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Again, all I have is what I have heard from others, and a gw store employee who said they stopped producing square bases (but not calvary bases). Rumor is that 9th was supposed to be done this year, but after looking at market loss to other games like warmahordes the decision was made to turn it into a more skirmish game, with far fewer models, and basic army boxes to be released ala old school mordheim. Rules will be included to play with your whole collection still, but they are more for big campaigns or apocalypse style battles like in 40k. They are shooting for the equivalent of 500 point games with individual models having more specialized rules and abilities, also like warmahordes. Now normally I don't spout this kind of stuff, since I have no concrete proof and it seems so far away from what gw would do. But I began hearing this about 3 months ago, and its been talked about a lot lately. It would make sense why they pushed back bertonia so long. My question is have you heard anything about this kind of change at all?

FOR THOSE WHO JUST WANT TO CHIME IN "THATS BS, WILL NEVER HAPPEN" I just want to start a thread to consolidate some of these rumors going around. Please don't just chime in with hate or to say how stupid the rumor is.

And your source?

Sorry, but calling it BS is not 'hate', this needs a MOUNTAIN of salt to go with it.

It would be very strange. But many things that happen with GW are very strange, so who knows. Perhaps there will be a new game built around a smaller number of figs. Fantasy does take a ton of them to play usually.

Just like the Inquisitor rumors floating around last year, this sounds too good to be true.

Then again, we tend to use WFB stuff in skirmishes anyways.

Wouldn't mind if they finally gave us something official.

 curran12 wrote:
And your source?

Sorry, but calling it BS is not 'hate', this needs a MOUNTAIN of salt to go with it.

My "sources" are second hand rumors and internet chats. That's why I started this, to see if anyone had anything more concrete. If nothing pans out from it we can all go on ignoring 9th edition fantasy when it pops up and is still to expensive for the new players to jump into.

I've also heard there that there was considering making the next edition of Fantasy more skirmish like 40k, but I have my doubts.

 Ahtman wrote:
I've also heard there that there was considering making the next edition of Fantasy more skirmish like 40k, but I have my doubts.

A lot of people I know have heard that. Anything to add to what I wrote?

They have been growing 40K for several editions, though, in the pursuit of selling larger armies.

What makes some kind of sense is a detailed skirmish game set in the Fantasy background, intended to be used with the larger "character" figures.

GW need more games to sell, in order to access different segments of the wargamer market.

Extremely unlikely. Making fantasy skirmish-based would take quite a bit of effort, and totally change the way it plays. I mean, the whole point of Fantasy is the way the unit blocks line up and how it isn't a skirmish game. Random suspicions have no particular validity in my book.

I think it would be interesting if it happened, though. It seems more likely to me that fantasy is being neglected simply because 40k is making more money right now, not because they have any grand plans for Fantasy.

Anyway, are you hoping this happens, or dreading that it might happen? Would you be excited if it went skirmish?

 Mysterious Pants wrote:

It seems more likely to me that fantasy is being neglected simply because 40k is making more money right now

Right now? I'd have thought that was true for many years now, with no sign of reversal. I wonder if Fantasy sales are even 10% of 40K these days.

It's not beyond the realm of disbelief to think that someone's bright idea for improving Fantasy sales is to turn it into a 40K clone, only with swords instead of guns. Well, even more so.

There's a big thread on this over on Warseer from some very reliable rumour mongers.

By the sounds of it, first there will be either a major campaign or a series of campaigns about the end times in which Nagash returns. This will allow GW to release any outstanding Army Books for 8th. Then 9th is supposed to be based in a post apocalyptic world where a lot of bad stuff has gone down.

There's still some confusion whether the skirmish will replace WFB (seems stupid to me) or be an additional option to make an introduction to Warhammer more affordable.

Here's the link, anyway;

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?398133-WHF-in-the-near-future

I would totally start a lizard man army if it turned into a skirmish game. Take my money!

