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I think TrasnD Beamers on Wraiths is the way to go. You can't have too many MC killers in a Cron list.

Hollismason wrote:
A Cryptek with Solar Staff , outflanking with a large unit of Flayed Ones on turn 2 isn't that terrible a idea. Hrrrmmm.

Assuming you come in on turn 2. Can the Cryptek outflank though? Maybe that's what I was thinking of, that it's ok to outflank with the unit?

Hollismason wrote:
A Cryptek with Solar Staff , outflanking with a large unit of Flayed Ones on turn 2 isn't that terrible a idea. Hrrrmmm.

Infiltrate does not confer to the IC. Just discussed.

 Ghaz wrote:

 luke1705 wrote:
D Lord can't deep strike though right?

Wrong. The Destroyer Lord's Unit Type is 'Jet Pack Infantry'. You'll see if you check the rulebook one of the special rules that Jet Pack units have is 'Deep Strike'.

Yeah gotta love all of those hidden special rules. I understand the consolidation, but how hard would it be to just put that in the unit profile? That's some redundancy I could get behind.

On topic though, how would you guys deep strike a D Lord if you had to? With flayed ones? Probably would take a solar staff, but maybe it's best to include a Cryptek to have it so the D Lord could have a warscythe/voidreaper


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Aha! So I just looked into the rulebook to double check. I am marginally vindicated! So outflank works like infiltrate used to - you just need one model that has the rule. So it will work with ICs. It actually kind of makes sense. The turn one infiltrate was some nasty stuff but with reserves it's turn 2 at best so that's not too bad. Outflank to your heart's content

The infiltrate doesn't but the Outflank ability most certainly does.

So outflanking with Flayed Ones and a Cryptek to give them some good saves isn't a terrible idea. Honestly having a huge strong squad show up turn two or later isn't that big of a hindrance, plus it's actually possible get some reroll reserve rolls in the Necron army.

 luke1705 wrote:
Yeah gotta love all of those hidden special rules. I understand the consolidation, but how hard would it be to just put that in the unit profile? That's some redundancy I could get behind.

It's not exactly hidden, its a rule that the unit gets because of its unit type so that's the best place to put it.

Okay how is this for a assault heavy take all comers list

Destroyer Lord w/ Warscythe, Phase Shifter (155) ( can Deep STrike with Flayed Ones, Praetorians, or Go with the Wraiths)
Cryptek w/ Staff (80) ( can stay with the Wraiths to give them that valuable 6s to hit on the first turn or outflank with the Flayed Ones. running w/ the Wraiths won't be to bad especially if there's a lot of firepower on them it may slow their movement on the first turn but ensure a Turn 2 charge by them)

Elites
13 Flayed Ones ( outflanking or deep striking) (169)

Elites
10 Warriors w/ Ghost Ark (235)
5 Immortals w/ Night Scythe (215)

Fast Attack
6 Wraiths w/ Whip Coils (258)
9 Tomb Blades w/ Gauss Blasters , Shield Vanes, Nebuloscopes (188)
3 Tomb Blades w/ Nebuloscopes , Shield Vanes (66) (Late game objective Grabbers, Flyer Killers)

H. Support

H. Destroyer (50)

H. Destroyer (50)

H. Destroyer (50)

Fortification
Aegis Defense Line w/ Quad Gun (75)

Formations
Justicar Battalion
5 Praetorians P. Casters (140)
5 Praetorians P. Casters (140)
Triarch Stalker w/ H. Gauss Cannon (135)

This gives me some nice tactical options, 3 Deep Striking Lascannons, or I can get them near the Triarch for a BS of 5 for a 2+ reroll. The D-Lord can can stay with the Wraiths or deep strike with the Praetorians, and Flayed Ones, The Flayed Ones can infiltrate snaked forward with the Cryptek or Outflank with them.

3 Tomb Blades sitting back and pot shotting Flyers or running around grabbing objectives.

Hollismason wrote:
Okay how is this for a assault heavy take all comers list

Destroyer Lord w/ Warscythe, Phase Shifter (155) ( can Deep STrike with Flayed Ones, Praetorians, or Go with the Wraiths)
Cryptek w/ Staff (80) ( can stay with the Wraiths to give them that valuable 6s to hit on the first turn or outflank with the Flayed Ones. running w/ the Wraiths won't be to bad especially if there's a lot of firepower on them it may slow their movement on the first turn but ensure a Turn 2 charge by them)

Elites
13 Flayed Ones ( outflanking or deep striking) (169)

Elites
10 Warriors w/ Ghost Ark (235)
5 Immortals w/ Night Scythe (215)

Fast Attack
6 Wraiths w/ Whip Coils (258)
9 Tomb Blades w/ Gauss Blasters , Shield Vanes, Nebuloscopes (188)
3 Tomb Blades w/ Nebuloscopes , Shield Vanes (66) (Late game objective Grabbers, Flyer Killers)

H. Support

H. Destroyer (50)

H. Destroyer (50)

H. Destroyer (50)

Fortification
Aegis Defense Line w/ Quad Gun (75)

Formations
Justicar Battalion
5 Praetorians P. Casters (140)
5 Praetorians P. Casters (140)
Triarch Stalker w/ H. Gauss Cannon (135)

This gives me some nice tactical options, 3 Deep Striking Lascannons, or I can get them near the Triarch for a BS of 5 for a 2+ reroll. The D-Lord can can stay with the Wraiths or deep strike with the Praetorians, and Flayed Ones, The Flayed Ones can infiltrate snaked forward with the Cryptek or Outflank with them.

