ISIS

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**Computron**

CptJake wrote:
Computron wrote:

Oh yes, and we can add Russia to the list of countries that McCain would declare war against if given the chance. Can't someone muzzle that lunatic?

He is a senator. He does not make or execute policy. Who cares if he babbles on?

Because he's an elected official of the largest nuclear power in the world and for him to get away with such stupidity is akin to shouting fire in a packed theatre.

**whembly**

Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
Peter Hitchens of the Mail on Sunday, who's waging a one man war against cannabis, is of the opinion that cannabis consumption and poor mental health is a significant factor in the majority of "lone wolf" attacks. Which sounds very plausible to me. Cannabis does certainly seem to crop up a lot in these cases.

Mentally ill people make easy prey for Islamists looking to radicalize and recruit people.

Lone Wolf attacks are the most insidious and terrifying form of terror attack. Theres almost nothing authorities can do to prevent it. ANYBODY can pick up a kitchen knife, go to the nearest store and go nuts. The kill count is immaterial - just killing one single person can have the desired effect. (Lee Rigby).

You see... this is why we'd need to legalize weed and export it...

Because... man, it's gotta be harder to do terroristic things when you're stoned.

**Stonebeard**

Computron wrote:
CptJake wrote:
Computron wrote:

Oh yes, and we can add Russia to the list of countries that McCain would declare war against if given the chance. Can't someone muzzle that lunatic?

He is a senator. He does not make or execute policy. Who cares if he babbles on?

Because he's an elected official of the largest nuclear power in the world and for him to get away with such stupidity is akin to shouting fire in a packed theatre.

For Mr. McCain, it's more like a man, who happens to be in one of those soundproof rooms for crying babies, shouting about the horrors of GMO's to a theater filled with biologists. Even if, by some weird stroke of luck someone hears him, said person will just write off whatever McCain said as the ravings of an idiot and otherwise ignore him.

**CptJake**

Computron wrote:
CptJake wrote:
Computron wrote:

Oh yes, and we can add Russia to the list of countries that McCain would declare war against if given the chance. Can't someone muzzle that lunatic?

He is a senator. He does not make or execute policy. Who cares if he babbles on?

Because he's an elected official of the largest nuclear power in the world and for him to get away with such stupidity is akin to shouting fire in a packed theatre.

Yeah, okay.

Perhaps you ought to do bit of reading about how our gov't functions and the roles of the various positions.

I'm sure no senator/legislator from your country has ever said anything stupid, right?

(Jacqui Lambie is one of your senators, right?)

**Bromsy**

CptJake wrote:
I suspect IF we were to see a mall attack on the scale of the attack on Westgate it will be conducted by 'home growns', perhaps with a member or two of he cell having traveled overseas for training, but perhaps not. Assuming they are Al Shabaab affiliated or influenced, they will likely have been radicalized/chosen for radicalization by a local leader with aid of the interwebz. Perhaps some clan affiliations/loyalty due to recent (within a generation) family immigration (and likely supporting the clan back home financially).

A lot of those most likely to radicalize get infiltrated/set up by one Federal agency or another before they can actually execute their planned ops, hopefully that trend continues.

From a targeting perspective I would be a lot less worried about a major mall attack in the US, the surveillance and relatively quick reaction of cops would make it difficult to pull off nearly as successfully as the Nairobi attack was. The Mall of America is in a pretty gun friendly area too. At least some folks present may be willing to put up a fight. Most of the big malls have armed security available on site too.

A much easier target would be something like an East Coast grocery store. Fewer exits so more easily controlled, much less likelihood of armed victims, less security on site. You could take it down faster and get a lot more casualties a lot easier (and with a smaller cell which means less likelihood of LE infiltration) than you could a big mall.

The MOA bans guns on it's premises, so theoretically no private citizens will be armed there. That said, they have a police presence out of the mall itself and at least some of the mall security is armed - their security in general is a significant force and halfway to police themselves as far as training and such. It's used as a stepping stone for a lot of folks who want a foot in the door as far as getting into LEO careers.

**Bullockist**

whembly wrote:
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
Peter Hitchens of the Mail on Sunday, who's waging a one man war against cannabis, is of the opinion that cannabis consumption and poor mental health is a significant factor in the majority of "lone wolf" attacks. Which sounds very plausible to me. Cannabis does certainly seem to crop up a lot in these cases.

