Chaos Space Marine Rumors bye bye Cult Marines

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**H.B.M.C.**

JohnHwangDD wrote:
For the benefit of those few posters who might wonder why I'm not responding to HMBC's provocations, he is being ignored.

I love you too buddy!

And of course you're ignoring me. To engage with me would require you to come up with cogent arguments for the weird and whacky things you post, and we all know that's beyond you.

But we've known each other for so long now, so even if you are going to pretend I'm not there - just hiding in the shadows of your mind - then the least you could do is spell my name right.

BYE

**aka_mythos**

plastictrees wrote:
aka_mythos wrote:
plastictrees wrote:

Anyway. There's no reason that you couldn't have a diverse Chaos Marine book, even with Marks and then still have cult/legion supplements.
If anything is supplement based they are going to be accused of cash grabbing. I don't care how it's parsed out, I just want it to be interesting to build/play.
I think part of GW's issue with a diverse codex is that when you look at how they sell the game now, they want you to pay for each little different experience. A diverse army allows a player a range of gaming experience without necessarily spending money and at this point they'd rather coax people into buying whole new armies than just a new unit or two. They've killed about a quarter of their sales volume over the last 3 years with price hikes, so each remaining customer has to buy 25% more stuff for them to do as well as they were three years ago. That difference just about means a whole new army every two years, beyond what people are already spending.When they subdivide books a player now has two half armies and then it doesn't take as much to coax them into "completing" one and then the other. The real backfire is hen people decide its too much to buy to keep up and instead drop out of the hobby.

I don't see the evidence for what you're describing, unless by "pay for each little experience" you just mean the cost of the book(s)?
When has the "two half armies" thing occured?

When people had Grey Knights and Inquisitors. Or when Daemons and Chaos Marines were split.
The cost of the books is the most apparent form of what I mean. GW is pretty much out to give as little variation in play experience as possible with each codex, because they want to commoditize the flexibility of their game system. I don't think GW is successful with what they're doing but its pretty plain that they are doing what they can to get a fewer number of people to build more armies and spend more money.

**pepsuber**

Watching the playful banter between DD and H.B.M.C. gave me an idea. The two of them should get their own show where they run a FLGS. It would be the odd couple of the gaming world.

"What happens when you get two gamers together that do not agree on anything and have them run a gaming store? Hijinks, thats what. Weeknights at 8pm, 7pm central."

**JohnHwangDD**

pepsuber wrote:
Watching the playful banter between DD and H.B.M.C. gave me an idea. The two of them should get their own show where they run a FLGS. It would be the odd couple of the gaming world.

"What happens when you get two gamers together that do not agree on anything and have them run a gaming store? Hijinks, thats what. Weeknights at 8pm, 7pm central."

Running a gaming store? Ha! Things were sorta plausible up to that point, but everybody knows that starting a gaming store involves a cut in your lifestyle, big cut in your pay, and a bigger cut in your personal net worth. It's quite possibly the worst business decision one could make as any sort of gamer. HMBC is goofy, but I doubt he's foolish enough to mix business with pleasure. Sorry, not realistic.

**Azreal13**

If you're going to mock someone, have the courtesy to spell their name right, Honj.

**CthuluIsSpy**

Matt.Kingsley wrote:
Um, it is 7th Ed...
and BA already have a 7th Ed codex...

Do the Space Marines have a 7th ed book?
I do agree that it is unlikely for GW to downgrade the BA to a supplement when they already have a codex.

**pepsuber**

It's called suspension of disbelief. Exaggerations and even flat out falsehoods are used to achieve comedic effect all the time.

@CthulusSpy: Black templars had their own codex, until they got demoted to a mere chapter trait. Yes it was serverely outdated but if GW can reduce an entire codex to a mere few pages in a codex then reducing it to a supplement is not that hard to believe. Hell, Blood Angles use to have its rules in a WD which i beleive is even worse since those can be harder to obtain.

