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davethepak wrote:
To the people who keep talking about "this is how you measure it..."

PLEASE STOP.

Half of you are wrong. Do not comment UNLESS YOU ARE READING THE RULES IN the magazine.

AGAIN they do NOT follow normal rules

Thank you.

Having actually seen the WD in person, I can tell you that you would be the one who is incorrect. Again, the rules specify that each weapon fires at the closest unit in range and line of sight (though it doesn't specifically specify "of that weapon," which is a further important distinction you should take note of) and that each one *can* fire at a different target. In order to determine how you measure range/LOS for a monstrous creature (because, again, the WD rules don't tell us how range/los are determined) you have to refer to the core rulebook. The core rulebook tells us that monstrous creatures, which these things, have 360 degree line of sight, and both line of sight and range are measured from a monstrous creatures base, not from its weapon. Ergo, despite having 'special rules', it is still subject to the core rules which make it possible for it to fire 5 weapons into a single target.

Its a 100 pt road block that can deliver a threat. Has its uses, otherwise the rules for it are questionable it seems, even at release.

Sorry if a dose of reality is "harshing someone's buzz" and "bringing the thread down, man." We're two month away from a trend becoming a pattern, and we need to see real changes to the game for the better or else you won't be getting new releases.

So cool models, if not incredibly hard to transport. And great for bringing back something that should have been in the codex to begin with. My memory isn't terrible; Nids players paid more money for less options in the new book. The free rules here are a great start, but they need a lot more to fix issues that are driving folks to greener pastures. And what happens a year from now, the white dwarf is out of print... Does GW expect someone to buy the model blind on what it does or will they start offering rules for free or will they be purchasable somewhere?

The pods do make the newer bugs interesting, but without a formation that ensures threat overload arrival turn one or two, piece mealing in bugs was always a recipe for disaster in the past. The pod being mobile does ensure a Rhino can't just tank shock it to death!

So after closer inspection of the leaked photos it appears occupants MUST disembark within 6" of the pod and cannot move and any that cannot be placed more then 1" from enemies or impassible are removed as caualties.

Meh, the 6" restriction makes this thing suffer from the same problems previous pods did. You really need to wrap the thing when you come down.

Good for devil gants as the new model allows LOS under it.

Bad for anything that would want to hide behind this thing for a turn... So basically stealers and warriors lol.


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Also its pretty fething unbelievable that they STILL aren't allowing more then 1 carnifex inside one of these. Hillariously enough he takes the same seating as a Tyranofex.... Isle hog

Yes, I thought drop pods were a little cheaper. Woe is me.

haha and it has 6 T5 wounds.

With a 4+ save. Yes, that is so incredibly hard to kill in this volume of fire meta.

and it can transport more than just marines.

So can a drop pod.

and it can move.

Yes it can.

and it's CC attacks are AP2.
and it can smash.

It can't assault, so if you end up in CC with it, that is your fault.

and it can be equipped with 5 venom cannons.

With BS2, a restriction on how it fires, and having it cost 100 points.

soooo yah. hush now.

Or I can simply respond.

as said before, these for the points are FAR superior to a drop pod

Well, they cost more, I would hope they are superior.

i

f for nothing else, the 6 wounds at T5.

With a 4+ save. It is not difficult to kill at all.

not to mention smash, moving, and enough barbed stranglers to make every ork player in a 20 mile area cry.

It can't assault, and if you are putting barbed stranglers on it, it costs 100 points. That's a pretty big investment for something you cannot fully control and that is relatively fragile.

Talking them down wont make people suddenly go "oh well guess no reason to take notice, they seem totally balanced and fine"

I'm not talking them down. People getting all hysterical for no reason is a problem.

Question, can the bugs from a Tervigon assault the turn they are spawned (I forget). If so, you could drop in a pod, fart out the Tervigon, then poop out models. Per the rules, those gants didn't deep strike, so could assault?

Tervigon spawnings can't move/charge, they can only run or shoot.

Oh, well. I feel like podding Tervigon Brothers will be a great thing as you can get bugs in vehicle back arcs and bring the glancing templates. I'd bring a Tyrannofex with the two sprays, as well.

I'd not being the 4+ bugs, on second thought, just because Tau would murder them softly with interceptor fire.

I could see these being hilarious paried with the endless swarm formation and a couple of trygons. Re-spawning groups of 20 poisoned gaunts and 3 half&half FB/devilgants in your lines turn 2. All of which come in from trygon tunnels if they are killed. Pair with lictors and maybe a coms relay, nids have a really nasty DS army with these things.

Then land 2 malanthrops along with for synapse/spore cloud. GG.

I keep thinking of how much fun I could have with those sporepods but the reality is that every carnifex/other monstrous creature I stick in one of them is one less model on the table to eat up some heavy incoming from my opponent, I'm not sure how worth it that is, as it just concentrates more fire on things like my flyrants and shrikes.

