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Made in us
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Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!

 kronk wrote:
Mine didn't either.

But "liberal zombies?"

Dunno... maybe to this old meme?

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Conservatives and Zombies? Neither care about health care!

   
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/07/08 18:51:13


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Somewhere in south-central England.

 whitedragon wrote:
It's almost like you can find a picture on the internet to support any viewpoint you want!


You mean... image macro memes are useless gak!!

There I was believing they are the fount of modern wisdom.

I'm writing a load of fiction. My latest story starts here... This is the index of all the stories...

We're not very big on official rules. Rules lead to people looking for loopholes. What's here is about it. 
   
Made in us
5th God of Chaos! (Ho-hum)





Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!

 d-usa wrote:
Conservatives and Zombies? Neither care about health care!


Heh... like this?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/07/08 19:13:46


Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!


 
   
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 kronk wrote:
Mine didn't either.

But "liberal zombies?"


OPSEC!!!!

They might become intelligent and go to ground trying to be the average citizen. If they don't know we're tracking them then its easier to round them up and/or execute them trying to esca....eerrrr Zombie bite us to spread the infection.

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Leerstetten, Germany

 kronk wrote:
Raven911 wrote:
I hate that term as being disrespectful to America.
It seems to be used a lot lately to slander this country by liberal zombies.


I'm not saying you're brainwashed, but I wouldn't let you within 100 yards of any voting booths.


Don't worry, I fixed it.
   
Made in us
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Fort Campbell

Raven911 wrote:
I hate that term as being disrespectful to America.
It seems to be used a lot lately to slander this country by liberal zombies.


You'll find few that bleed more red then me, and I glory in the term 'Murica!

Just grow a thicker skin.

Full Frontal Nerdity 
   
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Leerstetten, Germany

 djones520 wrote:
Raven911 wrote:
I hate that term as being disrespectful to America.
It seems to be used a lot lately to slander this country by liberal zombies.


You'll find few that bleed more red then me, and I glory in the term 'Murica!

Just grow a thicker skin.


Everything I wore in that picture was purchased in the Walmart July 4th section. No irony there at all!
   
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Poking da Bear

Proud Member of the Infidels of OIF/OEF
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DE 6700
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RIP Muhammad Ali.

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USA

 Jihadin wrote:
Poking da Bear



   
Made in us
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Dumbest thing I ever done was standing out in the open acting like I own the world. Pointing in the direction for my gun shy troopers to shoot back. To the troops I was Hardcore. To the SMAJ I was Stupidity. Think my left arse cheek has grown fully back

Proud Member of the Infidels of OIF/OEF
No longer defending the US Military or US Gov't. Just going to ""**feed into your fears**"" with Duffel Blog
Did not fight my way up on top the food chain to become a Vegan...
Warning: Stupid Allergy
Once you pull the pin, Mr. Grenade is no longer your friend
DE 6700
Harlequin 2500
RIP Muhammad Ali.

Jihadin, Scorched Earth 791. Leader of the Pork Eating Crusader. Alpha


 
   
Made in us
Blood Angel Captain Wracked with Visions






Delakar wrote:
TBH the mass shootings are doing that quite well on their own.

It weird how the countries with strict gun laws, do not have regular mass killings in schools and running gun battles on the streets.

Who'd have imagined that freely available weaponry might be, you know, dangerous.

It's amazing that States with the strictest gun control have some of the worst gun violence


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kilkrazy wrote:
You mean... image macro memes are useless gak!!

There I was believing they are the fount of modern wisdom.

Only if they have commentary typed in Comic Sans

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/07/09 17:34:33


 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




Illinois

 Dreadclaw69 wrote:

It's amazing that States with the strictest gun control have some of the worst gun violence

You do realize more recent studies have found the exact opposite right?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/06/29/states-gun-violence_n_5541292.html
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/03/07/gun-violence-study-chicago/1969227/
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/study-claims-violence-surges-repeal-gun-control-laws/

   
Made in us
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The Great State of Texas

(looks at number of murders in Chicago in 2013 and this year vs. Houston)

Mmmm no.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
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Apologies, I had meant to say cities in States with strict gun control have some of the worst crime. I should have been more precise with what I was saying.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/06/29/states-gun-violence_n_5541292.html
If you're going to include suicide then that will distort the figures. It also notes that in general crime is higher in these areas.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/03/07/gun-violence-study-chicago/1969227/
Findings from a hospital study that were not supported by the CDC. In addition;
"Despite the findings, researchers did not establish a cause and effect relationship between guns and deaths. Rather, they could only establish an association."

