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 Zande4 wrote:

Verviedi wrote:

 Zande4 wrote:
@Verviedi why do you make threads like this? It's becoming a habit for you. You know exactly what kind of replies you're going to get, you're just looking to start arguments.

Because I can, and there isn't a rule against it.

There's little Timmy!

I am a mix of Timmy and Spike, incidentally. Love my Wraithknights (Timmy) but I use the more subtle approach of buffed Psyker deathstar.

There is a Timmy at my store. He has 4 unpainted armies, and promised me that he would paint his GKs. Sadly, when he says "paint", he means "basecoat with red or blue and wash with Nuln Oil"
And I can't refuse games against him because RL friend.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Frankenberry wrote:

 Zande4 wrote:

Verviedi wrote:

 Zande4 wrote:
@Verviedi why do you make threads like this? It's becoming a habit for you. You know exactly what kind of replies you're going to get, you're just looking to start arguments.

Because I can, and there isn't a rule against it.

There's little Timmy!

This couldn't have been funnier, have an exalt sir.

Could have been funny, needs more dragons.

Probably that kid from that old Frosties advert

"They're gonna tase great! They're gonna tase gret! I can hear the sound of Frosties hittin me plate!"

Seems the people getting worked up the most about Little Timmys in this topic are the people defending them, in an extraordinarily kneejerk and hypocritical way, while IMO getting the definitions wrong.
As far as I can see 'Little Timmy' is not 'any kid who ever picked up a codex and fumbled the dice'. That's too wide, and if you're starting to froth at the mouth because of it, seek help. If you started out as an awkward kid, who stuck with it and became a... I hesitate to say 'mature' gamer, for several reasons... you're not a Little Timmy, and I'd doubt if you ever were.
Rather, as has been mentioned several times, Little Timmy is the particular market that GW has been criticised for aiming at, informed by previous economic bracketing: the temporary customer, the kid with well-off parents who gets a starter box for Christmas or Birthday because it's ded kewl, gets a couple more boxes, then dumps the whole thing when they get bored and move onto another fad. And replaced, in GW's eyes, by another kid hitting their eleventh year. Then another, and another, and so on. Churn and burn.

I gotta agree it's annoying that GW structures themselves around this particular slice of a demographic, to the detriment of their prices, product design, rules quality etc. But, well, it seems to me that GW always aimed at kids. All that attractive 'dark and grown up' stuff of early GW was arguably less attractive to actual grown-ups, and related to part of that old chestnut by C S Lewis that gets bandied about in defence of toy soldiers: “Critics who treat 'adult' as a term of approval, instead of as a merely descriptive term, cannot be adult themselves. To be concerned about being grown up, to admire the grown up because it is grown up, to blush at the suspicion of being childish; these things are the marks of childhood and adolescence..."

So people have stuck with the same game from their own childhood. One with wacky, gnarly models covered in spikez, skullz, and huge wepunz. One with rules that rely on stacks of 'Top Trumps' memorisation and list-building rather than elegance and tactical consideration. And then they grumble about children moving into the game, and the game catering to them. My question, the TL;DR of all this, is:

If you're annoyed about your game being tailored to kids, then why are you playing a kid's game?

"We were all "Little Timmy" at one point. "

Not so.

I don't play GW games. I didn't start wargaming until I was 42.

I was never a Little Timmy.

EDIT- Removed

Sooooo.....if I get this right.....focusing on bringing new gamers (of any age) into the fold with shiny new units and demo games galore is making bad business decisions and providing tighter rules for long time gamers to make better lists with the models they already have (and therefore no need for new ones) is good business.

Right then....now I understand the problem with lil Timmy.

The problem is one of balance; when the company focuses entirely on the former, and it's completely at the expense of the latter.

The issue is I believe that you now have all of GW's product lines and releases controlled by a sales department. i.e. they decide what should or shouldn't be in the game, and the people that are focused on what should make the game 'good' (and by that, I mean a balanced ruleset with clean rules that can provide a good experience for the player involving tactical planning - the central tenet of a wargame) are forced to play second fiddle.

Orktavius wrote:
Sooooo.....if I get this right.....focusing on bringing new gamers (of any age) into the fold with shiny new units and demo games galore is making bad business decisions and providing tighter rules for long time gamers to make better lists with the models they already have (and therefore no need for new ones) is good business.

Right then....now I understand the problem with lil Timmy.

You are assuming adding new units needs to be unbalanced. It doesn't. Plenty of game companies these days manage to expand their range regularly and keep their tight, balanced gameplay.

Games Workshop chooses to not bother with the balance side of rules development. That's a co virus decision, and one that will be brought up by people searching for a more balanced experience.

I had no idea people put this much meaning behind the term.

I was always under the impression that "little timmy" simply referred to someone young who's new to the hobby.

 Bronzefists42 wrote:
Well the usage of the term is partially due to the seeming hatred of children some of the more distasteful members of the hobby have.

Many adults Hate the fact that someone that is not a blessed power gamer dare to even look their way.

Others hate that they see their distasteful qualities reflected in the kids, who then on serve as a constant reminder of their failings.

And some kids just really suck.

Not to say everyone who uses "little Timmy" is like this (I use it myself) but some people I have met through this game just really hate kids.

I don't hate all kids. Just the ones that are spoiled little snots.

I thought "Little Timmy" referred to a child who begs his parents to buy him more marine kits while having no solid knowledge or understanding of the game, it's publisher and their practices. Meaning, an ignorant source of moolah. Games Workshop's target audience.