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Deshkar wrote:
Yep, in JY2's batrep, the Wraithstar should retain their Reanimation Protocols until the start of his next turn. Unless the necron player goes 2nd and gets alpha striked, the spyder will have done its job of making the wraiths nearly invulnerable to ranged weaponry for up to at least the start of the necron players' turn 3.

This is not very clear, but I believe it goes as soon as the spider is killed, as you are no longer within 12 inches of the spider, which is the primary clause... Just my opinion and how I am playing it at the moment. (lets hope this is the way or this formation is going keep peeing people off)

I'm more than a little surprised that the Wraiths took down that Knight so quickly (did you just roll a lot of 6s to glance/pen, or did the D-Lord do a lot of the damage?) Otherwise, the report so far is convincing me that Necrons became more, not less, competitive. That 4+ RP is going to be a real pain for most armies to deal with.

I'm a little curious about how the organization of the previous NecroNids force works. It's obviously not using an Allied Detachment-- are you actually using a combined + Leviathan Detachment? (I'm coming back into the game after a short hiatus, and I'm a bit rusty on how the the 7th ed detachments work-- can you actually make a list with two full, non-Allied detachments like that?)

Lord of Nonsensical Crap wrote:
I'm more than a little surprised that the Wraiths took down that Knight so quickly (did you just roll a lot of 6s to glance/pen, or did the D-Lord do a lot of the damage?) Otherwise, the report so far is convincing me that Necrons became more, not less, competitive. That 4+ RP is going to be a real pain for most armies to deal with.

I'm a little curious about how the organization of the previous NecroNids force works. It's obviously not using an Allied Detachment-- are you actually using a combined + Leviathan Detachment? (I'm coming back into the game after a short hiatus, and I'm a bit rusty on how the the new detachments work-- can you actually make a list with two full, non-Allied detachments like that?)

New Necrons are a lot more durable with the Decurion formation but the damage output is not as great since there is a requirement to take so many extra models in the auxillaries. I have been testing out a list for LVO, without a solid auxillary formation such as the destroyer cult, the list just takes a lot of damage but doesn't dish it out well at all. For example, I tried a list with the Annihilation nexus and royal court and the list just didn't pack any punch. The tesla nerf was a lot more serious than I thought after running about five games with the new codex and Annihilation barges are not worth the points.

I have a feeling that the Judicator Battalion probably isn't competitive (stalker is way too easy to kill), the Annihilation Nexus isn't competitive (Doomsday arks are useless if you jink and annihilation barges are too expensive), and the doomscythe formation isn't competitive (jinking the doomscythes makes them impotent). However, Flayed ones are amazing and the deathmarks are still great (especially with relentless). Both units are inexpensive and pack a lot of punch for the points. I haven't tested the canopatek swarm. Seems like a lot of extra models I wouldn't necessarily take in a regular list.

Flayed ones may never get into combat but your opponent will do everything he can to stay as far away from them as possible and you don't need to take a lot of them. If your opponent does let them get into melee, chances are it will be expensive for him. 10 flayed ones could destroy a blob of guard or orks or brood of any sort of small tyranids and still have models left over.

Warmonger2757 wrote:

Lord of Nonsensical Crap wrote:
I'm more than a little surprised that the Wraiths took down that Knight so quickly (did you just roll a lot of 6s to glance/pen, or did the D-Lord do a lot of the damage?) Otherwise, the report so far is convincing me that Necrons became more, not less, competitive. That 4+ RP is going to be a real pain for most armies to deal with.

I'm a little curious about how the organization of the previous NecroNids force works. It's obviously not using an Allied Detachment-- are you actually using a combined + Leviathan Detachment? (I'm coming back into the game after a short hiatus, and I'm a bit rusty on how the the new detachments work-- can you actually make a list with two full, non-Allied detachments like that?)

