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Any links on how to play the game in a 20mm scale? do any of you do this?

Thanks. The 28mm is a tad too large

See it played in 15mm, with no changes whatsoever, no reason at all not to play in 20mm - just base the models on something of a suitable size, say a small coin or similar and away you go.

Wouldn't even change the range measurements, just run with it as printed but slightly smaller models, and cheaper terrain.

Aesop the God Awful wrote:
That is a slick looking set. Not entirely sure what I prioritize, the savings from the set, or the exclusive miniature you get if you buy the book separately

The exclusive for that set isn't much cop, anyway.


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leopard wrote:
See it played in 15mm, with no changes whatsoever, no reason at all not to play in 20mm - just base the models on something of a suitable size, say a small coin or similar and away you go.

Wouldn't even change the range measurements, just run with it as printed but slightly smaller models, and cheaper terrain.

Absolitely nothing stopping you. My first "Bolt Action" sets were a pair of 2 FoW box sets of Red Devils and SS. Of course, due to house moves I never got them painted, but the plan was to use the little FoW men with either CM or stick with inches and see how it went.

 judgedoug wrote:

 MadMaverick76 wrote:

In regards to Tank War, I have heard it is a bit dull and I tend to agree. 28mm for massive armor battles doesn't seem to fit, I think Flames of War (not much experience with it) would do a better job at a better scale. I have been tempted to give FoW a try though, the difficulty of the rules has kept me away though.

I do not like Flames of War for armor as it encourages weird tank walls where tanks are side by side touching, so that one tank blocks LOS to other tanks, it's really very weird.

FOW would only encourage weird tank walls for people who aren't that familiar with the rules, since as far as I remember enemy units don't block LOS in Flames of War. In addition, tanks touching each other would be the juiciest artillery target ever. It also makes it way easier for the enemy to block LOS by dropping smoke right in front of the line. In my experience most people try to keep their tanks at maximum dispersion to ensure that as few tanks as possible get hit by arty.

 Azazelx wrote:

Aesop the God Awful wrote:
That is a slick looking set. Not entirely sure what I prioritize, the savings from the set, or the exclusive miniature you get if you buy the book separately

The exclusive for that set isn't much cop, anyway.

I don't know, I'm a sucker for those.

 Stevefamine wrote:
Any links on how to play the game in a 20mm scale? do any of you do this?

Thanks. The 28mm is a tad too large

This is no problem what so ever. As said, you probably don't even need to cut measurements, but if you'd want to the natural choice would be to cut it by a third. 6 inches become 4 inches etc. Then you could play on a smaller gaming surface as well, without it being too small.

Given most 20mm games have ranges longer than BA, I wouldnt bother changing anything.

Weapon ranges are abstractions anyway.

As Aesop said - it depends on what you're playing on. I was thinking of playing some 15mm BA on a 2x2 surface, for example. Cutting down the ranges to cm would (potentially) allow a bit more movement without being under fire.

I've ordered the books (rules and army lists) and some Soviet Infantry. I'm so stoked to get playing again. Tomorrow it's a trip to the Tamiya store in Tokyo for some 1/48 T-34s.

So stoked.

Naturally you got the bundle?

 judgedoug wrote:

 MadMaverick76 wrote:

In regards to Tank War, I have heard it is a bit dull and I tend to agree. 28mm for massive armor battles doesn't seem to fit, I think Flames of War (not much experience with it) would do a better job at a better scale. I have been tempted to give FoW a try though, the difficulty of the rules has kept me away though.

I do not like Flames of War for armor as it encourages weird tank walls where tanks are side by side touching, so that one tank blocks LOS to other tanks, it's really very weird.
However, my brother and a couple friends love Battlegroup and they have declared they will play the same scenario in Battlegroup as well as Bolt Action to see which mass tank battles sytem they like the best (using their giant collection of 20mm armor)

Let me know how they take it. The only thing that turns me off about FoW is the rules. I got into Bolt Action because I loved the simplification when compared to 40k, I am trying to stick with that same logic with any further games I pick up. I am eagerly awaiting my download of the Gates of Antares beta ruleset to get back to using my beautiful 40k models. They are painted and now just sitting collecting dust due to me being so fed up with the 40k rules.