**CthuluIsSpy**

pepsuber wrote:
It's called suspension of disbelief. Exaggerations and even flat out falsehoods are used to achieve comedic effect all the time.

@CthulusSpy: Black templars had their own codex, until they got demoted to a mere chapter trait. Yes it was serverely outdated but if GW can reduce an entire codex to a mere few pages in a codex then reducing it to a supplement is not that hard to believe. Hell, Blood Angles use to have its rules in a WD which i beleive is even worse since those can be harder to obtain.

Yeah, but the BT were demoted 3-4 editions after their codex.
I find it unlikely that GW would release a codex for an army, and then demote that army to a supplement in the same edition.

**DarkStarSabre**

ClockworkZion wrote:
I like how Sisters got left out of the Imperium list.

Seriously though, unless every faction is going to get something like 10 different books we don't need more books. We need better books.

You're not Space Marines.

And AM were listed as our resident Lost and the Damned counterparts. Which really, perhaps shouldn't be since Lost and the Damned is a FW list.

And a damn fine one at that. Let's me use these 30 traitor Kasrkin in my CSM army as dirt cheap scoring allies. (Seriously, 1 HQ and 3 troops for around 350 points is super valuable to a Death Guard army!)

Automatically Appended Next Post:

H.B.M.C. wrote:
Maybe GW will grow some stones and give a big beastie in 40K that doesn't have the world "Wraith" in it a Toughness value of 8.

In fact, screw it, give the Bloodthirster 2nd Ed stats:

WS10
BS10
S10
T10
W10
A10
Everything10

(I can't remember if it was T10... probably not... )

Ah, the good old days...when the only things that could stand up to a Bloodthirster on the field were Eldar Avatars, Hive Tyrants and if you believed in longshots...Lictors

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Veskern wrote:

Which codex releases forced us to purchase titans and monstrous creatures? All the recent boxed armies have been decent deals, the 'web bundles' have only ever been provided for that one guy somewhere who likes to buy at full retail but only has web access for 30 seconds every month.

You could also see it as CSM without Cult Marines is the same as a Space Marine codex without Blood Angels.

Uhm - new Orks with mandatory Naut, which price is little lower than Apo's Stompa? Space Marines which, in Tournaments, are rather expected to work with Imperial Knight? Or Wraithknight in Eldars which is ruling every table ?

Decent deals - holy hell, saying that, for example, recent Adaptus Astartes Strikeforce (NOT previous SM Strikeforce!) is decent deal - *BLAM!* HERESY!
But on serious - as I said before, new Strikeforces/deals/packages are just, mostly, WEAK (maybe except Dark Eldar one, which is just good, same as Astra Militarium one) - Adeptus Astartes, Blood Angels (which is just big weirdo), or Orks - it is truly mixed bag, as compared to old, and unavailable sets like NEMESIS VANGUARD? Like even old CSM Attack Force?

You got a point here, because CSM stripped off from Cult Marines would bring this codex A LOT closer to generic Space Marines - but with spikes and Doggie-walkers. And it is not the same, because on one hand, GW would try to make tricks like that, smuggling rules to WD and making it mandatory purchase even for those who got little care about this paper, and, on the other, ignoring HUGE fanbases, and, for example, cutting Black Templars into Generic SM, making them not only lose their unique character and some units, but also throwing them into oblivion of these non-competetive army lists.

I wouldn't mind, of course (especially as ex-CSM player) some CULT SUPPLEMENTS containing Detachements and some advanced rules exclusive only for those who vow one Chaos God, but if it would be done WITHOUT cutting CONTENT from the Core Codex, which is 100% dickish and cash-grabbing move - am I right ?

To be fair, Black Templars sort of didn't lose much. The Emperor's Champion and Crusader squads moved to the new codex as well.

I think you lost the ability to stick Storm Shields in basic assault squads? But in return gained everything else. Including Storm Pidgeys.