I can see using them to block LoS for an advancing horde...

Yea comparing these thing to drop pods is a pointless exercise.

Drop pods are in fact MUCH better.

They are less then half the cost

They can have Obsec

They can come in on turn 1

AV12 3HP is arguably more durable to more things as well.

Oh and DP's cost about half in real currency

Having said all that these pods needed to be worse in a vacuum because of the book they are in. Tyranids shouldn't arrive in your DZ.

I wish these were cheaper but will need to see how they pan out. I used to barely pack enough stealers in the old Spods to work, costing double may make it less effective.

I am also wondering how well the infiltrator works as a synapse anchor mid field. Heck just infiltrate it onto an objective and rush your gargs and gaunts past it.

 Sasori wrote:

 Orock wrote:
Im all for tyranids getting better, but drop pods are a HUGE problem in this edition. They need to be not able to even contest objectives, or give you linebreaker for what they do and how many points they are, its broken. here is my space marine drop pod army. Blow 12 pods off the board by turn 5 or lose the game, Hope you dident have something else you needed to shoot more.

A single Tyranid drop pod nearly 3x the cost of a Space Marine drop pod.

Space Marine Drop pods may be a problem this edition, but I do not foresee The Tyranid ones having the same impact as they are much more expensive and not objective secured.

They may be only a little over the cost of 2,but they also bring to the table 2x the number of units or MCs which are largely favored this edition and also 5x the shooting. They also have 2x the wounds with 6 and can only be instakilled with a str 10, while regular drop pods can be killed with 1 shot with anything str 7 or higher no matter the ap. Assaulting this will also be much tougher because still a MC so ap 2, while a drop pod for space marines is auto hits for the attacker.

I just can't believe that they released ANOTHER large dual kit.

When was the last time GW updated infantry for 40k?

Would it have killed them to make a new type of infantry?

Flying genestealers? Cavalry stealers? The fact genestealers bond and adapt to any host makes the potential limitless.

 Red Corsair wrote:
I just can't believe that they released ANOTHER large dual kit.

When was the last time GW updated infantry for 40k?

Astra Militarum saw the Scions and Ogryn kits.

Would it have killed them to make a new type of infantry?

A "new variation" of some kind of an existing infantry(ala the Bullgryn) or a new actual classification of infantry, like Superheavy Infantry?

 Red Corsair wrote:
When was the last time GW updated infantry for 40k?

Would it have killed them to make a new type of infantry?

Not sure if serious...

There have been a ton of new infantry kits this year and a ton of new/updated infantry units...

Cavalry Genestealers...?


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 Kanluwen wrote:
Astra Militarum saw the Scions and Ogryn kits.

Orks had Flash Gits. DE had Wracks. Eldar had Wraiths.

So yeah, there's been a lot of updated/new infantry.

Don't forget that the Space Marine release saw a complete recut of the venerable SM Tactical squad, a new Sternguard box, a new Vanguard Veteran box, and Centurions.

Almost every release has seen at least one new infantry kit.

 Red Corsair wrote:
I just can't believe that they released ANOTHER large dual kit.

When was the last time GW updated infantry for 40k?

Would it have killed them to make a new type of infantry?

Flying genestealers? Cavalry stealers? The fact genestealers bond and adapt to any host makes the potential limitless.

As others have pointed out, there have been updates. But then I'm sure new kits sell better. New gamers and collectors/modelers will buy everything, but veteran gamers aren't guaranteed to buy new versions of miniatures they already own. I still use 2nd edition Biovores and Termagants, 3rd edition Zoanthropes, etc.

And there's a good indication of a new Zoan/venomthrope kit next week, so there's another possible infantry kit,

 Redemption wrote:
And there's a good indication of a new Zoan/venomthrope kit next week, so there's another possible infantry kit,

I don't think we've seen any such indication... Unless we're assuming 'Psychic Horror' is that indication...

Y'all think the Sporepod might make stealers viable again?

Any thoughts on what to deliver with these things? I'm thinking the ideal would combine synapse creatures with a high rate of short-ranged fire support. This would provide flexibility for patching any holes in the hive mind while providing directed quick punch.

The one thought I keep coming back to is 6 warriors with deathspitters or 3 zoanthropes. I know both suffer from how easily they're autokilled, but by deepstriking you can place them strategically to reduce their exposure to S8+ weapons while giving fire/synapse support to the advance hoard.

Pyrovores and TFex are good starters

I thought about the TFex, but it's not synapse so it lacks in the one area I was thinking. It might be the best MC to drop though. Pyrovores are interesting though they lack synapse as well.

 pretre wrote:

 Redemption wrote:
And there's a good indication of a new Zoan/venomthrope kit next week, so there's another possible infantry kit,

I don't think we've seen any such indication... Unless we're assuming 'Psychic Horror' is that indication...

That, and the removal of the finecast zoanthrope and venomthrope models from GW's webstore.