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I have the FoW OpenFire! Starter set in my closet. Just trying to find the time to paint then up for some BA action. Just realizing that I have no 15mm terrain as all my terrain is 28mm. Anyone know of any cardstock websites with cheap 15mm terrain? I am not looking for anything too crazy, I was hoping Dropzone Commander would be 15mm because their terrain gets the job done, collapsible, and cheap!

 Aesop the God Awful wrote:
Naturally you got the bundle?

Spoiler:

That's exactly what I ordered. I was a bit peeved at the Tamiya shop in Tokyo. They advertise to carry the entire line, which they don't. There were no 1/48 T-34s, so I ended up get a KV-1 instead. The shop clerk claimed that since the chassis of the 1/48 T-34 is made of cast metal, it's out of production (even though the KV-1 has the exact same cast chasis) Shades of shopping at a GW shop there, I thought. At least they didn't hound me through my stroll in the store trying to push the 1/35th Livestock set or something. lol

It may very well be that Tamiya is replacing the older 1:48 models with full-plastic versions instead. They more or less stopped going for metal hulls after a certain amount of kits. Imagine my disappointment when their IS-2 didn't come with a metal hull but instead four weights you need to glue down into the hull for that "extra realism" they want with these models..

Try Blitzkrieg mins http://www.blitzkriegminiatures.com/html%20pages/Main%20Pages/56%20scale%20tanks%20menu.html

 BrookM wrote:
It may very well be that Tamiya is replacing the older 1:48 models with full-plastic versions instead. They more or less stopped going for metal hulls after a certain amount of kits. Imagine my disappointment when their IS-2 didn't come with a metal hull but instead four weights you need to glue down into the hull for that "extra realism" they want with these models..

The tracks were a bit of a bother to put together, but seeing as I am going to use it for gaming and it'll probably get dropped on the floor more than once in its lifetime, I'm not too upset. I'm hoping to go take a look at some of the other 1/48 kits that are around at the supermarket and local hobby place. I had a remote control T-72 and a Panther which were Hasegawa...I think. They both ended up becoming cat tormenting instruments by attaching a laser pointer to the barrels.

I got a fair few Tamiya 1:48 tank kits for future Bolt Action use, but I've been liking them so much that I'm keeping them as display models, I loathe to use them on the gaming table where they might get damaged or break.

I did get a pair of Hobby Boss tanks though, the Sherman and KV-2, though the both of those have been offered up to the conversion altar for future games of 7TV.

I hit up the local hobby shop today after work and all they had in 1/48 were a couple of trucks. The KV 1 is all ready for priming now and I'm going through the 1/72 Shturmovik instructions tonight. I haven't built a model plane in over 25 years, so the little tricks and nuances of a good build might escape me.

I have to agree that it's difficult to just relegate Tamiya models to gaming as they are so amazing once they are done. But, living in Nippon they are pretty cheap (I think I got the KV-1 for about $15 US or so and the Shturmovik and Stuka for about $6 each, new). When I look at the price of some of the stuff from the UK and elsewhere I know I'm getting a good deal.

On an aside, has anyone actually done/painted up the Dad's Army figures from Warlord? They look great, but the price at the moment is making me kind of hmmm and hah. I love the show and have it on regularly on Youtube when I'm doin' Dubya Dubya 2 stuff.

The price may be steep, but they are by far (IMHO) the best looking ones to date. They did get the rights for their likenesses from the BBC for starters, so they don't look as half-arsed as the ones put out by other companies.

 Azazelx wrote:
As Aesop said - it depends on what you're playing on. I was thinking of playing some 15mm BA on a 2x2 surface, for example. Cutting down the ranges to cm would (potentially) allow a bit more movement without being under fire.

This has huge appeal to me. A 4x4 or 4x6 table barely fits anywhere in my house (big house, but no individually big rooms, it's always very cramped) and storing it is a pain in the arse. I end up just with a flat board and scattering some terrain on it.

