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I've trimmed my armies down to 1; just my Tau. Needless to say, playing one playstyle becomes staid. I'm dying to play something that can dictate the action; hence this bullrush list:

Chaos Sorcerer: ML3, MoN, Palanquin of Nurgle, Spell Familiar, The Black Mace
Chaos Sorcerer: ML3, MoN, Palanquin of Nurgle, Spell Familiar, Powerfist

Cultists
Cultists

Chaos Spawn x5: MoN
Chaos Spawn x5: MoN
Helldrake: Baleflamer

Maulerfiend
Maulerfiend
Maulerfiend

Imperial Knight Paladin

Total: 1810

Ok, so this is the list as it stands. It's for 1850, so I need some suggestions to bump it up intelligently. I haven't purchased any models yet, so anything goes. I am open to Forge World as well. A few tactical notes:

Obviously the sorcerers go with the Spawn. Opponent dependent, the things I'll be looking for are Invisibility, Iron Arm (for mace one), Shriek (primaris, but so good), shrouding etc. The Knight will be my Warlord, so he'd usually be the Invis target.

Out of curiosity, why Palanquin and not a bike? With the Palanquin you're losing a bit of mobility requiring the spawn Slingshot you into combat. This causes problems after you consolidate away from the first unit you mangle - other units are going to run like hell and possibly kite you a bit.

With a bike, your sorcerers will be able to keep up. Also they should both have Sigil and, if you have no objections otherwise, consider running Crimson Slaughter. Giving one the Slaughterer's Horns would help boost his CC power a bit. Demonheart is kind of pricey for a 2W model if you choose to go with the bike, but if you're going to keep them on Palanquins then Demonheart would make the thing a damn tank.


Other than that, the list looks very solid.

yeah the palanquin is a really weird choice! bike or jumppack to keep up with the spawn!

Otherwise gret fun, just be careful not to trigger One Eye Open tests with the knight.

Yeah, see this is the advice I need. I haven't played an army that relied on CC since 4th edition. I thought slingshotting would be fine, but I really don't know in practice how reliable that is and how big/small a pain that is to manage in the movement phase. I really wanted those extra wounds.

I don't have my codex in front of me, can I take a sigil of corruption and a spell familiar? Or are they both icon/gift things that are limit 1?

I don't have Crimson Slaughter, so Daemonheart and Slaughter's Horns are foreign to me...maybe you could PM me the rules so we don't tick off the mods? That would be a huge favor (exaltation is in it for you...just kidding, I already exalted your posts haha).

Bikes for the Sorcerers and actually I'd lose the Marks of Nurgle on them. Because you are forced to take a god-specific power it cuts down on your chances to get Invisibility, Iron Arm, etc. Plus, your majority toughness will be 6 anyway. With the saved points, Lasher Tendrils on as many Maulerfiends as possible. Otherwise, looks like bloody good fun!

Cheers!

Edit: Just noticed the Q on Sigil and Spell Familiar - they are Special Issue Wargear for the Sigil and Chaos Rewards for the Familiar so, yes, you can take both.

Edit #2: Crimson Slaughter info - http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/585104.page

Edit #3: Semi-rules for the Obsidian Knight: http://www.ordofanaticus.com/index.php?/topic/22524-obsidian-knight/

If your Chaos faction occupies as your Primary detachment, then the Knight cannot be your Warlord. Since you have some points to spare, you could take the Obsidian Knight from Damocles. He costs slightly more than a basic Knight Paladin, but gains Rage, Outflank, and is WS/BS6 (on top of being a Seneschal).

Why put MoN on your Sorcerers at all? With MoN, they will only receive two rolls each on the desired table(s). Alternatively, take Be'lakor as your Warlord.

Nice, I'll repost the list when I get home and have the points in front of me.

Thanks guys!

Where do you find rules for this "obsidian knight of Damocles"?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Forgive my noobish post.

Damocles supplement book. Likewise, Valedor supplement and a few others are available with various formations.

http://youtu.be/jWpd3FdFg4c?t=5m30s

As to Aurelian's point, what do "we" think of subbing Bela'kor for the two bike sorcerers? Pros: I get guaranteed Invis and have points to upgrade to the damocles pimp knight. Cons: I lose 2 warp charge, spell familiars, and my spawn become less effective.