Mymearan wrote:There are way more expensive things that will also get one-shot by S10 weapons. Why point this out specifically?

Most the other T5 stuff can hide in other units (Tyranid primes, broodlords, red terror) or flies (harpy, crone).

Sasori wrote:I have to agree, the "They have ID to strength 10" is really not that big a deal. Most armies don't really have a lot of access to strength 10. I can't even remember the last time I saw a Railhead on the Tabletop.

The only regular strength 10 that I see run regularly competitively, is usually a Wraith Knight.

Plus, if they do have strength 10 I'd rather them point it at my drop pod that's already done it's primary job, than something else anyway.

If it was ID to strength 8, then I would concede an issue. Strength 10 ID is really not an issue though.

lobbywatson wrote:When i hear people complain about getting doubled out on T5 models all I can think of is this....

Mod Edit: Please don't post links like this on the forum. - RiTides

Seriously for 75 points each you can have 3.5 of them which is the cost of one stock wraithknight....

Do what they do in the movie frozen... Let it go...its a awesome model with good rules.

I don't think I ever said that it sucks because of S10 instant death, I'm pretty sure I just pointed out that this is why I don't like the instant death rule. For the most part your opponent won't have S10.... but when they do it's hurty to lose a 75pt model in 1 shot. When they don't have S10 to dedicate to it, it's 12.5pts per T5 4+ wound, which is pretty good.

You may be able to have 3.5 of them for the cost of 1 stock wraithknight... but it only takes the wraithknight 1 shooting phase or 1 assault phase to kill it. It's not like you're tying up the wraithknight for any significant time

aiaiaiai... is anyone of you reading the rules or just talking?


it says clearly: MEASURE FROM THE MUZZLE OF EACH GUN!

http://i.imgur.com/gqr5Lzr.jpg

last paragraph on the left. And if you are looking at "16" now go a few lines up. Thanks.


(pic from 3plusplus.net forum)

Byron40k wrote:
aiaiaiai... is anyone of you reading the rules or just talking?


it says clearly: MEASURE FROM THE MUZZLE OF EACH GUN!

http://i.imgur.com/gqr5Lzr.jpg

last paragraph on the left. And if you are looking at "16" now go a few lines up. Thanks.


(pic from 3plusplus.net forum)

That's not rules. That's White Dwarf editorial fluff.


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 Redemption wrote:
and the removal of the finecast zoanthrope and venomthrope models from GW's webstore.

That's hardly an indicator. Just all the Bret players.

Im thinking 3 of those pods, filled with 2 exocrines and 2 Malanthrope with flanking devilgaunts (20x devourers 10xfleshborers) and flanking tervigon (cluster spine and egrub) with 2 Flyrant with hive commander to allow the troops to flank could be a good start for an "in yo face" army.

oz of the north wrote:

 Sasori wrote:

 Orock wrote:
Im all for tyranids getting better, but drop pods are a HUGE problem in this edition. They need to be not able to even contest objectives, or give you linebreaker for what they do and how many points they are, its broken. here is my space marine drop pod army. Blow 12 pods off the board by turn 5 or lose the game, Hope you dident have something else you needed to shoot more.

A single Tyranid drop pod nearly 3x the cost of a Space Marine drop pod.

Space Marine Drop pods may be a problem this edition, but I do not foresee The Tyranid ones having the same impact as they are much more expensive and not objective secured.

They may be only a little over the cost of 2,but they also bring to the table 2x the number of units Wong, they both bring 1 unit in.
or MCs which are largely favored this edition and also 5x the shooting. At Bs 2 or even more points invested.
They also have 2x the wounds with 6 and can only be instakilled with a str 10, while regular drop pods can be killed with 1 shot with anything str 7 or higher no matter the ap. Lol what?....no. hullpoints are much more valuable than wounds that have a 4+ armor save. Drop pods cant be one shotted by anything s7 or higher, read up on your rules.
Assaulting this will also be much tougher because still a MC so ap 2, while a drop pod for space marines is auto hits for the attacker. Of course why would your opponent assault it in the first place?

Decent arguments, but you stated them all funky.

Im glad for the nids.
But its not making them top tier OP.

 pretre wrote:


That's not rules. That's White Dwarf editorial fluff.
.

I know this is a dead horse but the rules say very much the same thing.

The rule for point of reference:
"Each weapon on this model automatically fires at the closest enemy unit within range and line of sight. The shots are resolved at the end of the shooting phase before Morale checks are taken. Each weapon can fire at a different target unit but they cannot be fired in any other way or at any other time."

Is someone able to point out to me where the rules for a MC firing from the base are located in the BRB, I see nothing in the shooting section and the MC section just has this:
Monstrous Creatures: Shooting
"Monstrous Creatures can fire up to two of their weapons each Shooting phase - they must, of course, fire both at the same target. They may never Go to Ground, voluntarily or otherwise."

Thanks. Again, not trying to be argumentative, I'm simply curious.