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Lord Tarkin wrote:Well, I guess Angron is the strongest. Psshh

It's explicitly stated that Vulkan or possibly Ferrus Manus are physically the strongest of the Primarchs if I recall correctly. Though where Magnus comes in if his Psychic might was dedicated to enhancing his strength I do not know.

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

Weight makes every bit of difference when it comes to strength.

Angron = 700 lbs, round about
Warlord Titan = 300 tons maybe? Something like that?

Yup, cannot be done. No way a 700 lbs primarch could lift 880,000 lbs. It is literally impossible. Angron should have been pancake.

The Primarchs were infused with Warp energy. They don't have to obey the laws of biology and physics like ordinary people.

Where does it say that vulkan / ferrus are the 2 strongest?
Angron uses his rage to gain strengh, thats kinda of his form of power conduit.

Uh, alright y'all. If Angron can lift a titans foot than Vulkan can beat an Emperor class titan to scrap metal. I honestly don't buy that childish fairytale but if you wish to indulge than go ahead.

Ferrus would be stronger only because he is more machine than he is flesh

 Lord Tarkin wrote:
Uh, alright y'all. If Angron can lift a titans foot than Vulkan can beat an Emperor class titan to scrap metal. I honestly don't buy that childish fairytale but if you wish to indulge than go ahead.

He can't, because he can only reach the toe.

And he would smash that toe badly, for your information. Even with the toned-down-in-game-stats, he has something like 5-6 S10 AP1 attacks to smack it with.

 Lord Tarkin wrote:
Uh, alright y'all. If Angron can lift a titans foot than Vulkan can beat an Emperor class titan to scrap metal. I honestly don't buy that childish fairytale but if you wish to indulge than go ahead.

Why would pushing a Warhound suddenly equate to an exponential difference to ripping apart an Emperor Class Titan?

 Lord Tarkin wrote:
I honestly don't buy that childish fairytale but if you wish to indulge than go ahead.

Welcome to the world of Warhammer 40K.

"Because he's a primarch" haha, I laugh at that. I am straight laughing on the floor.

He is a 10 ft tall 1,500 lbs man (without armour) and he cannot lift a 300 ton hulk of metal.

Yes, I said "man." He is indeed flesh and sinew and he must obey the laws of physics. Don't give me that ridiculous warp nonsense, he cannot do it.

Yes, laughing at the other side's argument is a polite and meaningful contribution to the discussion.

 Lord Tarkin wrote:
"Because he's a primarch" haha, I laugh at that. I am straight laughing on the floor.

He is a 10 ft tall 1,500 lbs man (without armour) and he cannot lift a 300 ton hulk of metal.

Yes, I said "man." He is indeed flesh and sinew and he must obey the laws of physics. Don't give me that ridiculous warp nonsense, he cannot do it.

Yes he can, or did you miss how the God Emperor bartered powers from the Chaos Gods to create the Primarchs.

I sometimes wonder if people have been living under a rock when it comes to 40K. 40K has been a lite version of DBZ for a while.

 Wyzilla wrote:

 Lord Tarkin wrote:
"Because he's a primarch" haha, I laugh at that. I am straight laughing on the floor.

He is a 10 ft tall 1,500 lbs man (without armour) and he cannot lift a 300 ton hulk of metal.

Yes, I said "man." He is indeed flesh and sinew and he must obey the laws of physics. Don't give me that ridiculous warp nonsense, he cannot do it.

Yes he can, or did you miss how the God Emperor bartered powers from the Chaos Gods to create the Primarchs.

I sometimes wonder if people have been living under a rock when it comes to 40K. 40K has been a lite version of DBZ for a while.

Dude, it doesn't matter. Calculate the difference in weight as I have done 3 times already. I understand this is 40k, a lot of stuff has scientific explaining to do but this goes way to far, even past the point of stupid.

Then your point of stupid is too restrictive for the setting, it seems.

 Ashiraya wrote:
Yes, laughing at the other side's argument is a polite and meaningful contribution to the discussion.

Ashiraya, I am still waiting for you to give me a single shred of meaningful debate. "Because he is a primarch" doesnt frickin explain a whole lot. Angron would have to be at least a quarter of that titans size to contend with it effectively.

 Lord Tarkin wrote:
Angron would have to be at least a quarter of that titans size to contend with it effectively.

Quote book, page and paragraph please.

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

 Ashiraya wrote:
Yes, laughing at the other side's argument is a polite and meaningful contribution to the discussion.

Ashiraya, I am still waiting for you to give me a single shred of meaningful debate. "Because he is a primarch" doesnt frickin explain a whole lot. Angron would have to be at least a quarter of that titans size to contend with it effectively.

