Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.
2015/02/27 04:02:21
Subject: Am I the only one tired of gaming culture?
You know that a discussion is a 2 (or more) way street where people with opposing opinions respect each other and try to sway the other with well formed sentences backed up
with research (or knowledge) that back your points.
"FU i am right your wrong" is a very juvenile response.
nomotog wrote: Are people arguing that media doesn't affect you? Maybe that isn't it, but it's what it is sounding like. The idea that media doesn't affect people is just so mind boggling that Google doesn't even accept it. I keeps adding an how in front of my query on the subject.
I don't think I would go so far as to say it doesn't affect you at all, I'm just aware that numerous studies have said that there is no real link between watching violent movies and playing violent games and actually being violent. I know the British Government used to ban gak all the time back in the eighties, but such things don't happen anymore because all of the professionals have debunked that kinda thing.
Michelangelo never had his nunchucks back in the day when the TMNT cartoons hit the UK, they don't care now, and yet here we are, people of my generation are generally nice pleasant folks no more likely to decapitate someone with a shovel than someone born in those prim and proper 1920's.
Like I told Hybrid, I'm not as passionately against his arguments as some of the blokes in here, but studies by smarter men than us appear to have suggested that the link is minimal at best.
Its back to what I have argued with Mel and Hybrid over countless times I'm afraid, its not that I think it isn't linked to anything to do with misogyny at all, just that its almost trivial so I don't think we shouldnt really be worrying about it, If I had to pick the root causes of an irrational hatred of women, I think fething "gaming culture" would be almost right at the bottom of the list. Same goes for almost eberything else I drip about, basiclaly anything and everything hobby.
Some minis have their tits out? Well so what? Mario rescues Princess? Whippee- doo. Its like worrying about a wasps nest at the foot of your yard when your kitchen is on fire.
My point isn't that the media isn't responsible for nothing ever, and gak, I would even go so far as to say we should indeed stop pushing images of Sports Illustrated models at young girls and try harder to give gals a bit more value themselves, but holy gak.. that's for parents to do. I'm pretty sure I would raise an awesome girl despite "the media" because I would be a loving dad and a smart parent.
Really, why not just forget about "the media" and worry about the in your face clearly and overtly problematic roots of misogyny, I can think of about a dozen off the top of my head. Lets see, is it Final Fight having three blokes throw people through telephone boxes that is screwing women over, or is it gak like confidence issues, familial problems, child abuse, some social structures, mental illness, all of the big religions, narcissism, sexual frustration and a gak-load of rejection?
I would go with a few of those last ones.
We are arming Syrian rebels who support ISIS, who is fighting Iran, who is fighting Iraq who we also support against ISIS, while fighting Kurds who we support while they are fighting Syrian rebels.
2015/02/27 04:37:31
Subject: Am I the only one tired of gaming culture?
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote: So, do they pick up only from parents because of some magical link, or could they pick up from other people?
You'll understand this when you have kids. other people? no, always traced back to the parents, yes. Your kids will turn out to be just like you.
I am not sure if that comment was meant as trolling or if it is the result of an intellectual breakdown, but I just do not even want to answer to someone who pretends children always share the social values of their parents, without any other influence, because that is just one step too far into cuckooland. You “win”, rejoice!
Well if modern psychology is cuckoo land territory for you, that certain explains your outburst here. Which of your parents where prone to the childish outburst you just had?
A good way to think about the childhood mind is being like a big block of stone. For roughly the first six years of your life your parents were the sole sculptors of that stone.
They slowly chipped away at it and shaped it in their own image. This sculpted stone then became the base of who you are as a person today and what the other sculptors in your life will have to work with.
The block of stone that we have just been referring to is your subconscious mind. It contains all the beliefs which you have about yourself and the world you live in.
yea, I win, and there was much rejoicing.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/27 04:38:02
2015/02/27 05:41:41
Subject: Am I the only one tired of gaming culture?
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote: So, do they pick up only from parents because of some magical link, or could they pick up from other people?
You'll understand this when you have kids. other people? no, always traced back to the parents, yes. Your kids will turn out to be just like you.
I am not sure if that comment was meant as trolling or if it is the result of an intellectual breakdown, but I just do not even want to answer to someone who pretends children always share the social values of their parents, without any other influence, because that is just one step too far into cuckooland. You “win”, rejoice!
