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Is there a consensus on the best Land Raider variant with the new objective based rules?

I am kinda liking the look of Redeemers, that flamestorm cannon seems like a good bet for roasting enemy troops on objectives and giving friendly troops mobility around the battlefield.

On the other hand the Crusader has that amazing 16 model capacity.

I have not gone out and bought the model yet. What are peoples thoughts?

Also is 2 Land Raiders feasible at 1500 points?

2 land raiders are easily doable at 1500. With the new rules, land raiders are as tough as nails are will be making a comeback.

Blood angels, dark angels, grey knights and iron hands all get land raiders with benefits(deep strike, venerable, psychic+psy ammo, and IWND respectively) so if you wanted to do LR's consider one of these factions.

The crusader is the best in my opinion, as it can dakka but still threaten heavy armor. Always take the multi melta upgrade if points allow, for extra AT shooting and additional weapon destroyed insurance.

The redeemer is nice, but getting both flame templates on a single infantry unit is next to impossible unless your target is a blob squad and/or your opponent fails to space their models.It is a hair cheaper, combining that with the flamestorm cannons makes it favorable for rushing up and delivering a big nasty squad to the enemy.

The godhammer(regular) landraider is a bit schitzo, as the heavy bolter and lascannons rarely have targets. Also, it is very expensive for the guns on it, but depending on your list it has use.

Also LRC's with objective secured, Black templars are BIT less useless now...

Yes interesting stuff.

I did not realise Blood Angels get a fast Land Raider. I knew they could deep strike, but fast tank?.

Yes I can imagine the redeemer being very situational, so hard to get both cannons to bear.

As far as Objective Secured goes you have a few options:

-SMs: a LRC taken as a dedicated transport for a crusader squad (BT)

-DAs: a LR (any variant) taken as a dedicated transport for a Deathwing terminator squad (with Belial as your Warlord), of note, this one will have to be Venerable (which is good)

-BAs: I believe they can take them as dedicated transport for their assault squads

-SWs: unsure but could a wolf-guard unit be a troop choice with Logan? Can they take LRs as dedicated transports?

-GKs: same deal, with added options (psy-ammo, etc...)

LandRaiders have a place in 7th edition, and any army with access to Objective Secured Land Raiders are pure gold and are very counter Meta. For ~325pts you can get yourself a BA Crusader with Assault Marines and a MM upgrade. This is a phenomenal deal. Two Objective Secured Units, one is an AV14 Hull.

There are many armies that just can't handle multiple AV14 Hulls.


I suggested a BA list in another thread for 1850

Mephiston
Corbulo

Assault Squad +LRC +MM
Assault Squad +LRC+MM
Assault Squad +LR+MM

Storm Raven
Storm Raven

If I wanted to run Competitive BA, that is how I would do it in 7th Ed. Makes me wish I hadn't liquidated them as I had the bulk of that list already.


Basically you have 6 Objective Secured Units, 3 of them are Land Raiders. Target any AT they have that can Hurt a Raider then pick them off. You have Mephiston and Corbulo rolling out of a Storm Raven when they arrive while the two Storm Ravens pretty much assures air superiority.

Think about what this list does to a normal Tesla Spam Necron list. Only the Overlords with Warscythes have a chance at hurting it, or their warriors/immortals with Guass. Fielding this list is a hard counter to what is going to be the most common and powerful Necron Build and don't be fooled, Necrons are going to be brutal in 7th.

Serpent Spam, even Serpent Spam with one or two Wraithknights really struggles against this list as two Wraithknights can be dropped by Turns 2-3 when both Storm Ravens arrive and can hide before that. Even two Wraithknights aren't blwoing up more than one Raider in 2-3 turns if you avoid assault.

Most lists just don't have the capability to reliably take out 2-3 AV14 hulls.

Now, AV14 that isn't Objective Secured isn't nearly as good, but will still be counter meta and can be filled with Objective Secured Troops waiting for a late game Grab.

Also, other AV 14 vehicles are going to be tough, Battle wagons, Leman Russes, etc.

Look at sticking an Inquisition blob in an LRC. Bunch of Crusaders, DCAs, Priest, and a Librarian with either Telepathy or Santic (depending on the ML you choose and what you're going up against).