But scaling it down to 2x2 or 2x3, they actually fit easily in a room so I could host a tournament in my house with several boards going at once. And I can store them, so it opens up the idea of making awesome scenic boards and having several of them, snowy hills, desert dunes, town on a hillside and just whipping out the one I want.

Just to be clear to the OP...from a guy wo has played a lot of hero quest and 40k over the years...bolt action is a GREAT alternanative to the grim dark. Clear rules, FAQs, multipart, plastic kits, decent prices, all made by a company who will email you with a heads up when they plan on price increases. Sure it's not exactly "historic", but when people stand around a 6x4 board with finite boundaries, push around plastic soldiers with a god like view of the AO, and roll six sided dice to determine what happens, all while claiming it to be closer to real life than other games it's absurd. Bolt action is a fun game....

game caught my eye(big WW2 buff) but the main issue with games of historic level...theres only so far you can take it..fiction goes alot longer..plus WW2 is beaten to death

So you're a "big WW2 buff" but you feel that "WW2 is beaten to death" and that "there's only so far you can take it" for Historical games? And it was important that you come into the BA thread in the historical gaming subforum to share that?

I mean, I don't play Infinity or WHFB, but I don't feel a compulsion to go into the threads in their subforums and gak the place up.

Well, the Korean war hasn't been beaten to death, and Bolt Action works very well for that conflict too.

 Azazelx wrote:
So you're a "big WW2 buff" but you feel that "WW2 is beaten to death" and that "there's only so far you can take it" for Historical games? And it was important that you come into the BA thread in the historical gaming subforum to share that?

I mean, I don't play Infinity or WHFB, but I don't feel a compulsion to go into the threads in their subforums and gak the place up.

Yes i do enjoy history, but WW2 is over worked, i've played a decent amount of mainstream WW2 games and yes they were fun until the mini well runs dry. Then you get companies churning out models that had little to no effect on the war or hell never even saw the war (pershing, king tiger, elephant, jagtiger..the list goes on and on). Essentially when stuff like that surfaces the game loses its historic value and becomes another meta driven game. I did not come into this thread to attack any of you that play historic games, i just wish they would put some spotlight on other confilicts in history instead of rehashing WW@ over and over

Crimson Heretic wrote:

Yes i do enjoy history, but WW2 is over worked, i've played a decent amount of mainstream WW2 games and yes they were fun until the mini well runs dry. Then you get companies churning out models that had little to no effect on the war or hell never even saw the war (pershing, king tiger, elephant, jagtiger..the list goes on and on). Essentially when stuff like that surfaces the game loses its historic value and becomes another meta driven game. I did not come into this thread to attack any of you that play historic games, i just wish they would put some spotlight on other confilicts in history instead of rehashing WW@ over and over

I can certainly see your point of view. However, someone like myself isn't interested wholly in scenario play and does enjoy pick up and play games. So Bolt Action works well for that - it's WW2 _themed_ but I can fight my 1000 point army against anybody else's 1000 point army and have a fun game. It's also great for "what if" scenarios and such. Maybe I wanna have a "destroy the fully operational Maus" as an objective in a game!

WW2 is the largest conflict in human history. There's everything from hand to hand combat in close quarters to the deployment of atomic weaponry. It spans pretty much every conceivable terrain type.

If you think it's overworked, the issue is with you and not the period.

 frozenwastes wrote:
WW2 is the largest conflict in human history. There's everything from hand to hand combat in close quarters to the deployment of atomic weaponry. It spans pretty much every conceivable terrain type.

If you think it's overworked, the issue is with you and not the period.

Definitely. Always bugs me when people see WWII (or any other historical period, for that matter) as a "trope" or "universe" to be played out.

Crimson Heretic wrote:

 Azazelx wrote:
So you're a "big WW2 buff" but you feel that "WW2 is beaten to death" and that "there's only so far you can take it" for Historical games? And it was important that you come into the BA thread in the historical gaming subforum to share that?