New Necrons are a lot more durable with the Decurion formation but the damage output is not as great since there is a requirement to take so many extra models in the auxillaries. I have been testing out a list for LVO, without a solid auxillary formation such as the destroyer cult, the list just takes a lot of damage but doesn't dish it out well at all. For example, I tried a list with the Annihilation nexus and royal court and the list just didn't pack any punch. The tesla nerf was a lot more serious than I thought after running about five games with the new codex and Annihilation barges are not worth the points.

I have a feeling that the Judicator Battalion probably isn't competitive (stalker is way too easy to kill), the Annihilation Nexus isn't competitive (Doomsday arks are useless if you jink and annihilation barges are too expensive), and the doomscythe formation isn't competitive (jinking the doomscythes makes them impotent). However, Flayed ones are amazing and the deathmarks are still great (especially with relentless). Both units are inexpensive and pack a lot of punch for the points. I haven't tested the canopatek swarm. Seems like a lot of extra models I wouldn't necessarily take in a regular list.

Flayed ones may never get into combat but your opponent will do everything he can to stay as far away from them as possible and you don't need to take a lot of them. If your opponent does let them get into melee, chances are it will be expensive for him. 10 flayed ones could destroy a blob of guard or orks or brood of any sort of small tyranids and still have models left over.

Yea tomb blades and flayed ones are the true super hitters in the codex.

I feel that the Judacator Battalion requires a minimum 2 Stalkers to run well. From there if you take NS with the Praetorians its pretty solid. Just use the formation buff to help the NS kill Flyers/FMC.

Doomsday Arks are just fine in cover. You wouldn't need to jink and it isn't hard to get that 25% as they are fairly low to the ground. That and AV13 to start with 4 hull points makes them hit hard. And an okay cointer to Wraiths.

umbo wrote:

Deshkar wrote:
Yep, in JY2's batrep, the Wraithstar should retain their Reanimation Protocols until the start of his next turn. Unless the necron player goes 2nd and gets alpha striked, the spyder will have done its job of making the wraiths nearly invulnerable to ranged weaponry for up to at least the start of the necron players' turn 3.

This is not very clear, but I believe it goes as soon as the spider is killed, as you are no longer within 12 inches of the spider, which is the primary clause... Just my opinion and how I am playing it at the moment. (lets hope this is the way or this formation is going keep peeing people off)

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/635131.page From dakka's on YMDC, posted earlier in this thread as well. By RAW, the buff remains even after the spyder is dead.

 koooaei wrote:

 Red Corsair wrote:
His first turn drop pod was kind of a waste, he didn't gain much territory using where he did and he shot at a horrible target.

Really surprised you man handled his knight like that You must have rolled pretty hot on your rends, or he whiffed and your D lord punked it?

Statistically, it's 2 HP off on the charge.

He didn't have a full unit.

Decurion Necron battle report completed on p. 3.





Automatically Appended Next Post:

 SwistakCZC wrote:
In my opinion from choices you've proposed Lance wit Rants is the best. There is so few good counters to that. I've played against the same list once and I have to admit it's hard as f*k.

But I belive, newcrons gonna be more interesting.

Tell me how do you competetive guys in US interpret Canoptek Harvest wording. May I have only 1 spyder in formation? Or may I buy it and then buy him upgrades normally as described in heavy support section. Which means not only wargear but including two more spyders to this one as well? I'm looking forward to see a faq, but i know it's a pipe dream only.

My Adlance-flyrant army is not as strong because it will have problems in the Maelstrom scenarios. Flyrants don't want to land and knights don't want to split up. As long as the opponent spreads out the objectives, I will have trouble with Secondaries in the BAO format.

Newcrons will be interesting as well as very challenging to play, but honestly, if I run them, then I feel that my chances of winning isn't very high (compared to some of the other armies that I have in my poll).

 Ansel Darach wrote:
I was wondering, is there any reason you aren't taking particale casters on the wraiths for the S6 shot and +1A, or does it jump the cost just above the "too high" mark.

Just curious to hear your thoughts on that.