For your last link I can view the errata, but not the article itself

 
   
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Member of the Ethereal Council






 Jihadin wrote:
Dumbest thing I ever done was standing out in the open acting like I own the world. Pointing in the direction for my gun shy troopers to shoot back. To the troops I was Hardcore. To the SMAJ I was Stupidity. Think my left arse cheek has grown fully back

Stupidest thing I have done is question a proffessor in my sociology class.

5000pts 6000pts 3000pts
 
   
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[MOD]
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Somewhere in south-central England.

There is an excellent study by South African surgeons which suggests a considerable cause and effect relationship between getting shot and serious injury/death.

I'm writing a load of fiction. My latest story starts here... This is the index of all the stories...

We're not very big on official rules. Rules lead to people looking for loopholes. What's here is about it. 
   
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WA

 Kilkrazy wrote:
There is an excellent study by South African surgeons which suggests a considerable cause and effect relationship between getting shot and serious injury/death.


I read that people who own guns are more likely to use a gun for suicide than those who don't. Maybe it was the same guy!

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The Great State of Texas

 Kilkrazy wrote:
There is an excellent study by South African surgeons which suggests a considerable cause and effect relationship between getting shot and serious injury/death.


Bullocks, he's just afraid of jumping Great White sharkies.

I heard that people who chew gum are more likely to choke on gum.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
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Illinois

 Frazzled wrote:
(looks at number of murders in Chicago in 2013 and this year vs. Houston)

Mmmm no.

You do relalize there is more to Illinois than Chicago right? Don't feel bad though, as someone who has lived in Illinois all their life but never Chicago I find people make that mistake all the time.

Dreadclaw69 wrote:
Apologies, I had meant to say cities in States with strict gun control have some of the worst crime. I should have been more precise with what I was saying.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/06/29/states-gun-violence_n_5541292.html
If you're going to include suicide then that will distort the figures. It also notes that in general crime is higher in these areas.f

Not really, of the top 10 most crime ridden cities, 5 are in blue states, 4 are in red states and one is a in a swing state. And why should we not include suicide? It is a major problem. And also there is more to states than just cities, and since many laws on gun control are at the state level comparing states makes a lot more sense than just looking at cities.

Dreadclaw69 wrote:
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/03/07/gun-violence-study-chicago/1969227/
Findings from a hospital study that were not supported by the CDC. In addition;
"Despite the findings, researchers did not establish a cause and effect relationship between guns and deaths. Rather, they could only establish an association."

Easy, the CDC wasn't allowed to study gun violence because I guess someone doesn't like people pulling back the certain with facts... Obama did sign a executive order last year letting them do it again. Republicans of course are against this move.

Also "researchers did not establish a cause and effect relationship between guns and deaths. Rather, they could only establish an association" means something like"we need more money and time to look into this but we think something is there". That sort of conclusion is not entirely surprising given the huge lobby movement to kill research on gun violence by republicans and the NRA.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/01/17/gun-research-is-allowed-again-so-what-will-we-find-out/

The simple answer to why we have little data to go about what laws work best/worst for example is because the NRA and the gun lobby spent millions to kill the research funding.

Edit:
For your last link I can view the errata, but not the article itself

It is a short article:
A study claims to have new evidence that proves tighter gun control laws can reduce gun violence. After the repeal of a 2007 Missouri law — a law that required potential gun buyers to be vetted and licensed by a local sheriff — Researchers in Missouri tracked changes to the homicide and non-negligent manslaughter rates.

The report, soon to be published in the Journal of Urban Health, analyzed the data and found there was immediate spike in gun violence and murders, with more than 60 additional gun-related murders per year in Missouri between 2008 and 2012.

“Coincident exactly with the policy change, there was an immediate upward trajectory to the homicide rates in Missouri,” Daniel Webster, one of the lead authors of the study, told the BBC. Webster is also the director of the Johns Hopkins Center for Gun Policy and Research. He believes that the study confirms that strict firearm laws lead to less gun deaths.

Many states have worked to tighten their gun control laws after the December 2012 shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn., but gun and ammunition sellers reported sales had been increasing throughout the past two years. Sellers attributed the spike in gun sales to President Barack Obama’s re-election, CNN reported. Obama spoke out against assault weapons during his 2012 presidential campaign and continued to push for stricter gun control regulations into his second term. Gun sales spiked again after the shooting in Newtown, Conn.

