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2014/09/17 11:14:25
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
H.B.M.C. wrote: Polygon has written what amounts to a veiled attack on the lovely Christina Sommers, almost falling over itself to attack her character via guilt-through-association with a "conservative think-tank".
This is why we hate the gaming media. Speak out against the points they're making and they don't try to rebut; they just attack you personally.
We're seeing in this thread too. On this very page in fact...
Edit: on page 13
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/09/17 11:14:58
2014/09/17 12:12:15
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
The "Are video games sexist" video was spot on, women like Christina Sommers should be the "face of feminism" if it needs one. The others remind me of Suey Park from the "#cancelcolbert" thing from a few months ago.
2014/09/17 12:22:47
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
Yonan wrote: The "Are video games sexist" video was spot on, women like Christina Sommers should be the "face of feminism" if it needs one. The others remind me of Suey Park from the "#cancelcolbert" thing from a few months ago.
Yeah they remind me of hippy movement from the 80s.
From whom are unforgiven we bring the mercy of war.
2014/09/17 14:06:01
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
Kevin VanOrd, one of the more well-known reviewers at Gamespot, has declared Christina Sommers to be a "dangerous person". This was in response to someone who claimed she was... wait for it... "mansplaining".
H.B.M.C. wrote: Kevin VanOrd, one of the more well-known reviewers at Gamespot, has declared Christina Sommers to be a "dangerous person". This was in response to someone who claimed she was... wait for it... "mansplaining".
I mean the nerve of these people.
I'm alarmed that we declare people "dangerous" for free exchange of ideas. Sometimes I don't think humanity wasn't ready for the internet.
There's a difference between "You're wrong because you're an idiot!" and "You're wrong and you're an idiot". One is ad hominem. The other isn't.
You're right, dismissing him because he is Peregrine ('Why do you argue with Peregrine? <Insert thinly veiled/implied insult here>') is possibly genetic fallacy, not ad hominem. I am not sure, but it is not really the point anyway. Regardless of what technical term you prefer, it's not very nice.
I am not saying Peregrine was nice. It is possible that he wasn't. I didn't consider his posts offensive, but I was neither the target nor a moderator so it is not mine to judge. However, that is no excuse for being not-nice back.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/09/17 15:45:11
"Our fantasy settings are grim and dark, but that is not a reflection of who we are or how we feel the real world should be. [...] We will continue to diversify the cast of characters we portray [...] so everyone can find representation and heroes they can relate to. [...] If [you don't feel the same way], you will not be missed"
https://twitter.com/WarComTeam/status/1268665798467432449/photo/1
2014/09/17 15:59:50
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
But establishing some gamer creed will certainly show that I am one of the gamers, and therefore on their side, right? This whole thing is obviously us gamers against the SJW that corrupts game journalists to make them write articles saying that gamers are dead because…
Well, that is first step, and third step is always profit anyway.
Now, I am not saying you cannot have an interesting and possibly constructive discussion with Asherian Command. You can. But with the many members in this thread that keep on saying it is all about journalist corruption/integrity, but will never stop posting vitriol at “SJW” and discussing social issues, you will not be able to. Not unless they drop the act and agree that social issues is what they actually want to rant about. Or possibly they start actually talking about corruption, but there is not much to be said on that subject, apparently.
"Our fantasy settings are grim and dark, but that is not a reflection of who we are or how we feel the real world should be. [...] We will continue to diversify the cast of characters we portray [...] so everyone can find representation and heroes they can relate to. [...] If [you don't feel the same way], you will not be missed"
https://twitter.com/WarComTeam/status/1268665798467432449/photo/1
2014/09/17 16:25:57
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
Peregrine wrote: You really need to work on your communication skills.
I'll admit, I laughed
I know, right?
Ad hominem is funny, guys.
Soladrin wrote: Peregrine, you will never change your stance on ANYTHING
There is this expression about pots and kettles...
I have never seen Mechanical Crow or HBMC do that, either, but that is completely fine because they are on your side of the argument.