I don't interpret the particle casters to give +1A to the wraiths and will not play it as such (unless it is actually FAQ'd by the tournament as giving the +1A).

 MLKTH wrote:
^You can't take both whip coils and casters. It's "one of the following" type of deal.

And that too!

 Tomb King wrote:

 jy2 wrote:

 Tomb King wrote:
My turn 1 is rather uneventful. Necrons advance. Warriors disembark from their transport and Zandrekh + immortals get in.

Not sure if its been mentioned but this isnt allowed. Warriors only...

It's been mentioned.

Apologies then, also does killing the spyder remove the benefits or do they still last until the necron players next turn? It appears the game is closer then expected. You killed the solo imperial knight pretty easily though.

No worries.

With regards to the spider benefits, honestly, I hadn't really thought that much about it. I tend to play more conservatively (as in no, they don't last) but I also tend to play it the way the majority of the people do. I guess I'll just have to check with the TO's with regards to how they would rule it.

 Red Corsair wrote:
His first turn drop pod was kind of a waste, he didn't gain much territory using where he did and he shot at a horrible target.

Really surprised you man handled his knight like that You must have rolled pretty hot on your rends, or he whiffed and your D lord punked it?

He did it mainly to grab a Maelstrom objective (#2). But to be fair, I don't think he realized just how resilient the Newcrons were.

I took off 1HP on T1 with shooting. I then took off another 1HP on T2 with shooting, so when I charged, he only had 4HP remaining.

Wraiths (with Prefered Enemy) took off 2HP with their assault. 20 attacks, about 12 hits due to PE, 2 glances/pens....that's about average.

D-lord then hit 3 times out of 4 attacks and penned with all 3 attacks.

Deshkar wrote:
Yep, in JY2's batrep, the Wraithstar should retain their Reanimation Protocols until the start of his next turn. Unless the necron player goes 2nd and gets alpha striked, the spyder will have done its job of making the wraiths nearly invulnerable to ranged weaponry for up to at least the start of the necron players' turn 3.

If that is how the majority of the people interpret it, then I will play it that way in the future.

But first, I will check with the TO (for the LVO) to see their rulings on it.

Darkwynn wrote:
in your Test games JY have you noticed that your games go a lot longer? Played a couple times against the new necrons and I swear the games go 30 to 45 minutes longer. It feels like its because of all the extra RP saves and models not dieing as fast.

So by turn 3 or 4 there is still 30% more models on the board then what they used to be like.

Not really. I tend to play somewhat faster than most other people. The new RP is just like FNP. It'll only take more time if the players aren't very familiar with it.

This game actually took longer than normal to play, but that is mainly because my opponent takes his time.





Automatically Appended Next Post:

 SwistakCZC wrote:
Ive changed my mind, take the fluffkillah, not newcrons, wraiths with triple rant are even too fab man.

Had another test game with it against mechdar. It's turning out to be a very strong build.

Lord of Nonsensical Crap wrote:
I'm more than a little surprised that the Wraiths took down that Knight so quickly (did you just roll a lot of 6s to glance/pen, or did the D-Lord do a lot of the damage?) Otherwise, the report so far is convincing me that Necrons became more, not less, competitive. That 4+ RP is going to be a real pain for most armies to deal with.

I'm a little curious about how the organization of the previous NecroNids force works. It's obviously not using an Allied Detachment-- are you actually using a combined + Leviathan Detachment? (I'm coming back into the game after a short hiatus, and I'm a bit rusty on how the the 7th ed detachments work-- can you actually make a list with two full, non-Allied detachments like that?)

I did manage to strip off 2HP's with 2 turns of shooting before charging in with my wraithstar. The wraithstar itself did 5HP of damage, 2 for the wraiths and 3 for the D-lord. I swear, with T6, 2+/4++ and 4+++ RP re-rolling 1's, that guy is a major bada$$!

NecroNids consists of Newcron CAD + Leviathan Detachment. It's legal as long as the detachments are unique.