Mentally ill people make easy prey for Islamists looking to radicalize and recruit people.

Lone Wolf attacks are the most insidious and terrifying form of terror attack. Theres almost nothing authorities can do to prevent it. ANYBODY can pick up a kitchen knife, go to the nearest store and go nuts. The kill count is immaterial - just killing one single person can have the desired effect. (Lee Rigby).

You see... this is why we'd need to legalize weed and export it...

Because... man, it's gotta be harder to do terroristic things when you're stoned.

You wouldn't be wrong.

""that's it i'm going to do it today....hmmm what's that big white thing?......fridge.....foood!.....salami and peanut butter sandwiches..*nom nom nom* ......*snore*

**BaronIveagh**

'Dude, it's me, Ahmed, i got the bombs!'
'Ahmed?'
'Yeah, man.'
'Ahmed's not here dude.'

**Frazzled**

Bromsy wrote:
CptJake wrote:
I suspect IF we were to see a mall attack on the scale of the attack on Westgate it will be conducted by 'home growns', perhaps with a member or two of he cell having traveled overseas for training, but perhaps not. Assuming they are Al Shabaab affiliated or influenced, they will likely have been radicalized/chosen for radicalization by a local leader with aid of the interwebz. Perhaps some clan affiliations/loyalty due to recent (within a generation) family immigration (and likely supporting the clan back home financially).

A lot of those most likely to radicalize get infiltrated/set up by one Federal agency or another before they can actually execute their planned ops, hopefully that trend continues.

From a targeting perspective I would be a lot less worried about a major mall attack in the US, the surveillance and relatively quick reaction of cops would make it difficult to pull off nearly as successfully as the Nairobi attack was. The Mall of America is in a pretty gun friendly area too. At least some folks present may be willing to put up a fight. Most of the big malls have armed security available on site too.

A much easier target would be something like an East Coast grocery store. Fewer exits so more easily controlled, much less likelihood of armed victims, less security on site. You could take it down faster and get a lot more casualties a lot easier (and with a smaller cell which means less likelihood of LE infiltration) than you could a big mall.

The MOA bans guns on it's premises, so theoretically no private citizens will be armed there. That said, they have a police presence out of the mall itself and at least some of the mall security is armed - their security in general is a significant force and halfway to police themselves as far as training and such. It's used as a stepping stone for a lot of folks who want a foot in the door as far as getting into LEO careers.

They ban guns? Thats stupid, but so Yankee.

**sirlynchmob**

threatening america with mall violence is the dumbest thing isis can do. America is so apathetic about gun violence in the states, they'd spend the day of coverage speculating. "terrorist" or "just another random guy shooting up the place" The terrorists would probably do less damage than a random american.

gun violence is the price they pay for the second amendment, and they're glad to pay it.

The only result of such a act would be the increase of gun sales.

**KiloFiX**

Shadow Captain Edithae wrote:
Peter Hitchens of the Mail on Sunday, who's waging a one man war against cannabis, is of the opinion that cannabis consumption and poor mental health is a significant factor in the majority of "lone wolf" attacks. Which sounds very plausible to me. Cannabis does certainly seem to crop up a lot in these cases.

Mentally ill people make easy prey for Islamists looking to radicalize and recruit people.

Lone Wolf attacks are the most insidious and terrifying form of terror attack. Theres almost nothing authorities can do to prevent it. ANYBODY can pick up a kitchen knife, go to the nearest store and go nuts. The kill count is immaterial - just killing one single person can have the desired effect. (Lee Rigby).

That's why I believe in Personal Self Defense.

It's not 100% but at least it's something.

**CptJake**

sirlynchmob wrote:
threatening america with mall violence is the dumbest thing isis can do. America is so apathetic about gun violence in the states, they'd spend the day of coverage speculating. "terrorist" or "just another random guy shooting up the place" The terrorists would probably do less damage than a random american.

gun violence is the price they pay for the second amendment, and they're glad to pay it.

The only result of such a act would be the increase of gun sales.

1st: It wasn't Da'Ish/ISIS that made the threat.

2nd: Go find a gun thread to spew your crap. There are plenty.