Thoughts?

 Aurelian wrote:

Why put MoN on your Sorcerers at all? With MoN, they will only receive two rolls each on the desired table(s). Alternatively, take Be'lakor as your Warlord.

Are you sure this roll portion is still true? In 7th having a mark automatically grants a sorcerer the primaris of their mark, which I believe fulfills the requirement of one god aligned power. I could be wrong on this.

They must still roll at least one, and up to half, of their powers on their patron god, but get the Primaris for free (since they can't get the entire table like the other Disciplines).

Any thoughts on my above question about Bela'kor vs. Sorcerers?

Well, Belakor does give you Invisibility, but he is all about Telepathy. Having two unmarked level 3 sorcerers gives you more warp charges, as well as the chance to get 2 Invisibility's (and the ability to possibly double up on another power within Telepathy). Plus, if it comes down to only needing 1 Invis and you get it, then the other Sorcerer can roll on another table that might suit a different role.

For me, I'd rather have two strong units of Spawn, with the flexibility that 2 Sorcerers gives, than one FMC (albeit a very good one). Additionally, a single FMC tends to get shot up quickly, which will likely give Slay the Warlord every game, whereas your Sorcerers are surrounded by 15 T6 ablative wounds.

Done. I tried to buy that Damocles book to get the rules for the Obsidian Knight but the hard copy is sold out and there is no digital copy. I mean I saw the video, and I appreciate it but to take units to tournaments you need a copy of the rules; anybody have any solutions?

I don't completely advocate taking Be'lakor due to his cost and limited function, but it seems that he fits the role you are attempting to achieve (Biomancy offense in combat, and a Telepathic defensive support caster) from two models. Be'lakor has reasonable stats, and won't necessarily need Biomancy powers (would be cool to have), and Perils won't be as detrimental unless you lose Invisibility and/or Shrouding for the game.

The Spell Familiars will definitely minimize Perils and failed castings, which is valuable when you have two casters and more spells competing with finite resources of WC (as appropriate to the situation in-game).

With Be'lakor, you lose two WC dice, but you can earn more dice when you cause your opponent to fail respective Ld-based checks (Morale, Fear, Pinning) against non-Fearless armies. You should have enough dice to reasonably result in 2-3 successful powers in either case. Also consider that if players start re-taking Culexus Assassins in their armies, the extra WC will hurt more, especially when the LOS! fails.

I think I'll stick with the sorcerers; here's the final list if people want to give it one last look; I'm torn about Laser Tendrils vs. Magma Cutters:

Chaos Sorcerer: ML3, Bike, Spell Familiar, Sigil of Corruption, The Black Mace, Meltabombs
Chaos Sorcerer: ML3, Bike, Spell Familiar, Sigil of Corruption, Powerfist

Cultists
Cultists

Chaos Spawn x5: MoN
Chaos Spawn x5: MoN
Helldrake: Baleflamer

Maulerfiend: x2 Lasher Tendrils
Maulerfiend: x2 Lasher Tendrils
Maulerfiend: x2 Lasher Tendrils

Obsidian Knight

Total: 1850

I don't mean to derail the thread, but did I miss something about Knights being available to chaos now? or was the intention to bring it in as a come-the-apoc ally?

Come the Apocalypse.

Overall, your army is fast and aggressive to force target priority but you don't have an abundance of AT weaponry until you get into combat. Between the Heldrake and Knight arriving later in game, I would make sure that any mech-heavy armies are crippled to let them devour on the "cream-filling" if you will and I think Magma cutters would increase the likelihood that any tanks are going suffer enough HP damage to become Wrecked (with the exception of Land Raiders which may need two turns).

 The Shrike wrote:
I think I'll stick with the sorcerers; here's the final list if people want to give it one last look; I'm torn about Laser Tendrils vs. Magma Cutters:

Chaos Sorcerer: ML3, Bike, Spell Familiar, Sigil of Corruption, The Black Mace, Meltabombs
Chaos Sorcerer: ML3, Bike, Spell Familiar, Sigil of Corruption, Powerfist

Cultists
Cultists

Chaos Spawn x5: MoN
Chaos Spawn x5: MoN
Helldrake: Baleflamer

Maulerfiend: x2 Lasher Tendrils
Maulerfiend: x2 Lasher Tendrils
Maulerfiend: x2 Lasher Tendrils

Obsidian Knight

Total: 1850

I like it a lot.