Unlike 2013, guns sales have plummeted in the first few weeks of 2014. According to a CNN Money report, gun industry analyst Rommel Dionisio said, “Retail (gun) inventories, which had been in short supply last spring, have largely returned to normal now.” Outdoor-gear retailer Cabela’s Inc. reported gun and ammo sales were down 50 percent from this time last year. FBI background checks are also down about one-third from January 2013.

The Congressional Research Services estimates that there are over 300 million guns in circulation in the United States.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2014/07/09 19:18:37


 
   
Made in us
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The Great State of Texas

As shown above, Detroit, and Chicago have substantially higher rates. Texas cities are lower. NY is comparable to Texas cities, but evidently their crime rates are rising post Blasio.

You can't say its firearms when there are already severe firearm laws on the books (but not enforced), and the violence is only centered in a few areas.


-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
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Illinois

 Frazzled wrote:
As shown above, Detroit, and Chicago have substantially higher rates. Texas cities are lower. NY is comparable to Texas cities, but evidently their crime rates are rising post Blasio.

You can't say its firearms when there are already severe firearm laws on the books (but not enforced), and the violence is only centered in a few areas.

Looking at the states as whole makes a hell of lot more sense than just looking a few case examples. The fact is that states with more strict gun laws have lower levels of violence, trying to find a few anecdotal examples won't change that.
   
Made in us
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The Great State of Texas

Not especially. Outside of cities crime is minimal anyway. Thew cities are where this is an issue.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
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Dakka Veteran




Illinois

So we should only talk about cities? You do realize there is plenty of crime going on rural areas. Locally drug use is really bad in poor rural areas around where I live.
   
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On moon miranda.

I feel this is an interesting table to look at

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States_by_state

From there, it looks like there's little rhyme or reason to the level of gun control vs gun murder rate.

Hawaii and Idaho have very similar firearms murder rates, but Idaho has nearly 10x the firearm ownership rate, and much laxer firearm laws. Meanwhile, CA, Illinois and NY and TX have roughly similar firearm murder rates (all several multiples above Idaho and Hawaii), but CA and NY have notably lower firearms ownership rates and much stricter gun control laws than TX has, while Illinois state has relatively lax gun laws but Chicago (the state's biggest population center and primary center of most gun violence) has exceedingly strict gun control laws.

Meanwhile Washington DC has *very* strict gun laws, *very* low firearms ownership rates, and sky high firearms murder rates.

While gun violence isn't exclusive to cities, the vast majority of it takes place in cities (especially as most people live in cities).

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/07/09 19:43:57


IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.

New Heavy Gear Log! Also...Grey Knights!
The correct pronunciation is Imperial Guard and Stormtroopers, "Astra Militarum" and "Tempestus Scions" are something you'll find at Hogwarts.  
   
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The Great State of Texas

 Blood Hawk wrote:
So we should only talk about cities? You do realize there is plenty of crime going on rural areas. Locally drug use is really bad in poor rural areas around where I live.


I doubt it had a company's worth of casualties like Chicago did last weekend (so far only two apprehended).

Further I wouldn't trust anything from the Huffington Post.

-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
 
   
Made in us
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 Blood Hawk wrote:
You do relalize there is more to Illinois than Chicago right? Don't feel bad though, as someone who has lived in Illinois all their life but never Chicago I find people make that mistake all the time.

And there is more to Texas than Houstan


 Blood Hawk wrote:
Not really, of the top 10 most crime ridden cities, 5 are in blue states, 4 are in red states and one is a in a swing state. And why should we not include suicide? It is a major problem. And also there is more to states than just cities, and since many laws on gun control are at the state level comparing states makes a lot more sense than just looking at cities.

What does party have to do with gun control? Answer, very little


 Blood Hawk wrote:
Easy, the CDC wasn't allowed to study gun violence because I guess someone doesn't like people pulling back the certain with facts... Obama did sign a executive order last year letting them do it again. Republicans of course are against this move.

Also "researchers did not establish a cause and effect relationship between guns and deaths. Rather, they could only establish an association" means something like"we need more money and time to look into this but we think something is there". That sort of conclusion is not entirely surprising given the huge lobby movement to kill research on gun violence by republicans and the NRA.