**sirlynchmob**

CptJake wrote:
sirlynchmob wrote:
threatening america with mall violence is the dumbest thing isis can do. America is so apathetic about gun violence in the states, they'd spend the day of coverage speculating. "terrorist" or "just another random guy shooting up the place" The terrorists would probably do less damage than a random american.

gun violence is the price they pay for the second amendment, and they're glad to pay it.

The only result of such a act would be the increase of gun sales.

1st: It wasn't Da'Ish/ISIS that made the threat.

2nd: Go find a gun thread to spew your crap. There are plenty.

1st, ok I stand corrected. it wasn't ISIS. Doesn't change my argument at all.

2nd, it's related in this case. Look at sandy hook, a terrible tragedy where even the president decided now was the time for executive action. End result. nothing changed, more gun sales.

What's the difference between a terrorist shooting up a mall or an american shooting up a mall? the color of his skin obviously. End result. nothing changes, more gun sales.

**Frazzled**

You're just jealous of our utter domination in the commercial mall market. Just because we have malls so large that they have indoor waterparks is not cause for such envy. Its ok. Its not your fault you're...small.

**sirlynchmob**

Frazzled wrote:
You're just jealous of our utter domination in the commercial mall market. Just because we have malls so large that they have indoor waterparks is not cause for such envy. Its ok. Its not your fault you're...small.

Please, your MOA is cute, but it's no west edmonton mall. MOA pales by comparison and is also listed as a target.

http://www.wem.ca/

17th in the world, largest in north america

MOA comes in 26th.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_shopping_malls_in_the_world

You'd think Texas would have a large mall since they like to claim everything is bigger in Texas.

**Frazzled**

sirlynchmob wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
You're just jealous of our utter domination in the commercial mall market. Just because we have malls so large that they have indoor waterparks is not cause for such envy. Its ok. Its not your fault you're...small.

Please, your MOA is cute, but it's no west edmonton mall. MOA pales by comparison and is also listed as a target.

http://www.wem.ca/

17th in the world, largest in north america MOA comes in 26th.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_shopping_malls_in_the_world

You'd think Texas would have a large mall since they like to claim everything is bigger in Texas.

We do. Its called Dallas.

**Jihadin**

Seems ISIS launched a snap raid and kidnapped more Christians from Syria. Mix bag of men, women, and children

Edit

We've gone all this time without inserting a "gun debate" derail. Let's keep it to the other threads eh

**Ensis Ferrae**

sirlynchmob wrote:

the color of his skin obviously.

That is completely untrue, and I think you know it. "Terrorists" come in all shapes, sizes and even colors.

I know this thread is specifically about ISIS, but... what color of skin do you think the majority of ELF members have? What about the IRA/ Sinn Fein (sp?), etc?

**CptJake**

A very good article on why Da'Ish and their ilk operate the way they do, and why we (westerners) have trouble understanding it:

http://warontherocks.com/2015/02/the-strategy-of-savagery-explaining-the-islamic-state/?singlepage=1

Yes, it is long, but in my opinion it is worth reading.

**dogma**

Frazzled wrote:

They ban guns? Thats stupid, but so Yankee.

Pretty much every business in the Twin Cities metro does, at least in my experience. Granted the bulk of that experience is dated and focused in the nicer areas of MSP proper.

CptJake wrote:

Yes, it is long, but in my opinion it is worth reading.

Interesting, but it still basically outlines the paper tiger strategy which has been a favorite of revolutionary movements since the waning days of imperialism.

**Hordini**

sirlynchmob wrote:
What's the difference between a terrorist shooting up a mall or an american shooting up a mall? the color of his skin obviously. End result. nothing changes, more gun sales.

Last time I checked being a terrorist didn't have anything to do with skin color. And if you're going for the demonstrably false "all terrorists are Muslim" implication, with the linked demonstrably false assumption that Muslims aren't white, I'd like to point out there are plenty of white Muslims, and that includes white Muslims who are also Arabs, in addition to Iranian Muslims, and Turkish Muslims, and probably others that I'm forgetting.

**CptJake**

Hordini wrote:
sirlynchmob wrote:
What's the difference between a terrorist shooting up a mall or an american shooting up a mall? the color of his skin obviously. End result. nothing changes, more gun sales.

