being assaulted?
"So, do please come along when we're promoting something new and need photos for the facebook page or to send to our regional manager, do please engage in our gaming when we're pushing something specific hard and need to get the little kiddies drifting past to want to come in an see what all the fuss is about. But otherwise, stay the feth out, you smelly, antisocial bastards, because we're scared you are going to say something that goes against our mantra of absolute devotion to the corporate motherland and we actually perceive any of you who've been gaming more than a year to be a hostile entity as you've been exposed to the internet and 'dangerous ideas'. " - MeanGreenStompa
"Then someone mentions Infinity and everyone ignores it because no one really plays it." - nkelsch
That happen to a OIF Vet we discussed awhile back. The one when the breaching team screwed up at the door and had chubster stumble setting off the exchange of gunfire
Proud Member of the Infidels of OIF/OEF
No longer defending the US Military or US Gov't. Just going to ""**feed into your fears**"" with Duffel Blog Did not fight my way up on top the food chain to become a Vegan...
Warning: Stupid Allergy
Once you pull the pin, Mr. Grenade is no longer your friend
DE 6700
Harlequin 2500
RIP Muhammad Ali.
Jihadin, Scorched Earth 791. Leader of the Pork Eating Crusader. Alpha
CptJake wrote: I guess the good news is, in this case the system seems to be working. Guy was arrested and charged with homicide instead of being set free after claiming the castle doctrine defense.
We had better wait for the result of the trial before we can say the system is working. He may get off scot free.
Anyway, this sort of thing can't be covered by legislation. It's a social issue. A certain number of Americans live their lives in fear of home invasions, burglaries un-addressed by the police, and so on, and feel they have to defend their selves with deadly force. The castle doctrine and "stand your ground" laws encourage them. It's obvious to a rational person that you cannot lay a trap,
hotsauceman1 wrote: This is why I hate things like this, Kansas past a law that says you can shoot a police officer if they illegally enter your home.
Just because you have the means and the ability doesnt mean you have the right to take a life.
Why is that a bad law? If the police illegally enter your home and you are not sure they are police, why should you be charged for firing on an officer when you legitimately believed you were being assaulted?
It's actually pretty reasonable for Kansas. The moment we begin treating law enforcement as being themselves above the law is the moment we begin having problems.
hotsauceman1 wrote: Because how do you know they are illegally entering your home. How do you know they didnt see a criminal they where chasing in there.
Castle doctrine laws are typically for people who are inside your house and threatening in some fashion. If he's flashing a badge and yelling "which way did that man go?" he'll be okay.
hotsauceman1 wrote: This is why I hate things like this, Kansas past a law that says you can shoot a police officer if they illegally enter your home.
Just because you have the means and the ability doesnt mean you have the right to take a life.
Why is that a bad law? If the police illegally enter your home and you are not sure they are police, why should you be charged for firing on an officer when you legitimately believed you were being assaulted?
It's actually pretty reasonable for Kansas. The moment we begin treating law enforcement as being themselves above the law is the moment we begin having problems.
Considering the amount of no knock raids now its becoming more understandable.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
hotsauceman1 wrote: Because how do you know they are illegally entering your home. How do you know they didnt see a criminal they where chasing in there.
Castle doctrine laws are typically for people who are inside your house and threatening in some fashion. If he's flashing a badge and yelling "which way did that man go?" he'll be okay.
'
But whose going to pay for the door they broke down?
From whom are unforgiven we bring the mercy of war.
But whose going to pay for the door they broke down?
You probably just want to replace it yourself.
Government work usually turns out like this:
Also, in a lot of counties, you fill out the paperwork and don't actually get it for months or even years.
You know you're really doing something when you can make strangers hate you over the Internet. - Mauleed
Just remember folks. Panic. Panic all the time. It's the only way to survive, other than just being mindful, of course-but geez, that's so friggin' boring. - Aegis Grimm
Hallowed is the All Pie The Before Times: A Place That Celebrates The World That Was
CptJake wrote: I guess the good news is, in this case the system seems to be working. Guy was arrested and charged with homicide instead of being set free after claiming the castle doctrine defense.
That's complete BS. It should be Murder One.
A Missoula man was charged with deliberate homicide Monday for shooting and killing a high school foreign exchange student in his garage a day earlier, allegedly after setting a trap for burglars and announcing that he was waiting up at night to “shoot some (expletive) kid.”
Not sure that charge is BS... I suspect deliberate homicide is what you consider Murder One (which is not a charge in Montana...)
Felonies in Montana range from deliberate murder—the most serious felony crime in the state—to sexual assault, kidnapping, aggravated assault, robbery, and criminal distribution of dangerous drugs. The following are specific examples of felonies and the possible penalties under Montana law:
Deliberate murder – life in prison, 10 to 100 years in prison, or the death penalty.
Negligent homicide – up to 20 years in prison or a fine up to $50,000, or both.
Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings.
And this is why we don't have good samaritans anymore. Now I know to keep on walking if I saw an open garage door and a purse on the car. Doesn't matter if someone might be dying of a heart attack on the other side of the car where I can't see them, I'm not going to risk getting shot by some nutjob.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/05/01 21:23:48
"Through the darkness of future past, the magician longs to see.
One chants out between two worlds: Fire, walk with me." - Twin Peaks
"You listen to me. While I will admit to a certain cynicism, the fact is that I am a naysayer and hatchetman in the fight against violence. I pride myself in taking a punch and I'll gladly take another because I choose to live my life in the company of Gandhi and King. My concerns are global. I reject absolutely revenge, aggression, and retaliation. The foundation of such a method... is love. I love you Sheriff Truman." - Twin Peaks
That is what he is being charged with. Deliberate Homicide is pretty much the same as Murder 1 in Montana. What he is being charged with is punishable by death.
I think people are conveniently ignoring the fact that the people shot in these situations are thieving criminals.
Are the people who allegedly bait thieves onto their property just to kill them douchebags? Yes. Are they completely within their rights to be this kind of douchebag? Also yes. Of course castle law doesn't mean you're allowed to shoot to kill someone after you have already incapacitated them, so in that case the person is a murderer and should go to prison.
But shooting somebody who comes into your garage with the intent to steal is completely justified. Why? Because the only kinds of people who fall for this "bait" are doing so with the intent to commit a crime. This type of thing wouldn't work on me because I'm not thieving scum, so I don't see the problem here. I don't understand how criminals are suddenly some kind of victims.
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