Warmonger2757 wrote:
New Necrons are a lot more durable with the Decurion formation but the damage output is not as great since there is a requirement to take so many extra models in the auxillaries. I have been testing out a list for LVO, without a solid auxillary formation such as the destroyer cult, the list just takes a lot of damage but doesn't dish it out well at all. For example, I tried a list with the Annihilation nexus and royal court and the list just didn't pack any punch. The tesla nerf was a lot more serious than I thought after running about five games with the new codex and Annihilation barges are not worth the points.

I have a feeling that the Judicator Battalion probably isn't competitive (stalker is way too easy to kill), the Annihilation Nexus isn't competitive (Doomsday arks are useless if you jink and annihilation barges are too expensive), and the doomscythe formation isn't competitive (jinking the doomscythes makes them impotent). However, Flayed ones are amazing and the deathmarks are still great (especially with relentless). Both units are inexpensive and pack a lot of punch for the points. I haven't tested the canopatek swarm. Seems like a lot of extra models I wouldn't necessarily take in a regular list.

Flayed ones may never get into combat but your opponent will do everything he can to stay as far away from them as possible and you don't need to take a lot of them. If your opponent does let them get into melee, chances are it will be expensive for him. 10 flayed ones could destroy a blob of guard or orks or brood of any sort of small tyranids and still have models left over.

Bingo! Give that man a cigar! The Decurion trades offense for defense. This army can win, but it usually won't win big.

col_impact wrote:
Yea tomb blades and flayed ones are the true super hitters in the codex.

You left out the wraiths! How could you do that!?!

 BrotherGecko wrote:
I feel that the Judacator Battalion requires a minimum 2 Stalkers to run well. From there if you take NS with the Praetorians its pretty solid. Just use the formation buff to help the NS kill Flyers/FMC.

Doomsday Arks are just fine in cover. You wouldn't need to jink and it isn't hard to get that 25% as they are fairly low to the ground. That and AV13 to start with 4 hull points makes them hit hard. And an okay cointer to Wraiths.

I wouldn't overdo it with the JB. The Triarch Stalker is more of a support, force-multiplier unit than an actual offensive one. The Decurion suffers from the lack of offense. I think you need to focus on getting more firepower/offense into the army. Don't overdo it with the support units.

Also, there is some controversy with regards to Praetorians and Night Scythes. My recommendation is that you don't buy them Night Scythes.

 BrotherGecko wrote:
I feel that the Judacator Battalion requires a minimum 2 Stalkers to run well. From there if you take NS with the Praetorians its pretty solid. Just use the formation buff to help the NS kill Flyers/FMC.

Doomsday Arks are just fine in cover. You wouldn't need to jink and it isn't hard to get that 25% as they are fairly low to the ground. That and AV13 to start with 4 hull points makes them hit hard. And an okay cointer to Wraiths.

In my experience, doomsday arks don't make it much past turn 2. I play against a lot of eldar players and once that first pen hit happens, av 11 doesn't protect the ark at all.

Being able to reroll hits and reroll wounds and armour penetration with the Night Scythes, make them pretty great with the Judicator Battallion but it hinges on the Triarch STalker remaining alive.

Possibly a YMDC question - If the Praetorians take Night Scythes, are they considered part of the formation? They are a separate unit from the Praetorians, and the only listed models in the formation are the praetorians and the stalker(s).

 jy2 wrote:

I did manage to strip off 2HP's with 2 turns of shooting before charging in with my wraithstar. The wraithstar itself did 5HP of damage, 2 for the wraiths and 3 for the D-lord. I swear, with T6, 2+/4++ and 4+++ RP re-rolling 1's, that guy is a major bada$$!

Great battle report as always. I had one question though, you claim your D-lord was getting rerolls of 1's on his RP, how? I thought in the decurion you had to be within 12" of the reclemation HQ to receive that, which was Zahndrek in your list correct?