Except the CDC did look at gun violence, and the results did not correspond with what the Administration was agitating for. The study was commissioned by Executive Order (so those Evil Republicans couldn't interfere with funding) and it had a budget of $10 million to carry out this study, as well as overturning a ban from 1996 preventing the CDC from studying firearm violence. And what did they report back?
1. Armed citizens are less likely to be injured by an attacker:
“Studies that directly assessed the effect of actual defensive uses of guns (i.e., incidents in which a gun was ‘used’ by the crime victim in the sense of attacking or threatening an offender) have found consistently lower injury rates among gun-using crime victims compared with victims who used other self-protective strategies.”

2. Defensive uses of guns are common:
“Almost all national survey estimates indicate that defensive gun uses by victims are at least as common as offensive uses by criminals, with estimates of annual uses ranging from about 500,000 to more than 3 million per year…in the context of about 300,000 violent crimes involving firearms in 2008.”

3. Mass shootings and accidental firearm deaths account for a small fraction of gun-related deaths, and both are declining:
“The number of public mass shootings of the type that occurred at Sandy Hook Elementary School accounted for a very small fraction of all firearm-related deaths. Since 1983 there have been 78 events in which 4 or more individuals were killed by a single perpetrator in 1 day in the United States, resulting in 547 victims and 476 injured persons.” The report also notes, “Unintentional firearm-related deaths have steadily declined during the past century. The number of unintentional deaths due to firearm-related incidents accounted for less than 1 percent of all unintentional fatalities in 2010.”

4. “Interventions” (i.e, gun control) such as background checks, so-called assault rifle bans and gun-free zones produce “mixed” results:
“Whether gun restrictions reduce firearm-related violence is an unresolved issue.” The report could not conclude whether “passage of right-to-carry laws decrease or increase violence crime.”

5. Gun buyback/turn-in programs are “ineffective” in reducing crime:
“There is empirical evidence that gun turn in programs are ineffective, as noted in the 2005 NRC study Firearms and Violence: A Critical Review. For example, in 2009, an estimated 310 million guns were available to civilians in the United States (Krouse, 2012), but gun buy-back programs typically recover less than 1,000 guns (NRC, 2005). On the local level, buy-backs may increase awareness of firearm violence. However, in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, for example, guns recovered in the buy-back were not the same guns as those most often used in homicides and suicides (Kuhn et al., 2002).”

6. Stolen guns and retail/gun show purchases account for very little crime:
“More recent prisoner surveys suggest that stolen guns account for only a small percentage of guns used by convicted criminals. … According to a 1997 survey of inmates, approximately 70 percent of the guns used or possess by criminals at the time of their arrest came from family or friends, drug dealers, street purchases, or the underground market.”

7. The vast majority of gun-related deaths are not homicides, but suicides:
“Between the years 2000-2010 firearm-related suicides significantly outnumbered homicides for all age groups, annually accounting for 61 percent of the more than 335,600 people who died from firearms related violence in the United States.”

But it must be so much easier to blame the go to boogeymen instead of the findings.


 Blood Hawk wrote:
The simple answer to why we have little data to go about what laws work best/worst for example is because the NRA and the gun lobby spent millions to kill the research funding.

Except for the $10 million, Executive Order enabled CDC study that undermined the case for gun control
And Bloomberg's $50 million being spent on furthering gun control, and setting up "grassroots" campaigns



A study claims to have new evidence that proves tighter gun control laws can reduce gun violence. After the repeal of a 2007 Missouri law — a law that required potential gun buyers to be vetted and licensed by a local sheriff — Researchers in Missouri tracked changes to the homicide and non-negligent manslaughter rates.

The report, soon to be published in the Journal of Urban Health, analyzed the data and found there was immediate spike in gun violence and murders, with more than 60 additional gun-related murders per year in Missouri between 2008 and 2012.

“Coincident exactly with the policy change, there was an immediate upward trajectory to the homicide rates in Missouri,” Daniel Webster, one of the lead authors of the study, told the BBC. Webster is also the director of the Johns Hopkins Center for Gun Policy and Research. He believes that the study confirms that strict firearm laws lead to less gun deaths.

Many states have worked to tighten their gun control laws after the December 2012 shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn., but gun and ammunition sellers reported sales had been increasing throughout the past two years. Sellers attributed the spike in gun sales to President Barack Obama’s re-election, CNN reported. Obama spoke out against assault weapons during his 2012 presidential campaign and continued to push for stricter gun control regulations into his second term. Gun sales spiked again after the shooting in Newtown, Conn.