Well if modern psychology is cuckoo land territory for you, that certain explains your outburst here. Which of your parents where prone to the childish outburst you just had?
A good way to think about the childhood mind is being like a big block of stone. For roughly the first six years of your life your parents were the sole sculptors of that stone.
They slowly chipped away at it and shaped it in their own image. This sculpted stone then became the base of who you are as a person today and what the other sculptors in your life will have to work with.
The block of stone that we have just been referring to is your subconscious mind. It contains all the beliefs which you have about yourself and the world you live in.
yea, I win, and there was much rejoicing.
Your last statement is rather cocky, and really puts your argument to shame. Don't get me wrong, I like the quote you included, but acting like you know everything doesn't help a reasonable argument.
Besides, I think a lot of psychology places a little too much emphasis on childhood and not enough on self-responsibility. Don't get me wrong, childhood is huge and will shape who you are, but there is something to be said for having some self-knowledge and not letting your past define you. Plenty of people have started with gakky childhoods and moved on to greater things and become awesome human beings.
Arguing with Hybrid is one of the most pointless things you can do. Best just to put him on ignore and move on. This same kind of discussion has been had over and over again with him, and it never does anything good.
The only thing arguing with him is known to do is send a thread off topic, and toward the lock. There are very few posters in history of Dakka that display his talent at ruining an entire forum (The Video game forum).
nomotog wrote: Are people arguing that media doesn't affect you? Maybe that isn't it, but it's what it is sounding like. The idea that media doesn't affect people is just so mind boggling that Google doesn't even accept it. I keeps adding an how in front of my query on the subject.
People who can't discern reality from fiction, perhaps...
That's why we have age dependant content warnings on movies and games. Younger people are the most impressionable. By the time you grow up, you grow (or should grow) out of that impressionabilty. That's why the "sexist/violent video games cause sexism/violence " argument is so annoying. It's treating gamers like children.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/02/27 08:21:59
2015/02/27 08:24:03
Subject: Am I the only one tired of gaming culture?
And why comments like "I wouldn't let my kids play that!" gall me so much, because they're often said in relation to games that have been specifically rated to be not for kids in the first place. "I wouldn't let my kinds play that!" about GTAV is no more insightful or revelatory than saying "I wouldn't let my 6 year old watch Hostel!". Of course you fething wouldn't. It's not for them!
Video games are still seen as something kids do. The very idea that they're made for adults seems to pass some people by, and that's just tragic.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/27 08:25:33
And why comments like "I wouldn't let my kids play that!" gall me so much, because they're often said in relation to games that have been specifically rated to be not for kids in the first place. "I wouldn't let my kinds play that!" about GTAV is no more insightful or revelatory than saying "I wouldn't let my 6 year old watch Hostel!". Of course you fething wouldn't. It's not for them!
Video games are still seen as something kids do. The very idea that they're made for adults seems to pass some people by, and that's just tragic.
Which is funny when it's been the biggest form of media for a while now.
2015/02/27 09:59:02
Subject: Re:Am I the only one tired of gaming culture?
nomotog wrote: Are people arguing that media doesn't affect you? Maybe that isn't it, but it's what it is sounding like. The idea that media doesn't affect people is just so mind boggling that Google doesn't even accept it. I keeps adding an how in front of my query on the subject.
What are your search terms? When I typed "media doesn't cause violence," there were links to articles about a study that shows it doesn't among the first few entries.
In fact, when I just typed "media doesn't" into the search bar, the auto fill options were "body image" and "society"
And why comments like "I wouldn't let my kids play that!" gall me so much, because they're often said in relation to games that have been specifically rated to be not for kids in the first place. "I wouldn't let my kinds play that!" about GTAV is no more insightful or revelatory than saying "I wouldn't let my 6 year old watch Hostel!". Of course you fething wouldn't. It's not for them!
Video games are still seen as something kids do. The very idea that they're made for adults seems to pass some people by, and that's just tragic.
Ai, its the same with Anime. People seem to have this idea that cartoons are always for children, when it reality its just another medium.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2015/02/27 10:51:50
What I have
~4100
~1660
Westwood lives in death!
Peace through power!
A longbeard when it comes to Necrons and WHFB. Grumble Grumble
2015/02/27 11:15:52
Subject: Am I the only one tired of gaming culture?