Come on, guys.
I am seeing a certain lack of integrity here, which I do feel should be adressed.
Fair enough, I'll agree that there are plenty of posters on this forum that don't tend to ever change their stance on stuff. The main difference is that most of these don't argue uninformed points. (where I've encountered it, I stick to very specific parts of this forum so YMMV. )
Anyway, I'm pretty much done here untill we get another big blow out of stuff. I'm not actively taking part in the whole thing anyway.
Back to watching WCS Starcraft 2.
2014/09/17 16:36:16
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote: But establishing some gamer creed will certainly show that I am one of the gamers, and therefore on their side, right? This whole thing is obviously us gamers against the SJW that corrupts game journalists to make them write articles saying that gamers are dead because…
Well, that is first step, and third step is always profit anyway.
Now, I am not saying you cannot have an interesting and possibly constructive discussion with Asherian Command. You can. But with the many members in this thread that keep on saying it is all about journalist corruption/integrity, but will never stop posting vitriol at “SJW” and discussing social issues, you will not be able to. Not unless they drop the act and agree that social issues is what they actually want to rant about. Or possibly they start actually talking about corruption, but there is not much to be said on that subject, apparently.
You can as long as you don't insult me. I will take criticism, as long as you don't use blanketing terms and absolutes.
I have though said I mainly support the idea that there is corruption, mainly in this attack against gamers.
I think we should be kind and courteous but so far on twitter, the anti-gamer gate peeps have been extremely well.... rude. Some attack me for having an opinion to dare to slay a kings deer, but they are rude and not as kind as the gamer gaters.
There are anti-gamer gate supporters. People who are either trolling or attacking people and claiming to be friends with journalists or lawyers and claiming that they are right and we are all wrong. And keep saying it over and over again. Calling us harassers, spamming our twitters. calling us names
Yeah. You can tell the opposition are just a bunch of hypocrites. There is a difference between insulting and criticizing, or being a bloody observer.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ashiraya wrote: It doesn't really matter what his points are, belittling is unnecessary either way.
And he's not guilty of this? He insults and makes remarks with little evidence.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/09/17 16:49:23
From whom are unforgiven we bring the mercy of war.
2014/09/17 16:52:31
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
Asherian Command wrote: You can as long as you don't insult me. I will take criticism, as long as you don't use blanketing terms and absolutes.
Well, if I recall correctly, I did not insult you.
I mean, I am not saying that there are not jerks on Twitter. I have no idea. The only Twitter I sometimes read is Wonderella's. But there is no reason to take the Twitter stuff out of Twitter and into this thread, right?
Beside, I would actually be pretty surprised if there were not pro-GamerGate being jerks on Twitter too.
"Our fantasy settings are grim and dark, but that is not a reflection of who we are or how we feel the real world should be. [...] We will continue to diversify the cast of characters we portray [...] so everyone can find representation and heroes they can relate to. [...] If [you don't feel the same way], you will not be missed"
https://twitter.com/WarComTeam/status/1268665798467432449/photo/1
2014/09/17 17:02:43
Subject: Re:The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
Asherian Command wrote: You can as long as you don't insult me. I will take criticism, as long as you don't use blanketing terms and absolutes.
Well, if I recall correctly, I did not insult you.
I mean, I am not saying that there are not jerks on Twitter. I have no idea. The only Twitter I sometimes read is Wonderella's. But there is no reason to take the Twitter stuff out of Twitter and into this thread, right?
Beside, I would actually be pretty surprised if there were not pro-GamerGate being jerks on Twitter too.
Some are more aggressive but thus far anti-gamer gaters have been more aggressive and attacking more people.
I am quite surprised actually, there is a lot of positive people on GG, but the other side is overwhelmingly in chaos.
Not talking about you talking about a certain person.
From whom are unforgiven we bring the mercy of war.