Necronic Angel wrote:

 jy2 wrote:

I did manage to strip off 2HP's with 2 turns of shooting before charging in with my wraithstar. The wraithstar itself did 5HP of damage, 2 for the wraiths and 3 for the D-lord. I swear, with T6, 2+/4++ and 4+++ RP re-rolling 1's, that guy is a major bada$$!

Great battle report as always. I had one question though, you claim your D-lord was getting rerolls of 1's on his RP, how? I thought in the decurion you had to be within 12" of the reclemation HQ to receive that, which was Zahndrek in your list correct?

No codex nearby ATM, but i think the Reclamation Legion formation are the only models that get re-roll 1's when within 12" of the overlord anyway.

 tetrisphreak wrote:
Possibly a YMDC question - If the Praetorians take Night Scythes, are they considered part of the formation? They are a separate unit from the Praetorians, and the only listed models in the formation are the praetorians and the stalker(s).

I would say yes. DT's counts as having the same role as the unit they were bought for all rules purposes.

Necronic Angel wrote:

 jy2 wrote:

I did manage to strip off 2HP's with 2 turns of shooting before charging in with my wraithstar. The wraithstar itself did 5HP of damage, 2 for the wraiths and 3 for the D-lord. I swear, with T6, 2+/4++ and 4+++ RP re-rolling 1's, that guy is a major bada$$!

Great battle report as always. I had one question though, you claim your D-lord was getting rerolls of 1's on his RP, how? I thought in the decurion you had to be within 12" of the reclemation HQ to receive that, which was Zahndrek in your list correct?

Yes, my mistake. I thought the +1 RP was a part of the Reclamation Legion as well as the re-roll 1's. Hence, if the +1 RP applied to all the other formations, I assumed the re-roll 1's would also. However, after reviewing the rules, the +1 RP is part of the Decurion and the re-roll 1's part of the Reclamation.

As far as gameplay was concerned, it probably affected 2-3 of my RP tests with regards to my wraithstar and maybe 1-2 were reversed from failure to successes.

 jy2 wrote:

Ok, so here are my thoughts on the new Necrons with the Decurion detachment. It is super-resilient. However, it's offense is also somewhat stagnant. I've got basically 1 hard-hitting hammer unit, my wraithstar, but as soon as it went down, the offense of the rest of the army was just mediocre. To be fair, however, I think the Destroyer Cult would have done better against another army. But against White Scars, where their jink saves are the same as their armor saves, the effectiveness of the destroyer offense just wasn't that great.

Also, mobility is an issue with this army. Sure the wraithstar is fast. Sure, my tomb blades are fast. And it's great that destroyers can deepstrike all over the table. However, the core of my army is somewhat slow (without the night scythes) and can be trapped by the more aggressive armies. The new Decurion just does not have the speed that made the previous Necrons sooooo good. Currently, you just can't do the last turn objective-grab/contest that has won so many games for me before (and if you do, it will be at a premium in terms of cost).

I don't think it's fair to blame the decurion that your list lacked punch. Your entire heavy support consisted of 2 lascannons. The destroyer cult was 650 points that was never going to kill it's points in enemy models. The d-lord seems the only one that made up its points by killing half an IK. And yeah, against a WS biker list the destroyers are at their absolute worst. Plus, surely with 3 units in reserve you could have taken Hyperlogical Strategist on Zahndrekh turn 2? Unless you already did and just rolled a lot of ones.

As for mobility, again you need to bring it to really know if it's going to work. There's nothing stopping you bringing NS and more tomb blades.

To be fair, my list does have a decent amount of firepower. However, most of it is rapid-fire and not very effective against units 12"+ away. And because my units were somewhat spread out, that makes it even harder to focus down on any 1 unit. Most of it is also low-strength and so not as effective against high-Toughness units or vehicles.

Now compare that to other top-tier armies like mechdar, flyrant-spam Tyranids, Tau, White Scars or the Oldcrons who can spam lots of high-strength or AP2 VoF and you will see where I am coming from with my comparisons.