Hey do you know what? No. Or, rather, go feth yourselves, all of you.
There's no need to feel or get defensive and especially not in such a tone. You know that I really like you as a poster and wasn't aiming to offend you. The point is that you can't just post blank statements and sell them as a fact when the exact opposite is the case. It's perfectly in order and okay to state that as your opinion or even say that you strongly think so because of several reasons. But please don't misportray information.
Sigvatr wrote: The point is that you can't just post blank statements and sell them as a fact when the exact opposite is the case. It's perfectly in order and okay to state that as your opinion or even say that you strongly think so because of several reasons. But please don't misportray information.
It works for Anita Sarkeesian.
2015/02/27 12:37:49
Subject: Am I the only one tired of gaming culture?
Compel wrote: I would like to see those stats for Dragon Age Inquisition. - So would bioware no doubt. One of the things they intentionally did was randomise what the 'default' was in character creation.
In saying that still, 1 in 5 player a female character isn't insignificant at all. As I like saying to people on this topic: If your boss came up to you and said, "I'm taking 18% off your paycheck, after tax for reasons." Would you dismiss it as insignificant?
Bioware doesn't like to see those stats, they have them. They've always data mined their own games.
Here's the stats for Inquisition.
Straight from the Bioware twitter.
I beg of you sarge let me lead the charge when the battle lines are drawn
Lemme at least leave a good hoof beat they'll remember loud and long
It works for the industry. Noone takes her seriously as everyone knows that she has very little substance but she's a great posterboy / girl. Have her talk about her stuff, people think you're super engaged in feminism in games and still continue actually doing the same thing you did before.
nomotog wrote: Are people arguing that media doesn't affect you? Maybe that isn't it, but it's what it is sounding like. The idea that media doesn't affect people is just so mind boggling that Google doesn't even accept it. I keeps adding an how in front of my query on the subject.
People who can't discern reality from fiction, perhaps...
That's why we have age dependant content warnings on movies and games. Younger people are the most impressionable. By the time you grow up, you grow (or should grow) out of that impressionabilty. That's why the "sexist/violent video games cause sexism/violence " argument is so annoying. It's treating gamers like children.
Well kids play games too and another one of the differences between violent content and sexist content is that we don't restrict or even label sexist content. I think I recall a debate about if it should be labeled and most people thought the idea was crazy over reaching. (maybe this form?)
nomotog wrote: Are people arguing that media doesn't affect you? Maybe that isn't it, but it's what it is sounding like. The idea that media doesn't affect people is just so mind boggling that Google doesn't even accept it. I keeps adding an how in front of my query on the subject.
What are your search terms? When I typed "media doesn't cause violence," there were links to articles about a study that shows it doesn't among the first few entries.
In fact, when I just typed "media doesn't" into the search bar, the auto fill options were "body image" and "society"
I wanted to keep it generic and without a inherent bias in the search, so I just asked the question Dose media affect you. Are you affected by media. Are we affected by media. Basically every result was talking about how media affects us.
2015/02/27 14:14:21
Subject: Am I the only one tired of gaming culture?
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote: So, do they pick up only from parents because of some magical link, or could they pick up from other people?
You'll understand this when you have kids. other people? no, always traced back to the parents, yes. Your kids will turn out to be just like you.
I am not sure if that comment was meant as trolling or if it is the result of an intellectual breakdown, but I just do not even want to answer to someone who pretends children always share the social values of their parents, without any other influence, because that is just one step too far into cuckooland. You “win”, rejoice!
Well if modern psychology is cuckoo land territory for you, that certain explains your outburst here. Which of your parents where prone to the childish outburst you just had?
A good way to think about the childhood mind is being like a big block of stone. For roughly the first six years of your life your parents were the sole sculptors of that stone.
They slowly chipped away at it and shaped it in their own image. This sculpted stone then became the base of who you are as a person today and what the other sculptors in your life will have to work with.
The block of stone that we have just been referring to is your subconscious mind. It contains all the beliefs which you have about yourself and the world you live in.
yea, I win, and there was much rejoicing.
Your last statement is rather cocky, and really puts your argument to shame. Don't get me wrong, I like the quote you included, but acting like you know everything doesn't help a reasonable argument.