Fish for Invisibility on Inquisitors with TDA Psycannon ML1, Invis your LRC, charge forward, disembark with hammerhand'd massed AP2/AP3 attacks with rerolls from Priest and another potential Invisibility from your Librarian or 2++ Invul from Crusaders, depending on the discipline you went with.

 scommy wrote:
Yes interesting stuff.

I did not realise Blood Angels get a fast Land Raider. I knew they could deep strike, but fast tank?.

Yes I can imagine the redeemer being very situational, so hard to get both cannons to bear.

They don't I'm afraid. Fast is only a thing on Rhino chassis tanks, LRs "just" get DS.

Common misconception, but it is accounted for both in the rules and the fluff.

Where can we find the current rules for Land Raiders and what it is that they can transport? I've never actually seen rules for them, aside from the fact that people saying you can't put things like Bikes inside them.

Current rules for Land Raiders are in the various Codexes that use them. Current rules for embarking on a transport are in the BRB.

 scommy wrote:
I did not realise Blood Angels get a fast Land Raider. I knew they could deep strike, but fast tank?.

BA Land Raiders are not Fast, sorry. Fluff-wise, they couldn't figure out how to turbocharge their engines, so they just said "feth it" and dropped them directly onto the battlefield using thunderhawks.


Anyhow... they're better in this edition, since it's not nearly as easy to get an Explodes or Immobilized result with ap2 weapons (melta are still fairly reliable). The Crusader and Redeemer are the ones I have the best luck with - they have enough transport capacity for an entire tactical squad + an independent character. Their weapons are more geared towards shorter ranged combat, which is fine - you should be driving your landraiders right up into the enemy's face. That pintile-mounted multimelta is a steal at 10pts, always buy that.

No DT landraiders for GK unfortunately.

I agree that they will see a resurgence, and a DT landraider on an objective would be nasty!

MarkCron wrote:
No DT landraiders for GK unfortunately.

I agree that they will see a resurgence, and a DT landraider on an objective would be nasty!

Codex: Inquisition has dedicated LR for henchmen. also dedicated valkeries!

 phoenix darkus wrote:
As far as Objective Secured goes you have a few options:

-SMs: a LRC taken as a dedicated transport for a crusader squad (BT)

-DAs: a LR (any variant) taken as a dedicated transport for a Deathwing terminator squad (with Belial as your Warlord), of note, this one will have to be Venerable (which is good)

-BAs: I believe they can take them as dedicated transport for their assault squads

-SWs: unsure but could a wolf-guard unit be a troop choice with Logan? Can they take LRs as dedicated transports?

-GKs: same deal, with added options (psy-ammo, etc...)

you also left out that the dark angels can make their lrc's salvo 2/4 and can grant it a 4++ so easy it's not even funny

If you got a LR for a Death Company squad (or any dedicated transport) would it have objective secured for being a troops choice or would it be never scoring like the DC?

D

The general consensus when I last asked about LR variants was that the Godhammer (standard) pattern was in most cases the best choice, the Redeemer with its flame weapons looks good but because they are sponson mounted it is almost impossible to get them into a position where they can both hit a single unit.

AV14 is the tits this edition...

With that being said, LRC's are my go to. I try to fit at least one or two in at 1500 points with my BA. Mech BA seem to be the better way for me to go currently in 7th (My JP BA is getting no love).

The DA get a fantastic PFG for theirs.

Slightly Off Topic...I just switched my AM/IG over to 3x LRBTs (2x Vanquishers, 1x Punisher) and 2x Chimera at 750 points...Haven't lost a game yet...

AV14, my love...

 ionusx wrote:

 phoenix darkus wrote:
As far as Objective Secured goes you have a few options:

-SMs: a LRC taken as a dedicated transport for a crusader squad (BT)

-DAs: a LR (any variant) taken as a dedicated transport for a Deathwing terminator squad (with Belial as your Warlord), of note, this one will have to be Venerable (which is good)

-BAs: I believe they can take them as dedicated transport for their assault squads

-SWs: unsure but could a wolf-guard unit be a troop choice with Logan? Can they take LRs as dedicated transports?

