Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Starweavers are officially awesome. I'd kill to let my tau have a few (it will make EMP commandos work!, until next codex will take away our haywire mass too at least )

Open-topped skimmer is nice for assaults, having it get a 4++ on demand, even if once only-it a godsend. it will take at the very least some decent firepower to down the thing, without even hurting its not-too-shabby damage output.
Its no WS, but nothing is quite a WS, but I'd say it competes with ghost ark for the second-best transport around.

Not sure about the voidreaver though. the EMP cannon is nice, but not enough to be a true anti-tank solultion. the prism cannon looks like an intresting TAC option though.


As for the FoC chart, I'd say its early to panic. by what I see so far what I suspect is that you can take an entire FoC for its (non-listed) benefits, or take a single trope and up to a single character as a "formation" (and naturally as 7th go duplicate it as much as you want)

Exactly what time do preorders usually go up in USA?

Frankly - I am not even that mad about the restrictions of FOC, especially as I will still be able to field them alone (thanks to this being actual Detachement and I am able to take Warlord Trait on basically any character), and as I wasn't planning them to be some BIG force anyway - something about max 2000 points.
Shame about lack of some big time HQ of course, but oh well - maybe there will be one in a dex ?

The things that I am really happy about instead is the Voidweaver, it looks just fine, and will be enough of HS slot for this type of army, and will be able to do some tank hunting, as well as of course that we will get actual Codex - full, Hard Cover, official release with probably more Detachements and additions.

Dis whole stuff is fine by me!

Nifty, thanks for posting those images. The models look lovely.

I'm hoping that some of the Eldar and DE choices that are suitable make it into the codex proper, but I'm not going to hold my breath as they seem to expect you to use allies to add them in. This is fine however you are stuck with the troop tax and neither the Eldar or DE troops really fits in properly.

My first reaction to the void weaver was 'wtf, its got so many guns, its way undercosted when compared to a venom'.

But then I got to thinking, aside from range issues (which are huge for an AV 10 vehicle having to get within 24 inches to attack); this is a rather nice depature from what GW normally does with regards to points.

A lot of times you pay for something regardless of its usefulness. Tac Terminators are a good example. They pay so many points for a combination of gear that on paper sounds fantastic, but at the end of the day is pretty useless.

They pay gobs of points for +2 armor, that at the end of the way is tactically restrictive. They pay for a stormbolter, which is really a sad amount of firepower compared to the overall price of the unit. And they pay for a powerfist, while devastating, rarely ever sees action in skilled play (the terminators are either avoided or killed before use).

Burna boyz are another example of paying a lot of points for a dangerous weapon, but ultimately its on a pathetically weak chasis (just an ork boy).

These voidweavers do have a fantastic amount of firepower, but its not firepower it can really use all at the same time. I think 75 points is actually quite fair considering the platform's limitations.

And the ability to squadron them is amazing.

If the codex has HQ options like the Great Harlequin/Avatar, GW will have successfully pulled me back into 40K.

Mimes too?

Wow!

A big IF though, right?

I'm still hoping something like that is in there...

All signs are pointing to no more surprises.

I imagine the Masque is just like the Coven Coterie basic detachment that nobody uses. There will be formations we haven't seen yet and they'll be more usable than the Masque.

So Death Jesters and Shadowseers are their own units now? Maybe they can be allocated out like Warlocks?

mercury14 wrote:
I imagine the Masque is just like the Coven Coterie basic detachment that nobody uses. There will be formations we haven't seen yet and they'll be more usable than the Masque.

So Death Jesters and Shadowseers are their own units now? Maybe they can be allocated out like Warlocks?

They used to be their own units back in the day, this is just a return to what they should be !

mercury14 wrote:
I imagine the Masque is just like the Coven Coterie basic detachment that nobody uses. There will be formations we haven't seen yet and they'll be more usable than the Masque.

So Death Jesters and Shadowseers are their own units now? Maybe they can be allocated out like Warlocks?

I would think that 2014-style basic detachments as used with the recent Dark Eldar release are likely dead now.

I'd expect it to be similar to the Necrons' Reclamation Legion, with other formations building on it, adding to a "super-formation.detachment". Masque could either be the 1+ "core" or the name for the "super-formation" that comprises variable amounts of smaller "sub-formations".

Does this mean, with the possibility of commonly running two detachments. That two Solitaires will be an option? One per detachment?

haroon wrote:
Exactly what time do preorders usually go up in USA?

Friday at 2pm ish in North America.

 drazz wrote:
Does this mean, with the possibility of commonly running two detachments. That two Solitaires will be an option? One per detachment?

Nope they are unique you can only bring 1 per army.
You can't bring two Mephistons or Marneus Calgars or Avatars of Khaine can you? No double CAD does not help you with unique characters.

In White Dwarf 53 GW released some kind of ally rules and a matrix for the Harlequins. I could not find a scan of it online. Has someone access to the issue and could post a photo or description how it works, please? It is currently impossible to ally Harlequins with CWE/DE as they have no HQ unit. Maybe these WD rules allow it

Warhams-77 wrote:
In White Dwarf 53 GW released some kind of ally rules and a matrix for the Harlequins. I could not find a scan of it online. Has someone access to the issue and could post a photo or description how it works, please? It is currently impossible to ally Harlequins with CWE/DE as they have no HQ unit. Maybe these WD rules allow it

They can't use an Allied Detachment. Instead, they must use the Masque detachment (printed in part in issue 55, scanned a page or two back) or play unbound, depending on how many you want to use.