Besides, I think a lot of psychology places a little too much emphasis on childhood and not enough on self-responsibility. Don't get me wrong, childhood is huge and will shape who you are, but there is something to be said for having some self-knowledge and not letting your past define you. Plenty of people have started with gakky childhoods and moved on to greater things and become awesome human beings.
I knew I should have posted the monty python video. I don't know everything, I can admit that, but I do know google, I have taken parenting classes, and I know how to find proof to back up my claims. so read the article I linked and ignore my snarky replies to insulting replies.
The same article touched on that briefly "In this sense, the root of the subconscious is essentially a combination of your parents' minds and will stay that way unless it is examined and changed" For most to reach the stage where they are examining and choosing to change, the term is rock bottom.
1. Decide that you really want to change and convince yourself that you can.
You can only change what you decide you want to change. All psychological models of change emphasize the importance of commitment as a necessary first step. If you don't see a problem, you won't work on changing your behavior.
Playing a video game is not going to cause someone to examine their subconscious and go, "yes, I should choose to be more sexists."
2015/02/27 14:17:24
Subject: Am I the only one tired of gaming culture?
The burning pits of Hades, also known as Sweden in summer
It seems a bit naïve to think that video games and media doesn't affect us. Things like this do affect us. In the US, countless billions of dollars (220 billion IIRC?) was spent last year on advertising. That wouldn't happen if it had no effect.
Humans are actually quite impressionable creatures, whether we like it or not.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/27 14:17:45
Ashiraya wrote: It seems a bit naïve to think that video games and media doesn't affect us. Things like this do affect us. In the US, countless billions of dollars (220 billion IIRC?) was spent last year on advertising. That wouldn't happen if it had no effect.
Humans are actually quite impressionable creatures, whether we like it or not.
And yet we're not out there murdering people 'cause of video games.
Ashiraya wrote: It seems a bit naïve to think that video games and media doesn't affect us. Things like this do affect us. In the US, countless billions of dollars (220 billion IIRC?) was spent last year on advertising. That wouldn't happen if it had no effect.
Humans are actually quite impressionable creatures, whether we like it or not.
There's a bit of difference between "that's a cool thing; I want to buy it" and "Time to murder someone like in GTA"
What I have
~4100
~1660
Westwood lives in death!
Peace through power!
A longbeard when it comes to Necrons and WHFB. Grumble Grumble
2015/02/27 16:21:20
Subject: Am I the only one tired of gaming culture?
Ashiraya wrote: It seems a bit naïve to think that video games and media doesn't affect us. Things like this do affect us. In the US, countless billions of dollars (220 billion IIRC?) was spent last year on advertising. That wouldn't happen if it had no effect.
Humans are actually quite impressionable creatures, whether we like it or not.
And yet we're not out there murdering people 'cause of video games.
Speak for yourself! I'm out there frequently gunning people down wearing nothing but a t-shirt with naked, busty women.
Ashiraya wrote: It seems a bit naïve to think that video games and media doesn't affect us. Things like this do affect us. In the US, countless billions of dollars (220 billion IIRC?) was spent last year on advertising. That wouldn't happen if it had no effect.
Humans are actually quite impressionable creatures, whether we like it or not.
Big difference between:
"Oh Hey, Sub Zero just ripped some dudes skull and spine out of their body, that was pretty damn awesome"
And
"Man I'm hungry, what should I eat?....... Huh, McD's is in 5 miles, might as well stop there".
I've never feared Death or Dying. I've only feared never Trying.
2015/02/27 17:11:44
Subject: Am I the only one tired of gaming culture?
Ashiraya wrote: It seems a bit naïve to think that video games and media doesn't affect us. Things like this do affect us. In the US, countless billions of dollars (220 billion IIRC?) was spent last year on advertising. That wouldn't happen if it had no effect.
Humans are actually quite impressionable creatures, whether we like it or not.
Big difference between:
"Oh Hey, Sub Zero just ripped some dudes skull and spine out of their body, that was pretty damn awesome"
And
"Man I'm hungry, what should I eat?....... Huh, McD's is in 5 miles, might as well stop there".
Speak for yourself. McD's forgot my fries and I screamed "FINISH HIM!!!" before freezing him and ripping his spine out
Azazelx wrote: While we're still far from "everyone is a gamer", gamers aren't going anywhere. Our gak is here to stay and has climbed into the mainstream with BBT, Marvel movies and all of the rest of it. Pretty much most to all "normal" people haven't heard of "gamergate" nor do they care.