I don't really blame the Destroyer Cult in this game. Normally, I think that their offense can be incredibly effective, but White Scars is just a natural counter to the Destroyer Cult.

I didn't take Hyperlogical Strategist because I took Conqueror of Cities instead. Between the Castigator's 8 S7 AP3 shots and all the meltas and grav weaponry, I preferred to have the +1 cover to try to keep my spider alive instead. By the time I killed his Knight, it was already Turn 3 and so I decided to keep Conqueror for its defensive applications instead (destroyers in bolstered ruins with Conqueror for the 2+ ). Besides, the destroyers weren't so effective in this game that I was ok with them staying in reserves for a little longer.

The list has got some mobility. HOWEVER, the core of the army just isn't really mobile. It can be trapped by other armies (especially other MTO armies). Maybe not in this battle, but the mobility of the list is a concern of mine, especially in comparison to some of the other top-tier lists. Yes, you can definitely bring in some night scythes, but doing so for the troops will cost almost 500-pts! You definitely do so at the expense of your other formations (meaning I'd probably have to drop the heavy destroyers and maybe some wraiths). Overall, it is a balancing act juggling all the resources in the army to come up with a TAC that I am happy with. It is going to be a challenge that I will relish, but also one that may also take me beyond the LVO in order to do so.

 jy2 wrote:

 SwistakCZC wrote:
Ive changed my mind, take the fluffkillah, not newcrons, wraiths with triple rant are even too fab man.

Had another test game with it against mechdar. It's turning out to be a very strong build.

In this case I'm looking forward to reading the report boss. I've had simillar idea long time ago to ally with nids, but triple flyrants rock. Moreover I gonna test version with CCB in order to have good maelstorm grabber, rather then d.lord.

 jy2 wrote:

The list has got some mobility. HOWEVER, the core of the army just isn't really mobile. It can be trapped by other armies (especially other MTO armies). Maybe not in this battle, but the mobility of the list is a concern of mine, especially in comparison to some of the other top-tier lists. Yes, you can definitely bring in some night scythes, but doing so for the troops will cost almost 500-pts! You definitely do so at the expense of your other formations (meaning I'd probably have to drop the heavy destroyers and maybe some wraiths). Overall, it is a balancing act juggling all the resources in the army to come up with a TAC that I am happy with. It is going to be a challenge that I will relish, but also one that may also take me beyond the LVO in order to do so.

Yeah the new Necrons are very complicated it will likely take many months to find and playtest the optimized lists. I think you are going to struggle to find one in the next week

I'm doubting the destroyer cult will make the cut for TAC though, it's just so situational and expensive. Paying for so much AP3 without the Str to hurt vehicles gives it a lot of bad matchups. I'm trying to figure out how to make Decurion + CAD workable. It's not like Necron troops are a tax, especially with either 4+RP or ObSec.

You don't lose adaptive subroutine if you move out of 12" of the Spyder, the only clause to get the ability is to stay with in 12" at the beginning of the phase.

Here's a convenient thread about it.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/635131.page#7586451

Destroyer Cult rerolls wounds/pens with gauss so they're better than they look especially against higher av's.

 SwistakCZC wrote:

 jy2 wrote:

 SwistakCZC wrote:
Ive changed my mind, take the fluffkillah, not newcrons, wraiths with triple rant are even too fab man.

Had another test game with it against mechdar. It's turning out to be a very strong build.

In this case I'm looking forward to reading the report boss. I've had simillar idea long time ago to ally with nids, but triple flyrants rock. Moreover I gonna test version with CCB in order to have good maelstorm grabber, rather then d.lord.

Yeah, it's tough choosing between the D-lord and the CCB. The D-lord really helps out the wraiths and is both a force-mulitplier as well as a hammer unit. The CCB, on the other hand, offsets some of the limitations of the list with regards to the Maelstrom objectives. It is not an easy choice at all. Both can be so good.