I mean, I don't play Infinity or WHFB, but I don't feel a compulsion to go into the threads in their subforums and gak the place up.

Yes i do enjoy history, but WW2 is over worked, i've played a decent amount of mainstream WW2 games and yes they were fun until the mini well runs dry. Then you get companies churning out models that had little to no effect on the war or hell never even saw the war (pershing, king tiger, elephant, jagtiger..the list goes on and on). Essentially when stuff like that surfaces the game loses its historic value and becomes another meta driven game. I did not come into this thread to attack any of you that play historic games, i just wish they would put some spotlight on other confilicts in history instead of rehashing WW@ over and over

Pretty much every war is covered by figures... my 2nd Afghan War figures, or my Franco-Thai War confirms that. Big wide world of historical gaming, you may want to explore it.

I have no idea how you get bored of a period. Im still learning about WW2 after 30 years of reading and teaching... so many scenarios to play, so much to research.

Crimson Heretic wrote:

 Azazelx wrote:
So you're a "big WW2 buff" but you feel that "WW2 is beaten to death" and that "there's only so far you can take it" for Historical games? And it was important that you come into the BA thread in the historical gaming subforum to share that?

I mean, I don't play Infinity or WHFB, but I don't feel a compulsion to go into the threads in their subforums and gak the place up.

Yes i do enjoy history, but WW2 is over worked, i've played a decent amount of mainstream WW2 games and yes they were fun until the mini well runs dry. Then you get companies churning out models that had little to no effect on the war or hell never even saw the war (pershing, king tiger, elephant, jagtiger..the list goes on and on). Essentially when stuff like that surfaces the game loses its historic value and becomes another meta driven game. I did not come into this thread to attack any of you that play historic games, i just wish they would put some spotlight on other confilicts in history instead of rehashing WW@ over and over

So... why did you come into the Bolt Action thread to piss on the WW2 period? Also not seeing a lack of "spotlight" on any other period - unless perhaps you think this particular WW2 game should also be catering for other periods? There's a pile of other periods where people are actively playing games - and I'd wager they're more popular than WW2 in many cases. Ancients, Napoleonics, ECW, ACW. There's stuff available in a variety of scales for most any conflict between 3000bc-40,000ad Go find what you're actually interested in and be positive and interesting talking about that rather than choosing to come into the WWII threads and bitch about what you don't like about the period - which seems to be more of an anti-FoW rant from your latest post. Dakka isn't especially historical-heavy anyway, so you might find somewhere like TMP or lead-adventure more to your taste in terms of people discussing other specific historical periods that appeal to you?


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...and interestingly, the entirety of your posts/contribution to the Historical forums here on Dakka are the two posts in this thread bitching about WW2 being like, so played out...

I've said this elsewhere, but it bears saying here. Do not buy Warlord Games tank kits and only buy the infantry kits if you like their models (which are well detailed, and do look good, but...).

They are ALWAYS miscast in some fashion; barrels that are paper thin and warped (i.e. insufficient metal), tank metals are almost always rock hard and super brittle, resin is typically warped plus miscast plus huge mold lines, barrels are often bent all the way around such that fixing them will break them, and so forth.

I thought I'd save 20 bucks and buy their Chaffee and M3A1 Half Track. Dumb me, I knew better, should have spent the extra cash and bought the Company B models or waited for JTFM to finish his M3A1 and picked up a Locust.

They're fixable enough, it just means you do have to fix them (the fubar garand and carbine barrels are a royal PITA to fix though).

1/72 might be the way to go if you have other folks that are okay gaming in that scale. It's much cheaper and a much larger variety of manufacturers (although 28mm has it's fair share, depending on exactly what you are after you might find getting suitable models hard).

Have you had any experience with their plastic vehicles? Are they as shabby?

 Azazelx wrote:
...and interestingly, the entirety of your posts/contribution to the Historical forums here on Dakka are the two posts in this thread bitching about WW2 being like, so played out...

I was into the Carlist War before Perry released their range. Too played out for me now.