The thing is, to profess to be a "gamer" is evolving differently than what it used to mean.
As you pointed out "normal" people play many games, it is not fringe recreation like it used to be, having a "culture" is becoming more a misnomer.
The way I see it is that "gamer culture" has gone (semi) mainstream. It's not fully there yet, and it's not like sports - but it also depends on what you see as part of "gamer culture". I mean, there's the larger "geek culture" thing that encompasses the whole sci-fi fantasy comic book shebang and gives us Big Bang Theory. I see the "culture" part not so much as being someone who plays Peggle or Candy Crush on their phones - since playing games is becoming much more normalised - but either being right into it and/or understanding the jargon. MMO. RPG. FPS. Rail Shooter. Cover Shooter. RTS. MOBA. Even using a controller that has three joysticks and 13 buttons (maybe a touchpad as well) without feeling any intimidation from the thing and instead being completely comfortable with it.
At the same time, I consider all of this stuff to be just as much part of "gamer culture". The Warhams we paint and the Zombicides that we play and the Pathfinders that we find. This whole forum. It's a different genre and kind of game, sure, but then so is Just Dance and Guitar Hero when compared to Halo or Madden. After all, someone who is into sports can be into watching F1 and playing Hockey and still be "sports culture" etc.
I've been a gamer for almost my entire life. Yet I don't give two feths about #gamergate or SJWs (both sides are filled with morons. But then again, what do you expect from a #hashtagwar?
So again, as you point out so well, you are not emotionally attached to the label, you game and do not identify as a "gamer" so much of the drivel flung about has little meaning to you.
Ah, but you see, I do identify as a gamer. I've been a gamer since before many of the monkeys flinging poo at one another right now as part of this were born. I just don't think that the poo is going to stick. As others have said, every group of people contains a good number of feth wits. I've been around for long enough to see that it doesn't stick to me, and that with the rise of Spider Man, Transformers, Big Bang Theory, Sony PlayStation and XBox into the mainstream - along with working alongside "normal people" that it's incredibly obvious that gaming culture isn't poisonous, or the term/identity hasn't been poisoned, or any of that crap. Most people who live outside the goldfish bowl don't know or care about #gamergate or Anita - and a brief interview on the Daily Show doesn't change that.
Sexism in gaming is alive and well, and I'd like to see less of it. Death threats are for feth wits either way.
As long as humans are involved this stuff happens and should not surprise...
While I'll agree with that. The problem with the internet and people with differing levels of ...familiarity with "internet culture" as well as more younger people these days seemingly not having a fething clue about posting moronic things is that stupid "death threats" are even more common. See the Code Avarice saga. (Seriously, google it. It's worth a read, a good laugh and a facepalm.) But hey, consequences are a thing.
Anita's stuff (pre-"gamergate" anyway) is skewed and has a few too many half-truths and twists of the truth sprinkled throughout it to take 100% seriously but I still find it interesting, and she does make good and valid points as well.
What makes what she says dangerous is people who are involved in determining policy would take much of what she says at face value and maybe less salt than you, which is what makes her rather one-sided views problematic.
This is why she is so vehemently attacked on many points because it is not balanced, it demands a critique which BTW she typically closes all means of discussion or feedback.
See, here's the thing. And I'm not sure if the way the discourse has developed is symptomatic of how polarised the US has become between red and blue viewpoints over the last decade or so - but simply attacking her so vehemently (from the KS onwards) - initially from idiot man-children might be what has caused her and her supporters to double down on their overall viewpoint, and in turn those who slightly disagree doing the same, and Zoe Quinn and her dodgy friends and gakky game getting drawn into the fight so that now both sides are generally so shouty and polarisied that they're generally unwilling to take on or accept valid points that the others make.
Bringing to light gakky "game journalism" is a good thing, though my most trusted source these days is Forbes - yeah, the financial paper/site. Not beholden to the producers of the product. Along with sidetracks into people like Sterling, Joe, Yahtzee, etc. Still, I'll read and watch an IGN or Gamespot review, and oddly, they (generally) seem a little less paid off and filled with bs lately. (See reviews for The Order).
This is the thing as well, the label "journalist" is being attacked where many sources do not behave like they are conveying news impartially, more like an extension of advertising for gaming companies.