-GKs: same deal, with added options (psy-ammo, etc...)

you also left out that the dark angels can make their lrc's salvo 2/4 and can grant it a 4++ so easy it's not even funny

Also blood angels get the LR as a DT for any unit that can take a DT. tactical, DC, assualt squads, etc


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Inquisitor_Dunn wrote:

MarkCron wrote:
No DT landraiders for GK unfortunately.

I agree that they will see a resurgence, and a DT landraider on an objective would be nasty!

Codex: Inquisition has dedicated LR for henchmen. also dedicated valkeries!

I wonder how many land raiders you can fit into a 2k list with just a bare minimum inquisitor and then the bare minimum acolytes in bare minimum land raiders.

The answer is six.

Also, Inquisitors can't get Invisibility, sadly. At least not from C:I; not sure about in the GK codex.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Correction, 7 if redeemers.

 evildrcheese wrote:
If you got a LR for a Death Company squad (or any dedicated transport) would it have objective secured for being a troops choice or would it be never scoring like the DC?

D

The Land Raider doesn't have Black Rage

 scommy wrote:
Yes interesting stuff.

I did not realise Blood Angels get a fast Land Raider. I knew they could deep strike, but fast tank?.

Yes I can imagine the redeemer being very situational, so hard to get both cannons to bear.

No, the Landraiders in the BA codex are not fast, but they were able to deep strike.

Landraiders still go down against dedicated units, like Fire Dragons or Sternguard with combi-meltas.
Thus I'd still hesitate to use them in regular games.

I'm not sure if this has been pointed out already, but BA Land Raiders aren't fast.

They can deep strike though.

EDIT: Oh, look at the post above mine. Hm.

Codex: I Henchman are not troops so they don't get objective secured.

Seems Cronus in a LR he would be quite dangerous. Anyway 2 LRC at 1500 with some assault marine infantry with their free Pods and Rhinos to distract the enemy, seems like a lot of fun to me. Pod to alpha enemy Anti Tank, LRC and assault troops to kill and capture stuff.

Hammerfall formation is nice for boosting the the assault out of the Landraider.

I like godhammer pattern as a nice durable lascannon platform.

Redeemer is probably the best assault buggy against power Armor, While the crusader is really solid close fire support against Xenos.

Could Da deepstrike a LR with a DW squad, I forgot.

 scommy wrote:
Seems Cronus in a LR he would be quite dangerous. Anyway 2 LRC at 1500 with some assault marine infantry with their free Pods and Rhinos to distract the enemy, seems like a lot of fun to me. Pod to alpha enemy Anti Tank, LRC and assault troops to kill and capture stuff.

The problem with Cronus is that he takes an already expensive tank and adds more points on top of it. And because LRs are pretty much entirely twin-linked already, the boost to BS is not that significant.

Kisada II wrote:
Codex: I Henchman are not troops so they don't get objective secured.

True. UNLESS of course, those same Codex: I Henchmen have an allied Codex GK Coteaz! Then they are troops via the whole "warbands are Troops choices in an ARMY" thing :-)

 w0lfgang7 wrote:

Kisada II wrote:
Codex: I Henchman are not troops so they don't get objective secured.

True. UNLESS of course, those same Codex: I Henchmen have an allied Codex GK Coteaz! Then they are troops via the whole "warbands are Troops choices in an ARMY" thing :-)

Sure but Codex: I detachments can't take troops either because of their force org restriction, so technically GK Coteaz makes your list illegal =/

w0lfgang7 wrote:

Kisada II wrote:
Codex: I Henchman are not troops so they don't get objective secured.

True. UNLESS of course, those same Codex: I Henchmen have an allied Codex GK Coteaz! Then they are troops via the whole "warbands are Troops choices in an ARMY" thing :-)

Kisada II wrote:

 w0lfgang7 wrote:

Kisada II wrote:
Codex: I Henchman are not troops so they don't get objective secured.

True. UNLESS of course, those same Codex: I Henchmen have an allied Codex GK Coteaz! Then they are troops via the whole "warbands are Troops choices in an ARMY" thing :-)

Sure but Codex: I detachments can't take troops either because of their force org restriction, so technically GK Coteaz makes your list illegal =/

Further evidence that C:I needs a 7th edition treatment by GW.