Tactics-wise for your psychic powers, I think you should roll Telepathy on the Black Mace sorcerer first. If you don't get Invisibility, try for it on the Power Fist sorcerer. If you DO get Invisibility on the Mace sorcerer, roll Biomancy on the Fist sorcerer. Biomancy is pretty brutal for the Biker + Sorcerer combo because Iron Arm makes his fist S10 (and he'll be T9 lol...have fun with that), and Endurance is ridiculous on Spawn - Hello Eternal Warrior and 4+ FNP. You can also Enfeeble enemy T6 models then whack them with your S10 powerfist, basically one-shotting a Riptide with your fist.

I like this list a lot - you're going to kick ass and take names.

 Aurelian wrote:
Overall, your army is fast and aggressive to force target priority but you don't have an abundance of AT weaponry until you get into combat. Between the Heldrake and Knight arriving later in game, I would make sure that any mech-heavy armies are crippled to let them devour on the "cream-filling" if you will and I think Magma cutters would increase the likelihood that any tanks are going suffer enough HP damage to become Wrecked (with the exception of Land Raiders which may need two turns).

I'm getting some feedback from people that Obsidian Knight is Apoc only.....thoughts? Should I take Gargantius the Forgotten instead? He's WS5 BS5 and has the 3++; but I'm not sure how many points. If he's more I could lose the Lasher Tendrils, which I'm thinking about anyway. They help me survive in CC against Knights and Wraithknights, but obviously hurt my damage output against all vehicles. Tough decision.

I would talk to your TO to see if it would accepted. If not, you could always take a stock Knight Paladin and you'd have 25 pts to spend on one of your HQs. If you dropped the Lashers, you could pick up a cheap fortification if allowed. As you said, keeping the Lashers would help against non-tanks, and may be more worthwhile to keep.

Stick to a standard Knight Paladin or Errant. Don't spring for the ultra expensive Knights, I think he's 500pts, and will dies just as easility as a base Knight against a competent opponent.

 Zagman wrote:
Stick to a standard Knight Paladin or Errant. Don't spring for the ultra expensive Knights, I think he's 500pts, and will dies just as easility as a base Knight against a competent opponent.

He's not much more expensive than a stock Knight actually but fields a 3++. But if he's unable to field him due to restrictions, then he won't have the option anyways.

Alright, just see how you like this. I shaved some points because Gergantius is five hundo. BUT he's +1 BS/WS/Inv save, IWND, and runs after shooting...and is a character so can challenge! Say goodnight hidden nob with a powerklaw! (like Orks were a problem in the meta )

Chaos Sorcerer: ML3, Bike, Spell Familiar, Powerfist
Bela'kor

Cultists x10
Cultists x11

Chaos Spawn x5: MoN
Helldrake: Baleflamer

Maulerfiend
Maulerfiend
Maulerfiend

Gergantius the Forgotten

Total: 1850

I do pick up another warp charge here and guarantee an Invis. But I considerably weaken the sorcerer and lose a pack of spawn. Thoughts? I kind of hate it, and I am partial to Paladins for the second large blast, but I figured I'd solicit other opinions.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Yup, I hate it too much, so here's the final list.

Chaos Sorcerer: ML3, Bike, Spell Familiar, Sigil of Corruption, The Black Mace, Meltabombs
Chaos Sorcerer: ML3, Bike, Spell Familiar, Sigil of Corruption, Powerfist

Cultists
Cultists

Chaos Spawn x5: MoN
Chaos Spawn x5: MoN
Helldrake: Baleflamer

Maulerfiend
Maulerfiend
Maulerfiend

Imperial Knight Paladin

Imperial Bunker (For Mechanicon, no source limit, in 2-source limit games I have no idea what I'll do with the spare points, probably a third squad of cultists).

Total: 1850