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The Empire has suffered at the hands of the Vampires in wars that have almost destroyed them on more than one occasion. Nagash returning only makes this an even bigger threat

Yes and no - most Vampires want him destroyed or at least "sleeping" - he wants to eliminate their food supply.............plus they don't tend to do what he says.........

I totally agree the Nagash trilogy is great

This will be many much funs! I look forward to my Tomb Kings trying to strike down the accursed necromancer!

I'd say they'd march on just about any land for that opportunity!

Any talk of Heinrich Kemmler and Krell showing back up, or being able to run a necromancer undead army?

 Grot 6 wrote:
Any talk of Heinrich Kemmler and Krell showing back up, or being able to run a necromancer undead army?

They are both in the current VC book IIRC?

 Mr Morden wrote:

 Grot 6 wrote:
Any talk of Heinrich Kemmler and Krell showing back up, or being able to run a necromancer undead army?

They are both in the current VC book IIRC?

They should be. They're both in the Vampire Counts section of the online store.

You see, the real big thing that is going on here isn't a new campaign or anything....

It's GW releasing a 3rd Undead army....

 Avrik_Shasla wrote:
You see, the real big thing that is going on here isn't a new campaign or anything....

It's GW releasing a 3rd Undead army....

Or just wrapping both undead factions back together in one book. The way it was; the way it should be.

I may still be a little bitter from when half my army got cut away...

inb4 Necrons being a part of WHFB now.

 Sigvatr wrote:
inb4 Necrons being a part of WHFB now.

The beginning of trying to grab the Warmahordes market?

 puma713 wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:
inb4 Necrons being a part of WHFB now.

The beginning of trying to grab the Warmahordes market?

Well, they already made NewCrons essentially Tomb King in space, so... ;D

Fantasy is declining because, like everything else, the insane startup costs. It at least seems more balanced than 40k though. I remember the old Nagash and pre-VC Warhammer Armies: Undead.

If the model looks good I told my brother (he used to play Undead back then, even had the old Nagash) I would buy it for him for nostalgia's sake, but nothing would ever get me to play Fantasy again as long as GW does what GW does.

WayneTheGame wrote:
Fantasy is declining because, like everything else, the insane startup costs. It at least seems more balanced than 40k though. I remember the old Nagash and pre-VC Warhammer Armies: Undead.

Precisely. WHFB has insane entry costs if you buy your army from scratch and first-hand. Sure, there are cheaper builds. "Cheaper". But have fun playing Skaven, G&O, Tomb Kings, Empire etc. If they go for a Skirmish game, however, WHFB loses its main appeal, the big armies / troops. I would not be interested in a skirmish WHFB game. WHFB, to me, is all about big armies fighting each other. The only way to save WHFB is a price reduction. And that's not going to happen.

 Sigvatr wrote:

WayneTheGame wrote:
Fantasy is declining because, like everything else, the insane startup costs. It at least seems more balanced than 40k though. I remember the old Nagash and pre-VC Warhammer Armies: Undead.

Precisely. WHFB has insane entry costs if you buy your army from scratch and first-hand. Sure, there are cheaper builds. "Cheaper". But have fun playing Skaven, G&O, Tomb Kings, Empire etc. If they go for a Skirmish game, however, WHFB loses its main appeal, the big armies / troops. I would not be interested in a skirmish WHFB game. WHFB, to me, is all about big armies fighting each other. The only way to save WHFB is a price reduction. And that's not going to happen.

Bring on warhammer quest & mordheim as entry points to newcomers... run demos of those at salute and gencon... Keep people buying small warbands or expansion packs for warhammer quest ( zombicide formula) even if expensive. in short dilute the idea that WFB is all or nothing type of deal.

According to a BOLS rumor, Nagash is powerful enough to take on an entire army (supposed to be a batrep with him alone vs. a Tomb Kings army), and everyone is able to summon Undead.

Sounds pretty ridiculous to me.

@everyone can summon undead:

"Hey guys, remember that Storm of Magic and Scroll of Binding thing that everyone hated?"

"Yeah, what about it?"

"LETZ DO EET AGAIN!"

Well, there're several factions were it COULD be explained fluff-wise (if you want). Empire had Kreugar's company, Chaos had undead champions and plague skeletons and Lord Kroak is... undead. Sort of. As is Boneripper. And maybe... Kroak's Skink too.

I remember Dwarf ghosts in 'The Dark beneath the World' fighting some Orks and a (deranged) Skaven Necromancer in a WFRP adventure (well, a necromantic dwarf and elf in 'Something rotten in Kislev, too). In more recent publications the Nightmare Legion is mentioned again - maybe you can still hire them.

Of course, I still remember GWs example of Teclis summoning a bunch of khornate Daemons...

New Archaon, new Nagash, new Valten and a full blown expansion similar to Storm of Chaos.

I heard the above rumor quite some time ago while at a GW, i took it with a grain of salt but from that video we saw all 3 of the above.. I really hope it is true.

 primalexile wrote:
New Archaon, new Nagash, new Valten and a full blown expansion similar to Storm of Chaos.