Unlike 2013, guns sales have plummeted in the first few weeks of 2014. According to a CNN Money report, gun industry analyst Rommel Dionisio said, “Retail (gun) inventories, which had been in short supply last spring, have largely returned to normal now.” Outdoor-gear retailer Cabela’s Inc. reported gun and ammo sales were down 50 percent from this time last year. FBI background checks are also down about one-third from January 2013.

The Congressional Research Services estimates that there are over 300 million guns in circulation in the United States.

Shame that report's findings goes against the national trend, and that there is little else to go on, or even what other factors were considered when the report was compiled. There was also quite a few accusations from John R. Lott Jr., president of Crime Prevention Research Center, that “There is a lot of arbitrary cherry-picking of the data,”, and that the murder rate in Missouri was already on the rise before the study (“Missouri was on an ominous path before the law was ended.”)

http://www.iom.edu/Reports/2013/Priorities-for-Research-to-Reduce-the-Threat-of-Firearm-Related-Violence.aspx
via http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/human_nature/2013/06/handguns_suicides_mass_shootings_deaths_and_self_defense_findings_from_a.html
2. Most indices of crime and gun violence are getting better, not worse. “Overall crime rates have declined in the past decade, and violent crimes, including homicides specifically, have declined in the past 5 years,” the report notes. “Between 2005 and 2010, the percentage of firearm-related violent victimizations remained generally stable.” Meanwhile, “firearm-related death rates for youth ages 15 to 19 declined from 1994 to 2009.” Accidents are down, too: “Unintentional firearm-related deaths have steadily declined during the past century. The number of unintentional deaths due to firearm-related incidents accounted for less than 1 percent of all unintentional fatalities in 2010.”

4. Handguns are the problem. Despite being outnumbered by long guns, “Handguns are used in more than 87 percent of violent crimes,” the report notes. In 2011, “handguns comprised 72.5 percent of the firearms used in murder and non-negligent manslaughter incidents.” Why do criminals prefer handguns? One reason, according to surveys of felons, is that they’re “easily concealable.”

5. Mass shootings aren’t the problem. “The number of public mass shootings of the type that occurred at Sandy Hook Elementary School accounted for a very small fraction of all firearm-related deaths,” says the report. “Since 1983 there have been 78 events in which 4 or more individuals were killed by a single perpetrator in 1 day in the United States, resulting in 547 victims and 476 injured persons.” Compare that with the 335,000 gun deaths between 2000 and 2010 alone.

6. Gun suicide is a bigger killer than gun homicide. From 2000 to 2010, “firearm-related suicides significantly outnumbered homicides for all age groups, annually accounting for 61 percent of the more than 335,600 people who died from firearm-related violence in the United States,” says the report. Firearm sales are often a warning: Two studies found that “a small but significant fraction of gun suicides are committed within days to weeks after the purchase of a handgun, and both also indicate that gun purchasers have an elevated risk of suicide for many years after the purchase of the gun.”

7. Guns are used for self-defense often and effectively. “Almost all national survey estimates indicate that defensive gun uses by victims are at least as common as offensive uses by criminals, with estimates of annual uses ranging from about 500,000 to more than 3 million per year … in the context of about 300,000 violent crimes involving firearms in 2008,” says the report. The three million figure is probably high, “based on an extrapolation from a small number of responses taken from more than 19 national surveys.” But a much lower estimate of 108,000 also seems fishy, “because respondents were not asked specifically about defensive gun use.” Furthermore, “Studies that directly assessed the effect of actual defensive uses of guns (i.e., incidents in which a gun was ‘used’ by the crime victim in the sense of attacking or threatening an offender) have found consistently lower injury rates among gun-using crime victims compared with victims who used other self-protective strategies.”

10. It isn’t true that most gun acquisitions by criminals can be blamed on a few bad dealers. The report concedes that in 1998, “1,020 of 83,272 federally licensed retailers (1.2 percent) accounted for 57.4 percent of all guns traced by the ATF.” However, “Gun sales are also relatively concentrated; approximately 15 percent of retailers request 80 percent of background checks on gun buyers conducted by the National Instant Criminal Background Check System.” Researchers have found that “the share of crime gun traces attributed to these few dealers only slightly exceeded their share of handgun sales, which are almost equally concentrated among a few dealers.” Volume, not laxity, drives the number of ill-fated sales.



http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2013/12/foghorn/guns-violence-united-states-numbers/
As the anniversary of the Newtown shooting approaches, the usual gun control advocacy organizations are gearing up their propaganda campaigns to try and convince us that guns make us less safe, and that the only “common sense” solution to the “gun violence epidemic” is gun control. But as we’ve proven time and again here on this website (and cataloged for you in our Gun Facts section), that’s just not the case. Every claim that gun control advocates make trying to link the existence of guns to violence falls flat on its face when you add a splash of context and some verified numbers. But in preparation for this weekend, I wanted to bring together some of those hard and fast facts, based on verified numbers from the U.S. government (rather than surveys or flawed studies), that illustrate the truth about guns and violence in the United States. This way you’ll have a single post to link to when you come across one of these pro-disarmament articles . . .