Last time I checked being a terrorist didn't have anything to do with skin color. And if you're going for the demonstrably false "all terrorists are Muslim" implication, with the linked demonstrably false assumption that Muslims aren't white, I'd like to point out there are plenty of white Muslims, and that includes white Muslims who are also Arabs, in addition to Iranian Muslims, and Turkish Muslims, and probably others that I'm forgetting.

Many Chechens are white and Muslim. As are many Bosnians.

**whembly**

Heh... the Italians show some humor...

https://twitter.com/hashtag/We_Are_Coming_O_Rome?src=hash

**Grey Templar**

whembly wrote:
Heh... the Italians show some humor...

https://twitter.com/hashtag/We_Are_Coming_O_Rome?src=hash

Welp, ISIS is boned.

**LordofHats**

No one beats Zombie Maximus.

**Hordini**

CptJake wrote:
Hordini wrote:
sirlynchmob wrote:
What's the difference between a terrorist shooting up a mall or an american shooting up a mall? the color of his skin obviously. End result. nothing changes, more gun sales.

Last time I checked being a terrorist didn't have anything to do with skin color. And if you're going for the demonstrably false "all terrorists are Muslim" implication, with the linked demonstrably false assumption that Muslims aren't white, I'd like to point out there are plenty of white Muslims, and that includes white Muslims who are also Arabs, in addition to Iranian Muslims, and Turkish Muslims, and probably others that I'm forgetting.

Many Chechens are white and Muslim. As are many Bosnians.

Boom. I already knew I was forgetting some.

**Bullockist**

Hordini wrote:
sirlynchmob wrote:
What's the difference between a terrorist shooting up a mall or an american shooting up a mall? the color of his skin obviously. End result. nothing changes, more gun sales.

Last time I checked being a terrorist didn't have anything to do with skin color. And if you're going for the demonstrably false "all terrorists are Muslim" implication, with the linked demonstrably false assumption that Muslims aren't white, I'd like to point out there are plenty of white Muslims, and that includes white Muslims who are also Arabs, in addition to Iranian Muslims, and Turkish Muslims, and probably others that I'm forgetting.

err aren't a lot of people from the middle east considered white? I always thought since they are caucasian they should be considered white.I always have trouble with the xenophobic "they aren't the same as us"thing as they are. Israeli muslims? kurdish muslims? russian muslims, muslims from all the 'stans,lebanese muslims That's a thought, are subcontinentals technically considered caucasian?

**Hordini**

Bullockist wrote:
Hordini wrote:
sirlynchmob wrote:
What's the difference between a terrorist shooting up a mall or an american shooting up a mall? the color of his skin obviously. End result. nothing changes, more gun sales.

Last time I checked being a terrorist didn't have anything to do with skin color. And if you're going for the demonstrably false "all terrorists are Muslim" implication, with the linked demonstrably false assumption that Muslims aren't white, I'd like to point out there are plenty of white Muslims, and that includes white Muslims who are also Arabs, in addition to Iranian Muslims, and Turkish Muslims, and probably others that I'm forgetting.

err aren't a lot of people from the middle east considered white? I always thought since they are caucasian they should be considered white.I always have trouble with the xenophobic "they aren't the same as us"thing as they are. Israeli muslims? kurdish muslims? russian muslims, muslims from all the 'stans,lebanese muslims That's a thought, are subcontinentals technically considered caucasian?

Yes, that's correct. A significant number of people from the middle east would be considered white, which was part of my point.

**Relapse**

BaronIveagh wrote:
'Dude, it's me, Ahmed, i got the bombs!'
'Ahmed?'
'Yeah, man.'
'Ahmed's not here dude.'

I got the reference. I am....old. I will go rest now.

**BaronIveagh**

Relapse wrote:

I got the reference. I am....old. I will go rest now.

I know how to bring peace to the middle east. Take all the weed that gets confiscated in the US and UK in a given year, set up huge piles of it wherever the prevailing wind direction blows from, and light it all up at once. I call it the 'Shake and Bake' strategy.

**Psienesis**

... the Middle East grows the world's greatest opiate crops. Huge piles of marijuana there won't do much, they already have the best heroin on the planet.