I heard the above rumor quite some time ago while at a GW, i took it with a grain of salt but from that video we saw all 3 of the above.. I really hope it is true.

Hmm, I wonder how true that could be. I mean Nagash could come back for some very obvious reasons. But Valten could be a stretch, I mean he was only mortal and he was killed...This seems like a great undead expansion theme. I would love to see a new box coming from this. There were rumors a while back about new Empire units being done, new knights and new State Troops (cause they keep sucking when they make them.)

Archaon @ 10 seconds
Valten @ 15 seconds

Is Valten dead in the current 8th edition timeline? I believe the Storm of Chaos has not happened yet has it?

 Avrik_Shasla wrote:
But Valten could be a stretch, I mean he was only mortal and he was killed...

That whole Valten stuff was such a debacle that I do not think anyone would object if they retcon it away. I mean, building all this tension about this guy being a reincarnation of Sigmar, and then Archaon rolfstomp him to be in turn roflstomped by Grimgor? Seriously?

 primalexile wrote:
New Archaon, new Nagash, new Valten and a full blown expansion similar to Storm of Chaos.

Soo... terrible then?

 Cryptek of Awesome wrote:

 primalexile wrote:
New Archaon, new Nagash, new Valten and a full blown expansion similar to Storm of Chaos.

Soo... terrible then?

The only thing bad about SoC was that they were trying to hand over creative control to the community.

Never do that.

Never.

As long as they stay away from that, it should be fine.

 primalexile wrote:
Archaon @ 10 seconds
Valten @ 15 seconds

Is Valten dead in the current 8th edition timeline? I believe the Storm of Chaos has not happened yet has it?

Believed to have been assassinated by Skaven while recuperating from the battle against Archaon. Though there is speculation that a jealous elector count killed him, or possibly the Grand Theogenist, Volkmar the Grim, resurrected and controlled by Be'lakor.

If there is a new Nagash, I may have to pick one up for nostalgia and painting, I have little inclination to start WHFB, but when I played many, many, years ago, I had a force which consisted essentially just of him and whatever came in that old Skeleton box (the one with the chariot.)

If he lends himself to a conversion to become my third, Grim Reaper themed, Daemon Prince of Nurgle, then he will get promoted to the top of the shopping list!

Doesn't look like any of these rumours preclude the rumoured daemon wave either, which is good from a personal standpoint.

 Nevelon wrote:

Or just wrapping both undead factions back together in one book. The way it was; the way it should be.
I may still be a little bitter from when half my army got cut away...

I used to play a bit of Chaos, back in the day....

 puma713 wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:
inb4 Necrons being a part of WHFB now.

The beginning of trying to grab the Warmahordes market?

Warhammer Armies: Necryx!

You heard it here first folks...

WayneTheGame wrote:
According to a BOLS rumor, Nagash is powerful enough to take on an entire army (supposed to be a batrep with him alone vs. a Tomb Kings army), and everyone is able to summon Undead.

Sounds pretty ridiculous to me.

Last time he had rules (the unified undead book) Nagash clocked in at 750 points. Which while not a full army, is a reasonable little force. IIRC we were playing 1,500 to 2,500 point games back then at my FLGS. So he might be half your points for a small game, and 1/3 to 1/4 for normal/large games.

I have no idea how he would compare in today’s points, but 750 was also the price of a top-end dragon, to give a sense of scale.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Azazelx wrote:

I used to play a bit of Chaos, back in the day....

As did I. The hoops we had to jump through to build our armies back then

First they cut our units. (over 3 books)
Then they have bizarre retinue rules.

Ugh. Thanks for reminding me.

If there is a new Nagash?

I AM BUYING HIM.

Personally, I think 8th edition is the best WaFaBa's been for almost a decade. 6th was annoying at best, and 7th was better, but 8th really fixed a lot of what was wrong. (Haven't played 1st through 5th, so I can't comment on those, but if it's like anything from GW in the 80's/early 90's, it's probably very expansive, but very vague at the same time.)

Sure I still hate 'wheeling', and sort of wish it was replaced with just 'moving the entire unit block like a HUGE skirmisher'. But the game is built on this mechanic, and really utilizes it well, and to change it would change the entire game.

That being said, creating a smaller scale, skirmish type game to bring in some new people would be awesome! Just don't abandon true WaFaBa to do it.

If there is a new campaign with Nagash then BRING IT ON!! I think he's a great characters to really stir the pot across the entire setting, and I'd love to hear about interactions between races other than the empire, dwarves, high elves, or Bretonia attacking vampire counts, or WoC., or Orcs n' Goblins. We need more skaven vs ogre kingdoms, Lizzies vs wood elves, Dark eves vs chaos Dwarves! (hint, hint, poke, poke).


Considering they haven't made the heirophant for the TK (he's the bone giant, right?), maybe he could share a plastic kit with Nagash? I know it probably wouldn't happen, as they're two different armies, but, hey, they're both giant... skeleton... dudes... right?

Undead were technically my first Warhammer army of any sort, though I never actually got them onto the gaming table. If they bring out a new Nagash army, I'll have to pick it up, even if I don't play Fantasy all that often.