When someone gave an actual reason you ignored them.

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Lord Tarkin wrote:
Angron would have to be at least a quarter of that titans size to contend with it effectively.

Quote book, page and paragraph please.

Um, that's just common sense. Are you...serious right now?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

pm713 wrote:

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

 Ashiraya wrote:
Yes, laughing at the other side's argument is a polite and meaningful contribution to the discussion.

Ashiraya, I am still waiting for you to give me a single shred of meaningful debate. "Because he is a primarch" doesnt frickin explain a whole lot. Angron would have to be at least a quarter of that titans size to contend with it effectively.

When someone gave an actual reason you ignored them.

What??

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

Um, that's just common sense. Are you...serious right now?

'Common sense' is not a valid argument. We are discussing fiction here, very fictional fiction.

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

Um, that's just common sense. Are you...serious right now?

'Common sense' is not a valid argument. We are discussing fiction here, very fictional fiction.

Ok, whatever.

So you concede the point?

Or how am I to interpret 'whatever'?

 Ashiraya wrote:
So you concede the point?

Or how am I to interpret 'whatever'?

You can interpret it as; Lord Tarkin has made his point quite clear as have everyone else. Conclusion is that everyone has their own fictional tolerance level and further arguing will do no good.

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

Weight makes every bit of difference when it comes to strength.

Angron = 700 lbs, round about
Warlord Titan = 300 tons maybe? Something like that?

Yup, cannot be done. No way a 700 lbs primarch could lift 880,000 lbs. It is literally impossible. Angron should have been pancake.

Superman weighs 240 pounds and he could lift a continent above his head. In All Star Superman he pushes a planet back to the universe it came from. All Star Superman is also a better work than anything 40k has ever put out.

Also, Angron stopping a Warhound from crushing him is easily one of his worst feats of strength. He picked a mountain off of him in False Gods with enough force to make it crumble and shatter like a bomb went off, and Magnus makes references to destroying mountains while training his martial abilities alongside his brothers in A Thousand Sons. Konrad Curze fell through the crust and mantle of Nostramo and crawled the feth back out.

Primarchs are superheroes. Classical mythological figures if you'd prefer, both of whom have reputations for being incredibly powerful fethheads accomplishing impossible feats.

 Void__Dragon wrote:

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

Weight makes every bit of difference when it comes to strength.

Angron = 700 lbs, round about
Warlord Titan = 300 tons maybe? Something like that?

Yup, cannot be done. No way a 700 lbs primarch could lift 880,000 lbs. It is literally impossible. Angron should have been pancake.

Superman weighs 240 pounds and he could lift a continent above his head. In All Star Superman he pushes a planet back to the universe it came from. All Star Superman is also a better work than anything 40k has ever put out.

Also, Angron stopping a Warhound from crushing him is easily one of his worst feats of strength. He picked a mountain off of him in False Gods with enough force to make it crumble and shatter like a bomb went off, and Magnus makes references to destroying mountains while training his martial abilities alongside his brothers in A Thousand Sons. Konrad Curze fell through the crust and mantle of Nostramo and crawled the feth back out.

Primarchs are superheroes. Classical mythological figures if you'd prefer, both of whom have reputations for being incredibly powerful fethheads accomplishing impossible feats.

In False Gods the Technocracy blew up the mountain leading to it falling on Angron but he still lifted hundreds of tonnes off of himself to escape

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:

 Lord Tarkin wrote:
"Because he's a primarch" haha, I laugh at that. I am straight laughing on the floor.

He is a 10 ft tall 1,500 lbs man (without armour) and he cannot lift a 300 ton hulk of metal.

Yes, I said "man." He is indeed flesh and sinew and he must obey the laws of physics. Don't give me that ridiculous warp nonsense, he cannot do it.

Yes he can, or did you miss how the God Emperor bartered powers from the Chaos Gods to create the Primarchs.

I sometimes wonder if people have been living under a rock when it comes to 40K. 40K has been a lite version of DBZ for a while.

Dude, it doesn't matter. Calculate the difference in weight as I have done 3 times already. I understand this is 40k, a lot of stuff has scientific explaining to do but this goes way to far, even past the point of stupid.

It always makes me smile how somebody can cry realism in a setting with space magical orks that can move engines with their will and guys who use swords on a battlefield with the most futuristic fire weapons available.

If you can't accept something relatively coherent with the setting such as a Primarch (a being part Emperor, part Warp) doing extraordinary feats, then maybe you should look at something else.

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

 Wyzilla wrote:

 Lord Tarkin wrote:
"Because he's a primarch" haha, I laugh at that. I am straight laughing on the floor.