Ehhh... thing is, I know where this will lead eventually. It's an unending cycle of GW disappointment, even if the initial idea of skirmish letting me get into the game more cheaply.

At this point, there's a lot of fun skirmish fantasy games out, or coming out in the next few years.

 Daemonslave wrote:
There's a big thread on this over on Warseer from some very reliable rumour mongers.

By the sounds of it, first there will be either a major campaign or a series of campaigns about the end times in which Nagash returns. This will allow GW to release any outstanding Army Books for 8th. Then 9th is supposed to be based in a post apocalyptic world where a lot of bad stuff has gone down.

There's still some confusion whether the skirmish will replace WFB (seems stupid to me) or be an additional option to make an introduction to Warhammer more affordable.

Here's the link, anyway;

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?398133-WHF-in-the-near-future

That sounds both dubious and very very disconcerting. Dubious because GW surely still remember the total omnishambles that surrounded both the Eye of Terror and Storm of Chaos campaigns/storyline advancements, and given they rolled both of those events back and reset the clock at one minute to midnight(and in the case of 40K have confirmed they have no plans to change that ever again and will be exploring "historical" stuff instead) I would be extremely surprised to see them essentially do Storm of Chaos 2 - The Nagashening and then even further double-down on that concept by completely rewriting the Warhammer World as some post-apocalyptic fantasy-skirmish system. Disconcerting because it would sound like total arse even if I trusted GW's current fluff team to execute it competently, which I do not.

While Skirmish sounds like fun, GW is in the game of "selling giant armies", and that would run counter to that.

I'd love to see it happen,

I think a roll back on points, army size etc are essential to give the game a chance of springing back to anything like a true companion for 40K,

but I just don't see GW going quite as far as a skirmish game in that direction (unless you consider 40K a skirmish game, we might get to that size if we're lucky)

but we will see

 Daemonslave wrote:
There's a big thread on this over on Warseer from some very reliable rumour mongers.

By the sounds of it, first there will be either a major campaign or a series of campaigns about the end times in which Nagash returns. This will allow GW to release any outstanding Army Books for 8th. Then 9th is supposed to be based in a post apocalyptic world where a lot of bad stuff has gone down.

There's still some confusion whether the skirmish will replace WFB (seems stupid to me) or be an additional option to make an introduction to Warhammer more affordable.

Here's the link, anyway;

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?398133-WHF-in-the-near-future

Thanks, that's what I was looking for, to concentrate what we have heard somewhere.

I have to agree with the majority here. I don't see WHFB becoming the new Mordheim as much as I wish it were true.

 AegisGrimm wrote:
While Skirmish sounds like fun, GW is in the game of "selling giant armies", and that would run counter to that.

They have been known to change tactics when it could boost sales before. And tricking people into the "new, sleeker fantasy" ala warmahordes with the promise of far fewer models initially needed to purchase then ramping up what is eventually needed to play from basic models to a whole line sounds like something plausible for them. I don't put it past them to try bait and switch for one second.

My local store owner also stated 9th will be a big shift in philosophy.

I could see Regiments of Renown becoming the "entry point" for the game.

 Yodhrin wrote:
I would be extremely surprised to see them essentially do Storm of Chaos 2 - The Nagashening and then even further double-down on that concept by completely rewriting the Warhammer World as some post-apocalyptic fantasy-skirmish system.

Especially since they gave the complete Tamurkhan cycle(which would lead us down an alternate future of Karl Franz's death and near collapse of the Empire to Chaos victory, IIRC) the axe for even hinting at such a huge status change.

 Platuan4th wrote:

 Yodhrin wrote:
I would be extremely surprised to see them essentially do Storm of Chaos 2 - The Nagashening and then even further double-down on that concept by completely rewriting the Warhammer World as some post-apocalyptic fantasy-skirmish system.