3 Tomb Blades sitting back and pot shotting Flyers or running around grabbing objectives.

I think wraiths with TransD beamers is the way to go. The soft spot for Necrons is MC and TransD beamers help with that. 5 wraiths with TransD beamers > 6 wraiths with whip coils.

Wraiths with Transbeamers cannot move and shoot. Unless beasts are relentless.

Hollismason wrote:
Wraiths with Transbeamers cannot move and shoot. Unless beasts are relentless.

Canoptek Harvest. Because why run them any other way?

Anything you shoot the Transdimensional beamer at you can probably charge and kill so I say why bother that's kind of my view of it.

Hollismason wrote:
Anything you shoot the Transdimensional beamer at you can probably charge and kill so I say why bother that's kind of my view of it.

Well, yeah, but tying up an MC for multiple turns when you have a chance to just outright remove it from the board, psh.

 krodarklorr wrote:

Hollismason wrote:
Wraiths with Transbeamers cannot move and shoot. Unless beasts are relentless.

Canoptek Harvest. Because why run them any other way?

Because CAD is better

It's only on a 6, I'll take the more reliable murderizing Wraiths. It's not like the thing your shooting at isn't going to have a Invulnerable or a Cover save.

It's just meh.

Hollismason wrote:
Anything you shoot the Transdimensional beamer at you can probably charge and kill so I say why bother that's kind of my view of it.

Think of it like this: If you could get 1 extra attack per model at Initiative 10 that was AP2 with ID on 6s, you would take it. It's the same thing, but instead of being at I10, it's before the attack. And if it kills them outright, they don't get overwatch. You're paying 10 points to do more damage, and if you don't kill it outright, you'll do the same damage charging as you would without them. Except more, because now they're down models.

bodazoka wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

Hollismason wrote:
Wraiths with Transbeamers cannot move and shoot. Unless beasts are relentless.

Canoptek Harvest. Because why run them any other way?

Because CAD is better

CAD + Canoptek Harvest is best. Don't need to be part of a decurion to get that sweet sweet Relentless and 5+ RP or Shred. Just have to pay 110 points for 4 models that are actually still pretty good on their own.

I'd rather be giving my Wraiths RP with the Formation than relentless.

Hollismason wrote:
I'd rather be giving my Wraiths RP with the Formation than relentless.

You don't have to choose... everything in the formation gets Move Through Cover and Relentless baseline. The choice is between RP, Shred, and Fleet. So you can get both RP and Relentless.

Oh right, yeah for whatever reason I keep thinking that's a choice they have to make.

Beamer are a tough call. They are only really good against mc, but necrons struggle with mc.

I'm also not sure if CAD is better or not. It's obsec for troops versus army wide 4+ rp. They can both build a solid list.

 schadenfreude wrote:
Beamer are a tough call. They are only really good against mc, but necrons struggle with mc.

I'm also not sure if CAD is better or not. It's obsec for troops versus army wide 4+ rp. They can both build a solid list.

Beamers are the right call. You have a seriously good chance (~50%) of outright removing a Dreadknight or a Wraithknight and when you outright remove them you generate enough tempo to effectively win the game right there. It's like flipping a coin to see if you win the game.

col_impact wrote:

 schadenfreude wrote:
Beamer are a tough call. They are only really good against mc, but necrons struggle with mc.

I'm also not sure if CAD is better or not. It's obsec for troops versus army wide 4+ rp. They can both build a solid list.

Beamers are the right call. You have a seriously good chance (~50%) of outright removing a Dreadknight or a Wraithknight and when you outright remove them you generate enough tempo to effectively win the game right there. It's like flipping a coin to see if you win the game.

Just saw that Necron vs Grey Knight game. Watching that Dreadknight get removed by a single overwatch shot was a bit painful.

In the dark harvest list, with flayed ones being troops, do you think that massed flayed ones could be viable?

I think mass flayed ones could be viable in the normal Necron dex as well, and moreso within a Decurion for the extra durability.
Sure, the Dark Harvest version gets ObSec, but that's about it. They have less attacks and pay extra for shred, and then it is one use only.

Hitokageresu wrote:
In the dark harvest list, with flayed ones being troops, do you think that massed flayed ones could be viable?

If you take Dark Harvest Flayed Ones, you have to use the profiles provided in IA12. And you don't want to do that.

 schadenfreude wrote:
Beamer are a tough call. They are only really good against mc, but necrons struggle with mc.

I'm also not sure if CAD is better or not. It's obsec for troops versus army wide 4+ rp. They can both build a solid list.

They're not "only good against MC" by any stretch of the imagination. It's still a S4 AP2 gun. You know what that kills? Marines, Terminators, Eldar, Tau Battlesuits, Immortals, Tyranid Warriors, Hive Guard, Obliterators, Nobz... everything. Anything that is too "light" to require ID on 6s is still going to take a S4 AP2 hit. That's not useless.

Eh.. I still don't consider it that strong of a build for the simple fact that the spyder will get taken out and then the powers kind of meh.

You don't lose Relentless when the Spyder dies, only RP/Fleet/Shred. So Beamers are still good even if they focus the Spyder or you leave it behind.

Oh right, yeah I cannot get it out of my head that the Spyders give relentless for whatever reason.

yea, TransD is sick. It turns the MCs that the opponents fielding against you from assets for them into liabilities for them.

It's 60 points though for the squad pushing the formation to a hefty 400+ points.