In any case, they are BB with Eldar and DE, AoC with the Imperium and Tau, and Desperate or Come The Apoc with anyone else.

Battle Bros: Eldar/Dark Eldar
Allies of Convenience: Imperium, Tau
Desperate Allies: Orks
Come the Apocalypse: Chaos, Tyranids

I think that's it.

**Edit: by Para..

Add Necrons to 'Come the Apocalypse'.

Mymearan wrote:
People, stop your doomsaying and think for a moment. Has there been any 7th Ed codex without multiple detachments/formations? Nope. So why would this be any different? Just wait for all the formations before you throw your Harlies in the trash.

Except most tournaments I've seen/gone to don't allow those formations/allies, only bare bones codexes/standard force org...
7th ed is a broken pile of insanity if you let everyone just do whatever...so as far as I am concerned, if Harlequins have no HQ, not a standard force org (instead whatever crazyness that one is) then I am not interested in the army.

Never been to a tournament that didn't allow:

-Inquisition
-Legion of the Damned
-Knights

All are codexes with special force org detachments that don't include the majority of what we know of as the force org. They will be legit for Tournament play in any non-single detachment event. They just have certain requirements to bring.

That said depending on the Shadowseers I can totally understand why they force everything but elites to be full. Imagine being able to take a ton of eldar psykers for super small taxes on other units.

 Red Corsair wrote:
Hmmm, being able to join 7 deathjesters to Maugan rha sounds like a fun fire base

Not quite there yet...

Ha ha ha! Glorious!

What are the odds we'll get Death Jesters with lances again?

Reasonable?
They've been pretty consistent with the eldar/dark eldar weapon options. The mini having just a cannon may not matter, it's not as though Meks and Sang Priest clam packs include all their options.

 Hulksmash wrote:
Never been to a tournament that didn't allow:

-Inquisition
-Legion of the Damned
-Knights

All are codexes with special force org detachments that don't include the majority of what we know of as the force org. They will be legit for Tournament play in any non-single detachment event. They just have certain requirements to bring.

That said depending on the Shadowseers I can totally understand why they force everything but elites to be full. Imagine being able to take a ton of eldar psykers for super small taxes on other units.

Agreed - just with they would allow more than 3 troop choices....
Did a little math hammer last night - now we do not know prices on all wargear or deathjesters and psyckers, but did 3 squads of 5 - with starweavers , 1 squad had 3 kisses and 2 caresses, the other two had the same but with neurodisruptors, had a Solitaire, bikes 3 man with glaive for about 1000 pts.. not cheap

 Alpharius wrote:
If the codex has HQ options like the Great Harlequin/Avatar, GW will have successfully pulled me back into 40K.

Mimes too?

Wow!

A big IF though, right?

I'm still hoping something like that is in there...

I'm guessing wer're going to see exclusions like these pretty consistently going forward. It gives them some room for future expansions through supplements and campaign books.

 Eiluj The Farseer wrote:

 drazz wrote:
Does this mean, with the possibility of commonly running two detachments. That two Solitaires will be an option? One per detachment?

Nope they are unique you can only bring 1 per army.
You can't bring two Mephistons or Marneus Calgars or Avatars of Khaine can you? No double CAD does not help you with unique characters.

It's "A" solitaire, not "the" solitaire, so I'm pretty sure you can take multiples, and you can indeed take more than one avatar, read Heart of the Craftworld special rule, you can have as many avatars as you have detachments

The new harlequins make me want to start a force of them with dark eldar allies. Can't justify starting a new 40k army throw, but would be nice.

Pathfinder Shaun wrote:

 Eiluj The Farseer wrote:

 drazz wrote:
Does this mean, with the possibility of commonly running two detachments. That two Solitaires will be an option? One per detachment?

Nope they are unique you can only bring 1 per army.
You can't bring two Mephistons or Marneus Calgars or Avatars of Khaine can you? No double CAD does not help you with unique characters.

It's "A" solitaire, not "the" solitaire, so I'm pretty sure you can take multiples, and you can indeed take more than one avatar, read Heart of the Craftworld special rule, you can have as many avatars as you have detachments

However according to the rules an army can only have one Solitaire, no matter how many detachments you take.

 Rainbow Dash wrote:

Mymearan wrote:
People, stop your doomsaying and think for a moment. Has there been any 7th Ed codex without multiple detachments/formations? Nope. So why would this be any different? Just wait for all the formations before you throw your Harlies in the trash.

Except most tournaments I've seen/gone to don't allow those formations/allies, only bare bones codexes/standard force org...
7th ed is a broken pile of insanity if you let everyone just do whatever...so as far as I am concerned, if Harlequins have no HQ, not a standard force org (instead whatever crazyness that one is) then I am not interested in the army.

Technically Space wolves only have one formation, they have more in the Champions of Fenris Supplement but the actual codex only has the great company formation which is a bit rubbish really.

I think it's fine to have all these fancy organisations but it is restrictive if you don't want to play an army as suggested, whether for fluff/competitive/or you just want to add to your forces without playing unbound if you actually want to mix and match legally

Young Logan