A name for a type or group of people conveys a certain meaning with all the benefits and prejudices that entails.
If we as "gamers" make fun of the publications saying they are not behaving like proper "journalists" then it is funny how they turn around and say "Oh yeah? Well gamers are dead! You guys do not exist, what you say then is unimportant, we are publishing for the general public this is not a publication catering to a dead fan base."
Generally speaking, "gaming journalism" has been in the "lolwut?" category for a long, long time. There have been bright sparks, but generally it's been piss poor for decades. Look up almost any mention of Peter Molyneaux over the y̶e̶a̶r̶s̶ decades before the recent few that show the gaming press turning on him. But "gaming journalism" has been pretty much accepted for the corrupt thing that it is for many years. Ask Jeff Gerstmann. Despite the attention-seeking "gamers are dead" article (which you seem to be echoing here in a way?) that article was written by a single commentator and published by a single publication's editor/editing staff. It is also just as much a joke as the rest of "gaming journalism" has generally been. I'm hoping that one positive that will come out of this is that game journalism will be a little more like journalism and less like PR, but I suspect that this too will blow over. At least some have added "ethic policies" and started to state where there are potential conflicts of interest. If there are any long-term changes, it'll be the result of competition from sites like GiantBomb, the YouTubers that are big enough to openly have integrity, and places that aren't beholden to game advertisers like Forbes.
This is such riveting school-yard stuff, it may be best this all gets behind us.
It's already behind us for the most part. And I'm still a gamer, just like I was this time last year.
Pretty much on same page, experiences and status as a "gamer".
Thanks for the point-by-point reply.
I would disagree on the "gamers are dead" as being one article, this person was kind enough to tally them (12 at that infamous time):
https://pixietalksgamergate.wordpress.com/gamers-are-dead-article-analysis/ The google search alone with some 20 million hits at least shows it has some interest:
https://www.google.com/search?q=gamers+dead What you had mentioned is that there are so many variations of this label that the range is too broad to fit comfortably, like being into "sports": more of a lead-in than a label.
This is what is more relevant; it is less that the "identity" of being a "gamer" that has "normalized" but that the varied interests and sub-groups within, are not readily contained in the one label.
I could say "I like sports, I do kendo and hockey." I can also say "I like gaming, Warhammer 40k and strategy PC games."
The true LOL moments I found with all this are the various gaming media "stars" trying to wrestle control of the topic away from the public, saying they were not answerable for what they do since "gamers" are just boy geeks in their parent's basement... sucks when you are out of touch with your audience or not know who they are.
Now we are entire families on phones, tablets, game systems and PC and various times during the day, kids, dad and mom... this is prime time entertainment that has largely shifted from TV. The audience has grown well beyond what reviewers are used to and are getting away with less. They need to talk more to Hollywood and learn from them how it gets when the audience turns against them.
Ashiraya wrote: It seems a bit naïve to think that video games and media doesn't affect us. Things like this do affect us. In the US, countless billions of dollars (220 billion IIRC?) was spent last year on advertising. That wouldn't happen if it had no effect.
Humans are actually quite impressionable creatures, whether we like it or not.
And yet we're not out there murdering people 'cause of video games.
Speak for yourself! I'm out there frequently gunning people down wearing nothing but a t-shirt with naked, busty women.
I am a huge supporter of paintball.
I would strongly suggest not doing it naked or with only a T-shirt: nether region fire reaches such an exquisite level of pain(t) it is just best to have clothing.
In all seriousness, some moments in gaming you want to try to recreate or simulate in real life since it was so epic.
As long as we stick to things that do not maim or kill we are golden...
There's no need to feel or get defensive and especially not in such a tone. You know that I really like you as a poster and wasn't aiming to offend you. The point is that you can't just post blank statements and sell them as a fact when the exact opposite is the case. It's perfectly in order and okay to state that as your opinion or even say that you strongly think so because of several reasons. But please don't misportray information.
Well, you can tell Hybrid cares at least. When the swearing starts, it does tend to give the audience the permission to ignore you and what you had to say however. Sigvatr, it is perfectly fine to feel defensive when a person has made a statement possibly off-hand and gets taken-up on it: we all do.
It just gets maddening when data to defend the statement or worse, knowing you were wrong happens: public retractions or apologies suck.