Gun Ownership On the Rise


Over the last decade, the number of guns being purchased in the United States has skyrocketed. Just over the last two years, there really hasn’t been a month where the NICS checks (the background check required to buy a firearm from a firearms dealer) has dropped under a million checks per month. The NSSF tracks the number of NICS checks reported by the FBI, and while the numbers are slightly lower than last year around this time (artificially high due to Obama’s re-election) sales are still through the roof. And that doesn’t even count the number of new (factory fresh) gun sales in states where a concealed handgun license exempts the holder from having to pass a NICS check, such as Texas and Virginia.

Ruger is shipping over 1.2 million firearms this year, and that’s just one gun manufacturer — and not even the largest one. Some companies have backlogs of gun orders that will take them up to 2 years to fill, and when those guns do hit the market they’re quickly sold out in stores. Even without the new sales, guns are “durable goods” which means that they last a long time and the existing number of guns in the United States is (by some estimates) enough for eight guns for every ten people in the country.

All this is to say that guns are prevalent, and more guns are being sold every year in this country. The standard cry from gun control advocates is that more guns equals more death and more crime, so if their assertion is correct we should see a direct correlation between the number of guns being sold and an increase in the death rate in this country. But the numbers say otherwise.

Firearms Related Deaths On the Decline


If the gun control activists are right, then more guns must equal more crime. However, even in this graph that shows the overall homicide rate in blue and the firearms related homicide rate in red, you can clearly see that the phrase “steady” is the worst you can use to describe the current state of affairs in the United States, and the phrase “decline” might be more appropriate for the years since 2005. These numbers are from the U.S. Government Center for Disease Control, which tracks all deaths in the United States, and I personally pulled them yesterday when researching this article. .

Gun control activists constantly clamor that there’s a “gun violence epidemic” in the United States, but the numbers don’t reflect that statement. In fact, the argument could be made that as the firearms ownership rate increases there’s a correlation to a decline in the murder rate. So perhaps, more guns equal less crime? That’s the position taken by a recent study from Virginia that showed a decrease in violent crime as the number of firearms being sold increased, and while it’s an interesting possibility there’s no good way to decisively prove it. On the other hand, this data does decisively disprove the gun control hypothesis that “more guns = more crime.”



To give you a little context on where these crime rates are compared to historical data, take this chart which shows the murder rate over a much larger period. The last time the United States was this peaceful was 33 years ago, according to the CDC. The United States has seen a decline in the murder rate ever since the peaks of the 1990s, and yet the gun control advocates claim that there’s now a “gun violence epidemic.” I’m not buying it.

Accidental Deaths On the Decline


While crime prevention is one claim of gun control advocates, another popular statement is that more guns mean that more people will accidentally shoot themselves. Well, again, the CDC disagrees with that assessment. Even as gun ownership is on the rise, and more people than ever are carrying concealed firearms, the number of people (raw number, mind you) accidentally killed with firearms each year continues to drop. The accident rate shows an even more marked decline.

Let me put this into context a little bit more. There are, according to the CDC, 308 million people in the United States. That’s 308,745,538. Of those 308 million people, only 600 were accidentally killed with a firearm. That’s a 0.000194% chance that you will be accidentally killed with a gun in any given year. According to the National Safety Council, over 12,000 people die every year simply by falling down.

Accidental Death Rate High, but Guns are Not the Problem


The accidental death rate in the United States is about twice that of other countries, like the United Kingdom (18/100,000 versus 39/100,000). And while that may seem like a vote against guns, in reality the number of firearms related accidental deaths are so small that they’re barely visible in this chart (source: CDC). The main issue in the accidental death rate is traffic accidents, but when gun control advocates talk about their topic of choice they make it seem like the only thing keeping us from having the same lower statistics as the UK is gun control. It’s a lazy analysis of the situation, and even if we eliminated all firearms related accidental deaths it still wouldn’t bring us any closer to eliminating the gap in overall accidental deaths.