He is a 10 ft tall 1,500 lbs man (without armour) and he cannot lift a 300 ton hulk of metal.

Yes, I said "man." He is indeed flesh and sinew and he must obey the laws of physics. Don't give me that ridiculous warp nonsense, he cannot do it.

Yes he can, or did you miss how the God Emperor bartered powers from the Chaos Gods to create the Primarchs.

I sometimes wonder if people have been living under a rock when it comes to 40K. 40K has been a lite version of DBZ for a while.

Dude, it doesn't matter. Calculate the difference in weight as I have done 3 times already. I understand this is 40k, a lot of stuff has scientific explaining to do but this goes way to far, even past the point of stupid.

You really don't seem to understand. Lemme make it very simple.

Primarchs. Are. magical. They were created from the warp by the GEOM. That's GC/HH basic knowledge. The Primarchs are as much normal humans as the God Emperor is, or did you miss how they were originally stated as bulldozing mountains in the Index Astartes articles? The Hours Heresy series is a step down. The Warp doesn't give a flying gak about science, physical laws are simply an opinion to it, and it's how you end up with a lot of the crazy bs in 40K, like Alpha Psykers.

But seriously dude, have you just gotten into 40k or something? The Primarchs have always been lulzy levels of power. Curze arrived on Nostramo by smashing clean through the adamantanium crust of the planet in his pod, right into the mantle. He then crawled out as a baby coated in magma, unharmed.

Ok everybody, I get it.

DaKKaLAnce wrote:
Ferrus would be stronger only because he is more machine than he is flesh

Um Ferrus wasn't largely bionics or anything like that. He had metal (well technically Necrodermis) hands, but was otherwise flesh and blood like the rest of the primarchs. His legion were the ones who were heavily into bionics (partially to simulate his metal hands), and that only became their dominate practice after his death.

Anyway, even ignoring the whole 'primarchs are magic superheroes who can do what they want' side of things, Angron holding up a Warhound's foot is that implausible imo. First of all, its a Warhound not a Warlord like some people seem to think, its the smallest Titan around and is no bigger than something like a Baneblade (which Vulkan was more than capable of pushing around, so a Primarch moving a something that big around is not unprecedented). Secondly he was only holding one foot up, he didn't lift the entire thing up by its waist so it wasn't carrying the entire weight. Given the size and construction of Titans I think its pretty safe to assume that they don't sprint around (even moreso in this context as it was a restrictive urban environment) i.e they are walking, which means the other foot is still on the ground and carrying most of the weight. When you read that sequence it is mostly made to sound like Angron is fighting the power from the servos and machinery that is trying to get the leg to straighten rather than the weight of the entire titan.

Warhounds are Scout Titans... they do sprint. And, again, 400 tons.

Powerguy wrote:

DaKKaLAnce wrote:
Ferrus would be stronger only because he is more machine than he is flesh

Um Ferrus wasn't largely bionics or anything like that. He had metal (well technically Necrodermis) hands, but was otherwise flesh and blood like the rest of the primarchs. His legion were the ones who were heavily into bionics (partially to simulate his metal hands), and that only became their dominate practice after his death.

Anyway, even ignoring the whole 'primarchs are magic superheroes who can do what they want' side of things, Angron holding up a Warhound's foot is that implausible imo. First of all, its a Warhound not a Warlord like some people seem to think, its the smallest Titan around and is no bigger than something like a Baneblade (which Vulkan was more than capable of pushing around, so a Primarch moving a something that big around is not unprecedented). Secondly he was only holding one foot up, he didn't lift the entire thing up by its waist so it wasn't carrying the entire weight. Given the size and construction of Titans I think its pretty safe to assume that they don't sprint around (even moreso in this context as it was a restrictive urban environment) i.e they are walking, which means the other foot is still on the ground and carrying most of the weight. When you read that sequence it is mostly made to sound like Angron is fighting the power from the servos and machinery that is trying to get the leg to straighten rather than the weight of the entire titan.

That actually makes the feat more impressive.

It was running to crush Lorgar and Angron caught it.

He'd have been dealing with over a thousand tons of force.

 Void__Dragon wrote:

 RileyJessup wrote:
I do believe in one of the HH books Valdor the chief custode bested a primarch in close combat

Nah, this never happened.

The physical gap is simply too great. Custodians are on average a bit stronger, tougher, and quicker than Space Marines.

Primarchs can tear Custodians to pieces with their bare hands, and have done so. Just ask Angron, who butchered ten Custodians unarmed and unarmoured with his bare hands.

What about Alpharius or Omeg? You think any Space Marines or Custodes could take them on?

No. They are the smallest primarchs but they still play in a different division.