Tekron wrote:

 jy2 wrote:

The list has got some mobility. HOWEVER, the core of the army just isn't really mobile. It can be trapped by other armies (especially other MTO armies). Maybe not in this battle, but the mobility of the list is a concern of mine, especially in comparison to some of the other top-tier lists. Yes, you can definitely bring in some night scythes, but doing so for the troops will cost almost 500-pts! You definitely do so at the expense of your other formations (meaning I'd probably have to drop the heavy destroyers and maybe some wraiths). Overall, it is a balancing act juggling all the resources in the army to come up with a TAC that I am happy with. It is going to be a challenge that I will relish, but also one that may also take me beyond the LVO in order to do so.

Yeah the new Necrons are very complicated it will likely take many months to find and playtest the optimized lists. I think you are going to struggle to find one in the next week

I'm doubting the destroyer cult will make the cut for TAC though, it's just so situational and expensive. Paying for so much AP3 without the Str to hurt vehicles gives it a lot of bad matchups. I'm trying to figure out how to make Decurion + CAD workable. It's not like Necron troops are a tax, especially with either 4+RP or ObSec.

One thing I really like about the Destroyer Cult is the mobility they possess and the MSU element they add to the army. Even when their shooting isn't really going for them (like in this game), they are still a harassment unit that I can deepstrike into my opponent's deployment zone to harass his MSU troops on his home objectives. And because of the nature of their shooting, they really can't be ignored by most armies.

Here's a list another poster here has submitted to me (I won't name him in case if he wants anonymity). It consists of CAD + Destroyer Cult and I think it has the potential to be really good:


CAD:

Destroyer Lord - Wargear

2x5 Immortals

16-17x wraiths w/whip coils

Heavy Destroyer
Heavy Destroyer

Destroyer Cult:

Destroyer Lord - Wargear

2x Destroyers, 1x Heavy Destroyer
2x Destroyers, 1x Heavy Destroyer
2x Destroyers, 1x Heavy Destroyer

3x Heavy Destroyers




Automatically Appended Next Post:

Hollismason wrote:
You don't lose adaptive subroutine if you move out of 12" of the Spyder, the only clause to get the ability is to stay with in 12" at the beginning of the phase.

Here's a convenient thread about it.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/635131.page#7586451

Thanks. I'll check it out.

dominuschao wrote:
Destroyer Cult rerolls wounds/pens with gauss so they're better than they look especially against higher av's.

The re-roll pens sure is helpful. It was because of it that I was able to take 2HP's off of the Imperial Knight with my shooting.

I think you'll see a lot of Conclave of the Burning one armies with Night bring and Veil / Solar staff combo. That's a incredibly strong unit. Pair it with a realistic Wraith Wing and Destroyer Cult you've got a deadly army.

Hollismason wrote:
I think you'll see a lot of Conclave of the Burning one armies with Night bring and Veil / Solar staff combo. That's a incredibly strong unit. Pair it with a realistic Wraith Wing and Destroyer Cult you've got a deadly army.

I'm not so sure. It's a good board control unit for sure. However, it is just too slow for my taste and the formation, when geared up, is pretty expensive (maybe 400+ pts?). Go up against MSU and that unit will never make its points back.

More importantly, most tournaments only allow for 2 sources. CAD + Conclave + Destroyer Cult would be illegal in many tournaments. Decurion w/Destroyer Cult + Conclave won't leave you with many points to run anything else unless you make major sacrifices to your Reclamantion Legion (by not taking transports, etc.).

Sorry, but I just don't see the Conclave fitting in well in a competitive Necron list.

It's pretty quick with Veil and good board control, plus it nukes a very competitive army ( Bikers who's gravcannons don't do to well, and who's Jink is ignore)

It's strong but your right it loses a lot on being taken in a Decurion because of the point sink.

I'm not a tournament player, so I don't really care that much what the tournaments say I pay attention to them mainly to see what the strong builds come out and just passing interest.