Interesting side note: the difference in accidental death rate is actually based on the way we commute to work. Cars are basically death traps, and the United Kingdom relies more on public transportation to get to work than the United States. We love our cars, even though we have an extremely high likelihood of dying in them. And yet we still drive, even though there’s a 0.012% chance we’ll die in one every year. For comparison, I have a 0.0002% chance that I’ll accidentally kill myself with my gun. So in reality, my gun is safer than my car. Go figure. Maybe I can somehow shoot my way to work, circus clown style…

Proportion of Guns Used in Crimes: Very, Very Low


Going back to that original point of the gun control advocates, that guns directly cause crime, then we should expect that a large percentage of the guns in this country would be used in a crime. However, that’s just not the case.

This chart shows the number of guns in the United States (using a LOW estimate from Wikipedia) versus the total number of victims of violent crime involving a firearm every year (source: Bureau of Justice Statistics numbers for 2012). If we assume that a different gun was used for every robbery, murder and assault, then that number comes out to 460,718 firearms. That’s 0.185% of all guns in the United States. For reference, every year 2.13% of all motor vehicles are involved in a collision. So again, guns are safer than cars.

Concealed Carry: Safer and More Law Abiding than the Police

With the increasing popularity of concealed carry, there was a common thread among the gun control advocacy groups’ opposition: the statement that concealed carry would bring “blood in the streets.” That these “gun nuts” who carry guns everywhere they go are just “looking for trouble” and itching to kill someone. Well, again, that’s just not right.

Thanks to some sleuthing, we know that concealed carry holders are actually less likely than even the police to commit a murder. According to the Violence Policy Center, Florida has the highest murder rate among concealed carry holders, and Dean figured out that those numbers put the murder rate at somewhere around .58/100,000. Counting domestic homicides only, police officers committed 1.85/100,000 over the same time period. Nationally, the murder rate in the United States sits right around 4.5/100,000. Therefore, you’re over three times less likely to be killed in a room filled with concealed carry holders than police officers.

Cool, huh?

Firearms and Children: Declining Murders and Accidents
The last refuge for those without a logical leg to stand on is “think of the children!” OK, let’s think about the children for a second in terms of guns.



According to the CDC, the number of firearms related fatalities for “children” has been steadily falling over the last two decades even without more restrictive gun control laws. I put children in quotation marks because, while some people consider 24 year old people to still be children, my cut-off is the age at which the state lets you operate a 2-ton moving death machine unsupervised in public (16). The reason that this age bracket is used by gun control advocacy groups, as I outlined in this article, is that this is the age range in which most gang related crime is committed. Some estimates put the percentage of gang related murders in the United States at around 80%, indicating that the issue isn’t the availability of guns but the prevalence of gangs and the related violence.

Let’s move away from the murders for a second. Gun control advocates love to use the image of a child who accidentally shot themselves or someone else and died after “playing” with a gun. It evokes a parental response, making you feel like you need to “do something” to prevent such tragedies. And while those incidents do happen, it’s extremely rare — and getting rarer by the year.



Notice that distinctive downward trend? Yeah, I did too. Nevermind the fact that this happens to less than 150 kids every year, the fact of the matter is that the “problem” of kids accidentally killing themselves or others with a gun is one that is disappearing. Instead of increasing as more guns are being sold to the U.S. population, not only is the raw number of kids being killed in this matter staying relatively stable but it even seems to be declining.

Public Support for Increased Gun Control Measures
The gun control activists like to make the claim that “90% of Americans” support whatever new gun control scheme they’re pushing that week. However, if you look at the results of a reputable polling organization (like Gallup) the truth is very, very different.



The facts of the matter are that the hunger for stricter gun control in the United States is like a fad that has run its course — fewer and fewer people every year believe that gun control is a good idea. The numbers of supporters have been steadily dropping since 2002, and with the exception of a small spike in 2012 (just after the Newtown shooting) that trend has been steady. The real surprise is that the percentage of people who think gun control laws should be less strict has been steadily on the rise, and in 2014 that number tripled to 16%.

Gun control advocates claim that the vast majority of Americans support new gun control laws. In reality, 56% of Americans either want gun laws to stay the same or become less strict. “Common sense” indeed.