2014/09/17 17:04:46
Subject: Re:The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
This should be posted here: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/613557.page, where it is really relevant to the discussion going on. I wholeheartedly agree with him that it is pretty easy for him to judge and dismiss the feelings of people whose experience he has never lived.
"Our fantasy settings are grim and dark, but that is not a reflection of who we are or how we feel the real world should be. [...] We will continue to diversify the cast of characters we portray [...] so everyone can find representation and heroes they can relate to. [...] If [you don't feel the same way], you will not be missed"
https://twitter.com/WarComTeam/status/1268665798467432449/photo/1
2014/09/17 17:27:03
Subject: Re:The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
Anyway guys, I have been asking for proof all the way back at page 5 for evidence regarding all those claims of knowing the motivations of people, like 'Quinn and Anita does this just to troll/trick people into giving them money' et cetera ad nauseam.
I'd like to repeat this request.
If you are worried you'd break some forum rule by linking evidence, you can use PM, that won't get you banned. I just want some backup for those claims, and I'll put this request to rest.
Anyway guys, I have been asking for proof all the way back at page 5 for evidence regarding all those claims of knowing the motivations of people, like 'Quinn and Anita does this just to troll/trick people into giving them money' et cetera ad nauseam.
I'd like to repeat this request.
If you are worried you'd break some forum rule by linking evidence, you can use PM, that won't get you banned. I just want some backup for those claims, and I'll put this request to rest.
I would suggest you look up depressed quest and reviews on it and the awards that they have gotten.
Please note these people all know each other personally. And also being affiliate with silver string media. (http://silverstringmedia.com/team/)
Many of the GJs are also part of the same company or publication.
They act as advisors for the GJs on many matters.
It is more of an assumption that there is corruption as you just simply connect the dots.
There is no media coverage of this at all. But silverstring is a radical feminist group. They have cowritten bits and pieces.
(Polygon @Polygon 16h FBI investigating death threats against Feminist Frequency creator Sarkeesian http://polygon.com/e/5989876 )
I know we aren't suppose to share tweets.
Spoiler:
FBI investigating death threats against Feminist Frequency creator Sarkeesian By Brian Crecente on Sep 17, 2014 at 1:30p @crecenteb
SHARE TWEET
STAY CONNECTED. FOLLOW POLYGON NOW! × The FBI is investigating death threats and online abuse that Feminist Frequency's Tropes vs Women in Games creator Anita Sarkeesian says drove her out of her home last month, a San Francisco police spokesperson confirmed to Polygon.
San Francisco police public information officer Albie Esparza told Polygon that Sarkeesian had filed a report with the police department about the threats she received online and that the police department handed the information to the FBI for investigation.
Esparza declined to release any other details, saying that doing so could compromise the investigation or the safety of the victim. He also noted that the FBI is the primary agency handling the case. FBI officials did not respond to questions about the case.
Earlier this month, Esparza told publications that there was no complaint on file from Sarkeesian. When asked why and how that changed this week, the spokesman said he sent out a statement on Friday saying that it was reported to the police department and then forwarded to the FBI for investigation. He did not further clarify why his original statement contradicted that information.
On Aug. 26, Sarkeesian took to Twitter to write that "some very scary threats have just been made against me and my family. Contacting authorities now."
She later tweeted, "I'm safe. Authorities have been notified. Staying with friends tonight. I'm not giving up. But this harassment of women in tech must stop!"
The following day, Sarkeesian shared a particularly disturbing series of threats from one abuser, along with a trigger warning. "I usually don't share the really scary stuff. But it's important for folks to know how bad it gets."
Last month, Feminist Frequency published a new episode of Tropes vs Women in Games looking at the Women as Background Decoration trope, which Sarkeesian described as "largely insignificant non-playable female characters whose sexuality or victimhood is exploited as a way to infuse edgy, gritty or racy flavoring into game worlds. These sexually objectified female bodies are designed to function as environmental texture while titillating presumed straight male players." The episode has been widely praised and shared.
Earlier this month, the International Game Developers Association told Polygon that they were working with the FBI and bullying experts to help game developers deal with what they see as an increase in online harassment.