Gaming culture! We are fething pieces of work who like to nit-pick everything: long habit messing with gaming rules.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2015/02/27 17:35:27
A revolution is an idea which has found its bayonets.
Napoleon Bonaparte
2015/02/27 20:09:01
Subject: Am I the only one tired of gaming culture?
I'm moving this thread to OT. That's where all of these GamerGate fallout threads should be posted from here on out. Feel free to PM me if you have a question about where a thread you want to post should go. Thanks.
Ashiraya wrote: It seems a bit naïve to think that video games and media doesn't affect us. Things like this do affect us. In the US, countless billions of dollars (220 billion IIRC?) was spent last year on advertising. That wouldn't happen if it had no effect.
Humans are actually quite impressionable creatures, whether we like it or not.
There's a bit of difference between "that's a cool thing; I want to buy it" and "Time to murder someone like in GTA"
Well ya some things are easier to influence then others. I actually believe this debate started because someone said they thought videogames encouraged sexism, but not violence. People kind of jumped up and said how can it be one and not the other, but it's basically the same thing here.
2015/02/27 22:46:50
Subject: Am I the only one tired of gaming culture?
Ashiraya wrote: It seems a bit naïve to think that video games and media doesn't affect us. Things like this do affect us. In the US, countless billions of dollars (220 billion IIRC?) was spent last year on advertising. That wouldn't happen if it had no effect.
Humans are actually quite impressionable creatures, whether we like it or not.
And yet we're not out there murdering people 'cause of video games.
Well no, you're not going to murder or rape someone solely because you did it in a video game, but it can have a contributive effect.
Ashiraya wrote: It seems a bit naïve to think that video games and media doesn't affect us. Things like this do affect us. In the US, countless billions of dollars (220 billion IIRC?) was spent last year on advertising. That wouldn't happen if it had no effect.
Humans are actually quite impressionable creatures, whether we like it or not.
And yet we're not out there murdering people 'cause of video games.
Well no, you're not going to murder or rape someone solely because you did it in a video game, but it can have a contributive effect.
I respectfully disagree, as most people whom are going to murder someone are more messed up in the head than influenced to do it. The influence of games would contribute in that factor, but only because the guy is highly influenced and highly disturbed.
I've never feared Death or Dying. I've only feared never Trying.
2015/02/27 23:02:16
Subject: Am I the only one tired of gaming culture?
Ashiraya wrote: It seems a bit naïve to think that video games and media doesn't affect us. Things like this do affect us. In the US, countless billions of dollars (220 billion IIRC?) was spent last year on advertising. That wouldn't happen if it had no effect.
Humans are actually quite impressionable creatures, whether we like it or not.
And yet we're not out there murdering people 'cause of video games.
Well no, you're not going to murder or rape someone solely because you did it in a video game, but it can have a contributive effect.
Based on what?
Also in how many games you can actually sexually assault something?
Every time I hear "in my opinion" or "just my opinion" makes me want to strangle a puppy. People use their opinions as a shield that other poeple can't critisize and that is bs.
If you can't defend or won't defend your opinion then that "opinion" is bs. Stop trying to tip-toe and defend what you believe in.
2015/02/27 23:04:42
Subject: Am I the only one tired of gaming culture?
Slarg232 wrote: I respectfully disagree, as most people whom are going to murder someone are more messed up in the head than influenced to do it. The influence of games would contribute in that factor, but only because the guy is highly influenced and highly disturbed.
You're assuming that all murders are coldly calculated far in advance, and not the result of poor impulse control. For example, a person with anger issues who plays lots of violent games, watches lots of violent movies, etc, is probably more likely to lose control in a road rage incident than someone with anger issues who removes those influences from their life.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
illuknisaa wrote: Also in how many games you can actually sexually assault something?
That's not the point. The actual point is that (some) games reinforce attitudes about sexual assault, gender stereotypes/values, etc, that contribute to sexual assault. You don't have to release a "rape as many people as possible" game to contribute to things like the stereotype of the "stranger jumps out of the bushes" rapist. And that's a stereotype that is often used to dismiss cases where the victim knew the rapist as "that's not really rape", "she was at a party and drinking", etc.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2015/02/27 23:07:38
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
~1.5k
4000+
6000+ Order. Unity. Obedience.
Thousand Sons 4000+
~1660
I didn't think they had published any results yet.