Especially since they gave the complete Tamurkhan cycle(which would lead us down an alternate future of Karl Franz's death and near collapse of the Empire to Chaos victory, IIRC) the axe for even hinting at such a huge status change.

Er, that was never meant to be legitimate canon change? It was meant to be exactly what you said: an alternate future.

The general shuttering of Warhammer Forge and the subsequent axing of the Tamurkhan cycle has far more to do with the simple fact that 40k/Heresy stuff outsells Fantasy by a margin that is so large it is not really comparable.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Platuan4th wrote:

 Yodhrin wrote:
I would be extremely surprised to see them essentially do Storm of Chaos 2 - The Nagashening and then even further double-down on that concept by completely rewriting the Warhammer World as some post-apocalyptic fantasy-skirmish system.

Especially since they gave the complete Tamurkhan cycle(which would lead us down an alternate future of Karl Franz's death and near collapse of the Empire to Chaos victory, IIRC) the axe for even hinting at such a huge status change.

Er, that was never meant to be legitimate canon change? It was meant to be exactly what you said: an alternate future.

The general shuttering of Warhammer Forge and the subsequent axing of the Tamurkhan cycle has far more to do with the simple fact that 40k/Heresy stuff outsells Fantasy by a margin that is so large it is not really comparable.

Except that the axing of the rest of the Tamurkhan cycle happened before Monstrous Arcana happened, and IIRC, before the first book was actually released.

And thus, before the shuttering of Warhammer Forge. The rumors surrounding the change were what stated that the main office didn't want such an event, even if it wasn't true canon.

Wouldn't be the first time that something like that has happened then.

Imperial Armour 8 was supposed to be the first of a two book cycle and 11/12 were supposed to be multiple books as well.

 Kanluwen wrote:
Wouldn't be the first time that something like that has happened then.

Imperial Armour 8 was supposed to be the first of a two book cycle and 11/12 were supposed to be multiple books as well.

True dat. I weep for what could have been before HH took all their resources and time.

I don't see GW changing one of their flagship products, a game where you need to buy hordes of models, into a small scale skirmish game. GW haven't even released good Kill Team rules since 5th edition, I don't see them doing this to Fantasy as a whole. A Fantasy skirmish supplement or expansion would be viable, but changing the whole game isn't something they'd do.

 Brother SRM wrote:
I don't see GW changing one of their flagship products, a game where you need to buy hordes of models, into a small scale skirmish game. GW haven't even released good Kill Team rules since 5th edition, I don't see them doing this to Fantasy as a whole. A Fantasy skirmish supplement or expansion would be viable, but changing the whole game isn't something they'd do.

What if, and im just spitballing here, what if they paid a team to come up with a GOOD set of rules, and dident consider them chained down to a failing franchise anymore. If you wanted to get into fantasy today, whats your base cost. Say you want to play dwarves, what do you even need before you can play? A mini rulebook at minimum, your army book, models and dice. Dwarven warriors are now 50 bucks for 10. A stupid increase from the old what was it 12 or 15 for 35? To make one single 40 man block, you need 4 boxes, or 200 dollars. Many games out there for that price you can play at just about full level.

I can totally see them finally saying "look we need a big change, this just isn't working anymore" or they can stagnate and continue to lose market share till they are unsalavageable for anything but their IP to whore around to video game companies.

 Brother SRM wrote:
I don't see GW changing one of their flagship products

When it isn't selling I do. Change is inevitable and Fantasy has been declining for some time. I'm not saying it will change, but it wouldn't surprise me if it did. I can absolutely see them looking at the numbers and thinking that if they make Fantasy more like 40k that it might bring the numbers up. Odds of them making things reasonably priced is certainly less likely.

 Platuan4th wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
Wouldn't be the first time that something like that has happened then.

Imperial Armour 8 was supposed to be the first of a two book cycle and 11/12 were supposed to be multiple books as well.

True dat. I weep for what could have been before HH took all their resources and time.

You have no clue how much we missed.