The FBI approached IGDA executive director Kate Edwards in July to discuss the online harassment of developers online, a spokeswoman with the San Diego office of the FBI confirmed to Polygon.
"We wanted to let Ms. Edwards know the FBI's capability," FBI spokeswoman Emily Yeh said at the time.
Yeh said all 56 field offices of the FBI help investigate a variety of cybercrimes, including harassment, adding that those who feel like they are being threatened should either contact their local police department or the FBI.
"Whichever they feel more comfortable with," she said.
Reached for comment this week, Sarkeesian said she wasn't able to talk much about the incident "because of the seriousness of the situation and because it is an active investigation."
"There are ongoing investigations in multiple municipalities regarding death threats targeting me and my family," she said. "Despite the seriousness of the situation, a group of obsessive cyberstalkers have started a witch hunt against me attempting to prove some sort of paranoid conspiracy theory about fabricated threats. This is unfortunately another example of how the aggressive denial of women's lived experiences online is not only sexist but can actually be dangerous. The witch hunt is irresponsible and has further compromised my privacy and my personal safety as well as serving as a distraction to authorities during an ongoing investigation." IMAGE SOURCE FBI
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2014/09/17 19:22:26
From whom are unforgiven we bring the mercy of war.
2014/09/17 20:46:33
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
H.B.M.C. wrote: Polygon has written what amounts to a veiled attack on the lovely Christina Sommers, almost falling over itself to attack her character via guilt-through-association with a "conservative think-tank".
Why stop at veiled attacks? I'll take the veil off and attack her directly: she's either a ing idiot, or a sociopath who doesn't care what she says as long as she gets paid for it. And given how painful it was to watch her "I never play games but let me tell you all about how feminism is ruining them" video I'm favoring the first option. Take away the chance to whine and cry about the evil feminists and she wouldn't care one bit about any of this.
Ashiraya wrote: Anyway guys, I have been asking for proof all the way back at page 5 for evidence regarding all those claims of knowing the motivations of people, like 'Quinn and Anita does this just to troll/trick people into giving them money' et cetera ad nauseam.
I would suggest you look up depressed quest and reviews on it and the awards that they have gotten.
{"evidence" that is not evidence at all}
That's not what she asked for. The following are not evidence that someone is doing something just to trick people into giving them money:
*A game getting good reviews.
*People in the industry knowing each other.
*Being affiliated with feminist media.
*Lack of media coverage for your conspiracy theories.
*Claims of death threats.
Well, I take it back, I guess you could claim that it's evidence just as long as you admit that everyone is trying to trick people into giving them money. When the newest Call of Battlefield game comes out and gets good reviews it's clearly just an attempt to get money, not some amazing work of art done purely for its own sake. But if you're going to lower the standard so much that almost every game ever created is a scam then you're going to be making some awkward explanations for why this particular scam deserves so much more attention than all the other ones.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/09/17 20:54:27
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
2014/09/17 20:56:58
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
The burning pits of Hades, also known as Sweden in summer
Peregrine wrote: That's not what she asked for. The following are not evidence that someone is doing something just to trick people into giving them money:
THANK YOU.
It does get a bit tiring to see those claims be thrown around without backup and when I try to inquire for evidence, Quinn and Sarkeesian are apparently not relevant any longer.
I don't care if you have swapped discussion to whatever, I just want to see some evidence before everyone forgets about it and accepts it without proof.
And no, Asherian, speculation and extrapolation is not evidence. I want to see some irrefuteable evidence, and if there truly is no such evidence to be had even via PM then I simply call BS on the claim of motivations.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/09/17 21:43:53
ing idiot, or a sociopath who doesn't care what she says as long as she gets paid for it. And given how painful it was to watch her "I never play games but let me tell you all about how feminism is ruining them" video I'm favoring the first option. Take away the chance to whine and cry about the evil feminists and she wouldn't care one bit about any of this.
)