Conclusions
The burden of proof is on the gun control activists. Their assertion is that more guns equal more crime, that concealed carry means “shoot-outs in the streets” and deranged “gun nuts” looking to kill people, and that there’s a “gun violence epidemic” that needs to be addressed. But looking at the numbers from the CDC, I don’t see it. Gun sales have gone through the roof in the last six years, and at worst the numbers for firearm related deaths are stable. At best, they’re declining. Not one single metric that I could find indicated that gun owners were anything less than model citizens, and that gun ownership is not the root of all evil.

The best confirmation of this comes not from any study or calculation, but from the opinions of the American people themselves. Support for gun control is at an all time low. I’d like to think that it’s because people are finally understanding that the object is not the problem but instead it’s the behavior that needs to be changed. However, some people still don’t see the light. Hopefully with enough proof we can change their minds as well.


If gun control advocates want to actually reduce gun crime here are a few suggestions;
http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/gun-control-activists-cheap-gimmicks-article-1.1858651
In the week before gun violence in Chicago left 14 people dead and another 68 wounded over the holiday weekend, it’s worth asking what the gun advocate groups were busy doing.

Many were engaged in an all-out assault on mass retailer Target for refusing to ban legal guns in their stores.

Moms Demand Action and Everytown For Gun Safety, the two groups spun out of former Mayor Mike Bloomberg’s first failed anti-gun group, Mayors Against Illegal Guns, took their fight to — where else — Twitter.

Sending a flurry of tweets urging people to boycott Target using countless hashtags, Moms Demand Action flaunted photos of consumers buying their paper plates and hotdogs elsewhere. When Target finally capitulated, MomsDemand was victorious, retweeting supporters like CT Sen. Richard Blumenthal, who posted, “I’m shopping @Target today because they’re doing the right thing on guns.”

Then, over the weekend, the very same weekend that Chicago was erupting in gun violence, ABCNews aired a package featuring Moms founder Shannon Watts proudly touting her wins over Target and other retailers. “They listened to us when we said we don’t want loaded assault weapons around our children when we’re shopping.”

It’s a good thing Moms and Everytown are on the case, keeping us all safe from the army of legal gun owners who shop at Target, drink lattes at Starbucks and eat barbacoa burritos at Chipotle.

This is what counts as “productive” if you are a gun control advocate today. Watts may be proud of her group’s efforts, but the sad reality is that today’s anti-gun activists are nothing more than political operatives, no more noble than any other kind of lobbyist, and generally less informed about their own issue.

They may have been operatives by trade, who wandered into gun control as a lucrative issue to back. Others might start as victims of gun violence but by virtue of the strategies, tactics and channels they employ, they end up investing a lot more in gun politics than they do in meaningful community outreach, the real bedrock of activism, the kind that doesn’t rely on hashtags.

The problem with gun violence isn’t the woman with a concealed carry license at her suburban Target or Chipotle, or the prepper in rural Kansas with a handgun collection. And it isn’t the legal gun owner in Westchester County, N.Y., whose name and address was published by the Journal News after the Sandy Hook shooting.

And yet this is where gun control groups are directing their resources. This and, of course, toward the NRA. Moms and Everytown’s latest initiative is to score politicians on their commitments to gun control, the way the NRA scores on commitment to gun rights.

How does any of this even begin to solve gun crime in cities like Chicago? It doesn’t.

If the gun control groups were less interested in scoring meaningless political points and disarming lawful citizens, and were more interested in reducing gun crime, they'd be on the streets of Englewood, starting community programs to occupy inner-city children and teenagers and pull young men out of gangs and into jobs.

Talk to any Chicago principal and they will tell you their biggest fear isn’t what happens during the school year, it’s what happens over the summer when school is out, when many of their students either engage in violence or are the victims of it.

Credit goes to Mayor Rahm Emanuel for acknowledging as much, saying in a statement on Monday, that we “have to give our young people alternatives to the street, and as a community we need to demand more of ourselves and our neighbors.”

I doubt he means by boycotting the Highland Park Target or scoring Sen. Dick Durbin on a questionnaire.

Of course, when Moms Demand Action finally got around to addressing the violent weekend in Chicago, its response was predictable (and on Twitter):

“Weak federal gun laws led to deadly holiday weekend in Chicago. #momsdemand #gunsense”

Lazy. Ineffectual. Political. Exploitative. There aren’t enough adjectives to describe the irresponsible approach these hashtag advocates take to gun control.

By coercing businesses to cave into utterly meaningless demands, and by focusing largely on lawful gun owners — the only people who will submit to background checks, gun registries, magazine restrictions and other legislation — gun advocates may feel productive.

But the real problems — and victims — are left behind.

 
   
 
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