I am aware of the Veil tactic. However, many of the strong tournament armies - mechdar, White Scars, flyrant-spam Tyranids, MSU mech, etc. - can just get away from it. Other strong tournament armies - Adlance knights, green tide orks, wraithwing Necrons, assault deathstars - will just kill it in combat. And then some armies - Daemon summoning, MSU builds - can just tartpit it or feed it sacrificial units to tie it up for most of the game.

Just wanted to point out from a tournament perspective of how I think it would fare against the better tournament armies.

Yeah I don't think the veil C'tan is competitive. Can pub stomp some armies but it is too slow.

Jim your conclusion at the end of the report is exactly what I was thinking - super resilient but not killy enough to make up for the lack of Obsec

Gaze of Death is a seriously broken ability and can straight up murderize a lot of Death Stars and can target Flying Monstrous Creatures, AP2 , Ignore Cover wounds is pretty boss Even if it has a 18" range basically.

Hollismason wrote:
Gaze of Death is a seriously broken ability and can straight up murderize a lot of Death Stars and can target Flying Monstrous Creatures, AP2 , Ignore Cover wounds is pretty boss Even if it has a 18" range basically.

I wouldn't call it good at countering death stars or broken. It's more expensive and worse then the old doom of mal antai which wasn't that devastating to be honest. Most deathstars have tanking invulns like storm shields, so you'd be lucky to put a couple wounds on the tank then probably get nuked

Against FMC's you will get one good go using the veil then they will stay out of your range. A 16% chance to do 4 wounds and they will might have an invuln (demons) or FNP (nids) or both.

In a vacuum I think it's best used as a massive disruption unit in their backfield. In a Necron list it just doesn't gel IMO. For example it is similar to Dark Artisan which I think is good, but a big part of why dark artisan is good is because of what it adds to DE. I don't see the conclave as adding anything new or useful to necrons for it's cost.

Imma try it out regardless even if it doesn't kill Flyers having basically a 36inch wide line of Do not come here is pretty good and makes the FMC player at least think about what their gonna do other than. Fly forward shoot the crap out of everyone.

Tekron wrote:

 jy2 wrote:

Ok, so here are my thoughts on the new Necrons with the Decurion detachment. It is super-resilient. However, it's offense is also somewhat stagnant. I've got basically 1 hard-hitting hammer unit, my wraithstar, but as soon as it went down, the offense of the rest of the army was just mediocre. To be fair, however, I think the Destroyer Cult would have done better against another army. But against White Scars, where their jink saves are the same as their armor saves, the effectiveness of the destroyer offense just wasn't that great.

Also, mobility is an issue with this army. Sure the wraithstar is fast. Sure, my tomb blades are fast. And it's great that destroyers can deepstrike all over the table. However, the core of my army is somewhat slow (without the night scythes) and can be trapped by the more aggressive armies. The new Decurion just does not have the speed that made the previous Necrons sooooo good. Currently, you just can't do the last turn objective-grab/contest that has won so many games for me before (and if you do, it will be at a premium in terms of cost).

I don't think it's fair to blame the decurion that your list lacked punch. Your entire heavy support consisted of 2 lascannons. The destroyer cult was 650 points that was never going to kill it's points in enemy models. The d-lord seems the only one that made up its points by killing half an IK. And yeah, against a WS biker list the destroyers are at their absolute worst. Plus, surely with 3 units in reserve you could have taken Hyperlogical Strategist on Zahndrekh turn 2? Unless you already did and just rolled a lot of ones.

As for mobility, again you need to bring it to really know if it's going to work. There's nothing stopping you bringing NS and more tomb blades.

I disagree, destroyers are great against bikes because it forces the bikes to jink and that just punishes them in their shooting phase. With the re-rolls and AP3, if they don't jink, you are looking at better than 75% wound rate. If you can keep the enemy jinked across the board, you will have even more durability. Unless White Scars have a rule that lets them get full BS after they jink that I am not aware of.